Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

Gifts and supplies for the musician
SEARCH
the Forums & Piano World

This custom search works much better than the built in one and allows searching older posts.
Ad (Piano Sing)
How to Make Your Piano Sing
(ad) Pearl River
Pearl River Pianos
(ad 125) Sweetwater - Digital Keyboards & Other Gear
Digital Pianos at Sweetwater
(ad) Pianoteq
(ad) P B Guide
Acoustic & Digital Piano Guide
Who's Online
153 registered (accordeur, ajames, A-Tom, Al LaPorte, A Guy, 42 invisible), 1720 Guests and 19 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Quick Links to Useful Piano & Music Resources
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers
*Organs

Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano & Music Accessories
*Music School Listings
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Piano Books
*Piano Art, Pictures, & Posters
*Directory/Site Map
*Contest
*Links
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Screen Saver
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords
(ad) Estonia Piano
Estonia Pianos
Page 6 of 6 < 1 2 3 4 5 6
Topic Options
#1853781 - 02/29/12 03:02 PM Re: best piano microphone [Re: johnlewisgrant]
Entheo Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/12/04
Posts: 1120
Loc: chicago, il
Originally Posted By: johngrant
Here's a mistery mic I used to record that old saw .... by JSB...
And that old Chopin again, but now on the same mystery pair...


other than the clicks & pops i can find no fault with either recording, and believe that your choices (close mic for bach and a bit back for chopin) served each piece respectively well. and having to edit OUT some bass; my, what a luxury! your piano sounds excellent.

so will you tell us the name of the mystery mics?
_________________________
diary of an amateur pianist

Top
(ads 568) Hailun Pianos

 

#1853789 - 02/29/12 03:24 PM Re: best piano microphone [Re: richard_dup1]
Inlanding Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/05/09
Posts: 1743
Loc: Colorado
Hi John,
Wonderful playing. Perhaps a bit too much room feel on the Chopin recording (I guess it's all a matter of taste), but it sounds great.

The placement for your Bach recording sounds about right to my mind's ear.

Glen
_________________________

A Bit of YouTube
PTG Associate Member

Top
#1853857 - 02/29/12 05:51 PM Re: best piano microphone [Re: Inlanding]
johnlewisgrant Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/17/07
Posts: 519
Loc: canada
I agree about the Chopin being, perhaps, a bit "roomy", and the piano sounding a bit in-a-box on the distant miking.

OK... the mics, which I only purchased out of morbid curiousity (and I can return them) are Chinese Ribbons!!!! Apex 210, which you can get, I think, for around 230US a pair.

These are very fussy about placement (I suppose all ribbons are).

I think I can live with the Bach sound, and I'm not sure whether in this room, with this piano, my equipment, etc., I would do any better with expensive cardioid small diaphrams, like the AKG 451 series, or the KSM 141s (switchable between card and omni). I may still yet be in a position to rent some Schoeps, and if that happens a comparison would be interesting.

As it stands, I think this Ribbon mic captures the actual tone of the instrument more accurately, depending of course on placement.

JG


Edited by johngrant (02/29/12 05:51 PM)

Top
#1853918 - 02/29/12 08:28 PM Re: best piano microphone [Re: Entheo]
Entheo Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/12/04
Posts: 1120
Loc: chicago, il
i close out with a "final production" (as if there is such a thing) of the schubert impromptu, as follows. AKG 420s in cardioid mode, audiobox 22VSL, studio one DAW, converting WAV to MP3 with Exact Audio Copy (YouTube codecs suck, what can i say), windoz7 movie maker, here ya go:

_________________________
diary of an amateur pianist

Top
#1854987 - 03/02/12 03:28 PM Re: best piano microphone [Re: richard_dup1]
gabi Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 03/01/12
Posts: 10
Loc: Romania
Edited by moderator... SPAM


Edited by Rickster (03/02/12 04:08 PM)

Top
#1855712 - 03/03/12 07:36 PM Re: best piano microphone [Re: johnlewisgrant]
Seeker Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/26/04
Posts: 361
Loc: Rockville, MD
John - I listened carefully with my studio monitors, and I agree with your conclusion. The Apex 210's sound as good as the AKG condensers - maybe even a little better - at least on my equipment.

