Hi everyone:

I've been wanting to play Chopin's Fantasie Impromptu in C# minor for a long while but never got around to learning it. I would start a few bars, then quit. I'm now thinking about starting a daily blog with videoclips of my progress and I wondered if any of you might be interested in following along, if you've wanted to play this piece too? I thought it would motivate me to persevere and complete this sublimely beautiful piece and it would be great if we could all play this piece too.

I have uploaded myself playing Chopin's Raindrop Prelude, if you'd like to watch and comment:

http://www.youtube.com/user/candlelightpiano?feature=mhsn

Cheers!

I just finished this piece, and it would have been very cool (and motivating) to have people follow my progress while I learned it. I'd definitely follow along!

That would be cool to see, I am currently learning his Prelude op. 28 no. 4, and someday soon I will be able to start practicing the Fantasie Impromptu. Good luck on your endeavor!

I would follow it. I have the score for it, but haven't gotten around to it.

Thanks, Sam. I look forward to watching you play it some time. I just created the blog. Had trouble uploading the video to the blog so will have to do it using YouTube. But hopefully will have first video on blog tonight.

Blog address is:

Chopin's Fantasie Impromptu in C# minor Project http://projectfantasie.blogspot.com/

Look forward to having you follow my blog. Here's the address:

http://projectfantasie.blogspot.com/

I'm now uploading my first video of this piece (not the entire piece!!) to YouTube. Couldn't do it on the blog.

Thanks, Irene. Here's my blog:

http://projectfantasie.blogspot.com/

Look forward to seeing you there!

You can watch it on my YouTube channel (in my signature).
I look forward to following your progress!

Goodness gracious! You play it so beautifully I was moved. How long did it take you to learn it? If I could play half as well as you do, I'd be thrilled. Could use your help on this piece.

Thanks!! In response to your youtube comment, I do belong in the beginner forum because I am a beginner (about 14 months now since I started). I started this piece in late June, and worked on it on and off from then. I first recorded it on October 19th, so that should give you an idea of how long it took. The better recording was taken November 14th, so the few extra weeks of practice paid off. And I can play it even better now. There were lots of little mistakes in my recording.

I'm amazed by your sight reading. I can barely sight read at all. I learned this piece note by note. It was a labor of love I think if you put in as much time as I did, you'll have no problem with the piece. You'll probably play it better than me. You seem to like the metronome. I try to use it as little as possible. I didn't use it at all with this piece. Personal preference I guess. It's probably because I don't really know how to use the metronome properly. I never learned counting or any of that.

Which is why...I'm meeting my first piano teacher tomorrow! I've never taken any lessons before so I'm very excited

I just got "friended" on U-Tube by a very talented young man. This should inspire anyone to learn Fanaticaltaesia (sp?) Impromptu:

http://youtu.be/uic7i3AJRgE

Hey, if he can do it, so can I!

PS-give me another 10 years and a teacher..lol. Now, Sam Rose is a different story altogether. Good luck w/your new teacher Sam!

Thanks! It's easy to criticize the way a kid like him plays this piece, but when you look at the fact that he's FIVE FREAKIN YEARS OLD, it's just unbelievable. I'm sure he'll be great in a very short time from now. How do you work with such small hands? When there's a will, there is almost always a way. (my hands are teeny too )

Your first piano teacher? I still have a hard time thinking of you as a "beginner." OK. You're a beginner virtuoso, how's that? I hope your piano teacher is not expecting a student who is just starting out learning scales! Will he or she be in for a great surprise! Good luck. Please tell me how your first piano lesson went.

I went to your YouTube Channel and watched you playing that hauntingly beautiful nocturne and also playing the Fantasie from one month ago. WOW! You amaze me! And you inspire me. If you can play so well with no lessons, why have lessons? I can't figure that one out. You have the gift. Thank you for sharing and for inspiring us all.

That's amazing! Makes you stand up and really take notice. Such a small kid with so much talent. If he can play like this at the age of 5, what will he be playing at age 10? 15? Older? I dare not think of it.

I'm glad you enjoyed it! The truth is, I need lessons if I want to bridge the gap between playing that sounds very good (amateur level) and playing that sounds excellent (pro amateur). And while the technique I've acquired on my own is fair, with a teacher I hope to make it much better.

I met the teacher today, and it was excellent. He's exactly what I think I need to get better. Although he has to judge everything I do in order to help me get better, he's very encouraging and makes me feel very at ease. Although lessons are expensive, I think it will be well worth it

You're so ambitious and I applaud you. I can see you performing Beethoven's Emperor Concerto in a couple of years! No kidding! You're THAT talented and with all the hard work you put into it, you'll go places.

Awwww thanks! You flatter me

I'll try not to let you down!

You write beautifully, too. Did anyone tell you that? Are you in college?

Yes, I am in college. And my English composition teacher agreed with you

Hello everyone:

I just wanted to inform you that I've made a bit of progress on Fantasie Impromptu in C# minor and I've posted my second videoclip to my blog:

Step 2 of Fantasie Impromptu in C # minor http://projectfantasie.blogspot.com/2011/12/step-2.html

I hope you'll go and take a look and comment on it. I look forward to your thoughts.

Choo

Hi Sam:

I just posted my second videoclip. Made a bit of progress but struggling with the next 3-4 bars.

When you were learning this piece, how did you manage playing 4 notes in the RH against 3 in the left? Did you fit them together or did you play HT (hands together) for the 1st notes, then RH, LH, RH, LH? Also, did you find that the RH notes would get messed up when the tempo increased?

Thanks.

Choo

Choo, first of all, let me say that I have not learned this piece myself. But I was looking at it last week and was looking for tips on how to learn to play the polyrythm. Here are 2 tips that I picked up:

1. Learn the right hand and left hand separately first. Learn one hand very well to the point where you can play it through muscle memory alone and focus on the other hand when playing hands together.

2. There is a pattern with the 4 notes (Right hand) to 3 notes (Left hand). The pattern is TRLRLR TRLRLR TRLRLR and so forth. In the beginning of the piece, the bar starts with the left hand and a rest in the right hand, count that as a T (hands together).

According to what I've read, once you can play the polyrythm, the piece isn't so hard.

Hope this helps.

P.S. Choo, I see that you picked up on the pattern. I missed that in your last post.

Choo,

I did what denali wrote. I had a very hard time putting the hands together, so what I did was try to know each hand well enough that it could run completely on its own, without thinking about it. Then I could play the hands together while focusing on just ONE hand at a time while the other hand runs by itself. It can be very frustrating at the beginning, but it was worth the effort.

Thanks, denali. I've tried both methods. On the first page, I basically learned to play hands separately and memorized it, then fit them in together. It seemed to work okay. But in the next 3-6 bars of the second page, somehow, I'm having difficulty with the first method (why, I don't know since I managed to do it on the first page! LOL!) so I'm now working at them TRLRLR and I'll find out if that will work as well.

Thanks so much for watching my video and taking the time to comment and make suggestions. I appreciate it!

Did you also find that when the tempo increased, your right hand got messed up? How many hours a day did you work at it? I'm trying to get an hour's practice each day but I find that the more I practice the fast passages, the worst it gets!

I found that when the tempo increased, the flaws in the memorization came through. What I mean is that in order to play it faster, you have to REALLY have it memorized. You have to be able to play both hands at slow and fast tempos before you try to put it together. Also, focus on making sure that the notes that are supposed to match up between both hands in fact do match up.

I can tell you also that you sure learn a LOT faster than I did...

How do you do that??

Also, the part that you play at 2:20 took me a VERY long time to get, and I am still working on it.

I learned this piece and here are my suggestions. Play it very slowly until you have all the notes and hear the left/right tick tick rhythm and make sure it is even. Don't even begin to play it at the suggested tempo until you have all the notes and a balanced left/right hand polyrhythm.

