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thumbs up to that--

Amen! In many instances the child is basically punished by the parent.. just as an example.. where he or she can't get the 8 or 9 year old to the lessons on time. . or the parent FORGETS there's a lesson at all. I have seen everything.

It's a three-party proposition, and if any corner of the triangle is mooshy - student, parent, or teacher - then it can't hold its shape.

Here's what I think happened. The Dad thought that the other teacher was as good as or better than you. If he thought they were better than you, then you need to do more about displaying your value. I had a piano teacher who had pictures of her performing with orchestras in the room she taught. Very effective. Im not talking about throwing it in their face every day but ... I hope you get my point.

If he thought you were equal to the other teacher then you could work more on creating more of a personal relationship with the parents and kids; more small talk, personal interest to make them sticky. Otherwise when someone they percieve to be the same value as you, has a more personal magnetic pull to them, you will be shown the door.

Also, if you have rules that parents think are really restrictive they may see taht as a detractor and go for someone of the same value who is more customer friendly.

I think that any student should be free to pick me or not pick me as a teacher. I also think that I should have the right to decide not to work with a student.

However, where do we draw the line between who is and who is not a "teacher-hopper"?

I suspect that you may know what I will answer, but I say it anyway. Personal preference. For me it would be when I try to teach something and the child then counter's with what the other teacher is telling them to do and how it does not fit with your method. Then thats when I tell them they need to decide which method is best.

I have no bone to pick with any teacher here. I'm only surprised at the opinion expressed here that students shouldn't interview many teachers and if they tell you that you are one of the many teachers they have been trying out, you immediately tell them that you aren't interested. This view is absurd to me! It really does reflect a huge ego problem. Maybe I understood you guys wrong? If so, please clarify if this is not what you meant.

PS: I am not talking about maintaining two teachers simultaneously without telling either teacher. I don't agree with that. However, I absolutely think that the student has the right to shop for teachers just as much right the teacher has to accept/reject the student based on perceived fit.

I don't really understand this attitude. I think it is absolutely essential to meet with a variety of teachers and take your pick amongst them. Music study is a very precarious thing, and you are putting your artistic growth in the hands of one individual, so you had better take care to be meticulous in your screening process. So what if another teacher happens to be more compatible with the student than you? How would they have know that unless they played for both you you? At Juilliard, for instance, students are usually assigned TWO teachers, and there is a "trial" period at the beginning of each semester for students to have lessons with several teachers. As a matter of fact, I would go as far to say that I would be more skeptical of the student who was *not* considering several teachers. It sounds like the adult student was just being honest about it.

This is, of course, completely different from playing for other people after you have already started studying with somebody behind their back...

I wish I could agree with these statements, but it does not always follow that having CDs, videos, concert performances, pics on stage, will impress parents. If you teach in a less cosmopolitan area, some of the parents are more interested in whether you can give the flavor of the week piece to their kids, like rock, popular, you name it. In some cases it's a social connection. The friends have this or that teacher.. so let's get in with the network. Some teachers with 50 wall to wall students may not be nearly as skilled as players or even teachers as someone with the fancy credentials. Sad, but true.

I think folks are confusing the issues here. The OP is talking about a beginner who is shopping for a piano teacher. This is very different than a Juilliard student picking a better match for a professor. The Juilliard student would be in a much better position to know which teacher is a better fit for him/her. The beginner student would just go with the intangibles like "I like her better" or "he looks mean" or "she sounds too strict."

yes, that's true in most cases. I find that parents of many beginning students are not sure what they want. And often they will come with a 61-key bell and whistle keyboard.

I have to agree that when a beginning student has to keep telling you how many teachers he's going to interview it is just not going start the ball rolling in the right direction.

I will safely bet that if you said to the beginning student.. "Just to let you know that I have five other people who want this slot," the student would not show up for the consult.

I disagree. I inform people that call that I do have a waiting list and that I don't accept students without a live interview. I've never had anyone not show for the interview.