I actually like the Chopin sound a lot, though there were some balance issues between the channels.

I think a little fiddling with that would give me the "classical" sound that I like.

Interesting about the Apex 210.

Good luck with it, and, BTW, I think you're playing of the Bach was darned good.
_________________________
Andrew Kraus, Pianist
Educated Amateur Tuner/Technician
Rockville, MD USA
www.AndrewKraus.com
www.YouTube.com/RockvillePianoGuy
Twitter at @IAmAPianist

1929 Steinert 6'10" (Close copy of New York S&S "B")

Top
#1855717 - 03/03/12 07:44 PM Re: best piano microphone [Re: Entheo]
Seeker Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/26/04
Posts: 361
Loc: Rockville, MD
Finally had a chance to listen on my studio monitors to your Soundcloud clip.

Hurrah - you're there!

The recording sounds just fine;
the C7 sounds just fine;
and so does your playing.

Congratulations.

=====================================

PS - I have received a lot of benefit from the resurrection of this thread. I'm self producing/recording a CD of "Music from the Golden Age of the Piano" soon as there's time this spring. I think folks will enjoy the music as well as the sound of my 1929 Steinert (New York Steinway B close copy). I've changed microphone placement based on what I learned in several posts - I've got an idea of what sounds "right" to some very fussy PW ears - and I learned about some dirt cheap Chinese ribbon mics that sound fantastic on solo piano which might even fit into my budget.

Good Evening to All.
_________________________
Andrew Kraus, Pianist
Educated Amateur Tuner/Technician
Rockville, MD USA
www.AndrewKraus.com
www.YouTube.com/RockvillePianoGuy
Twitter at @IAmAPianist

1929 Steinert 6'10" (Close copy of New York S&S "B")

Top
#1857221 - 03/06/12 02:11 PM Re: best piano microphone [Re: Seeker]
NorseHorse Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 01/04/11
Posts: 11
Loc: Washington, DC
Good afternoon, friends. I frequently record grand piano, both solo and in ensemble. The tools and techniques that work for you will depend on your instrument, your space, your genre, your vision, your budget, etc. That said, let's get to the nitty-gritty...

This thread (Barber's Piano Concerto, Piano World Thread) has some videos recorded with two Shure KSM141s in omni:



And here's the same space, [different] piano, different performers, recorded with Rode NT5s (omni) on the piano and Gefell M270s in omni on the ensemble:



Edited by NorseHorse (03/09/12 11:05 AM)
_________________________
Piano Recording Engineer, Videographer
http://artslaureate.com/

Top
#1857229 - 03/06/12 02:16 PM Re: best piano microphone [Re: richard_dup1]
Entheo Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/12/04
Posts: 1120
Loc: chicago, il
VERY nice recordings norsehorse!
_________________________
diary of an amateur pianist

Top
#1857515 - 03/06/12 10:29 PM Re: best piano microphone [Re: NorseHorse]
Seeker Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/26/04
Posts: 361
Loc: Rockville, MD
Originally Posted By: NorseHorse
Good afternoon, friends. I frequently record grand piano, both solo and in ensemble. The tools and techniques that work for you will depend on your instrument, your space, your genre, your vision, your budget, etc. That said, let's get to the nitty-gritty====snip----

NorseHorse - you are, of course, correct. Me, I'm usually good with the vision thing; it's the darn budget that does the squeeze cry

Your two included recordings sound... professional.
Did you use the same preamps?

FWIW, I was surprised to find I liked the sound with the single omni pair of Shure KSM141s over the one with the NT5 and the Gefell M270s for the orchestra. I'm listening with a decent pair of headphones, not over speakers, since I'm on the road this week - but I didn't find the Gefells to sound better on the ensemble. As for the NT-5s, I'm note a Rode fan. They made the piano sound "brittle" and a bit "dead" to me.