Make sure you bring out the melody in the right hand.

Don't hurry the process and enjoy. Ellen

I don't feel like I'm learning fast at all. In fact, I feel like a snail struggling to cross the street but worrying about all the cars running me over!

The part at 2:20? I'm sorry but I'm not sure what part that is. Do you mean bars 7-8?

Thanks for your advice, Ellen. What do you mean by the left/ right tick tick rhythm?

That's very good advice, Sam. I'm going a bit too fast on the first page and I've noticed that the notes that are supposed to be played HT aren't quite together so I will slow down and work on it again, slowly, until they're much better coordinated.

I know what you're talking about, the part at 2:20. You mean the new bars I'm struggling with. I just watched you playing it again and it looks great.

So now that you have a teacher, what pieces are you working on?

Do you think that by using the TRLRLR method for the poly rhythm that it will be more balanced? That I will hear the L/R tick tick rhythm then?

I only had one lesson, and we mostly discussed technique. He did say he wants me to learn the Chopin Revolutionary Etude, but we will see

I've always like the 'Winter Wind' Etude. Too bad it is so far outside the envelope of my ability...

Sounds like you have found yourself an excellent teacher. I've always wanted to learn the Revolutionary Etude, too. I think I saw it played in a movie. The Pianist, I think. It was awesome. I hope you will learn to play it so that you can help me when I decide to learn it.

And mine, too. :-(

Sam: Ellen mentioned hearing the L/R tick tick rhythm for the Fantasie Impromptu. Do you have any idea what she meant? Choo

I'm not sure what she meant. Perhaps she'll clarify. How's the progress?

It's coming along okay. I worked on TRLRLR with the funny rhythm and it helped me get a better feel for the keys. Then, I fit them in 4 to 3. But I've slowed the tempo down from the beginning as I was losing control. My RH was running away with me.

I still don't know how you managed to learn to play this piece so well after 3 1/2 months. I'll be happy to be able to play this piece as well as you do in a year or longer!

I hope to have a videoclip of my progress in a day or two.

Sorry for not being very articulate. I meant that you can feel the polyrhythm as a steady ticking beat so that the 4 beats in the right hand against the 3 beats in the left hand produce a steady "click click" sound. Oh, someone help me to explain this better. Ellen

Whoops, this is what I meant to quote. Ellen

Choo Choo, I just listened to your videos and I think that you are putting pauses after measures. I can't quite tell but the rhythm does not sound even to me. I think the key to getting this piece is to slow it down. Believe me, this piece is pretty difficult and I don't think I ever "got it". But, it does need to have a steady, even rhythm.

Thanks for explaining, Ellen. I've slowed it down and I don't think I'm pausing as much (or hopefully, at all) between measures now. I have a feeling this will be a lifetime project after I completely get through this piece.

Hi everyone:

I've made some progress and I've posted my 3rd videoclip:

http://projectfantasie.blogspot.com/

Please let me know what you think. I appreciate all your feedback. Thanks so much for all your advice and encouragement!

Sorry, this may be a better link:

http://projectfantasie.blogspot.com/2011/12/chopin-fantasie-impromptu-in-c-minor.html

Thank you.

Uh oh. I think you can keep the rhythm at the slow tempo better than I can! I better get back to practicing!!

Sam:

You're too modest! I've never known any non-pro play this piece better than you do, fast or slow! My tempo was so uneven and the whole thing sounded so choppy and forced. I'm glad Chopin wasn't around to hear me play it. I don't dare to think what he would have said.

How did you manage the next section where the accent is on the off beat?

Do you get fatigued when you play this piece?

What kind of background did you have when you began playing piano? I still can't imagine how anyone with one year's piano can play this piece - so well, too. After my first year, I could only play Brahm's Waltz in A flat and I thought that was pretty good. You are extraordinary!

Choo

You're far too nice to me, but I'll take it

I need to go over this piece with my teacher with a fine toothed comb and fix all the problem spots.

What I did for the off beat was (and I DO NOT know if this is right, so take my advice with caution) to sort of flick my wrist slightly to the right so that my pinky accented the second note of each set of four. Does that make any sense? Hopefully someone more knowledgeable will chime in here.

I do get fatigued sometimes. I just try to take it slow and relax as much as possible, and if I get too fatigued, I take off for the day.

Thanks for the tip for tackling the off beat accent. I'm working on it. I don't know why I find it so difficult. Did you, too? Then, after practicing it and going back to bars 13-16, my fingers are confused! Chopin knew how to work the fingers or confuse the heck out of them!

I was looking over my music last night and happened to read the footnotes about bars 13-16 and 17-20. They mentioned that Klindworth, Jossefy and other editors added quarter note stems to the accented notes. Have you tried playing it that way?

Also, how are you pedaling this allegro agitato section? Are you using full or half pedal? Are you also using the soft pedal for the piano sections?

Choo Choo, I listened to your latest video and the rhythm is nice and even - no pauses between measures. It slowed down a little bit with the section you were less familiar with. Give yourself a break and learn the middle section which is easier to learn. Ellen

Don't worry. The more you practice it, the easier it will get!


I feel stupid, but I'm not even sure of the difference...



I feel stupid again here too, but I'm not really sure what the difference is between full and half pedal. I just pedaled however felt comfortable...
About the soft pedal, I've found that on an upright it doesn't do much (and it changes the feel of the action, which I don't like), so I never use it.

When I was touring piano stores on Friday and playing all these high end concert grand pianos, I tried using the soft pedal, and it's definitely something I need to learn how to do properly. Unfortunately, I hardly ever have access to a grand piano

You play on a grand piano in your You Tube videos but I notice it's in a store. Very nice, though. Do you have an upright grand? Yes, the soft pedal depresses the keys. It doesn't do that on my digital piano. Just has a muting effect but if I play on a real piano, I have a problem with the depression of the keys. Someday I need to buy a real piano.

Birba made me a video about my playing and how to approach practicing it:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kI5tdrryMFE

I forgot about that. The two videos of me on a grand were taken in August at an elementary school in Los Angeles where I'm sometimes able to practice. I'm in school in NY now and I play on an old upright Yamaha U3 that a friend and I bought. During the summer, I bought a U1 for my parents' house in LA, so I can play that when I'm staying at home.

I need to get myself a really nice grand piano. Hopefully sometime in the next few years...

That is so cooooool!!

Sam Bravo! amazing for just 1 year..I noticed there are 2 versions of fantasie impromtue
the one on the yamaha "U" your hand movments, seems more mechanical like typing, however on the grand,way better! more fluid hand movements,nice musical flow.. :)great job!

Thanks! That's very interesting. You are the first person to say that the video on the grand was better. The grand had a heavy action, and I was struggling with it a lot. The "U" is much lighter and I thought my performance sounded a lot better on it (even if I was using my fingers too much). Now that I got a teacher I'm working on my technique, and the first thing he wanted to change was the overuse of my fingers giving that "typing" look. Changing technique is hard, so we'll see how it goes. Wish me luck

Sam: Isn't that rather odd..you'd think the heavier action would cause you to play more mechanistic(typing) and the light action more fluidly?, and yet its just the opposite?
look at the 2 videos again..look how fluidly your hands move on the grand! If there are any
piano techs out there that can explain why this is? you should actually be gliding through
on the grand with a light action,not heavy?.. all the best with your teacher..your certainly are an inspiration..looking forward to more videos in the future..again, great job!

I almost fell over backward when I clicked on his link and he began, "Choo Choo Love ..." I thought he was a terrific teacher.

