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pv88,

If this is true (which I do not think it is) then there would still be no reason for it to effect your decision on buying a V-Piano.

We offer special V-piano packages that include a speaker system, stand, bench, etc. and have rarely had a customer buy elsewhere over price. Just a thought.

Good Luck,

If year or two later there's a better alternative to V-Piano, great.

But there may be none.

my sentiments too. The platform is set up to upgrade fairly easily- mainly just software downloads from roland. but there hasn't been a software update in 2 years. that is what amazes me. just do something, anything that makes users believe you are nurturing the concept/technology. The hardware is fine- obviously a lighter, more portable version would be interesting in the future, but sell the marketplace on the constant refinement of the software first and then innovate the physical instrument.

I concur and 100% agree with this point. Roland should hire bennevis and have him help in creating the next Evolution part 2 upgrade that the V-piano deserves. At the very least come out with the extra sounds taken from the V-piano Grand as part of Rolands way to say they are still supporting their amazing product.

When you really think about it, there have been very little development in digital emulations of various synths and keyboards these last 10+ years. V-Piano is certainly an exception, but even V-Piano is getting a bit long in the tooth now. As far as analog synth and keyboard emulations the industry is pretty much at a stand still. Creamware made some very good (still digital sounding though) synth emulations 10+ years ago, and those are still the best on the market IMO. The newest hammond organ clones still sound thinner than the real thing, and digital overdrive is still very nasty and/or flat sounding on higher settings (Nord C1/C2 for instance).
Hmm, you would think with the development of DSP and CPU chips that sound quality would conitinue to improve, obviously not...

I mean listen to progrock and fusion jazz albums for the 70s. I sooo much more prefer that sound to todays fake, digital sounds. V-Piano is a very good digital simulation, but it's still a weak in certain areas - as all other digital emulations today are. Nothing can beat the sound of a real piano, hammond organ, modular synth etc..

It'sad but music sounded better in seventies indeed.

Yes. The analogue art form reached full maturity in the 70s. A well recorded piece of music from the 70s cannot be equalled for sonic clarity, warmth or dynamics - the three could go hand-in-hand back then.

yet keyboards companies are heading still in wrong direction...

It seems we are in full agreement!
Well, convenience has won over sound quality. Even many of todays analog synths sound inferior to the 70s models, like MiniMoog Voyager which lacks the richness and power in sound that the original Mini-Moogs offered, though we got a decent tradeoff with the added tuning stability.
Well, I guess I'm still very happy with my digital piano, but some day I will have a grand piano in my living room.

I guess it will ba an analoge grand piano?

Definately analoge, yes!

What Roland needs to do is at the very least come out with another Evolution style upgrade to the V-Piano and allow retailers to lower their prices for a sale once again. The price was raised now long enough and the market still does not have any competitors that can match the organic qualities and richness of sound the V-piano produces.

I, like bennevis, play Grand Piano's in concert settings all the time so I know what they sound and feel like. First of all the criticism that I hear over the years about the V-piano not living up to the hype in my opinion come from three different sources.

The first being its competitors saying how they played it and yet there is something inherintly wrong with the sound that they can only hear, etc. I'm pretty sure there are some competitors planted by rival companies who's main goal is to make everyone believe they own the product, give it just enough praise, and yet make up something bad about the product etc. or say they sold it to move onto its competitor etc. With the internet age, it is very easy to do this and sadly it happens more often than people would like to believe.

Secondly there are those who bought Avant-Grands which are its closest competitor and feel the need to justify their purchase by saying how much better they are in comparison, etc. They are a great instrument, and are a worthy competitor. However they really fall in two very different categories.

Third are actual owners which are very few who all have different talents and abilities but do share one common passion which led us to buy the most expensive stand-alone digital piano to date. I personally went through this over ten years ago when I landed Yamahas flagship model the CLP990 which I still play and love how it sounds. In comparison to the V-piano, it.still feels more like a real grand due to having wooden hammers and spruce keys. When hearing the sound out from its own speakers, it has a natural sounding tone to it that no other CLP has yet to match after 10 or more years. Now fast-forward to when the V-piano was released and I first played it at a Sam Ashe using pro audio headphones I brought it. The sound blew me away then which was not easy to do since I play the real thing and already own a great digital. two years later I made the purchase after getting the deal I wanted. After going through a return from a damaged product and waiting even more, it finally arrived.

Now after pluging it in at home and playing it for many hours that first fay, was I still as impressed as I was when I first heard it two years prior? I have to say that yes I was. And that is thanks to bennevis and his patches as they breathed new life into the product and made the default sounds a whole lot better. It realy is a night and day difference.

Now most of the criticism I hear about the V-piano seems to come from people who have not added bennevis's user created sounds first and formost. Secondly much of the criticism lies with playing it in a music store with the V-piano connected to terrible speakers and or terrible quality headphones.

