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#1856602 - 03/05/12 01:35 PM EP sounds on Yamahas -- is it just me?
Jonny Guitar Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/22/12
Posts: 87
I have tried all the Yamaha DPs in the store (mostly through headphones or very quietly) and found that the entire lower register was pretty much useless because the sound would 'fart out' and become a quiet undefined blurting sound. I am talking pretty much anything left of the C left of middle C.

Is this normal for Yamahas like the 95 155 etc or am I doing something wrong? Perhaps I need to play more softly at a louder level for those lower notes; perhaps my headphones were not up to muster, though it wasn't a problem on the Rolands at all. How can I play Billy Preston Stone's stuff if I can go south of middle C?? Come on, I got the giant afro wig and I am ready to go.

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#1856638 - 03/05/12 02:51 PM Re: EP sounds on Yamahas -- is it just me? [Re: Jonny Guitar]
stringless Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/18/07
Posts: 143
Loc: Idiocracy, USA
The obvious (to me, anyway) question then becomes.. "why not buy a Roland, then?"

Is there something compelling you get a Yamaha instead of other makes? Brand recognition? Peer pressure? Internet consensus? Budget?

Be very careful of Brand Recognition and Internet Consensus -- they are often horribly, horribly wrong. Just because something is from popular brand doesn't make it good or great. Just because a lot of people agree en-masse doesn't make it good or great, either. I could name many examples in a great many subjects.

I went through a similar experience. I didn't like what I found at my price range (or any price range, frankly) in Yamaha, so I tried others, and found what I liked somewhere else.

I didn't set out to get a Roland. The Roland, however, seems to have chosen me. Believe it or not, my original thought was "get a Yamaha." It is a well-known name with a long history. In my case, it just wasn't the right name, the right feel, or the right sound at all. I had to bend my budget quite a bit to go elsewhere, but I'm so glad I did.

Just my 2¢.
_________________________
o.O

A hammered piano, minus the strings. Brilliant!

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#1856639 - 03/05/12 02:53 PM Re: EP sounds on Yamahas -- is it just me? [Re: Jonny Guitar]
toddy Online   content
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/30/11
Posts: 1768
Loc: Portugal
Jonny Guitar said:

entire lower register .......... sound would 'fart out' and become a quiet undefined blurting sound

Well. I don't know about Yamaha digital DP approximations, but this is certainly the finest, most concise and sensuously redolent description of a Fender Rhodes that I've ever heard. Ought to win a prize.
_________________________
Roland HP 302, Yamaha SY85

Reaper / NI Komplete 9 /Kontakt 5// EWQL Sym Choirs/ Sym Orchestra Silver/ MOR2
Mics: SP B1 & MXL V67g/ Alesis MicTube Preamp/ Xenyx302/ Yamaha HS7s .

"Only a fool is fooled" pv88, All Fools' Day 2014.

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#1856640 - 03/05/12 02:55 PM Re: EP sounds on Yamahas -- is it just me? [Re: Jonny Guitar]
anotherscott Online   content
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/20/10
Posts: 3323
Roland doesn't make any DP in the price range of a P95 or P155.

I haven't played the EP sound on the P155. I thought the sound of the P95 was okay except that the high velocity "bark" came in too abruptly and too soon, which may be the issue here. The Casio PX-100 was better, if you can still find that, though you may not like it's acoustic piano as much as the Yamahas...

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#1856676 - 03/05/12 04:25 PM Re: EP sounds on Yamahas -- is it just me? [Re: Jonny Guitar]
maduro Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/07/11
Posts: 276
unfortunately at this price point you arent going to get super duper winners just contenders and they are right fine keyboards
I thought the Ep on the p95 wasnt too bad
but you can get a real winner by getting a roland jv1010 or v880 and look for any SAEP
which is the type of synthesis which created the famous mks 20

think about it
yamaha has the cp5 and cp50 which sell for a few hundred and maybe a grand more than the 155


they have to make some sound differentiation. otherwise
why not save yourself a bundle right? I own a p85
I am not thrilled with the sounds they are doable for a gig but I always layer I even have a motif and a fantomg8 and I still layer.


you solution in my opinon is to simply deal with the 155 and go buy an inexpensive module like the roland 880 or the jv1010 about 60-200 dollars my jv880 cost me 40.00
and you now not only have many other keyboard sounds such as acoustic guitars pads strings horns etc but you can create layers to make lush sounding EPs and pianos check out my post OMG the perfect layered piano and listen to my layer using the jv1010
the 1010 is so small as to not require any extra luggage space.


just my two cents

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#1856708 - 03/05/12 05:28 PM Re: EP sounds on Yamahas -- is it just me? [Re: Jonny Guitar]
gvfarns Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/16/07
Posts: 3484
Loc: Pennsylvania
Originally Posted By: Jonny Guitar
I have tried all the Yamaha DPs in the store (mostly through headphones or very quietly) and found that the entire lower register was pretty much useless because the sound would 'fart out' and become a quiet undefined blurting sound. I am talking pretty much anything left of the C left of middle C.


Let's start by identifying whether it has to do with the tone engine or the speakers/headphones. Most digitals, including Yamahas, have horrible speakers, which tend to sound terrible in the lower registers. Did you play any digital pianos in the store that did not fart out? If not I would say the most likely thing is that your headphones were not amazing and the speakers definitely are not. If you played all the Yamahas in the store I assume some of those were nicer clavinovas, which have a somewhat better tone engine. But their speakers still stink.