Check this out:

http://pianosage.blogspot.com/2011/08/how-to-play-chopins-fantasie-impromptu.html

I just began working on the middle section (Moderato Cantabile) while I'm working on the beginning. I have a question for bar 49. Are those 4 little notes (C, Db, Eb, Db) that appear before F played before the beat (after the Ab of the LH) or played with the Db and Ab of the LH (2 RH notes to each LH note)? And what do you call these 4 little notes? Are they grace notes?

I see a similar pattern in bar 57, but there, the 4 notes are 32nd notes and played with the LH notes.

I had the same question but was too lazy to ask, so I just BSed my way through it. Lol
It's good to have a teacher

Birba, the piano teacher from Italy, answered my question. He said they were just embellishments and you can practice without them and then put them in later. You can play them slowly or faster, whatever you want. So basically, you BSing your way through them was the correct approach. It IS good to have a teacher! I should get one, too, but I don't have your assertiveness. I'm afraid the teacher will get me to play whatever I'd rather not play and I'm only interested in Chopin and Beethoven.

Here's the 4th videoclip of my progress thus far:

http://projectfantasie.blogspot.com/

Please visit and tell me if you see any improvements in my performance. I appreciate all suggestions and tips. Thank you!

Choo Choo,
Just listened to your latest installment and you have made a lot of progress in 17 days - impressive. The 1st section (12 measures) sounds really good and even. The next section that you're working on (measure 13-24) you might try to play to melodic line (top note that is accented) separately so that it is better phrased. Right now, the top notes sound all the same in loudness. In the B section of the piece I think you need to make the right hand a little louder and the left hand softer so that the melody has a singing quality. Ellen

Thanks, Ellen, for watching my video and for the tips and observations. I'm glad to hear that you think I've made progress. All that slow practicing has helped. When I began, I really didn't think I'd get this far. Those 4 notes against 3 always scared me. But now I think I can do it.

I have a problem with bars 11 and 12. When I hear the pros playing it, it sounds like a rushing waterfall. I can't figure out how to do it.

Also, the LH phrasing - when I watch the pros, they don't even appear to phrase the LH. Am I supposed to or not?

I'll work on the accented notes separately. I've been watching Paul Barton on The Piano Sage and trying to practice according to his suggestion.

Choo, I wanted to thank you for starting this thread thus unwittingly helping me to commit myself to trying to learn and play the Fantasie Impromptu. The piece first came to my attention about 50 years ago and I remember spending 10 minutes or so making a half-hearted attempt to put the first few bars together before quickly giving up.

Just to provide some context, I’m a very late adult returner (intermediate as a youngster) now in my dotage still with an intermediate ability right hand but, after years of amateur jazz and pop/R&B where the LH for the most part is very secondary, almost idle, I’m left with poor support in my left, also some creeping arthritis which is why I thought it better to wait before posting until I’d spent some time on the piece. Now that I think I can stay the course I’ll drop in to the thread from time to time to report back and hopefully contribute, though in attempting the impromptu I’m punching well over my weight so I can’t promise I’ll have anything useful to offer!

(Sam - I’ve looked at your page and noted your remarkable progress. To have reached such a stage from a standing start so as to be able to please an audience with your performance of Fantasie after just a year is impressive to say the least, almost freakish! Are you still working on the piece to improve it further or will you put it to one side now that you’ve got a teacher?)

For the moment I’m tackling only the allegro section where there are so many difficulties to overcome but I’ll mention just a couple for now since these seem to be common amongst most of us learners.

Regarding the 3 against 4, I’ve noticed very often the difficulty recedes as you build up speed, perhaps because of the limited amount of time one has to execute the sequence of notes? That said, I’m meeting with variable success, some sections are fairly smooth but others are lumpy and while I can reach a fair clip in the RH, my LH needs a lot of work. Typically I do a lot of looping practice, usually a full bar over and over but often just a half bar and sometimes even a single beat. Let’s say I’m working on a single bar with a 3-4 timing difficulty. I’ll run the LH on its own until it’s smooth then add the RH for just one cycle of the bar, then rest the RH for a bar while the LH is still playing to check for evenness and then re-introduce the RH again following that pattern ad-infinitum, i.e. LH is continuous, the RH plays a bar, rests a bar and so on. This is producing results for me.

Like you, I’ve a real difficulty from bar 17 and onwards where the accent shifts to the upper octave, 2nd semiquaver of each quadruplet but I tried a new approach yesterday and it seems to be helping. Instead of Paul Barton’s idea of playing only the solo melody notes shifted just after the beat (I tried this without benefit), I’m using a slight variation which is to play the full part but to try and get the fingers of the three unaccented notes to ‘ghost’ their part round the accented note i.e. allow the other 3 fingers to fall onto their respective keys without playing so you end up with the Barton ‘sound’ but your other fingers are working too. Usually I find it hard to avoid depressing one or two of the notes - and of course that means they'll speak - but this doesn’t appear to make the exercise any the less effective. I do it slowly, playing bar 17 only as a loop until it’s consistent at which point I let the 3 unaccented notes sound at their proper level and I’ll allow a bit of a speed up (still looping 17) then, once I’ve a measure of confidence I proceed into the following bars to complete that passage. I think Sam talked about a flick of the wrist to get the pinkie louder, to me it feels also like a stab into the note. I’m still significantly slower in 17 etc than in 13-16 but I’m optimistic that this will work.

Choo, I think the fluidity in bars 11,12 will come naturally as you build up speed and start to introduce more expression as you become confident. In any case, it’s good that you’re playing that first section from memory. Keep up the good work and I’ll make a point of following your video progress. I’m ‘in between’ pianos at the moment but when more settled might even post a video of my own.

Apologies for rambling on.

Look at that Choo! You're inspiring other people to start trying this piece too!
We should have threads like this one for many of the hard-but-doable pieces out there. Maybe I'll start one for Ballade no 1 or maybe for Moonlight sonata 3rd movement.



Thank yooouu!
The goal is to improve my technique overall (the biggest issue being dependence on fingers to the exclusion of arm/shoulder), so I'll definitely be revisiting everything I know with the teacher in order to make it as good as it can be at my current level. I'm hoping that having a teacher will speed up my progress somewhat so that I'll be looking at not just a qualitative difference in my output but also a quantitative one. I've only had two lessons but I feel that in that short time I've learned many important things and I feel more comfortable at the keyboard already.

I'm not sure this is the best advice since I never learned to play this piece very well, but I think you need to get the LH on autopilot so that you're not even thinking about the LH - basically memorize it. I don't think there should be a lot of dynamics in the LH like you mentioned. Then you can focus on phrasing the RH and the cascading fall in bars in 11 and 12 will come on their own. Each successive 4 note phrase should become softer but there should be dynamics in each of the phrases (crescendo slightly between notes 2 and 3).

Hello and thanks for sharing your background with me. I'm glad I've been an inspiration for you to learn this piece. We can learn to play it together.

Sam Rose is something else. I told him he's like a March Wind that roars into town, blowing everyone else out! If he had begun piano at a much younger age, he would have been considered a child prodigy. But it's never too late for him to make a name for himself, if so inclined.

I do like Paul Barton's method of getting the accented notes down. I'm now able to play with all the notes from bars 17 to 20 but I often return to play just the top accented note with the LH. I'm also using Sam's suggestion of flicking toward the right. Seems to help.

I'll probably post some musings on my blog tonight about my practice and what others have said about my most recent video. Hope you'll visit my blog.

I look forward to watching you play, however far you've gone. Perhaps I could post your YouTube video to my blog!! (only with your permission, of course)

Isn't it cool? I LOVE to hear that others are inspired by me to try learning this piece. Perhaps if we all finish it about the same time, we can have a recital for all of us together!

I think it would be a wonderful idea for you to begin a topic on Ballade or Moonlight No 3. I've always wanted to play those two. Also Revolutionary Etude. Now that you have such a fine teacher, you could share some of what you learn with us! Will you?