I'll keep you in mind for recording work when I have the budget to pay for you smile
_________________________
Andrew Kraus, Pianist
Educated Amateur Tuner/Technician
Rockville, MD USA
www.AndrewKraus.com
www.YouTube.com/RockvillePianoGuy
Twitter at @IAmAPianist

1929 Steinert 6'10" (Close copy of New York S&S "B")

Top
#1858917 - 03/09/12 11:04 AM Re: best piano microphone [Re: Seeker]
NorseHorse Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 01/04/11
Posts: 11
Loc: Washington, DC
Thanks for the responses!

A TL-Audio Tubetracker console was used for the Barber, and a Grace 801 was used for the Gershwin.

Recording-wise, the biggest difference in the recordings is how far the microphones are from the piano. In the Barber, they are in the third row of the house. For the Gershwin, they are close, which results in a brighter, more "modern" sound. Both practical and aesthetic concerns went into the decision for each.

[UPDATE] ** Just remembered these are probably not the same pianos. A rental was brought in for the Barber, presumably leaving the in-house piano backstage in its storage area for the soloist to warm-up and practice on.


Edited by NorseHorse (03/09/12 11:10 AM)
_________________________
Piano Recording Engineer, Videographer
http://artslaureate.com/

Top
#1859214 - 03/10/12 01:06 AM Re: best piano microphone [Re: NorseHorse]
Dave Ferris Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/12/07
Posts: 1733
Loc: Glendale, Ca.
NorseHorse is a recordist par excellence !

Welcome to PW Christian..
_________________________
http://soundcloud.com/dave-ferris

2005 NY Steinway D

Top
#1908124 - 06/04/12 10:30 AM Re: best piano microphone(s) - My Solution [Re: Dave Ferris]
Seeker Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/26/04
Posts: 361
Loc: Rockville, MD
For those who might be interested, here is a link to a recording made in my piano studio with my current set up. The complete recording will become part of my first CD available for commercial release: "15 Pieces from the Golden Age of the Piano". Should have everything ready for "mastering" in about two weeks if things go as planned.

The Music Sample: from Harry Farjeon's Einen Schanengesang. http://andrewkraus.com/Smpls/Farjeon-EinenSchwanengesangPreview.mp3

Microphones: 2 CM 414 large diaphragm FET condenser microphones from Advanced Audio in Canada. The pattern was set on "Omni".

Placement: Just past the ends of the keyboards, on stands, with the base of the mics 60" above the floor

Signal Chain: simplicity itself, direct into a Tascam DR-100 flash recorder 24-bit, 96k sampling frequency.

Recording: no EQ, no reverb added. Ready for trimming and mastering.

Piano: 1929 Steinert 6'10" grand. This is a very close copy of a 1929 New York Steinway "B". It has been restrung but has the original sound board (which I think is one of the reasons it sounds as good as it does). I also had the action refurbished and replaced the original WNG parts with Renner whippens, shanks and flanges, new back checks, and Abel Natural Select hammers medium weight.

Studio: started life as a 1 car garage, became the sales office for our suburban subdivision and got a "cathedral" ceiling in the process. Tile floor. Room was very reverberant, so I've done some treatment with 2" thick fiber glass panels covered with acoustically transparent burlap as well as a 4" thick corner trap. To my ears, the room is dry enough to allow hearing details, wet enough not to be dead.
_________________________
Andrew Kraus, Pianist
Educated Amateur Tuner/Technician
Rockville, MD USA
www.AndrewKraus.com
www.YouTube.com/RockvillePianoGuy
Twitter at @IAmAPianist

1929 Steinert 6'10" (Close copy of New York S&S "B")

Top
#2159854 - 09/29/13 09:51 PM Re: best piano microphone(s) - My Solution [Re: richard_dup1]
AZ_Astro Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/19/12
Posts: 479
Loc: Tempe, Arizona
I stumbled on this old thread recently when I was looking at ways of recording my acoustic piano. My requirements were:

1) Reasonably cheap
2) Decent audio result
3) Something that is better than recording directly from iPhone or PC using on-board microphones
4) Simple and easy to use
5) Easy to move to the computer

In this thread, Grandpianoman suggested the TASCAM IM2 microphone and tried it out. I did some follow-up research.