Many digitals are not amazing in the lower ranges (even the tone engine), but smaller acoustics are not amazing in that range either. It's something that comes with quality to some degree.

The other thing to remember is that humans often perceive loudness as quality and clarity (the source of the loudness war in mixing). Acoustics are significantly louder than digitals at the level people usually use them, even through headphones. That gives them an unfair advantage. Might want to try some at a higher volume level and with nicer headphones before you make the final decision.

When you do find out whether it's the tone engine or speaker/acoustic situation that was disappointing, then you will know whether you need better cans or to look at a different brand. I haven't heard anyone complain about this particular element of Yamaha's tone, and I haven't noticed it when I've played them, though I have noticed that when I play quietly on any instrument there's a lack of clarity, especially in the bass.

If by "farting out" you mean there is insufficient sustain, then all onboard piano sounds are going to disappoint. For some reason they all stink at this (probable exception is the V piano). If this is an important feature for you, you will likely be satisfied best by software pianos.

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#1856810 - 03/05/12 08:27 PM Re: EP sounds on Yamahas -- is it just me? [Re: stringless]
Jonny Guitar Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/22/12
Posts: 87
Thanks for the ideas...I don't know how to muliple quote so I am going to take them one a time. Figured out how to multiple quote but it is too late for this time.

Originally Posted By: stringless
The obvious (to me, anyway) question then becomes.. "why not buy a Roland, then?"


I am 95% towards buying a Roland Fp-f7 based on the sound, action, and I just seem to connect with it more than the other dps I have tried. I would of loved to be happy with the 155 because I could live without the extras the Fp7f offers but I really didn't like the non piano sounds. If I could get close feel and sound at 1000 cheaper I would be fine with whatever brand it was.


I posted the question because I am curious if I am doing something to incite the bad results. When I asked the saleperson, he told me it was because Yamaha doesn't have the experience with non piano sound that Roland does...don't know if that is a legit reason or not.


Edited by Jonny Guitar (03/05/12 08:49 PM)

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#1856812 - 03/05/12 08:29 PM Re: EP sounds on Yamahas -- is it just me? [Re: toddy]
Jonny Guitar Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/22/12
Posts: 87
Originally Posted By: toddy

Well. I don't know about Yamaha digital DP approximations, but this is certainly the finest, most concise and sensuously redolent description of a Fender Rhodes that I've ever heard. Ought to win a prize.


Was reading Finnegans Wake prior to posting...

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#1856814 - 03/05/12 08:32 PM Re: EP sounds on Yamahas -- is it just me? [Re: maduro]
Jonny Guitar Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/22/12
Posts: 87
Originally Posted By: maduro
you solution in my opinon is to simply deal with the 155 and go buy an inexpensive module like the roland 880 or the jv1010 about 60-200 dollars..............


I have to investigate this route..really don't know anything about it but I will check it out. Thanks.

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#1856817 - 03/05/12 08:42 PM Re: EP sounds on Yamahas -- is it just me? [Re: gvfarns]
Jonny Guitar Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/22/12
Posts: 87
Originally Posted By: gvfarns
Let's start by identifying whether it has to do with the tone engine or the speakers/headphones...... Might want to try some at a higher volume level and with nicer headphones before you make the final decision.


It sounded fine when I played the Fp4 Fp7 and 700nx and 300 so it kinda eliminates the headphones unless the yamahas produced lower frequencies that stressed the low end of the headphones. I will try some different headphones and crank it up and see what happens.

Originally Posted By: gvfarns
I haven't heard anyone complain about this particular element of Yamaha's tone, and I haven't noticed it when I've played them, though I have noticed that when I play quietly on any instrument there's a lack of clarity, especially in the bass.

If by "farting out" you mean ....


I didn't think it could be a common complaint because it is really bad (unusable imo)as I am hearing it. Now that I know it a controllable variable, I shall apply Occam's razor until I find the source of the problem.

The farting out is like the note starts to sound and then just dies out in a pathetic whelping choked attempt. It doesn't even sound like a note.

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#1856821 - 03/05/12 08:47 PM Re: EP sounds on Yamahas -- is it just me? [Re: anotherscott]
Jonny Guitar Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/22/12
Posts: 87
Originally Posted By: anotherscott
Roland doesn't make any DP in the price range of a P95 or P155.

I thought the sound of the P95 was okay except that the high velocity "bark" came in too abruptly and too soon,


didn't like that either...the Fp7f seems to transition between various loudness levels with natural grace and realism.

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#1856895 - 03/05/12 11:42 PM Re: EP sounds on Yamahas -- is it just me? [Re: Jonny Guitar]
Steve Lampl Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 03/04/12
Posts: 10
The EP sounds on my Yamaha CP-50 are very good and don't seem to become distorted at low volume or when fading out. There are no speakers in the CP-50, just a preamplifier and headphone output, so perhaps that's why the sound seems clean.
_________________________
Steve
Yamaha CP-50 Stage Piano
Peavey Cirrus-5 Bass

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#1856985 - 03/06/12 03:45 AM Re: EP sounds on Yamahas -- is it just me? [Re: Jonny Guitar]
andi85 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/08/11
Posts: 90
Loc: Germany
Well … I think that's just the way they sound. For my taste, the P series doesn't have convincing Rhodes sounds, that only changed with the recent CP models (1/5/50).
_________________________
Best

Andreas

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