Happy Hanukkah! Did you like the greeting I sent you?

Hey, I love the ego-stroking as much as anyone else, but I honestly hate the word "prodigy." I don't think I am one, and I think it minimizes the actual work that was put into learning to play. Many (probably MOST) kids who end up becoming great musicians are moderately talented, NOT prodigies, and just work VERY hard, either because they love it or because they are forced (hopefully because they love it!).



Perhaps I will start a topic. Maybe after finals.
I may share some things I learn, but what we've done so far is mostly technical and can't really be explained on the forum (it was hard enough to try to understand in person).

The greeting was very cute. I sent you a response to that last night. Check your messages

Sorry you hate the word Prodigy. I think Beethoven did, too! So you're not alone! He never believed in child prodigies. I don't know what I believe. Not much of anything, I think.

I'll go and take a look at my email.

It's a very interesting debate. It's not that I'm offended by the word or anything, so don't worry. I think that people like to use the word prodigy because it lets them feel that they are looking at someone super special and allows them to believe that they could never do what the "prodigy" is doing. Would you call yourself a prodigy? Probably not, but you are working hard at this piece and I think you will be able to play it very well in time. Someone who listens to you play it in a hotel might gush about how awesome you are, but really it's usually just a matter of hard work.

Before I started playing, I was firmly on the other side of the debate. I have a friend from Los Angeles who studies composition at Berklee and he argued against my position, telling me that if I didn't try, I'd never know whether I could play or not. His argument was one of the catalysts that got me to start, and now I'm more on his side of the debate. Obviously, there is some amount of raw talent that some people have more of, and some don't have at all, but within the middle level of this raw talent a LOT can be accomplished through hard work and determination.

I completely agree with you. And I remember telling you the same thing some time ago, that is, that you have the gift and with the hard work you put into it, you'll go places. I'm not sure where you want to go with this but you're definitely on the right path. I only wish I was as focused in my younger years. When I post Birba's video to my blog tonight, I'll place an announcement on this topic. I have a feeling it will take a while for me to get this new technique down. Of course, he was working with me on my areas of weakness and the stuff I need to work on may not be what you or anyone else needs to work on. I have a feeling that you do not have a problem with tension. I wonder if the stress of my life (this year has been incredibly stressful) is falling over into my playing.

Birba made me a new video yesterday to demonstrate a new passage. I've uploaded it to my blog:

http://www.projectfantasie.blogspot.com

Hi. I just wanted to say that I have been following your blog and this thread with much interest. Unfortunately this piece is well above me so I'm not able to do it or contribute anything to help you. However i just wanted to say how motivating it is to see you work through this piece. It actually has me thinking to ask my teacher for a challenge piece in the new year.

You are doing very well by the way! You seem to be making very quick progress. All the best to you and keep up the good work!

Hi ZoeCalgary:

Thanks for writing to let me know what you're following my blog and my progress. I hope you'll be able to play this piece sometime, perhaps next year, as you mentioned.

The "tutoring" I have received from Birba has been invaluable. Without that, I doubt I'd be able to progress as much as I have. I'm very excited about his second lesson and have become a bit of a practice addict. Before that, I was practicing one hour a day only. I got tired and frustrated with the inability to get the off beat accented part. But now I've got it, I feel like a new me and I jump on the piano bench whenever I can! It's quite funny actually. I even find myself doing his exercises without the piano! I think he's created a monster.

I hope you keep following my blog and I'm so glad I was able to motivate you.

Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!

Choo

I was wondering if anyone can help me with this. On Katsuri's video's, he suggests using the soft pedal for the beginning of this piece. Paul Barton from The Piano Sage website warns against over pedaling. What is the best way to pedal this piece? Should I use the half pedal? And if I use the soft pedal, when should I lift it up? Thanks.

I think over pedaling refers to the sustain pedal, not the soft pedal. I like to use the soft pedal the second time you play the main melody, and in other places in the piece. In my video, there is no soft pedal and there is some over pedaling on the sustain, but that's because I hadn't started using the soft pedal when I made the video.

Thanks, Sam. You mean, you use the soft pedal now on page 2? After the off beat passage? How about after the slow middle section?

I just wanted to wish everyone a very merry Christmas! And a big thank you to all who have helped me with my piece.

HI, Candlelightpiano,

Thanks for posting your progress on this piece--I am really enjoying it. I'd like to learn this piece someday.

About the soft pedal--my teacher has instructed me to use the una corda (soft pedal) in places where I want it to be extremely quiet--such as when a piece says pp or ppp.

On the first page, my edition (Alfred edition) says "u.c." (una corda) on measure 5 until measure 9. My edition has that section marked as (pp). So, you hold down the left pedal (soft pedal) from the beginning of measure 5 until measure 9.

Measure 9 begins with (p), so releasing the soft pedal will make that section a little less quiet, which is what you want when going from pp to p.

You can still pedal with the right pedal as usual while holding down the soft pedal from measures 5-9.

My edition also says "the dynamic shading is essential: for instance, in measure 5, the crescendo is only for that measure, and this same procedure is followed in measures 6 and 7; a crescendo is immediately followed by a subito pianissimo."

Hope this helps a little bit. Have fun!

Thank you so much, Playagain! I really appreciate your taking the time to share this information with me because my edition (Alfred Masterwork Palmer) doesn't have any una corda indication whatsoever. There aren't any crescendo/ descres markings in bars 5 and 6 either in my edition.

Can you please take a look at bar 12 of yours and tell me if it shows four short 16th note phrases with diminuendo signs under each phrase?

HI, Candlelightpiano,

My Alfred edition is an "Anatomy of a Classic" edition, edited by Maurice Hinson.

It actually has two versions of Fantaisie-Impromptu. One is called the Fontana Edition, and the other version says Fantaisie Impromptu Op. posthumous BI 87. It says BI stands for the 2nd edition of "Chopin: An Index of His Works in Chronological Order" by Maurice J. E. Brown.

It says that the Fontana 1855 edition is allegedly based on a manuscript dated 1834. The Fontana edition doesn't have the una corda markings or the crescendo markings in bars 5 and 6.

The Fontana edition does have the diminuendo markings under each group of 4 16th notes in bar 12.

The other Fantaisie-Impromptu version (Op. Posthumous BI 87) that I mentioned last time does not have those markings in bar 12. It does have accent marks over the first note of each group of 4 16th notes in the right hand.

That version is listed first in my booklet, so I was looking that that version when I saw the una corda markings.

Hope this helps!

Choo Merry Christmas and all the best in the New Year for you as well!

PS I didn't mean to imply I would be ready for a piece as hard as this any time soon. Your encouragement did bring a smile to my face though!! When I said challenge piece I meant something down nearer to my level. I'm pretty sure that means many levels below this piece!

Hi Playagain:

Thank you for the information regarding the differences in the two versions of Fantasie. It's so interesting. I have a book by Maurice Hinson for the Romantic Period. Unfortunately, Fantasie is not on it. On the version with the una corda markings, are any other bars marked una corda or just bars 5 - 9? Also where you have accents on the first group of 16th notes in bar 12, is each group a separate phrase?

I wish you a very joyous Christmas day and many thanks once again for your help with this.

Thank you, Zoe! A merry Christmas and a very happy new year to you, too! I don't really know what level this piece is or what level I'm at, to be honest with you. I wasn't even sure I could play this piece when I began so you never know what you can do till you give it a try. It's not an easy piece, though. I feel more confident about it now that I've overcome the 4 notes into 3 and I think I've overcome the off beat passages.

HI, Candlelightpiano,

There aren't any other una corda markings on that version. In Bar 12, there are not individual phrase markings over each group of 4 16th notes.

The phrase mark extends from the beginning of bar 11 through the end of bar 12.

