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#1841846 - 02/10/12 11:35 AM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: pianojosh23]
sophial Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/11/05
Posts: 3443
Loc: US
pianojosh23,

The Weinen Klagen Sorgen Zagen variations are an enormous outpouring of grief. My understanding is that they were written in the aftermath of the deaths of his daughter Blandine and son Daniel. Read Alan Walker on this piece in his biography of Liszt. This work holds tremendous emotional power-- you can hear at various points the piano weeping in downward minor seconds, and an absolutely overwhelming emotional climax of rage and questioning of God. Liszt writes a miraculous moment then as a fragile ray of grace and light breaks through, and a theme of a Bach cantata is used to form the coda (translated roughly as "What God does is well done"). It's a stunning piece.

Sophia

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#1842912 - 02/11/12 11:25 PM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: Samuel1993]
pianojosh23 Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/11/08
Posts: 603
Originally Posted By: Samuel1993
I can defiantly see why some may be indifferent to Liszt, his music at times is very showy, but in my opinion, beneath all the virtuosity and showmanship, Liszt was extremely sensitive and VERY romantic. Here's some of my favorite pieces which show "the other side" of Liszt:-

http://youtu.be/3WereFdCsII
A little posthumously published piece "Romance in E minor S.196". One of my all time favorite Liszt pieces.

http://youtu.be/MepHSMl0NGs
"Klavierstucke in A flat" - absoloutley beautiful.

http://youtu.be/iCFn5agTjTE
The first of the three Liebstraum, my favorite one. The first two are often overlooked because of the popularity of the third one, this one is just stunning. The third one, despite its overexposure is absoloutley gorgeous though, the final section gives me chills everytime.

You've got to love Liszt, very difficult to play but an absoloute genius.

I almost forgot this:- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Inh-Jyd7UhY
Hungarian Rhapsody in E minor ""Héroïde élégiaque" this one speaks for itself.



Amen to what you said! I myself have taken a very long hard look at his output, and while he WAS that virtuoso, sex symbol...He was also an absolute genius as a composer, i'm convinced.

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#1842913 - 02/11/12 11:26 PM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: sophial]
pianojosh23 Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/11/08
Posts: 603
Originally Posted By: sophial
pianojosh23,

The Weinen Klagen Sorgen Zagen variations are an enormous outpouring of grief. My understanding is that they were written in the aftermath of the deaths of his daughter Blandine and son Daniel. Read Alan Walker on this piece in his biography of Liszt. This work holds tremendous emotional power-- you can hear at various points the piano weeping in downward minor seconds, and an absolutely overwhelming emotional climax of rage and questioning of God. Liszt writes a miraculous moment then as a fragile ray of grace and light breaks through, and a theme of a Bach cantata is used to form the coda (translated roughly as "What God does is well done"). It's a stunning piece.

Sophia


Wow, thanks for that. After reading that and finding a good recording (by gooddog's piano teacher, no less), I now completely agree with you and see it for the masterpiece it is! What a remarkable piece. Thankyou!

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#1842924 - 02/11/12 11:48 PM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: pianojosh23]
Brendan Offline



Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 5285
Loc: McAllen, TX
Loved me some Liszt this week: two concerts of his transcriptions.

I almost don't want to learn a new program for next year!
_________________________
http://www.BrendanKinsella.com

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#1842927 - 02/11/12 11:50 PM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: Orange Soda King]
Brendan Offline



Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 5285
Loc: McAllen, TX
Originally Posted By: Orange Soda King
I started reading through the Dante Sonata today. It's actually really good!


...and it's actually not that hard once you get it! It's just an endurance test.
_________________________
http://www.BrendanKinsella.com

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#1843060 - 02/12/12 08:15 AM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: pianojosh23]
Dubious Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/11/04
Posts: 78
BTW, there is an interesting article by Charles Rosen, in the NY Review of Books,

http://www.nybooks.com/articles/archives/2012/feb/23/super-power-franz-liszt/



Edited by Dubious (02/12/12 08:24 AM)

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#1843099 - 02/12/12 09:34 AM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: Brendan]
Orange Soda King Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/25/09
Posts: 6070
Loc: Louisville, Kentucky, United S...
Originally Posted By: Brendan
Originally Posted By: Orange Soda King
I started reading through the Dante Sonata today. It's actually really good!


...and it's actually not that hard once you get it! It's just an endurance test.


That's what it seemed like when I was reading through it... It seems like the hardest part is conceptualizing how you want it to really go.

By the way, if you are able to play the word "conceptualizing" in Scrabble, you could score over 1000 points:


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#1848731 - 02/20/12 10:15 PM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: pianojosh23]
Damon Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/22/06
Posts: 6064
Loc: St. Louis area
Lovely piece from the "Canticle of the Sun" (also sounds like it is playable by mortals.)

