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#1835759 - 01/31/12 02:41 PM
latency < 5ms on a USB/Firewire sound card?
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Junior Member
Registered: 01/31/12
Posts: 4
Loc: Russia, Moscow
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hello friends, I am trying to figure out if it is possible to get latency < 5-7ms with a USB/Firewire soundcard interface, can someone clear this question for me? And possibly recommend a device in the range of 150-300$ (if it exists). Some background information: I just purchased Yamaha P155 (having owned P95 for half a year) and I am not quite happy with the sound, the second octave sounds a bit too bright to my taste. After thinking about this situation for a while I considered Ivory Grand to be my best choice and now I am looking for equipment to get descent latency while playing. I already have a laptop and it is only a question of getting the proper external sound device. I will use it mainly with headphones and some time later may be with montors. I would be grateful for any advice. thanks
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#1835769 - 01/31/12 02:59 PM
Re: latency < 5ms on a USB/Firewire sound card?
[Re: Igor777K]
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Junior Member
Registered: 01/31/12
Posts: 9
Loc: Toronto CANADA
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try asio4all first
fiddle with the buffer settings, get them as low as possible without the sound cracking/popping
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#1835841 - 01/31/12 05:30 PM
Re: latency < 5ms on a USB/Firewire sound card?
[Re: Igor777K]
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1000 Post Club Member
Registered: 04/16/07
Posts: 1685
Loc: Pennsylvania
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I recently learned that the P155 does not have USB-To-Host capability, so you will need to get some kind of MIDI-to-USB conversion.
Since you need both MIDI and possibly an external interface for latency purposes, I think the best solution for you is the M Audio Fast Track Pro or the presonus audiobox USB. Though a simple MIDI-to-USB converter would be cheaper and if ASIO4ALL works for you, then you could save money that way.
To answer your question, you can definitely get into that range. My latency is like 5 ms processing and .3 output. I could decrease the processing latency by having a faster computer, but already my latency is not a problem at all. The output latency is the one governed by the external interface and associated driver.
Edited by gvfarns (01/31/12 05:31 PM)
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#1836198 - 02/01/12 03:33 AM
Re: latency < 5ms on a USB/Firewire sound card?
[Re: Igor777K]
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Junior Member
Registered: 01/31/12
Posts: 4
Loc: Russia, Moscow
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Thanks a lot for your prompt help with this matter!! After analysing your suggestions and smoking some forums I ended up looking at at E-MU 0404 USB. Am I right in my assumptions that it is one of the best interfaces for the price? The only objection is that it is not sold on the market, only used ones are available. What would be the newer model for E-MU 0404 USB? I was able to find out that total latency with E-MU 0404 would be around 10ms, which is considered acceptable by most musicians. What appealing about E-MU 0404 - is high audio quality, many noted that it is a pleasure to listen to music via this device. What would be your comments?
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#1836269 - 02/01/12 06:57 AM
Re: latency < 5ms on a USB/Firewire sound card?
[Re: Igor777K]
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Full Member
Registered: 12/06/07
Posts: 289
Loc: Pennsylvania
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Why can't you do better than 10ms with an EMU 0404?
I use one with Garritan Steinway and easily get 5ms using the EMU driver and W7 64bit.
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#1836281 - 02/01/12 07:35 AM
Re: latency < 5ms on a USB/Firewire sound card?
[Re: jrcallan]
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Junior Member
Registered: 01/31/12
Posts: 4
Loc: Russia, Moscow
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Really? Great, thanks for the good news!! Are there newer versions of 0404 that are being sold? or similar devices? As I might not be lucky with getting a used one.
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#1836329 - 02/01/12 09:15 AM
Re: latency < 5ms on a USB/Firewire sound card?
[Re: Igor777K]
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1000 Post Club Member
Registered: 04/16/07
Posts: 1685
Loc: Pennsylvania
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The 0404 was highly regarded, but they don't make it any more and they haven't really put out a replacement. You are stuck with M audio, presonus, and focusright, basically.
Actually Behringer makes one too, I think, that gets good reviews for sound. Though there have been complaints about the driver quality.
To be fair, there are complaints about the driver quality of every one of these devices. Apparently no one company can have good hardware guys and good software guys.
Edited by gvfarns (02/01/12 09:17 AM)
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#1836337 - 02/01/12 09:29 AM
Re: latency < 5ms on a USB/Firewire sound card?
[Re: Igor777K]
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2000 Post Club Member
Registered: 09/24/09
Posts: 2344
Loc: Florida
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I have the Presonus. No problems at all. Very low latency.
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#1836344 - 02/01/12 09:43 AM
Re: latency < 5ms on a USB/Firewire sound card?
[Re: Igor777K]
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Full Member
Registered: 01/02/12
Posts: 212
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I replaced a 0404 with a Native Instruments Audio Kontrol 1 at some point, though I can't remember why exactly. I think I got a bundle or something and then switched because the Audio Kontrol seemed better suited for my home studio (jack connectors, smaller size). In fact I still have that 0404 lying around, the white special edition.
I certainly wouldn't go out of my way to obtain it. To my knowledge there is nothing that makes it more desirable than other audio interfaces. It's a little unnecessarily big really.
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#1836363 - 02/01/12 10:09 AM
Re: latency < 5ms on a USB/Firewire sound card?
[Re: gvfarns]
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500 Post Club Member
Registered: 08/28/08
Posts: 595
Loc: Lakewood, CA
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To be fair, there are complaints about the driver quality of every one of these devices. Apparently no one company can have good hardware guys and good software guys.
You are right about the software. I have a Steinberg CI1 that I could not get acceptable results using the driver written for it. The latency and crackling were horrible and I had to run a very large buffer making it un-useable. I recently downloaded the ASIO4All and am now able to use the interface. My computer is slightly underpowered for this interface. A 2GHZ processor is recommended and I have a 1.7
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#1836480 - 02/01/12 12:21 PM
Re: latency < 5ms on a USB/Firewire sound card?
[Re: Igor777K]
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Junior Member
Registered: 10/30/10
Posts: 19
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Please try your luck with the integrated sound card first. The ingredients to success should be Windows 7 and ASIO4All.
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#1836992 - 02/02/12 05:37 AM
Re: latency < 5ms on a USB/Firewire sound card?
[Re: Igor777K]
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Junior Member
Registered: 01/31/12
Posts: 4
Loc: Russia, Moscow
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Thanks a lot guys for your help!! yesterday was a busy day, I sold my P95 and was by some miracle able to buy a used E-MU 0404. I even managed to try it with Pianoteq (v.1.6) (currently downloading Ivory). I set 2ms delay and it seems to work fine. Sorry for getting a little off the topic, I have a question about pianoteq - piano sounds like it is being played in the next room, a little distant - is it normal for Pianoteq? Are drivers from Creative good for Windows 7 64, or asio4all works better with 0404? (also Pianoteq would start working only if I check "all midi devices" in settings, and not "EMU USB 0404", strange). What are must have tools for this E-MU 0404 card? I don't know even where to check the actual latency thanks a lot again! this is a great forum, very friendly, I am happy to have found it! 
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#1837114 - 02/02/12 10:37 AM
Re: latency < 5ms on a USB/Firewire sound card?
[Re: Igor777K]
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2000 Post Club Member
Registered: 09/24/09
Posts: 2344
Loc: Florida
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Yes, this is normal. I've never been satisfied with Pianoteq. It's inexpensive. But for not too much more money I bought Galaxy Vintage D, which sounds much better. I have a question about pianoteq - piano sounds like it is being played in the next room, a little distant - is it normal for Pianoteq?
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