That two-measure phrase mark is like that through bar 20, so it is over bars 13-14, again over 15-16, over 17-18, and over 19-20.

Thanks! Hope you have a very merry Christmas, too!

Hi Playagain:

Thanks so much for taking the time to look over your music and pass the info to me. There's quite a great deal of difference between your edition and mine. I marked the difference you mentioned in mine so that I can try practicing it the other way and see which method I prefer. I'm going to purchase a copy of the one you have.

Have you played this piece?

I hope to have a video update tomorrow or Wed, to mark my one month mark in learning this piece. It's still messy and all over the place but I think it will be good to do a recording.

Have a very happy and healthy new year!

HI, Candlelightpiano,

No, I haven't played it yet, except to play around with the first part just now after following your thread.

I bought it probably about a year ago--I sometimes pick up some sheet music when it's on sale at sheetmusic plus (online) or just when I feel like it will be something I'd like to learn eventually.

When I first looked at it, I put it aside because I thought it looked too difficult! So, I hadn't looked at it again until I saw your thread and website.

I would like to try to play it sometime fairly soon, but I'm taking lessons again in January, and I've already picked the pieces to work on for this next session. I'm taking adult piano lessons through the nearby community college, so it's on a semester basis (I'm an adult re-learner). So, my teacher and I already decided to work on some Schubert and Debussy pieces this semester.

There are also pages of notes about the piece in the Anatomy of a Classic edition, and it has both versions in it, so it's pretty neat if you'd like to learn more about the piece.

It would be interesting to know which version most pianists play. Maybe someone knows which is more common? You can also post questions at Pianist Corner--there are a lot of people who love Chopin music there.

Have fun, and I hope you have a wonderful new year! Can't wait to see your new video update!

By the way, when you record with a video recorder, can you re-record over it? I just wondered because I'm sure I'd make a lot of mistakes and I'd want to re-record it a lot. So, I'd use up a lot of disks with my old video recorder! Thanks! Kathy

Hi Kathy:

You were lucky to find that edition on sheet music plus. I usually purchase a lot of music from them but they didn't have this edition you have so I have to get it from Australia!! Amazon.com has it on their used marketplace but the seller does not ship to Canada.

What do you mean by re-record over something you record? When I make a lot of mistakes during recording, I usually delete it on the camera itself and re-do the recording. I try it a few times and pick out the best one. After 3 attempts, I give up if I can't get a fairly good recording. Since everyone who is following my blog knows I'm learning this piece, I don't feel that I need to "produce" an exceptional video!! That's the good thing about having a blog when you don't have a teacher. That's my secret to success!! This next video is going to be messy so be warned!

Thanks for sharing your music with me. If you hadn't told me about this edition, I would never have known about it. I definitely want to get a copy of it as this is my favorite piece. I'll go and take a look at the topic you mentioned, too. Thanks.

Good luck with your new teacher! I should get a teacher but I'm having too much fun learning to play this piece this way. I might, in future.

Choo

HI, Candlelightpiano,

I just checked at sheetmusic plus, and it is here:
http://www.sheetmusicplus.com/title/Fantaisie-Impromptu/3533418 but it says that it leaves the warehouse in 1-2 weeks, so it would take awhile. It says "Anatomy of a Classic" on the front cover.

I see that someone at the other forum says that your version is a good version. That's good to know.

I have a very old video camera, so I can't delete from it. I'll have to look at newer ones sometime!

I'm sure no one expects your videos to be perfect when learning something--I just wondered because I've never recorded myself playing on video before (just sound recordings), so I wondered if it was possible to delete or re-record video, and it sounds like it is possible to delete, which would be nice!

That is great that you are having a lot of fun and learning so much, too! Thanks! Kathy

Kathy:

I should have asked you before I ordered a copy from Australia and had to pay big bucks for shipping! I went to sheetmusicplus and ran a search and came up with nothing. I wonder if I can cancel my order from Australia and order from sheetmusicplus instead. Thanks so much for all your help.

I'm going to try making a video tonight. This morning, I was messing up so much I thought otherwise but then, I thought I really needed to show how I was playing the off beat section in order to get feedback. I'm not sure it's the right way. There's also a couple of difficult passages I need help with so I'll try and do a video tonight.

HI, Candlelightpiano,
Yes, it can be hard to find certain pieces online. Hopefully you can cancel your other order.
I look forward to seeing your video! I hope someone can help you with the difficult parts--I'm not very familiar with this piece, but hopefully someday! Have fun! Kathy

Have you tried imslp.org? They have sheet music for all the classical pieces, and usually all the different editions. Let me know if you can't find the piece and I'll link you to it.

I used music from there, and it even had some performance notes that were helpful.

Hi Sam:

Thanks for the link. I didn't know about it and they have a different version with a much higher suggested tempo. It's a good site. I'll browse the site for other pieces.

I didn't do a recording last night. The whole thing was so messed up that I decided to start all over at the slowest tempo, making sure they're all even, and then speeding up to about 66. That will take a few days or more. So perhaps next week.

Choo

Hi Kathy:

No luck with the video recording. I must have made a million mistakes! So frustrating. So I'm starting all over again at the slowest metronome tempo. It's good. I'm finding out that there were many areas of unevenness so I'm working on them as I move the speed up. Looks like no video this week.

Choo

Hi Choo, sounds like you are stressed and you shouldn't be. The important thing is learning the song not getting the videos done (though I love watching them!). If you can hear your unevenness you are listening to what you're doing and that is a GOOD thing! Going back to fix this now will save you lots of work later I'm sure.

When I get bogged down like this I find taking a break from the piece can be beneficial too. It's like your brain and your hands have to catch up to each other and you just need time to mesh things together.

Because of you, I may stop in at a music store today to check out more music! I don't need more music to play cause I have tons but I'm looking for a fun challenge piece based on your journey with this piece.

I'm sure it will all come together for you soon and you can move on to the next part!

Great advice there. Just take a day or two and don't play at all (easier said than done, I know). When you come back, your hands and your mind will feel fresh, like a cold wind blowing on your face. Try it

HI, Choo,

It can be very frustrating, and as others have said, a break from the piece can help. You might be putting too much pressure on yourself, too, with the videos, so take your time. It is a difficult piece.

Slowing down sounds like a good idea, too, whenever you do want to work on it. I often have to go back and do that with the metronome, and it helps so much. It is good that you are really listening to your playing.

Good luck! Kathy

Hi Zoe, Sam and Kathy:

Thanks all of you for your words of encouragement. What would I do without friends like you? I confess I'm a bit obsessed with this piece, even though I am working on a few others at the same time.

I think the only way I can take a full break from the piano is to go away for a week or two (I may do that if January gets too cold!)! And to think I had a piano for 8 years and hardly played on it! In those days, you couldn't get me to play if you bribed me!

Well, slowing down is working well. I feel in better control over the music. Someday I'll be happy to play as well as Sam!

Choo

Did you ever go through this similar phase when you were learning this piece? Like, it's atrociously messy and you have to slow down and start all over again?

Well, I posted a new topic in the Pianist Corner to find out about other editions of this piece and I thought you might all be interested in the topic thread:

http://www.pianoworld.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/1814486.html#Post1814486

There was an interesting debate between a few of the pianists on the topic.

I did go through that phase. I spent a lot of time in that state actually. The first video I took was LONG before I was ready to play the piece at tempo, and it's pretty terrible. I don't know if you've watched it, but I only leave it up for the sake of the "journal" aspect of my channel, because it is painful for me to listen to now. Even the second video has messy areas. It just takes time for us amateurs to smooth things out. Be sure to do lots and lots and lots (I can't stress this enough) of SLOW practice. I did that in between the fast playing, because fast is much more fun. Honestly, that approach may be detrimental, because you could get into bad habits playing poorly at a fast tempo, but it was the only way I could keep myself motivated, and it seems to work for me.