Why are you so threatened by being compared to other teachers? Parents of beginners know their children and understand how they interact with others. That's very important with a child. If they are uncomfortable with your style, they are right to go elsewhere.

Somebody who has never had a lesson with anyone in their life, by all logic, cannot possibly be a teacher-hopper.

I have already written my reasoning and put some thought into it - has it even been read?

Your analogy does not work because a teacher has many students, and a student works with only one teacher. You will be filling various slots. Additionally, I expect a good teacher to have a waiting list so there would be nothing wrong with being told that.

It is normal and prudent to be very sure about your decision, especially when embarking on unfamiliar territory. It is a courtesy to tell the teacher that you will interview more than one person before coming to a decision. That decision, after that, is a commitment. It is not an insult to a teacher, is not meant as a threat, and is not a put-down.

I had a feeling that this is actually advice given, so I googled:

"Take time and, if you feel the need to interview more than one teacher, do so, until you feel truly comfortable with the choice you have made."
PEP site

"Try to interview several teachers from your list."
link to advice by a teacher

"[you will need] Some time to research and interview different teachers."

I could go on. The point is that the advice given to parents and prospective students overwhelmingly is to interview more than one teacher. How, then, can a student be faulted for doing just that?

The advice given out there is to become informed, then do the steps you need to choose a teacher. That will not produce the type of person who pops in with a toy instrument. How many teachers here get dread "transfer students" because they didn't do their homework first time round, and now they get to undo the damage if that is even possible?

I think the problem with beginners and parents of beginners is that they are ill-equipped to make such decisions. That's why I get all these crappy transfer students.

Yet it's crucial. How do we solve this?

I've never had a prospective student announce to me that they are interviewing other teachers. I think it would be wise for the student to ask for an interview, gather information, but not point out that they are trying to interview 5 other teachers.

Declining an interview may not be about insecurity. It may be a decision that the interview is not worth the teacher's time. I do not charge a fee for the initial interview. If someone announced they have 5 teachers to interview, I would suggest that the student asks their questions over the phone, and reads info on my website. With a 20% chance of being "chosen", it may not be worth my time. I'd at least wait until they'd narrowed it down to 3. Maybe suggest that the student checks out the other teachers, and if they don't find what they're looking for to contact me then.

OTOH, if the student really could accept an opening time that I have available and I really do want another student, I may just go ahead with the meeting.

Also I have found that people almost always come to me by word of mouth, and already know they want in my studio. Having someone contact me with no referral from a parent or another teacher is unusual. The other selling point is location, and parents insist they want in my studio due to location.

I find the scenario of 5 or more face to face interviews to be a stretch of the imagination. Especially for an adult student. To find even one teacher with an suitable opening for an adult may be difficult, much less finding 5. If you've got so many teachers you want to choose from, I think a phone interview would be a realistic way to begin to narrow the field.

I'm glad that you bring up teacher hopping. I've seen it first hand.

Here's the thing about people interviewing other teachers. That's all well and good and of course that's part of the process of finding a good match.. BUT I don't need to have someone call me and go on and on about their teacher tryouts. It's not necessary. You do what you have to do and not announce to each and every teacher that you are shopping around. (I've had two adult beginners contact me with that preliminary and frankly I had no interest in going through the hoops with them..To be very psychodynamic about it, it registers the control issue.. or puts it front and center. The student who has to tell the teacher about her other tryouts is basically wanting to have CONTROL of the prospective teacher.. I could write pages on this, but the people who would recognize themselves would only respond with anger.. so there's my Music Therapy Degree showing.
At the risk of being redundant it's like the teacher telling the student, beginner or not, that five other pupils will be interviewed for the slot.. How insensitive to the student's feelings would that be.

exactly, but the student should be tactful enough to do her or his business and interview as many teachers as he or she pleases without sharing all that with me or any other teacher prospect.. Similarly I have the right to decline a particular interview for my own reasons. It runs both ways. The issue here, is that the student should do what he needs to .. and not have to invite the prospective teacher into his own selection process.