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#1805531 - 12/13/11 04:26 PM HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93?
LMKawai Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/23/06
Posts: 180
Loc: Madrid, Spain
Hi guys! thanks for reading! I cant really decide... Yamaha Clavinova CLP-470 or Kawai CA93? which one would you recommend?
Im not sure what to buy. I have tried both and I like them both. I used to have a CLP-240 and loved it. I think Yamaha's got a better keyboard, but I heard good things about Kawai too.
Your feedback would be much appreciated
Regards,
Luis
_________________________
YAMAHA GB1
Cherny upright (Russian, 1990)
Kawai ES7
Korg microPiano

Soundcloud: http://soundcloud.com/imarpal
Twitter: @imarpal

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#1805539 - 12/13/11 04:43 PM Re: HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93? [Re: LMKawai]
gvfarns Online   content
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/16/07
Posts: 3474
Loc: Pennsylvania
I would normally say get the Kawai because in my opinion it's got a much better keyboard (probably better speakers too). Personally I feel that it's one of the most desirable digital pianos there is. I like Kawai's action, though.

But if you have tried both and like the keyboard in the Yamaha better, I think you had better go that direction. I would never advise getting a piano with an action that you like less when there is one with an action you like more available.


Edited by gvfarns (12/13/11 04:46 PM)

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#1805591 - 12/13/11 05:44 PM Re: HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93? [Re: LMKawai]
spanishbuddha Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/08/09
Posts: 2235
Loc: UK
Which one did YOU like, enjoy, best, without headphones because of the sound board in the Kawai, and assuming that's how you'll play most of the time?
Originally Posted By: CLP240
I think Yamaha's got a better keyboard, but I heard good things about Kawai too.
Your feedback would be much appreciated
Regards,
Luis

That's confusing, have you really played them both? If so back to you and your choice.

After that do a relevant to you feature and affordability comparison. Or follow your heart.

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#1805610 - 12/13/11 06:04 PM Re: HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93? [Re: LMKawai]
MacMacMac Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/24/09
Posts: 3669
Loc: North Carolina
The CLP470 is just a CLP440 with better speakers and the NW keyboard (instead of GH3). And it's not much different from your existing CLP240. So I'd only buy the CLP470 if I felt the key action was better. If not, I'd add speakers to the CLP240 and be done ... at much lower cost.

I've not tried the Kawai, but it gets great reviews.

Question: What kind of improvement are you looking for?

If it's the key feel, then it would be worthwhile to have a look at those new pianos.

If it's the sound ... I (and others on the board) have found a much better way to improve: computer-based piano libraries. For under $1000 you can make your existing piano sound better than just about any digital piano, even those costing twice as much as a CLP470 or CA93.

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#1805613 - 12/13/11 06:09 PM Re: HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93? [Re: LMKawai]
Kawai James Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 8388
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
They're both excellent digital pianos, so it really just comes down to personal preference.
Buy the instrument you like best.

Cheers,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#1805615 - 12/13/11 06:11 PM Re: HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93? [Re: LMKawai]
gvfarns Online   content
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/16/07
Posts: 3474
Loc: Pennsylvania
If I read the OP correctly the poster USED to have a CLP 240 but does not have it any more.

So now it's a question of whether to get one almost the same as what he had or switch to a different brand.

It's up to you. They are both good pianos. Kawai is top of the line, and the Yamaha is pretty high up too, so either will make you happy most likely. Pick whichever feels better.

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#1805622 - 12/13/11 06:17 PM Re: HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93? [Re: LMKawai]
MacMacMac Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/24/09
Posts: 3669
Loc: North Carolina
Ah so! I misinterpreted his sig.
It says "EX" DGX-620 ... I thought that was the older one.
I guess he now has only the P140. So he really needs a replacement, not an upgrade.

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#1805624 - 12/13/11 06:20 PM Re: HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93? [Re: LMKawai]
LMKawai Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/23/06
Posts: 180
Loc: Madrid, Spain
Hi,

Yes, I played them both in different show rooms and like them both. Perhaps im more used to the Yamaha sound but I actually like the Kawai... maybe im a bit scared of changes... you know, what if...

Spanishbuddha: When I say I hear good things about Kawai that is apart from my own experience. Some people are telling me go for the Kawai, others Yamaha.