Yes, I've been following the thread. Fantaisie Impromptu is one piece many folks over there love to bash, as if music is a completely objective field where a piece is either "good" or "not good." I admit it's overplayed, but that's just because it has a really catchy fast melody and a really sweet melody in the middle, and because it's so much fun to play (and so much easier to play than it looks). I will continue playing it and not worry that some people (pretentious people, in my humble opinion) don't think the music is worthy.

Pretentious is a good word to describe those people! I completely agree. Besides, the fact is that the great pianists like Rubenstein and Horowitz played it and today, Yundi Li, among others, play it. From Birba's video, we can see that he plays it. He knows every note of that piece and he has said that it's a good encore piece. I'm getting help from AJ on PianoStreet as well. He's a teacher from Australia, very dedicated, and he loves this piece. So I thought I'd make a video tonight to show him my problem areas in order to get some feedback. I may send it to Birba and I may post to my blog.

What you said about being in the phase I'm in makes me feel better. Thanks. It's not that easy to play, at least, not for me, or not yet for me.

Well, I'll see if I can make a video tonight. Thanks so much, Sam. It's really nice to be able to talk to someone who has been through the same experience.

To clarify my opinion, nobody has to like the piece. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, as long as they don't force it down our throats.

I'm not saying that it's easy to play. I mean that it's much easier to play than it looks, which is one reason why it's so popular. It will sort of fall into place more and more as you practice (at least that's what happened for me). There's still lots of room for me to improve on it, mostly with changes in technique which I am working on.

I hope it will fall into place for me, too. Definitely, playing the 4 notes against 3 has fallen into place but I seem to be stuck on this accented part. I think I'm probably over doing it. I videotaped myself last night and looked at my hand and I looked over rotated. Didn't appear natural.

Well, guys, this is it! I've had it! My play has regressed. I've decided to take some time off from the piano completely. Don't know when I'll be back! But I shall return. Thanks for visiting my blog and thanks for your continued support.

Candlelightpiano,
I'm sorry to hear that you've had it. A break can be a good thing, and hopefully you'll be back at it soon. You were making a lot of progress!

I wish you all the best, and hope that you'll be back soon! Kathy

Thanks, Kathy. Yeah, I need a break. I'm tired and burned out. I just need to recharge and feel excited about the piece again.

I'll be back, for sure.

Choo

Choo you have made amazing progress and I'm glad to hear you're not giving up completely. That would be a shame because you are doing so well. But I do agree that a break might be a good thing for you.

I'm not sure if this would help or not but A few days ago I went to the music store and saw the score for this piece. Oh my! I almost turned and ran away. Wow! It does look very difficult. At my stage I don't even know how to decipher the notes. Way way way above me! And right away I thought of you and thought wow what amazing will to want to learn this on your own! I was impressed before but having seen the Score I am even more so now! I didn't buy it because it makes me sad when the music is too difficult for me.

But again because of your journey I did get a new book with late intermediate pieces in it. (I think I'm at an early intermediate level now). So I went through these on the included cd and picked my favorites. I'll review with my teacher and see what she thinks. I really want to do a challenge piece because as you said how will I know if I can do it if I don't try!

Enjoy your break, I am eagerly awaiting your return! Take care!

Zoe: I will DEFINITELY return. I'm just enjoying some days off from the keys to do other things and get a rest.

If I had posted my video last night, everyone would have told me I needed to take a LONG break! My frustrations showed through and through. And I was murdering the piece that I love so much! So I realized I had to take some time off. Funny thing is that Birba, the fellow from Italy who has given me two video lessons, suggested two weeks into my learning this piece that I should take at least one month off because of my hammering touch. I told him I wasn't going to do that because I had only started two weeks ago. He was quite surprised to hear that and said I should be able to get to speed quite quickly then. But now, I think I'll take his advice, though probably not for a month. Maybe a week or less. We'll see.

How long have you had lessons? What pieces are you playing now?

Hi! I took about 5 years of organ lessons waaaay back when I was between 12-17 or so. Then just got busy growing up, first job, etc. I always liked playing and never minded practicing. This past spring the music bug hit me again when I was thinking of starting my 7 year old and 5 year old sons on piano lessons. Before too long I got a second hand acoustic and started lessons in June 2011. I've had 6 months of lessons. At some point I decided to do the RCM graded exams. At first my teacher thought we should start at grade 2 then after the summer break in August she said we should prepare for level 4 instead. I was happy and shocked! When I first saw the grade 4 materials I thought oh oh!! But now I think it is something I can do even though i have gaps in my learning (particularly the technical requirements and ear training).

For my exam I am currently learning Minuet in D Minor (Bach), The Wild Horseman (Schumann), and Sonatina in G Major op.36 no.2, movement III (Clementi). I've already learned Fantasia in E Minor (Telemann) (which I posted a video of in the December Piano Bar).

In Nov/Dec. I took a break from scales, etc. And did a whole bunch of Christmas songs from the level 4 Faber book.

The piano has always fascinated me and I can't believe I have my own piano and taking lessons again. I am so addicted. I would play all the time if I could. I just have to be patient to go through the process. I have heard so much beautiful music from all the great folks on this forum I keep adding to my to do list.

Thanks, Zoe, for sharing your music background with me. Grade 4 RCM - WOW! That's pretty good considering you've only been back 6 months! CONGRATULATIONS! I'm not familiar with the RCM as I grew up doing the ABRSM exams in Malaysia. I do know that the RCM has 10 grades before diploma but with the ABRSM, there are only 8 grades before diploma. Other than that, I don't know much but I am familiar with the pieces you're working on for your exam. When will you be taking your exam? How about theory? Are you at the same grade?

Well, I'm not back yet, as far as getting back to practice but I had an idea last night that I thought would help me get over this slump.

First, I will break this piece into 5 parts, like a puzzle:

Section 1: Bars 1 to 24 - this is the section I've been beating up the last two weeks.
Section 2: Bars 25 to 40
Section 3: The lyrical middle section - I've got this part memorized
Section 4: Bars 83 to 102 - Oh, the dreaded Section 1 again but even worse, now at a faster tempo!
Section 5: Bars 103 - 138 - Finale

So, when I'm ready to return to the piano, I plan to work on Sections 2 and 3 and only work on Section 1 when I'm in the mood for it. I've also decided that I will post videos of passages I'm having trouble with and get feedback rather than beat those areas to pieces and burning myself out. So, that's my plan for now but I'm still taking a break. I'll be back!

Okay. I decided to quit procrastinating and just do a recording of the problem passage I've been working on over the last 2 weeks:

NEW VIDEO - ACCENTED PASSAGE

I’m pleased to see you're still determined, Choo. Most important of all is not to put yourself under undue pressure. The thread will always be there for you to revive as and when you want so it doesn’t really matter whether the Fantaisie takes you 10 weeks, 10 months or longer. Choose your own pace.

Regarding bars 17-22. I suspected there was a trick to this, that some players (all players?) were producing their accents on the pinky by synchronizing the pinky notes with the quarter note accents. Birba confirmed this in his 2nd video where he points out that the pinky note becomes the new downbeat. I’ve messed around with the score for bar 17 to demonstrate what I think he’s advocating and I certainly found it works well for me. Do try it out for yourself. I’d recommend working on just cycling bar 17 alone but first of all make sure that you can cycle bar 13 (HT) so that you can play it on autopilot, accent on the thumb.

Now, for bar 17, cycle this instead.



These are the exact same notes you were cycling in bar 13 but the entire RH pattern as been shifted a 16th note earlier. The pinky accents should now be quite easy once you get into the loop since they correspond exactly with the dominant LH notes which fall on the quarter notes. Once you’ve got into the pattern you should then be able to launch yourself into the remaining bars (omitting the transitional G# which is there only for cycling).