Roland should have come out with the V-piano Grand (which sounds identical throguh headphones as it is the same sound engine) and had people hear it with its excellent quality speakers. I'm pretty sure that after a year or two of people playing it and raving about it online, Roland would have justified the release of the smaller V-piano and marketed it in a much better way.

Sadly the failure of the V-piano caurrently lies mainly with the way Roland has made all of us feel like they abandoned the product. However without any competition, (physis isn't out yet) except for pianoteq, perhaps their new stategy of raising the price and stopping its sales may work to some degree.

However what Roland needs to do is keep current owners talking about the V-Piano and there is no better way to illicit excitement than release an update. Once every two years is about the longest times inbetween updates anyone can take before believing a product has been abandoned for a newer model or for lack of sales.

So that is where we are at this point in time. Has it lived up to the hype it once recieved when it first came out? Probably not, however it did set its expectations pretty high. In my case, it gets close enough for me and has met my expectations. V-piano is still in my opinion the best sounding digital piano since you can tweak the sound to get what you want if you have the patience. I'll be doing a lot of recording the next few months and will be able to share my music once a cd is finalized. Roland should do something soon to regain interest in this market once more. I think it is a mistake to let their competitors catch up before they make their next move.Even if its a small update, they really should ido something. And again I urge Roland to get in touch with bennevis here in this forum who trully has done more for the advancement of this fully modelled V-piano by meticulously listening to CD's of grand piano's as well as grands he plays and creating very close matches in sound. Hire people like him and you can improve the sound set even further for the defaults which are lacking in punch in comparison. So from current owners, the criticism now mainly comes from a lack of any newer updates. (as well as ivory key wear but that is taken care of by Roland's warranty dept. in a timely manner so far.) Roland can change the attitude and discussion real fast by releasing a new update. It is easy marketing and if done right, will get them some more sales and better brand name recognition at the very least by showing the world they are still cutting edge equipment without equal at the moment which is true.

Thanks for this endorsement .

However, my interests are solely in good, authentic piano sounds - I've no interest in any sound that lean more towards EP etc, so I suspect that my input will fall short of most DP users' expectations. If I had a say in the design of the upgrades, I'd simply use modeled piano sounds that sound identical to that of the big names' concert grands, plus maybe a few period pianos (Walter, Graf, Erard, Pleyel), and name the settings as such, just like the way I did on my customizations (which are as close to the real pianos - to my ears - as I could get using the existing presets, but obviously not quite identical). But that would probably fall foul of copyright laws.

The way the sounds behave depending on how the pianist plays is already way beyond what any sampled DP can do, and I don't see much scope for improvement here, especially as so much can be customized by the user anyway.

The way the V-piano was marketed, lacking any pads, and not allowing the use of its own GM sounbank shows they too wanted this to be just the best piano recreation possible. However not everyone has as good an ear as you do, and certainly not the Roland engineers who came up with the defaults. They could use someone like you quite honestly.

Complete utter BS !

Are you referring to me? If so, say it.

couldn't agree more.

Popper and Brace,

I am not pointing fingers at anyone, as I do not know and do not care about your intentions or interest in which companies pianos get praise and which do not. I am simply pointing out all the diferent forms of criticism the V-piano has gotten and could get, valid or not. It would be naive to think companies or people with agendas have not written posts or articles meant to prop up a competing manufacturer. That has been going on since the beggining of advertising and marketing of products took place.

As for me, my agenda is to keep on searching for the best possible digital piano available and look to buy one once every 10 or so years. 10 or so years ago I bought Yamahas flagship CLP990 and am still happy with its petormance. I give Yamaha all sorts of praise for inventing that machine. Roland's V-Piano had a lot of hype and unrealistic expectations when it was announced and for some it did not live ip to expectations. For me it has lived up to them since I am feeling more connected now to playing it in how it sounds when compared to my beautifully sampled Clavinova. I still play both, however the more I play them, the more I gravitate towards the V.

I am glad that the V is getting competition in the modeling world with the new Physis piano. I will be interested in that one as pure curiosity since I am not selling nor buying another digital piano for another 10 years. I still am a fan of new technology as I am writing this on my new Ipad 3. In a few months, I will have a cd out with music played on the V. I will make sure you guys hear what it can sound like in a good solid mix and by itself in piano solo's. In the end this is a forum with so few people interested in what goes on with digital pianos. 99% of people cannot and will never care about having the best piano sound or what goes into a sound. That is why the market is The way it is and prices remain so high. I do see in the V-piano that a lot of quality and effort went into its design and implimentation. I love hooking up mu computer to it and messing with the sounds. I again thank bennevis and hope to see some more creations. I wish I was more proactive and created my own sounds. This summer I will and contribute to the thread bennevis started.

Maybe so, but there is absolutely no evidence at all that ANYONE on this forum has made negative comments or criticised the V-Piano for any reason other than because it is their honestly held opinion.

I honestly don't care. If you believe my post has anything to do with you, that is your business. So far you're the one drawing attention to yourself over this.