MacMacMac: I had a CLP240, but had to sell it because I moved to Spain from the UK. I bought a P140 keyboard with GH3 key action, which is the one Im playing at the moment and I am very happy with it. I think it sounds beautiful and the keyboard is no different to my old CLP240, it is actually the same.

I am currently finishing my piano studies at a Conservatory of Music, so I want/need to get a better instrument. I have an old acoustic piano at my parents that I can play when I visit them but I need my own piano at home. I cant really buy an acoustic piano because I will not be at the place I am living in at the moment for a long period of time, so I thought a good digital would be perfect. Hope that help you guys understand my situation a bit better smile

What about the Kawai CS6? I have checked prices of both CS6 & CS9 and I dont think I could afford the CS9, I have not tried any of these two. So my choices are now the Kawai CS6, Kawai CA93 or the CL-270.

Thanks a million all!
_________________________
YAMAHA GB1
Cherny upright (Russian, 1990)
Kawai ES7
Korg microPiano

Soundcloud: http://soundcloud.com/imarpal
Twitter: @imarpal

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#1805631 - 12/13/11 06:31 PM Re: HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93? [Re: LMKawai]
gvfarns Online   content
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/16/07
Posts: 3474
Loc: Pennsylvania
If I understand correctly the CS6 and CS9 are pretty much CA63 and CA93 in different cabinets, with some very minor interface tweaks. The CA93 is Kawai's best performing instrument (soundboard, tactile response, etc) so I think it's better than the CS6 from a usage point of view.

Though that CS6 is quite the looker.

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#1805639 - 12/13/11 06:42 PM Re: HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93? [Re: LMKawai]
Kawai James Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 8388
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
CLP240, as gvfarns correctly notes, the CS6 and CS9 offer largely the same specifications as the CA63 and CA93 respectively, with the main difference being the more attractive cabinet design and polished ebony finish.

Kind regards,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#1805651 - 12/13/11 07:08 PM Re: HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93? [Re: LMKawai]
LMKawai Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/23/06
Posts: 180
Loc: Madrid, Spain
Cheers guys, only question is... Why is the CS9 much more expensive than the CA93?
So, would you go for then Kawai rather than the CLP-270?
_________________________
YAMAHA GB1
Cherny upright (Russian, 1990)
Kawai ES7
Korg microPiano

Soundcloud: http://soundcloud.com/imarpal
Twitter: @imarpal

Top
#1805688 - 12/13/11 08:57 PM Re: HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93? [Re: LMKawai]
MacMacMac Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/24/09
Posts: 3669
Loc: North Carolina
I found a You Tube video of the CS9 in the polished finish.
Wow! That's a nice looking piano!

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#1805695 - 12/13/11 09:19 PM Re: HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93? [Re: LMKawai]
Kawai James Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 8388
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
MacMacMac, the cabinet is based on the K-2 upright.

James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

Top
#1805709 - 12/13/11 09:46 PM Re: HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93? [Re: LMKawai]
MacMacMac Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/24/09
Posts: 3669
Loc: North Carolina
Yeah. You'd think it's a proper upright piano.
Tell the boys "nice job!"

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#1805830 - 12/14/11 03:28 AM Re: HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93? [Re: LMKawai]
LMKawai Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/23/06
Posts: 180
Loc: Madrid, Spain
Morning guys! (9:26am here)
Ok, I have narrowed my choices to: 1) Kawai CS6 and 2) Yamaha CLP 470 PE
Which one would you go for? Is true that the Yamahas hammer action is composed of real wooden hammers like in a real piano?
Cheers,
Luis
_________________________
YAMAHA GB1
Cherny upright (Russian, 1990)
Kawai ES7
Korg microPiano

Soundcloud: http://soundcloud.com/imarpal
Twitter: @imarpal

Top
#1805833 - 12/14/11 04:09 AM Re: HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93? [Re: LMKawai]
LMKawai Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/23/06
Posts: 180
Loc: Madrid, Spain
One more question,

the "smooth release" feature on the Clavinova keyboard is the same as the "let off" system on the Kawai?

Real Grand Expression vs RM3 - Ultra Progressive Harmonic Imaging ?
Lett off vs Smooth release ?

Thanks!
_________________________
YAMAHA GB1
Cherny upright (Russian, 1990)
Kawai ES7
Korg microPiano

Soundcloud: http://soundcloud.com/imarpal
Twitter: @imarpal

Top
#1805836 - 12/14/11 04:24 AM Re: HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93? [Re: LMKawai]
Kawai James Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 8388
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Good evening (6:25pm here),

Originally Posted By: CLP240
Is true that the Yamahas hammer action is composed of real wooden hammers like in a real piano?