_________________________
It's been scientifically proven that Horowitz sucks.

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#1849361 - 02/21/12 09:31 PM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: pianojosh23]
Damon Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/22/06
Posts: 6064
Loc: St. Louis area

Some songs are about love, others...spruce trees?

_________________________
It's been scientifically proven that Horowitz sucks.

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#1849483 - 02/22/12 06:42 AM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: Damon]
pianojosh23 Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/11/08
Posts: 603
Originally Posted By: Damon
Lovely piece from the "Canticle of the Sun" (also sounds like it is playable by mortals.)



I always loved that piece, and that is a terrific recording. Thanks for sharing!


Edited by pianojosh23 (02/22/12 09:19 AM)

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#1849529 - 02/22/12 09:48 AM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: pianojosh23]
pianojosh23 Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/11/08
Posts: 603
The Légendes. Two of Liszt's finest.



Edited by pianojosh23 (02/22/12 09:49 AM)

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#1855126 - 03/02/12 06:21 PM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: pianojosh23]
pianojosh23 Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/11/08
Posts: 603
Three of my recent Liszt 'discoveries' need to be added to this thread.

As I made another thread about, but I might as well put it here too...His masterpiece, the Weinen, Klagen, Sorgen, Zagen variations. Took me the longest time to understand, but I now consider it one of the most emotionally powerful and profound works in the literature.




His tone poem, Hamlet, which is a work I have known for a long time. However, it has only just clicked for me after not getting it at all, and i'm starting to see it as the masterpiece some commentators consider it to be.





The 'Benedictus' from the Hungarian Coronation Mass. I've only heard the Credo and this Benedictus from this mass, so i'm guessing the rest perhaps is not quite as inspired (i'll be finding out soon, with a Liszt collection i'm getting). But the Benedictus is absolutely gloriously inspired.






Edited by pianojosh23 (03/02/12 06:42 PM)

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#1855376 - 03/03/12 05:12 AM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: pianojosh23]
babama Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/15/08
Posts: 800
Loc: Netherlands
Nice. I've been exploring a bit with the help of this thread. The amount of music he wrote is really intimidating.

In general I like his more gentle, subtle music far more than the loud, fast and showy music with endless streams of notes.

The problem arises with pieces that have both. It's hard for me to like them even though there may be a number of gorgeous quieter moments.

A piece like Totentanz, there are certain elements and moments I really like, but overall it's just too much. I need my music to have more breathing space.


Edited by babama (03/03/12 05:25 AM)

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#1855396 - 03/03/12 07:38 AM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: babama]
pianojosh23 Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/11/08
Posts: 603
Originally Posted By: babama
Nice. I've been exploring a bit with the help of this thread. The amount of music he wrote is really intimidating.

In general I like his more gentle, subtle music far more than the loud, fast and showy music with endless streams of notes.

The problem arises with pieces that have both. It's hard for me to like them even though there may be a number of gorgeous quieter moments.

A piece like Totentanz, there are certain elements and moments I really like, but overall it's just too much. I need my music to have more breathing space.


I think that the appreciation of the pieces that have both will come with time. In the best of Liszt, like the second Ballade, the Sonata, etc pretty much all of the notes are for a musical purpose, even if it seems like that isn't the case at first.


Edited by pianojosh23 (03/03/12 07:38 AM)

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#1855399 - 03/03/12 07:54 AM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: pianojosh23]
pianojosh23 Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/11/08
Posts: 603
I posted this work earlier, although there is now a recording I like MUCH more at this point. It doesn't drag on nearly as much. His great Oratorio Christus. Liszt considered it the greatest work he wrote, as does Lesle Howard (who called it far and away the greatest Romantic era Oratorio). It is certainly a work that requires repeated listens and it does seem to drag on at first even in this recording, but the more I give those listens the more I agree with Mark Carpenter who said: ""Christus" is music-making on the very highest order -- this is a score which can stand comparison with Beethoven's "Missa Solemnis" and Brahms' "German Requiem" and hold its head high along side these greatest of masterpieces."

For those who have 2.5 or so hours available...here it is.





My personal favourite movements are...
March of the Three Magi. (first vid, 45:40).
The Miracle. (Second vid, 24:34.)
Stabat Mater dolorosa. (Third vid, 14:12).



Edited by pianojosh23 (03/03/12 09:07 AM)

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#1855403 - 03/03/12 08:10 AM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: pianojosh23]
apple* Offline


Registered: 01/01/03
Posts: 19862
Loc: Kansas
His larger works are too hard for me, but I am delighted to find that he is a very accessible working pianist and wrote sensibly.. his 'smaller' music really is easy to play.

