What are the differences between these? I'm starting to think about a stage piano for practice while driving on the road for extended stays. Will play mostly through headphones, so speakers don't matter much.

My main concern is a decent touch/action reasonably similar to an acoustic grand. (I know there are limits to what a stage piano can do.)

I don't care about how well it imitates violins or noseflutes, etc.

For those purposes, how much of an improvement are either of these two over the P95?

And how much of an improvement (for those purposes) over either is the CP5?

Are there Kawai stage pianos I should be looking at in the same price point areas? Pluses and minuses?

Thanks!

The action of both is the same, the piano samples are somewhat different (technically, the P155 is better but some might still prefer the tone of the CP33). Since both are fairly far from a realistic tone there is not much between them except the speakers in the P155 and the master keyboard functions in the CP33.

Both are solid boards and way above a P95 (a serious player won't be happy with the latter, I know from own experience...).
I haven't played the CP5 but it seems again a substantial step up, also in terms of the action.

My own portability solution has become the Nord Electro 3 HP (11kg but only 73 keys), and a Nord Piano would be even better (at 18kg). Their acoustic piano samples are better than anything Yamaha I know, and the action is actually decent (but lighter than the CP33/P155).

Thanks, Maurus. Lighter action might be fine if it's otherwise a good action. The action on my AP is pretty light.

I'll look into the Nords at your suggestion. ....

They aren't inexpensive, are they?

Perhaps you can even get a good deal on a Nord Piano 88 now that the Nord Piano 2 has been announced (it adds splits and layering with samples, all basic piano functionality is unchanged). These are boards built for serious gigging so the action should last for a while.

For myself, the action on the CP5 would be a serious step up. The P155/CP33 type has too much initial resistance and thereby unnecessarily gets in the way of playing – at least that's my impression.

Still, it's a good action.

I agree. That's why I don't believe the P155/CP33 action is unequivocally better than the "lower end" P95/MOX8. Better in some ways, but worse in others, as you describe.

Similarly, there are probably people who prefer the "lower end" P155/CP33 action to the CP5, which they may find too light for their taste. As another thread was talking about recently, more expensive doesn't always mean better, especially when personal taste also plays such a large part.

But personally, yes, I'd love to have the CP5 action. I wish it could be put in a board that was under 30 lbs, even if that board was nothing but a soundless controller. But it might be that the action itself simply weighs too much to permit that. (I'd be willing to drop it to 73-76 keys if need be...)

ClsscLib, was just reading over in the Piano forums that you recently got a Steingraeber C212...? There isn't anything in the DP world remotely close to that incredible instrument!

But to answer your question, I think you'd be satisfied with the Yamaha P155, Kawai ES6, or Roland FP-7F.

Same action and samples, I think the P155 is 128 poly vs 64 on the CP33 ... and the P155 has speakers ... thats about it

Different samples, actually. The P155 has a newer four-level sample set while the CP33 has the older three-level sample. Though they are both Yamaha samples and therefore have a very similar character.

Be aware that the fact that the P155 has technically better samples doesn't mean they are more pleasing. In fact, I've heard several people have the opposite opinion.

Do you know please if the CP33 supports continuous sustain or does it have an on/off type switch?

I believe this is characteristic of the Pedal not the piano

It's continuous. The last Yamaha stage piano with on/off sustain was the P-80.

Both the pedal and piano must support it in order for it to work.

Thanks...It seems the CP33 would make more sense as a midi controller (for Ivory etc) as it is cheaper than the p155 yet has the same action and supports continuous sustain also.

Thanks. The problem is that the 212 doesn't do me much good when I'm on the road for a week, making sure I can meet the payment schedule for it!

So while I know I'm not going to get a perfect action in a stage piano, I'm hoping I can get "decent" in a reasonably priced, reasonably portable package. The suggestions here have been very helpful.

Zachary, thanks for your suggestion that I might be satisfied with the Yamaha P155, Kawai ES6, or Roland FP-7F.