Perhaps this isn't quite what Chopin intended and the purists will take strong exception but to my ears the effect works fine and it's a lot easier to play. See what you think...

Thank you so much for watching my video and explaining your technique to me. I didn't understand what Birba meant when he said that the pinky became the downbeat. I was still playing the pinky accent on the off beat (just after the LH beat) and it was difficult but I see what you mean. I'll work on it. Thanks so much! I have a feeling this will be easier than playing it on the off beat.

Dire Tonic: I forgot to tell you that even though it's okay for me to take 10 months to complete this piece, the problem with me is that if I don't complete it in a reasonable period, I have a tendency to give it up altogether and it may be years before I return to it. So I have a tendency to push myself hard when I decide to do something or it will never get done.

I'm going to try your method this afternoon. Will let you know what happens. Thanks once again for your feedback. I really appreciate it.

Where in the piece are you at now? Could I take a look at you playing it, perhaps?

Zoe: I wanted to tell you that I got to know a nice guy from Brazil on PianoStreet Forum. He'll be attending Mt Royal Conservatory in Calgary mid-Jan. He was wondering if you knew about the conservatory? I'm assuming you live in Calgary?

Dire Tonic: I just wanted to let you know that Birba confirmed that what you said was right! So I've been practicing wrongly the last two weeks! Oh, boy! I should have made a video two weeks ago. Would have saved me a ton of anguish!

But now you can forge ahead, that's great! Birba's tip was the vital clue...

I‘ll try and post something up at a later date but at the moment I’ve too many rough edges to smooth out and a high chance of errors in many places. Current issues are:-

- concern that I might have hit a speed wall – I mentioned in a previous post that my LH has been under-used for years so I tend to get fatigue there.

- several fingering problems which only seem to manifest when I try and play fast (fast for me is half-note = 75, that’s quite a bit slower than the objective).

- still forgetting to keep the LH light (probably tension).

- small hands render the RH of bar 20 a struggle at speed, hence I lose continuity if I try and set off from bar 13 at a decent pace.

…and so many more difficulties. But I’m still enjoying working to try to overcome them and which is why I mentioned not allowing oneself to fret about failing to ‘finish’ the piece in good time, instead treating it as a work in progress though I understand your fears about losing momentum then letting go.

Looking forward to your next progress video!

A tempo of 75 to a half beat is very fast! I was only doing about 66 at the highest tempo, I think, a few weeks ago. Well, I don't have any trouble changing to playing the off beat ON the beat but I'm still stumbling a lot in that passage. I think I need to work it two bars at a time or something or slow it way down but play without stopping. I look forward to your video and thanks so much for your help today. I really appreciate it.

AJ, a teacher from Australia, has been following my blog and progress. This week, he made a video for me to demonstrate the principle of rotation. You may read about it and watch his video here:

http://projectfantasie.blogspot.com/

I'm also planning to record a video tonight to demonstrate my understanding of his method. If all goes well, I'll post it to my blog and post a link here tomorrow. Goodnight.

Hello:

I just posted a new video that I made yesterday based on the principle of rotation that AJ was talking about. I've also posted AJ's notes about it and his video on my blog. I'm playing very slowly as it's a new technique but I've basically learned the piece until the last page though not begun working on the last page yet. I'm still trying to work up to speed in the accented passages and from bars 30 - 40.

Here's my blog:

http://projectfantasie.blogspot.com/

Thanks and I look forward to your comments.

Candlelight,
I think you are doing very well! Very pretty! Thank you SO much for putting all the video instructions on your blog! I am learning so much just watching all the videos.

It's so neat to learn about the left and right rotation--I always have trouble with the small leaps going up or down the keyboard, so it was fascinating that AJ said not to try to move the thumb under, but to instead turn the hand upward (sideways), and then drop onto the thumb (going up the keys).

Thank a lot! You are getting fantastic advice! Kathy

Hi Choo, I just watch your video. Your playing at the last part of it sounds really good to me. Unfortunately I can't comment anything technically as this is way above me as you already know. But it really does sound like you are making progress. When you played hands together I thought it sounded very good!

I also watched AJ's video and I thought it was very interesting and valuable. I could see how that one simple rotation in the right direction could help keep your hand in the right position and help keep things moving along. I'll have to try and remember that on things that I'm playing. I had read once that you shouldn't 'reach' for keys to press. They should always be under your hand, so move hand first then press key. AJ's video reminded me of this as I was watching it. And as he says it can be such a small movement you may not notice it but when it's done right it makes a world of difference.

I have become more and more fascinated with this piece. I think I'll have to get my hands on a copy so I can follow along better. (thanks for naming measures by the way...otherwise I think I would struggle knowing where you are!)

Hi Choo, I’ve seen your latest video and congrats on sorting out the offbeat accent in bar 17 etc!

I’m not so sure about the rotation idea and although I humbly acknowledge AJs authority on the subject I’m not convinced it’s for me. For example, I notice when I play bar 8 which has a fair quota of left/right-ing, that the faster I play the more my wrist rotates so, bearing in mind I was never taught to rotate, this suggests to me that it's more a natural consequence than a technical device. But it may turn out to be useful for you, I don’t know. In any case, I suspect (I could be wrong) you'll be unable to start working on increasing tempo in any section until it’s under complete control of muscle memory. If that includes attention to rotation as well, then you have extra work to undertake. But I don’t rule out its possible long-term benefit to your technique – I’m not qualified to know.

Anyway, I’m pleased to see AJ and others participating in your blog – the more the better! I must say I was intrigued when he alluded to bars 13-24 requiring hours of discussion. I’d be very happy to listen to that!

By the way, my top speed of 75 is really a bluffer’s performance, what I would call the ‘Fantaisie Impromptu Effect’; it’s recognisably FI but only just. I recorded my rendition into my digital piano’s sequencer and halved the playback tempo. It was an utter mess!

Keep up the good work!

Yes, for some reason, there are a lot of really good experts on the other forum. They're simply amazing and they're so nice and helpful. I've learned more about piano playing from being on that forum for the last 6 weeks than I have from all the teachers I ever had!! Anyway, I'm glad you enjoyed it. I had to play slowly because I had to focus on the rotation. I plan to do a video about the Anatomy of a Classic, which I received last week. Just haven't had time to get to it. I thought of writing about it but I think it's easier to do a video - I'm just too lazy to write!!

Hi Zoe:

When I mentioned the measures, I nearly laughed because I knew Birba and all were watching and what would they think? They know every note of the piece! But then, I thought I was also making the video for others who were learning it or just learning piano.

Glad you enjoyed it and are thinking of buying a copy of the music. Actually, you can probably download a copy for free from the internet since you're not really learning to play it yet.

Thanks for your comments on my play. Birba said my articulation had improved but there were a lot of problems with my playing, including pedalling (too much), tension in the octaves, etc, etc. so he's given me a lot of suggestions for improvement. He's a great guy!

Choo

I think we should not get too bogged down with the rotation, especially the right left thing but instead, focus on AJ's articulation, which is absolutely beautiful. Look at the way he floats over the keys and the way his fingers sort of flick on the keys.

Birba suggested that I watch AJ's articulation and says that my articulation has improved but I need lots of work on the tension in my wrist when doing the octaves and to watch the pedaling (way too much), etc. and when speeding up, I go out of control. Anyway, I'm working on it. I put more value on Birba's advice than anyone else's.

I am planning to make a video to talk about a book that I purchased which has two different versions of FI. In that book, Maurice Hinson says that this piece is often played far too fast. It becomes an exercise in velocity rather than as a poetic expression of two contrasted moods. I thought about writing about it, then changed my mind. It's easier to do a video so that's what I'll do one of these days. Right now, I'm too busy working on the piece as I have so many problems with it. Thanks for watching.