I've explored his songs and organ works.. He was very diverse. My favorite?.. As a religious organist, i kind of like his dreary Weinen, Klagen, Sorgen, Zagen variations.. they are so meaningful.. I would never perform them much - I certainly have dabble tho and they are really interesting pieces. .. and thanks to the link to the Bendictus pianojosh.!!!

since he wrote so fiendishly, works out of my skill scope ... I do like his Totentanz and other, wildly crazy works.
_________________________
accompanist/organist.. a non-MTNA teacher to a few

love and peace, Õun (apple in Estonian)

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#1855793 - 03/03/12 10:01 PM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: pianojosh23]
Damon Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/22/06
Posts: 6064
Loc: St. Louis area
_________________________
It's been scientifically proven that Horowitz sucks.

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#1855833 - 03/03/12 10:41 PM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: pianojosh23]
Damon Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/22/06
Posts: 6064
Loc: St. Louis area
Fantastic!
_________________________
It's been scientifically proven that Horowitz sucks.

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#1855843 - 03/03/12 11:02 PM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: pianojosh23]
gooddog Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/08/08
Posts: 4777
Loc: Seattle area, WA
Last night I attended the third Liszt recital given by my teacher, Mark Salman. This one covered Liszt's Weimer Period. I am new to Liszt so every piece is a surprise. He played:

Funerailles - what a beautiful but angry piece of music. The "bells" gave me goosebumps. Mark related that Liszt had great national pride and wrote the piece in anger at the Hungarian government for brutally executing a small group of revolutionaries. Mark's playing evoked fury and mourning and hope.

Seliger Tod - one of the lesser played Liebestraume

Weinen, Klagen, Sorgen, Zagen - powerful piece.

Scherzo and March

and finished with the B minor sonata.

I enjoyed Funerailles and the Scherzo/march the best. The B minor sonata was a lot to absorb but I think I will grow to love it. I find Liszt to be one of those composers I have to listen to multiple times to appreciate. My admiration of his work is steadily growing.
_________________________
Best regards,

Deborah

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#1855944 - 03/04/12 03:47 AM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: gooddog]
pianojosh23 Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/11/08
Posts: 603
Originally Posted By: gooddog
Last night I attended the third Liszt recital given by my teacher, Mark Salman. This one covered Liszt's Weimer Period. I am new to Liszt so every piece is a surprise. He played:

Funerailles - what a beautiful but angry piece of music. The "bells" gave me goosebumps. Mark related that Liszt had great national pride and wrote the piece in anger at the Hungarian government for brutally executing a small group of revolutionaries. Mark's playing evoked fury and mourning and hope.

Seliger Tod - one of the lesser played Liebestraume

Weinen, Klagen, Sorgen, Zagen - powerful piece.

Scherzo and March

and finished with the B minor sonata.

I enjoyed Funerailles and the Scherzo/march the best. The B minor sonata was a lot to absorb but I think I will grow to love it. I find Liszt to be one of those composers I have to listen to multiple times to appreciate. My admiration of his work is steadily growing.


Sounds like you had a good time smile I'm very jealous! Of any of the recitals in the series that would have been the one I would want to have gone to. I actually found him playing Funerailles on youtube and it has quickly become on of my favourite performances, if not my favourite. From the limited amount i've heard Mark has quickly become one of my very favourite Liszt performers, by the way.

I also agree with you. Many of my favourite pieces by Liszt I didn't think much of at first. His music does take multiple listens and a certain understanding to appreciate in full, for sure. Thanks for the account!


Edited by pianojosh23 (03/04/12 03:48 AM)

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#1855945 - 03/04/12 03:59 AM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: apple*]
pianojosh23 Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/11/08
Posts: 603
Originally Posted By: apple*
His larger works are too hard for me, but I am delighted to find that he is a very accessible working pianist and wrote sensibly.. his 'smaller' music really is easy to play.

I've explored his songs and organ works.. He was very diverse. My favorite?.. As a religious organist, i kind of like his dreary Weinen, Klagen, Sorgen, Zagen variations.. they are so meaningful.. I would never perform them much - I certainly have dabble tho and they are really interesting pieces. .. and thanks to the link to the Bendictus pianojosh.!!!

since he wrote so fiendishly, works out of my skill scope ... I do like his Totentanz and other, wildly crazy works.


You're welcome smile

And I think you hit it on the head. With Liszt there is always the stereotype that all his music is impossibly difficult, but he wrote a huge amount of very accessible music that late intermediate - early advanced students can play. Of course, he did write a lot of virtuoso music and many great works that require a virtuoso technique, but even they tend to be easier than you'd expect due to just how proficient he was at writing for the piano. Very pianistic.

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#1856265 - 03/04/12 08:15 PM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: gooddog]
argerichfan Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/15/06
Posts: 8818
Loc: Pacific Northwest, US.
Originally Posted By: gooddog

Funerailles - what a beautiful but angry piece of music. The "bells" gave me goosebumps. Mark related that Liszt had great national pride and wrote the piece in anger at the Hungarian government for brutally executing a small group of revolutionaries. Mark's playing evoked fury and mourning and hope.

