Hello, ALL! This is my first post - ever, ever - on ANY forum, so let me say "Sorry!" up front for any errors and clumsiness on my part!

There is a 1940's Kimball console in my hometown classifieds that I would like your opinions on. I emailed questions and here is what I know so far. I have not seen the piano yet, except the photo in the ad.

It was completely overhauled inside and out. Also regulated, restrung, refinished. I asked, but was not told, when the work was done. The guild member who did the work is a family member (of the seller), and I can meet him if/when I see the piano. They are asking $900.

I am just beginning to learn piano (I am 55 1/2 yrs old). I don't want to spend a lot on my first piano.

There is also a Baldwin console in the same paper for $975, but I have not received an answer from my email to that one.

Thank you very much to anyone who answers!

Hi, and welcome to the Piano World Forums!!

Here is my meager .02....

It is my understanding that the Kemball pianos of that ear were more or less average quality, consumer grade instruments. Secondly, it is rare that someone would take the time and expense to actually rebuild such an instrument insde and out... I would have to have an independent tech to confirm what was done if it was me. The parts alone could be more than $900.

And, thirdly, I'd recommend putting that $900 toward a newer instrument such as a studio upright.

Sorry, I wish I had more positive things to say, though I have not seen and played the piano.

Maybe others will chime in with advice.

Good luck!

Rick

P.S. If it is any consolation to you, we are the same age and I have been learning to play the piano for the last 5 years or so and I'm having a ball!!!

The definition of "overhauled" is specious at best, and considering this is a $900 console-style upright piano, it's doubtful a lot of work was done to it (at least, not recently). I agree with Rick that you may want to have an independent tech take a look at it if you like the way it sounds and plays.

Thank you, Rickster!

I think what you said in your first paragraph was in the back of my mind, but being new to pianos, I need confirmation from those with more experience.

There are only two piano retailers in this city. I have been to each once or twice. I thought they seemed rather high on their used pianos. But, I am not sure I have looked around enough to judge that fairly.

"Tried out" a new Weber upright ($4990), new Young Chang upright ($4590), used Boston upright ($7500). Did not like the way the keys felt. They were "heavy", hard to press down. The salesman said that can be adjusted "to a point". He also has a 1991 Baldwin studio ($2895), that has a much lighter touch. Tell me if I am wrong, but I think $2895 is high for a 20 year old upright.

He also has a 1918 McPhail ($4995) 5' grand that felt and sounded really nice. I was rather surprised; I did not expect such a small grand to sound that good. He says all they've done to it is new strings and refinished it (or fixed the finish). I did not take good notes.

I know I would rather have a grand. Preferably over 7'. I am a Bosendorfer wanna be and I cannot even play yet!!!

P.S. No consolation needed. I have never been embarrassed or shy about my age. Never understood why some people are. As to the piano, I think our "maturity" lends to our enjoyment of the learning itself.

By the way, what piano do you have?

You could buy a much newer Kimball console for much less. I see them in the $200-400 range regularly.

Thank you to all who replied! I agree with all you have said.

BDB - I was looking at ads again last night, and I saw some of those Kimballs.

I won't buy any piano before having a tech look at it. But, if it is close enough to me, I want to look at it first.

I need to actually look at more pianos to see if my local pickings are as slim as I think they are. I also need to finish Larry Fine's book, and the supplements. Reading this forum is very helpful, as well.

My problem is, I want a piano NOW. I would rather spend small $ now, and then get a much nicer piano in a year or two, when I am better educated about pianos AND my playing to make a wiser choice. But, I do not want to buy a piano that I do not enjoy playing, either.

I try to keep in mind, also, that if I spend more on a piano with good resale potential, I can probably get back most of what I put in it.

Thanks again!
ldm

I grew up with a Kimball 'studio-sized' upright, probably new in the 1930's. Very handsome case, wimpy touch, shrill tone. Not a great player's piano or listener's piano--- in fact, my dad couldn't stand the sound of it. It made for problems. Kimball was, actually, primarily a furniture company. I have heard that there are better-sounding models of that make, but I haven't seen any and honestly couldn't recommend it.

Since you're right there in Indiana, you might call or even visit the Charles Walter Piano factory and retail showroom in Elkhart. They make a fine product. If you can find a used CW 1500 to buy for a first piano, I think you would do much better for yourself than to go for a Kimball. (They also sell used pianos at the CW showroom, some by other makers.)

Whether you buy from them or not, it would be very helpful for your piano-shopping education. If you have to shop a little longer and harder to meet your budget, or even save up a bit more, it would be better for you than to buy an old beater for a first piano--- and I've played on plenty of them. There's a post, right on this same page, from a lady who apparently bought a piano in a great hurry and now is not at all happy, and who is trying belatedly to save herself. Take a clue for your own good. As they say, "Marry in haste..."

http://charleswalterpianos.com/

Well, I have a 1978 model Yamaha C7 semi-concert grand that I absolutely love, and a recent 1985 model Baldwin 243 studio upright that I like a lot and a 1907 model Schiller 50" upright and a Casio Privia PX310 digital piano... almost a piano in every room of my house!

