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I'd like help in analyzing "Waltz Macabre" (Bitonal Waltz) by N. Faber. It's in The Developing Artist Piano Literature Bk 2.

Form: Is it ABCAB1? Or is it through composed?
Tonal centers: starts in A major, moves to Ab major

Wondering why the LH waltz accompaniment of A E E works for the entire piece even when the tonal center changes.
Obviously works for A major.

For Ab major I'm wondering if A E E working is a case of using "flat two"...or in this case the "flat two" fifth (if there is such a thing).

Anyone familiar with this piece?

I'm not aware of the work, but from the sounds of it (and the very fact that you're mentioning it), the composer decided to go to a bitonal territory. Bi-tonality means that you can have two different tonalities at the same time, which could very well mean that the left hand has A E E and the right hand is on Ab...

If the composer utilized some kind of 'pattern' with the left hand, or a more free version of a 'pedal' (the holding note in some chorals for example), it could be possible that the two tonalities could mingle together in a nice result...

I'm thinking the same thing, but we'd have the exact right answer in seconds if we could see the piece.

Thanks Nicholas and Gary. I didn't know that bitonality meant you can have two different tonalities at the same time. That explains a lot.

I've tried scanning, but having trouble with connection.

Ann in Kentucky, do you know about the Piano Adventures forum? There's probably oodles of people there with the DA series who could help. Unfortunately, I only have 3 & 4, and not the lower levels to be able to check for you.

[ETA: Isn't that the definition of bitonality: to have two different tonalities at the same time?]

Thanks PianoStudent88. I know about the PA forum, but haven't used it. It's a good option. I may check there if needed after this thread has no more responses.

Edit: I am reluctant to show my ignorance on a second forum.

The explanation of bitonality made sense. This piece uses two tonalities at the same time.

As far as form, if I ever get to teach this piece I can simply point out where there is repetition in the piece. I don't need to have an official stamp of approval on the form even though it would be nice. I can say "We'll call this section A" "Let's call this B" "This seems different from A and B, so lets call it C" etc.

Oh come on... Don't be... There's no reason to be shy if you want to know more! You should be proud that you've got the 'guts' to ask!

Cool. Since you know the work better than us, if it works... it works!

And, btw, while I'd like to take a small look on the score, it might enter the realms of illegality if you scanned the whole work and sent it over, so perhaps it's for the best (although it's for the best of reasons that you would be doing that).

Of course you don't need any kind of stamp and lets face it: Noone here can provide that except Nancy herself (the composer I think?). Otherwise all we can do is offer valid opinions and not much else!

Oh, Ann, you made me drag out my copy of the book...

The A-E-E pattern in the L.H. is ostinato.

Structure:
Intro-A-A'-B-transition (bridge)-A-truncated A' (coda)
If you analyze B and Transition as one unit (m. 21-36), you got yourself a classical ternary form.

Oh! Thanks AZN! Now I see why you chose A1. It's the same as A but in a different key. Your analysis makes sense.

Thanks for your input Nicholas. Really what's happened with PA the forum is that I must have signed up a few years ago. I don't recall my username and password. To get my password I have to have a username and email. And I apparently can't sign up again with my same email address. So I can't sign in.

I may not be getting an official stamp of approval, but it is nice to be able to consult teachers who know a lot more than I do about music theory. That's official enough for me.

A mistake I made was glancing at the word "bitonality" and assuming it's a heads up that the piece moves from one key to another. Instead it means two tonalities at the same time. I could have looked it up, but had assumed I knew what it meant. Then when I went looking for the key changes I noticed how odd it was that the accompaniment stayed the same throughout. Anyway, I've learned about bitonality thanks to you here at PW.

Ann in Kentucky, it's not indicated clearly at Piano Adventures, but you can get your login name as well as your password. At the login screen, leave both username and password blank and click on "Forget your password?". This will bring you to a screen where you have a choice to fill in your login OR your email. Fill in your email and click "I forgot my password". You will receive an email containing both your username and a temporary password.

Not trying to make you go over there; just posting this in case you ever do want to post there.

Thanks PianoStudent88 for the advice. I followed it. Now I'm just waiting for an email response. Hopefully it will work.