No doubt Deborah, and I am sure that Mark was awesome!

Funérailles to me has never been so much about anger, but all about a steady and progressive catharsis. Liszt has faced his anger and triumphed in another world. The final measures must rate as the spookiest in music, and he leaves the issue open.
_________________________
Jason

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#1856298 - 03/04/12 09:28 PM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: pianojosh23]
hawgdriver Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/13/09
Posts: 637
Loc: Denver, CO
I'm particularly moved by this seldom-performed piece, Vexilla Regis Prodeunt, S.185.

_________________________
Only in men's imagination does every truth find an effective and undeniable existence. Imagination, not invention, is the supreme master of art as of life. -Józef Teodor Konrad Korzeniowski

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#1856423 - 03/05/12 06:49 AM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: hawgdriver]
pianojosh23 Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/11/08
Posts: 603
Originally Posted By: hawgdriver
I'm particularly moved by this seldom-performed piece, Vexilla Regis Prodeunt, S.185.



Thanks for sharing! Not one i'm particular familar with myself although i'd heard it once or twice. Apart from that one, the Harmonies poétiques et religieuses, Legendes, etc he wrote quite a few religious piano pieces that I really like. Some of my favourites among those i'm more familiar with are...



In festo transfigurationis Domini nostri Jesu Christi.



Sancta Dorothea



Stabat Mater (Using the same 'Stabat Mater Dolorosa' theme as 'Via Crucis' and 'Christus').



Urbi et orbi. Bénédiction papale.



Hymne de la nuit.





Edited by pianojosh23 (03/05/12 07:20 AM)

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#1868450 - 03/25/12 09:18 PM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: pianojosh23]
pianojosh23 Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/11/08
Posts: 603
Some more obscure solo piano favourites...All of these were written before his Weimar years - some in the 30's, some in the 40's.














Edited by pianojosh23 (03/26/12 12:06 AM)

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#1869215 - 03/27/12 12:03 PM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: pianojosh23]
pianojosh23 Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/11/08
Posts: 603
Some more great works. Two beautiful new discoveries, and one old favourite.

Psalm 23.



Die heilige Cäcilia.



Von der Wiege bis zum Grabe.












Edited by pianojosh23 (03/27/12 12:51 PM)

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#1869352 - 03/27/12 05:15 PM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: pianojosh23]
Damon Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/22/06
Posts: 6064
Loc: St. Louis area
Our 20th century fans can just click "play" on all five at once to enjoy! cool
_________________________
It's been scientifically proven that Horowitz sucks.

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#1869529 - 03/27/12 11:56 PM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: Damon]
Damon Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/22/06
Posts: 6064
Loc: St. Louis area
After listening to Katsaris, the tempo here seems glacial and yet I was totally mesmerized by this performance.

_________________________
It's been scientifically proven that Horowitz sucks.

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#1869578 - 03/28/12 02:13 AM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: pianojosh23]
Pangur Bán Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/19/10
Posts: 84
Loc: Kuala Lumpur
I've just got myself a piano and started playing again after a hiatus of 27 years (with a couple of periods in between when I did have access to the odd instrument or two of dubious provenance). I never did get Liszt, either as a player (too many technical challenges for me at that time probably) or as a listener. I did have a go at some of the pieces in the first book of the Années those many years ago, and reading through them again on the piano just now, I believe can quite comfortably learn Wallenstadt, Pastorale, and Eclogue. What other pieces would people here recommend, that are not too technically challenging, but are musically rewarding?

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#1869597 - 03/28/12 03:17 AM Re: Franz Liszt appreciation thread. [Re: Pangur Bán]
pianojosh23 Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/11/08
Posts: 603
Originally Posted By: Pangur Bán
I've just got myself a piano and started playing again after a hiatus of 27 years (with a couple of periods in between when I did have access to the odd instrument or two of dubious provenance). I never did get Liszt, either as a player (too many technical challenges for me at that time probably) or as a listener. I did have a go at some of the pieces in the first book of the Années those many years ago, and reading through them again on the piano just now, I believe can quite comfortably learn Wallenstadt, Pastorale, and Eclogue. What other pieces would people here recommend, that are not too technically challenging, but are musically rewarding?


First of all, it's great you're getting back on the piano! I wish you luck in your journey with the instrument.

And to answer your question, the pieces you mentioned from the Annees could be a good start. Some other musically rewarding pieces around the same difficulty would be..

Romance in E Minor.



Consolations: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1Ye48y7mFU&feature=channel (That video contains 1 and 2, but 3, 4, 5, and 6 are found on the recommended videos on the side).

En rêve. Nocturne.



Tell me what you think of those.





Edited by pianojosh23 (03/28/12 03:38 AM)

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