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#1837032 - 02/02/12 07:50 AM Re: Advice on Baby Grand purchase for a High School PAC [Re: TunerJeff]
apple* Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/01/03
Posts: 19476
Loc: Kansas
Originally Posted By: TunerJeff
Dear Choir Director,

The Yamaha Conservatory Series (C-series) is an extremely stable, reliable, and well-built instrument. I have never encountered a string breakage problem with the C-series and I've seen a lot of them! One of my smaller venues seats 250, and purchased a C1; partly on budget, partly on size. That piano is a jewel. Performers love it, and the tuning stays solid as rock.


I am sorry if i came off as knocking the Yamahas... they really are wonderful.. i just had 2 services with 2 yamahas 2 small for the venue before posting. They are reliable pianos.
_________________________
accompanist/organist.. a non-MTNA teacher to a few

love and peace, Õun (apple in Estonian)

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#1837085 - 02/02/12 09:31 AM Re: Advice on Baby Grand purchase for a High School PAC [Re: NMChoirDirector]
Pianolance Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/28/09
Posts: 841
Loc: Nashville, TN
If you decide to go for a Yamaha make sure you get the C series and not the GC. GH or any other series. The only other Yamaha I would recommend would be a freshly rebuilt G series, but other series of Yamaha pianos are made for home and not commercial use and it makes a big difference.
_________________________
Knabe 5'2" Louis XV Walnut circa 1927
Very part time piano broker.

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#1837117 - 02/02/12 10:39 AM Re: Advice on Baby Grand purchase for a High School PAC [Re: NMChoirDirector]
ChrisVenables Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/03/09
Posts: 713
Loc: Hampshire, England
Hi NMChoirDirector

If Yamaha US prices are in line with those in the UK, the price hike between GC1 and C1 (same size) is massive, whereas dynamic range and bass quality difference is small.

However, a C2 (5'8") should cost you only $1700-1800 more than a C1 and the difference in dynamic range and bass quality between these two is massive. ie C1 is IMO Yamaha's least value-for-money grand and the new C2M one of the best.

Pianolance: I agree that C series have the edge over G but to recommend a 'freshly rebuilt G series' would need to be qualified with who rebuilt it and with what components.
_________________________
Tech. & Partner: Venables Pianos
Yamaha Piano UK main dealer and Grand Piano Centre
Stocking new Yamaha, Brodmann and Venables & Son

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#1837406 - 02/02/12 06:36 PM Re: Advice on Baby Grand purchase for a High School PAC [Re: NMChoirDirector]
kpembrook Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/10
Posts: 588
Loc: Michigan
Originally Posted By: NMChoirDirector
The district wants the warranty that comes with a new instrument otherwise I'd be looking at a used instrument as you can get a much better instrument for the money.

I am well aware of the problems with the size, I'm trying to make the best possible decision based on what I'm being allowed to do. Our budget is based on those sizes. We got a quote on a C1 at $16449.00 and that is the highest priced instrument I'm being allowed to look at.


Sometimes the sharp pencil folk need to be told that a given decision isn't appropriate. In this case you are about to waste $16,000. Loudness doesn't substitute for volume. You just overdrive the instrument in the attempt to use it and still wind up dissatisfied while it proceeds to an untimely demise.

Not sure what image is best for your area, but here we have a large river and people understand that even though the water from a garden hose (or even fire hose, for that matter) can go faster than the river, the river has much more power due to its volume of flow.

It's not only that you have no bass to give support to the musical uses you propose. The soundboard area is simply incapable of moving an adequate amount of air to appropriately couple the string energy to the air in the space.

It is understandable that the school wouldn't want to just pick up a piano from a private party. However, a used piano from a reputable dealer represents a minimum of risk -- not only because the dealer will have inspected the piano and will be motivated to make sure it is satisfactory, especially in a high-visibility venue, but also because you now have certitude rather than assurance: the piano has survived a number of years without any original manufacturing defects showing up and so, in a sense, doesn't need the same warranty as a new instrument that hasn't yet proved itself.

You will be doing your school a favor to reconsider the present purchasing proposal. Good luck!!
_________________________
Keith Akins, RPT
USA Distributor for Isaac Cadenza hammers and Profundo Bass Strings
Supporting Piano Owners D-I-Y piano tuning and repair

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#1837435 - 02/02/12 07:51 PM Re: Advice on Baby Grand purchase for a High School PAC [Re: kpembrook]
beethoven986 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/20/09
Posts: 1767
Originally Posted By: kpembrook
Originally Posted By: NMChoirDirector
The district wants the warranty that comes with a new instrument otherwise I'd be looking at a used instrument as you can get a much better instrument for the money.

I am well aware of the problems with the size, I'm trying to make the best possible decision based on what I'm being allowed to do. Our budget is based on those sizes. We got a quote on a C1 at $16449.00 and that is the highest priced instrument I'm being allowed to look at.


Sometimes the sharp pencil folk need to be told that a given decision isn't appropriate. In this case you are about to waste $16,000. Loudness doesn't substitute for volume. You just overdrive the instrument in the attempt to use it and still wind up dissatisfied while it proceeds to an untimely demise.

Not sure what image is best for your area, but here we have a large river and people understand that even though the water from a garden hose (or even fire hose, for that matter) can go faster than the river, the river has much more power due to its volume of flow.

It's not only that you have no bass to give support to the musical uses you propose. The soundboard area is simply incapable of moving an adequate amount of air to appropriately couple the string energy to the air in the space.

It is understandable that the school wouldn't want to just pick up a piano from a private party. However, a used piano from a reputable dealer represents a minimum of risk -- not only because the dealer will have inspected the piano and will be motivated to make sure it is satisfactory, especially in a high-visibility venue, but also because you now have certitude rather than assurance: the piano has survived a number of years without any original manufacturing defects showing up and so, in a sense, doesn't need the same warranty as a new instrument that hasn't yet proved itself.

You will be doing your school a favor to reconsider the present purchasing proposal. Good luck!!


Yup. +1
_________________________
B.Mus. Piano Performance 2009
M.Mus. Piano Performance & Literature 2011
PTG Associate Member (Just joined 5-5-2012!)

Current projects: Brahms: Variations on a Theme by Handel, op. 24

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#1837620 - 02/03/12 12:56 AM Re: Advice on Baby Grand purchase for a High School PAC [Re: ChrisVenables]
Pianolance Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/28/09
Posts: 841
Loc: Nashville, TN
Originally Posted By: ChrisVenables
Hi NMChoirDirector

Pianolance: I agree that C series have the edge over G but to recommend a 'freshly rebuilt G series' would need to be qualified with who rebuilt it and with what components.


I don't disagree with that, I was merely stating that a really good rebuilt G can be an excellent, commercial, institutional grade piano as opposed to a home quality piano. I think the C has an edge over a G but I would definitely consider the right G because some of them are truly great pianos.
_________________________
Knabe 5'2" Louis XV Walnut circa 1927
Very part time piano broker.

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#1837675 - 02/03/12 02:45 AM Re: Advice on Baby Grand purchase for a High School PAC [Re: NMChoirDirector]
Rotom Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/24/10
Posts: 1615
On the note of rebuilt G series...

I once visited a piano shop overseas that specialised in rebuilding old, worn out Yamaha pianos. In their storeroom, they had a rebuilt G2, G3, C2, and an unrestored G3 awaiting restoration. I got to wander around the showroom and play the pianos, and I actually noticed between the rebuilts of similar sizes that the tonal differences between the C and G series was very small. Even the unrestored G3 sounded nice, pianolance is right, some of them are truly great pianos.
_________________________
Ecce homo qui est faba
Yamaha C7

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