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I believe you also have to be consciousness of 'Full Trade-In Value' and the dealer terms. Sometimes it means you also have to spend a certain amount of $$$$ to qualify for their Full Trade-In option.

Yeah, I did ask what the requirements were for Trade In but verbally the saleslady said nothing. Which I don't believe because then theoretically I could just come back after a couple of years and buy a new piano for only whatever price increase has happened in the two years. Which might be just inflation 2-3% a year?

At my dealer, full value trade in only applies if the retail price of the new piano is double that of the trade-in piano. That's wasn't told to me verbally. It's in the page of legalese that's on the back of my invoice. Most trade in policies also allow for deductions for wear and tear but what constitutes "more than normal" wear and tear are poorly defined. Up in the stickies, at the top of the forum there's an article about full value trade-ins.

Facing the same dilemma, and with a similar budget, I wound up with a new premium line Young Chang 48.

Kurt

I think Brodmann is the best piano out of China. For some reason the Brodmann sound really impresses and when I was shopping I (initially) had a bias AGAINST Chinese pianos.
For ME I would take a Brodmann over a Yamaha any day.
(I'm not a fan of the Yamaha sound).

Do you guys find that Larry Fine's guidance of 20-30% off his SMP a good starting point for negotiating? So if I went with a new Brodmann PE-121, he has the MSRP listed at $8390 and SMP at $6590. My local dealer has the list price at $8480 and the sale price at $6690. Close enough.
If I did 20% it would be about $5300 and about $5000 if I did 25%. Does that sound about right? And do dealers normally include delivery, the bench, initial tuning, and extra tunings in that price?

Didn't want to start a new thread just on the pricing of the pianos so can anyone comment on me question above?
Is 20-25% off the list price of a new Brodmann piano at a dealer a good goal to negotiate down to?

The calc is not that straight forward unfortunately (which probably explains no response to the last question).

If it were me I'd go in and offer $5,500 to meet in the middle. My calc:

MSRP $8390 at 30% = 5873
SMRP $6590 at 20% = 5272

This is just me though. Normally included in the sale price of a piano is:

- the piano itself
- the bench
- free local delivery
- free 1st in home tuning

Sales tax is added on top of the final sale price. Hope this helps. Negotiating can be somewhat subjective.

Thanks. That gives me an idea at least. I had no idea how to use those numbers.

No problem. Let us know how it goes and/or what you end up purchasing.

Edited by moderator... SPAM

Full Trade In varies from dealer to dealer. If you're truly interested in buying a piano and you're told it comes with Full Trade In and a warranty, get the specifics in writing. Used pianos can be a great option if you want a bigger, better piano than you can currently afford new, but find your own RPT to go over it before writing the final check.

Best of Luck...let us know what you decide.

I went to two different dealers today. One sells Yamaha and Brodmann (amongst others) and the other sells Kawai and Hailun. It was funny to see them talk so much smack about the other brands.

I was quoted:
Hailun HU-1P $4400
Kawai K3 - $6100 (from $8995)
Kawai GM10 - $10k (from $13695)
Kawai GM12 - $12k (from $16195)

I think the prices have some play in them but they are definitely discounted down.

The other dealer quoted:
Brodmann PE121 $6000 (from $6690)
Brodmann PE162 $15k (from $16490)

I was actually leaning towards Brodmann but they hardly moved on the price at all. I was surprised. I was hoping at least $5500 on the PE121 if not more. And I was hoping for closer to $10k for the PE162. I estimated that price mainly from this thread.
https://www.pianoworld.com/forum/ubb...0with%20piano%20choices.html#Post1835977

If I could get the Brodmann PE162 close to $10-11k I think I'd get that one. But they don't look like they want to budge. So if that's the case I might just go with the Hailun. I'm still seriously considering a grand versus upright but the dealer only has that one Hailun model. Not sure if I should get the HG 151 or 161 without seeing/hearing it. But it should be sub $10k, no?

You don't mention anything about how these pianos sound or play - only prices. Unless you are buying a piece of furniture, the performance and playability of the instrument should be equally important.

Although I've not played a HG 151, there are few tiny grands that sound better to my ears than a decent quality full-sized upright, fwiw. Also, I find a grand piano that is wider than it is long somewhat ridiculous looking. Others disagree.

Sorry. I didn't mention the play because I don't play. Though I do play the clarinet, my only experience on a piano is hamming around. So I've been relying on my son (who's been playing for about 4 years) and forums such as this.

Prior to researching I didn't really have an idea of what I wanted. So I thought I was going to get a used Yamaha U3 or something, based on price point and brand. But now that I've heard them I think they're too bright for my taste. I do like the more mellow sound of the Brodmann. Today was the first day to hear the Hailun and my son like that one the best. It also happens to be the cheapest.

I was still leaning towards Brodmann based on the reviews here so I went back to dealership to compare price. But they didn't budge much.

As for buying furniture, that's actually part of the reason I'm considering a grand. I do like the look and think it would look better in my formal living area. What do you consider a tiny grand? Is 5'4" tiny? And what is a full size upright? Is 48" full or only 52"?

To me, a "full size" upright is 48"+, but that's not an absolute number. Same goes for small grand - there are no perfect boundaries, one's ears, fingers, and eyes should be the judge.

It is interesting that your son prefers the least expensive piano of the lot - perhaps going back to re-audition would be a good idea in the near future.

Well, I'm trying to take into account my son's likes but I'm also tempering it with the realism that he's only 8.5. He might like one piano more than another just because the keys are easier to depress. He has a keyboard so something as simple as that might skew his entire opinion. So I'm constantly having to asking him to focus on why or why he doesn't like something. And also just using my own ears as to the sound of the piano. And that's also why I'm trying to do as much research and due diligence as I can and hoping to learn more from PW.

The Hailun 161 has a significantly better low end than the 151.

Just an update.
I decided to pull the trigger on a Hailun HG-161. Price was $9500. I'm sure I could have gotten it a little lower but I didn't want to haggle too much. It was in the range I was comfortable.
The dealer also told me the Kawai GM10 he quoted me last week for $10k was down to $8k. But I liked the sound of the Hailun better.

Congratulations on your new piano! What matters is when you sit down at the piano in your home and make beautiful music! There is nothing like it!

Rick

Interesting. A 25% drop. Apply the same to the K3 $6100 price and it puts you at $4880 which is very close within the negotiable range of $4500-4800 which others here have scored on.

Congrats on your purchase btw! The search is over and you have your piano