May I ask where you read/heard that?

James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

Top
#1805840 - 12/14/11 04:38 AM Re: HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93? [Re: LMKawai]
LMKawai Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/23/06
Posts: 180
Loc: Madrid, Spain
Hi Kawai James,

Please have a look (second 36)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cGSB-QGHkqA

Maybe the video is just misleading...

thanks
_________________________
YAMAHA GB1
Cherny upright (Russian, 1990)
Kawai ES7
Korg microPiano

Soundcloud: http://soundcloud.com/imarpal
Twitter: @imarpal

Top
#1805854 - 12/14/11 05:35 AM Re: HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93? [Re: LMKawai]
bennevis Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/14/10
Posts: 4391
Originally Posted By: CLP240
One more question,

the "smooth release" feature on the Clavinova keyboard is the same as the "let off" system on the Kawai?

Real Grand Expression vs RM3 - Ultra Progressive Harmonic Imaging ?
Lett off vs Smooth release ?

Thanks!


None of Yamaha's Clavinova range have 'let off', which is the notchy feel you get when pressing the key down slowly, just like you'd get on an acoustic. Basically, a CLP doesn't have the feel of an acoustic in its key action, which may or may not concern you - it's totally smooth all the way down.

When you buy a DP, go with what your fingers and ears tell you, not what people say about the reputation of a brand or any specific model. I ended up buying a DP that didn't even look like any piano I'd ever seen, nor the brand I'd always thought was the best in DP, simply because of the way it connected to my playing like no other DP did. And that DP didn't even enter as a contender when I started doing research into likely models to buy. I've been really glad ever since that I put aside all my prejudices and preconceptions, and went with what my fingers and ears told me........

So, I'd say go and audition lots of DPs within your budget range with an open mind, and remember you are the one who's going to be using your DP. And if you're going to be using headphones at home, use your headphones for the auditioning.

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#1805855 - 12/14/11 05:37 AM Re: HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93? [Re: LMKawai]
Kawai James Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 8388
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
I don't believe it's misleading. An image of a grand piano hammers flashes up on the screen, and the chap explains that the CLP-470/CLP-480 is the first piano to use different key weights for each key.

Unless my ears are deceiving me, he doesn't mention anything about wooden hammers.

Perhaps you can visit the Yamaha and Kawai dealerships, and ask to see the keyboard action samples for the models you are considering. This should provide a clear indication of the construction and mechanism of the keyboard action.

Kind regards,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

Top
#1805881 - 12/14/11 07:57 AM Re: HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93? [Re: Kawai James]
LMKawai Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/23/06
Posts: 180
Loc: Madrid, Spain
Hi guys,

After much deliberation I have decided to buy the new Kawai CS6!

Only thing is that I have to wait until the end January. It is not available anywhere in Spain. I have spoken directly to Kawai and official distributors and containers coming by boat from Japan are due to arrive in Spain towards the middle of January. This model will be available in stores on or around the 21st of January 2012. OMG! I cant wait that long!!!

I will keep you posted!

Thanks for everything!

Regards,
Luis
_________________________
YAMAHA GB1
Cherny upright (Russian, 1990)
Kawai ES7
Korg microPiano

Soundcloud: http://soundcloud.com/imarpal
Twitter: @imarpal

Top
#1805893 - 12/14/11 08:39 AM Re: HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93? [Re: LMKawai]
Kawai James Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 8388
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Luis, is there a reason you don't wish to purchase the instrument in the UK?

Well, congratulations on your decision. I hope you enjoy the CS6, although as I wrote previously, the CLP-470 is an excellent digital piano too!

Best of luck waiting for the piano to arrive!

James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

Top
#1805956 - 12/14/11 10:48 AM Re: HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93? [Re: LMKawai]
LMKawai Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/23/06
Posts: 180
Loc: Madrid, Spain
Hi James,

I have contacted two stores in London, one of them would not deliver it to Spain, the other does not offer the option on their website, so I have emailed them…
If I buy the piano here I will get it delivered and installed at home…

I will keep you guys posted!