Thanks, Candlelightpiano! I found your thread on the other forum, and I look forward to reading it when I get a bit more time. It looks like a nice forum with lots of information, and it's great that they have been so helpful.

I look forward to seeing your videos! Good luck with everything!
Kathy

Thanks, Kathy. I look forward to seeing you there - and here! All the best!

Choo! I'm here!!

Kyle:

WELCOME!! And soon, Bienvenue (Welcome to) Canada! You need to learn a bit of French soon, eh?

Zoe:

If you're watching, please say hello here!

We can all three "talk" together!

Choo

Yes Choo I am here. I have been in a slump lately as you may have seen in another thread! Yes Kyle will soon be in Calgary! Wishing him a good and safe trip.

How have you been?

Hi Zoe:

Don't worry about the slump and I didn't know about it as I've been busy learning Birba's exercises for tension free play on the other forum. I was in a slump a few weeks ago, remember, when I said I wouldn't be back for many a day? Take a few days off and do something else. Take a step back, give your hands a rest and you'll feel all better and ready for the challenge when you return. Even a day makes a world of difference.

My FI is coming along really slowly because I'm learning all these exercises to overcome tension but they'll be good for me in the long run so it's all good. I posted on my blog the link to my thread on the other side:

http://www.projectfantasie.blogspot.com

So Kyle will be there tomorrow. He's so excited but a bit apprehensive about the winter - who can blame him? It's worse in Winnipeg. It's been bone chilling cold lately, with windchills in the -30s. Too cold. I'll be going to Jamaica for a week beginning Jan 25, a welcome break and I won't be bringing my laptop.

Thanks for reaching out in friendship to Kyle. He's a really nice guy, funny, loves piano big time. I'm sure you'll like him. Do stay in touch on this thread. It will be fun to "talk" with you and Kyle when he gets there.

Choo

I'm eagerly waiting to hear your progress!!

P.S.

I sent you a message on youtube.

Sam! Good to hear from you and I hope all is well with you. Sorry I always forget to check my YouTube email.

I haven't made great progress. Well, I'm still working on bars 30 - 40 and hoping to record that for the blog tomorrow or day after. Today I posted a video of the middle section - not great but it's something, I guess. Birba's been mentoring me through some tension relieving exercises as tension is my number one problem (what's yours, if any?) but I didn't post any of his videos on my blog as I didn't get his okay but two of his videos are posted on PianoStreet forum because he put them there! The other videos he sent to me by email.

I was going to post here that I've uploaded two videos to my blog:

http://projectfantasie.blogspot.com/

The rest of the videos from Birba and me you can see on the PianoStreet thread that I've posted on the blog.

Anyway, I'm going full steam ahead to complete the piece beginning today so after bars 30 to 40, it's only the last page left and I'm home! Then, it's working out the finer details of the piece. But I'll be away for a week beginning next Wed, Jan 25. Going to Jamaica to thaw out!

Sam: I just finished memorizing the LAST page! I only started learning it tonight and then memorized it but of course, it needs a LOT of work but it feels good to complete it. Now I just have to work on the finer details and get it up to speed. Hope to be able to record it for blog before I leave for Jamaica Wed.

Hi Choo. I saw your video. Very nicely done. You are coming along great!!

I have been sending notes to Kyle but have not met him yet. Hopefully next week,. Poor guy got here on our coldest week of the year! Tomorrow we go from -30 to plus 3 degrees.

I think I am out of my slump thank goodness! It was tough. I am focused again and feeling better about things. Isn't it like magic when it all comes together on a tough spot! Like from a bunch of disjointed notes suddenly there is music! I had little glimpse of this this past week.

I didn't get much time in today as one of my kids got sick with a fever. I must get a digital very soon. Can I ask what yours is? I'm pretty sure I'm going to get a yamaha p155 (looks like a stage piano) but I'm just curious.

Glad to see your videos again. I was wondering how you were doing. Take care.

This is a great piece but a tough one! Starting today I'm also learning this piece. Very exciting to have my teacher say I'm ready for it :-)

Congratulations, Tubbie! I would've wanted to try, too, ready or not, but I have too much on my plate now. Maybe near the end of the year... I wonder if I could still catch up with you guys before then...

Candlelight: It's great that you are memorizing Fantasie as you go along You're progressing really well. Keep up the good work, but don't get so bogged down that you forget to have fun in Jamaica!

Hi Zoe!! It's good to hear from you and sorry for the late reply. I'm been busy on the other forum posting lots of videos!! I posted 4 over the last two days! I'll either entertain or bore to tears! Probably the latter.

My Yamaha digital is a YDP 121. It's no longer being sold. It's about 9 years old. I'll be buying an acoustic baby grand after my trip to Jamaica. Received a huge gift from a mega wealthy cousin!!

Do check my blog for the new video. Some of them I've only posted on the other forum and not on blog because they're so short and if you haven't been following, you won't know what the heck I'm doing anyway:

http://www.projectfantasie.blogspot.com

Glad you and Kyle will get together soon. He is homesick and this awful cold is not easy on him. He hasn't made any friends, either. Too bad he didn't decide to come to Winnipeg, instead. Hope you two will have a great time!!

TUBBIE AND WANNABEPT:

Thank you and it's wonderful that you'll be starting it soon, Tubbie. It's a great piece. A nice party piece for entertainment, you know. Everybody loves it! I've memorized the last page though not committed to memory, if you know what I mean. Working on the middle section - more trills, got to get the poly rhythm correct, more scale passage in the "angel coming down" measure, got to loosen up my left hand.

I'll have a good time in Jamaica though I'll miss my piano and my friends on the forum. It's been such a wonderful experience. So positive, motivating, everything that's great.

I know I'll complete this piece in the next month or two but even after that, I'll be posting updates on the entire piece every week or two as it will continue to be a "work in progress" for years. So never worry about catching up. You will and I look forward to seeing videos of you playing it, too, in segments as you learn it. I'll be posting lots of videos after I return.

YAAAHOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!

That is awesome news!! I think a good acoustic really brings the music out of the player. With the digital, you have to try to force it to make the music. I look forward to seeing your videos on a beautiful acoustic piano very soon

Hi Choo! I'll have to visit your blog and check out all those videos. My recent attempt to buy a digital has consumed most of my free time lately (and the worse is I didn't even get one in the end...soon though hopefully soon.)

I really wanted to wish you a great trip. Have fun! Warm and sunny! I envy you!

PS. I will hopefully meet Kyle this week. I can well imagine how it feels to be alone in a new country. The good thing is at least Calgary has come out of the -30 deep freeze we were in last week.

And yes I agree with Sam R. How exciting to be buying a grand in the very near future!! I am so happy for you. Your playing certainly deserves it!

Wow...a grand piano! I'm so envious! Which one are you getting? Post pics when it arrives!

SAM: Yes!! I can't wait to buy my baby grand. It's too bad I have to go to Jamaica first! And we also have to wait to have the flooring in our kitchen and bathroom changed first before we get the piano. The workmen will be in our house for 3 days and I don't want dust all over my new baby. Sam, you must know how I feel. Did you watch my videos of bars 30 - 40 and the Octave passages? I need to check my blog to see if I posted them.

ZOE: Kyle can't wait to meet you. He's been really lonesome and cold and miserable and depressed! Poor guy. I do like my Yamaha digital very much. It's got a great on board recorder so I can hear myself play. Nice on board metronome too and the first piece on the piano demo is of course Fantasie Impromptu so whenever I need a shot of inspiration, I play the demo and dream of myself playing like that soon!! I plan to keep my digital. I think it's good to have both digital and acoustic but I cannot wait to get my baby grand. Good luck with your search. Sounds like the model you're considering is the newer one of mine.