I see from your signature block that you play an N1 (I just traded in my N2, though I loved it). I thought your Claire de Lune on the N1 was great -- and I see that you also play the Nord Piano 88 and Nord Electro.

Strictly in terms of touch/action, how would you compare the N1 with the P155, ES6, FP-7F, and the Nords?

I assumed you left the Nords off your list of recommendations because of their higher price points, but I'd very much welcome any observations you might wish to share on any or all of those instruments.

Thanks!

WTF ? the N1 has a real Grand Piano action .... nothing can compare.
FP-7F is the best of that lot you mentioned.

With respect, any action can be compared with any other action. For example, I could compare my N2's action with that of a "real Grand Piano."

What I was asking Zachary about was his opinion of how the action on his N1 compared to those of the other pianos he recommended.

Also it has USB-To-Host, which the P155 lacks. If you have a MIDI interface for your computer this doesn't matter, but it's a nice feature for those of us who do not.

ClsscLb, FWIW I prefer the GH action in the Yamahas to any Roland I've tried. More substantial. Lots of people like Roland actions because they are quicker among other things. Probably quicker than acoustics.

The AvantGrands, of course, have real acoustic actions. That doesn't mean they are divine or even necessarily the best by any measure except being similar to an acoustic action. By that measure I personally think the GH action is "better" than Roland's PHAIII.

Actions differ in many dimensions and people have completely different expectations and preferences, so asking for opinions about them has limited use. Better is to try a few and form an opinion, even if you can't try the specific piano you are interested in.

Thanks, GV. Is the Yamaha GH action in the P95, or does it only start with the P155 level of instrument?

The P155, CP33, and YDP161 are the cheapest and lowest end current Yamaha products with a GH action. There are those (like anotherscott) who prefer the lower-end and lighter GHS action found in the P95, but they are a small and odd group.

People who like light actions typically go for a Roland, but good Rolands are characteristically pricey.

My CP33 has a closer action to the Steinway D L1037 concert grand I played last week than the action of the 1978 Steinway B sitting in the same shop. (granted that action is a friction filled teflon clicking sludgefest and properly regulated Bs can be quite awesome.)

DP actions, coupled with Ivory II can be quite a convincing experience.

Sometimes I like learning new pieces on the CP33 and Italian Ivory Grand II better than on acoustics.

I swear that fricking software is an actual 10 ft piano in front of me sometimes. And the CP33 action always lets me play with huge dynamics. Right now I am learning Pathetique movement one and the ff on the Cp33 with Italian Ivory II is phenominal.

ClsscLib, really nothing comes close to my N1 from an action point of view. My NP88 action is a pleasure to play in context. It's perfect for piano and EP playing when gigging, but I would by no means want to spend a lot of time pkaying it to keep myself in shape for piano playing.

Btw, I have a nice gig and they have rented me a new Steinway B, and OH MY LORD, what an incredible instrument it is. Hands down the finest instrument I've played and I noticed right away the action was both lighter and more responsive than my N1. As soon as my wife and I move out, I'm buying a real grand. Will be looking at many options, but the Steinway B is definitely on my radar now. There is really NOTHING close to an acoustic grand piano from the digital world. It's corny sounding, but it's almost magic playing a high end instrument like a B after spending so much time on a digital.

I agree Zachary, but I went to play a new B and didn't like it much more than my C6 (I love them both) then played the D. Now I want a D.... Just need a bigger house and a winning lottery ticket. I will say, however, that Italian Ivory II with good headphones sound as good to play as sitting at any acoustic, but I will agree that the feel of a great acoustic has yet to be emulated properly, and a serious pianist needs an acoustic. If you can't play one though, a good digital action with Ivory II can give you that same wondrous feeling of getting lost in the music that a good acoustic can. I have never played a digital or software piano that can do that other than Ivory II (no I'm not paid to say that but will gladly take any money Synthogy!)

I try to be a serious pianist, but my late start and day job relegate me to a serious "hobby pianist!"