Regards wink
_________________________
YAMAHA GB1
Cherny upright (Russian, 1990)
Kawai ES7
Korg microPiano

Soundcloud: http://soundcloud.com/imarpal
Twitter: @imarpal

Top
#1806038 - 12/14/11 12:48 PM Re: HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93? [Re: LMKawai]
LMKawai Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/23/06
Posts: 180
Loc: Madrid, Spain
Hi all,

I just spoke to Kawai UK. Unfortunately, Kawai Classic series (CS3,6,9) are all out of stock in both UK and Europe and will not be available until the end of January (2012). I will have to wait! frown
Is it worth the waiting or should I get the CLP-470? What would you do?

Regards,

Luis
_________________________
YAMAHA GB1
Cherny upright (Russian, 1990)
Kawai ES7
Korg microPiano

Soundcloud: http://soundcloud.com/imarpal
Twitter: @imarpal

Top
#1806045 - 12/14/11 12:57 PM Re: HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93? [Re: LMKawai]
MacMacMac Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/24/09
Posts: 3669
Loc: North Carolina
Wait. If you like the Kawai, don't settle for something you like less.

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#1806048 - 12/14/11 01:00 PM Re: HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93? [Re: LMKawai]
gvfarns Online   content
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/16/07
Posts: 3474
Loc: Pennsylvania
Yeah definitely wait. To answer your previous question, the action in the Kawai is much more similar to an acoustic (in terms of construction, materials, and design) than the Yamaha action. Not to say the Yamaha action is bad, but the action in the CS6 is basically the pinnacle of digital piano action technology up to this point (this doesn't include hybrid actions like AvantGrand).

And it looks so good too!

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#1806162 - 12/14/11 04:17 PM Re: HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93? [Re: LMKawai]
LMKawai Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/23/06
Posts: 180
Loc: Madrid, Spain
Thank you all!
I have visited my local authorised KAWAI and YAMAHA dealer and I have played them both at the same store.
I played the CLP470 first, then moved to the CA63. Then tried the CA93, and finally the CLP280. Well, the difference is huge! Kawai's action is far better than the Yamaha's. Yamaha feels like plastic compared to Kawais keyboard.
The dealer has tried to convince me to go for the CA93 or wait for the CS9 instead; for this I would have to wait until March-April 2012, since they will not be available in Europe until then...

I would love to have a CS9, however, having played the CA93 and the CA63 I must say that the quality of the CA63 is more than enough for what Iam looking for, therefore, I am finally waiting until the end of January for the CS6!

I think the improved keyboard and the acoustic cabinet will make a better DP than the CA63, which I have already played and like it, so could say that I have fallen in love with it, and more with the looks of the CS6.

Only thing is that the speakers are better on the CA93, and obviously on the CS9, but I dont really need that much. The CA63(CS6) sounds beautiful and it is more than perfect, and Im only going to be studying on it and playing it at home, so dont really need more speakers power...

Thank you very much all for reading and your comments. I will keep you posted and... hopefully the end of January will come soon and I will post some pics for you all! smile

Regards,
Luis
_________________________
YAMAHA GB1
Cherny upright (Russian, 1990)
Kawai ES7
Korg microPiano

Soundcloud: http://soundcloud.com/imarpal
Twitter: @imarpal

Top
#1806192 - 12/14/11 04:59 PM Re: HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93? [Re: LMKawai]
Kawai James Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 8388
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Thank you for the update Luis. I realise now that you intend to play this piano in Spain, after completing your studies in London.

May I wish you the best of luck!

James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

Top
#1819127 - 01/05/12 02:22 PM Re: HELP! CLAVINOVA CLP-470 OR KAWAI CA93? [Re: LMKawai]
Derekasaurus Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 01/05/12
Posts: 1
I'm sure you will be happy with the Kawai. My recently came down to the Yamaha CLP-470 vs. the Kawai CA93. I was slightly disappointed by the 470 even though I have played Clavinovas for years (going back to 1988 if you can believe it). They are great instruments, but you are right, they still feel quite artificial. Also, the 470's keys make an annoying and audible mechanical sound when they strike bottom, which you can hear even with open air headphones, while the CA93 is muted and key strikes are completely silent. Plus at every level Kawai seems to have better sound systems in their instruments, all the way up to the soundboard of the CA93. And while some people don't care about escapement/let-off because it's not really a benefit in an acoustic piano, I find that it makes the keyboard significantly more lifelike, which is what matters to me. With my long history with Yamaha I was certain I would buy another Clavinova, but Kawai won me over.

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