And, with all due respect to the piano dealer you are visiting, all those prices seem way high to me.... maybe I'm just a cheap-skate, I don't know, but I think you can do better at the right dealer. Of course, I don't blame the dealer for wanting to make a killing profit on their pianos...

You might want to contact a local piano tech and a mover and start looking at some private sale pianos... the prices should definately be less and you might find a great value for your piano money.

Good luck with your search!

Rick

I'll second Jeff Clef's suggestion; go visit the Walter factory. They make a fine product. Several of our forum posters have visited and speak highly of the experience. As Jeff said, their showroom normally has used pianos of several brands. If they have a used Walter 1500/1520, give it/them a serious look. I'd recommend calling first to see what's available.

Charles

Jeff, you made me laugh! Shrill tone is one of my fears. One dealer here has two 5'7" Steinways (M's?), and to my ears they are way too bright. I think a trip to Walter would be very helpful. It is a 6-7 hour drive from here (southwestern corner).

Rickster. WOW! are you collecting? Glad to know you agree with me on the prices at the dealer. The Baldwin is on consignment, so I don't know if the price is negotiable. He also has a 1990, 7'9" Petrof, on consignment from a couple who moved to Florida. They want $31,000 (down from 33!!). Even if I could afford it, I think that is an inflated price. But she does have a really good sound and feel.

I think I need to put the brakes on my itchy fingers until I meet some techs (especially independent ones). There's two or three listed on the Guild's website within 20 miles of my zip code. Hadn't thought about talking to the mover. Good idea.

Thanks again!

There are other relatively inexpensive pianos that are not bad choices as instruments, yet which would not put you in the poorhouse. I believe ChasT found a used Kawai UST-9, which he likes (and I like). http://kawaius.com/main_links/vertical_09/ust-9.html
The was (and maybe still is) one at a local community center that I used to play, though it was in the process of being torn up. I still think of making them an offer on it, just to save it. That same maker's K-3 is a popular upright model at a modest price point. Plays nice, looks nice although the fold-out music rack is not what I would call a nice feature. But still. There may be more of them out there which people are selling used or trading in, so they can move up the piano food chain.

There are others.

Alas for Baldwin. A formerly fine company, ruined by a toothpaste executive and now gobbled up by the Chinese. Used specimens are now getting a little on the old side, but who knows, you may be a lucky man. As for the Kimball, look at it if you like--- why not? The piano education. Very valuable. The oceans seethe with piano plankton at certain seasons--- even the Arctic, of all places; there are no true backwaters. And we know that whales, the mightiest of ocean creatures, are plankton feeders.

Bon appetit!

Jeff - you are a poet! or philosopher!

To all who care to respond, I am leaving in approx 15 minutes to look at a Petrof upright, she says 10 yrs old, very little play time. She has all the papers. This will be my first private seller. I am looking forward to it, with a small amount of trepidation. Leaving the checkbook at home. They (parents) are asking $3500.

Any and all input is appreciated. I already know a tech needs to look at it - hence, the checkbook staying at home!

Thank you!

I'm thinking you'll like the Petrof... I owned a Petrof 46" upright for a couple of years; it had a soft touch and a warm, mellow tone... very clear.

If the one you are looking at is the 50" model, the price is in the ball-park, but some additional negotiations are in order.

Check the serial # for age, and if you like it, I'd suggest investing in a tech evaluation just to be on the save side.

Good luck!

Rick

Well, Rick, she is beautiful, even though I prefer the ebony mirror finish. But that is only her outer covering, Mahogany polish.

Serial # 559069, best I have been able to deduce from three websites, says she was built in 1998. They purchased her from a local dealer (same one whose prices we agree are high) for $5000, in 2000. They thought they were buying a new piano. Maybe the piano had been in the showroom that long, or maybe the salesman misled the buyers.

Has not been tuned in 7-8 years. Their daughter lost interest in piano shortly after they purchased the piano.

Could not find a model number. Under the keyboard, the dad found "115-1CHIPP". Maybe she has one chip somewhere (ha-ha). Measured 45 1/2 inches per the dad.

I think she has stood in the same spot since they got her. The mom said she thought about moving her into the formal living room, but knew that would mean she would have to have the piano tuned. One of the many things I have learned in the last few months: even though you are not playing a piano, it still needs attention like tuning, not just dusting.

The bench is adjustable. They did not know this!!

Tomorrow I plan to get in touch with at least one tech (from the PTG website) and see how soon he/she can look at the piano. I also want to visit our two retailers and try their keyboards again, particularly comparing the "feel" of uprights versus grands in the newer models. This one feels kind of "heavy" like the first ones I tried a couple weeks ago. Maybe that is the upright action, maybe the grands I played were overly soft.

So what say you since it's not 50"???? way to high? I am kind of leaning that way now that I know what they paid for it eleven years ago. But, it will be cheaper to move being just in the burb next door, right???

Far as I know, only one other person is interested at this point. He is in Tennessee, and has only seen pictures.

Thank you!