Then I found out that Tascam is dumping their inventory of IM2 microphones. I found this:

TASCAM iM2 Channel Portable Digital Recorder on Amazon for $24. Wow!

Ref: http://www.amazon.com/iM2-Channel-Portab...ords=tascam+im2


The IM2 TASCAM microphone is specially designed for IPOD Touch and older IPad/iPHone models that have the large (almost 1 inch wide) power connector. That's what I had, so I thought: "what's to lose for $23?" I had been seriously considering a portable digital recorder but this seemed to fill the same niche.

The IM2 arrived in about a week and I was lost on how to use it for about a day. The documentation for the microphone itself is ok but how to use it on/with the iPhone/iPod/iPad using TASCAM's PCMRecorder app left me a little lost for awhile.

From the accompanying manual:

Overview of Features:

1) This stereo mic can be connected to an iPhone 4, iPad 2, iPad, or iPod touch (4th generation) and used to record with applications that support mic input.
2) Using the angle-adjusted pair of high-sensitivity condenser mics, you can record in high-quality 44.1 kHz/16-bit format, which is equivalent to CD audio.
3) The limiter can prevent distortion when the input level is too loud, and the input level can also be adjusted, enabling optimal recording.
4) The USB connector allows the connected iPhone 4, iPad 2, iPad or iPod touch (4th gen) to be recharged while using this unit to record.

For what it's worth:

Here's a short clip that I made recording my Kawai KG-5 grand piano using this TASCAM IM2 recorder on my iPod Touch.

https://app.box.com/s/a77aw80akqe5hmws7n2k



Edited by AZ_Astro (09/30/13 01:18 AM)
_________________________
Kawai KG-5. Korg SP-250. Software pianos: Ivory II, Ravenscroft, Galaxy Vintage D, Alicia's Keys, et al.


Top
#2159864 - 09/29/13 10:15 PM Re: best piano microphone(s) - My Solution [Re: richard_dup1]
AZ_Astro Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/19/12
Posts: 479
Loc: Tempe, Arizona
... By the way, to record, I open the top and remove the music desk and place the ipod touch/IM2 mic on top of the front edge of the piano, on top of some cloth. [So the recording is 'close' and dry.] Recording is like using a VCR. You CAN play back the .wav files. You can record four or five recordings, upload them to SoundCloud (easy), or connect to your PC and move the files to your PC via iTunes. The iTunes procedure requires a little sleuthing but worked ok.


Edited by AZ_Astro (09/29/13 10:21 PM)
_________________________
Kawai KG-5. Korg SP-250. Software pianos: Ivory II, Ravenscroft, Galaxy Vintage D, Alicia's Keys, et al.


Top
#2159896 - 09/30/13 02:00 AM Re: best piano microphone(s) - My Solution [Re: richard_dup1]
KurtZ Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/13/10
Posts: 991
Loc: The Heart of Screenland
Tascam has been bought by Gibson. Based on what we're hearing from inside, It's not pretty.

Kurt
_________________________
I just wanted to be just "a" guy. That's enough of a life.

Top
#2160061 - 09/30/13 12:26 PM Re: best piano microphone(s) - My Solution [Re: richard_dup1]
Steve Chandler Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/18/05
Posts: 2789
Loc: Urbandale, Iowa
I must have read this thread way back when and every time it's resurfaced in between, but I'm grateful it's been resurrected again. AZ Astro it seems you've resolved your inquiry before you asked, but in typical PW style I'm going to offer a different solution.

I recently recorded my Estonia using the following; Rode NT5s through a Focusrite Scarlett 2i4 preamp and interface. It sounds much better than the previous setup of the NT5s through a Presonus preamp into converters in my laptop (that's probably the weak spot). Here's a link.

http://soundcloud.com/pantonality/rhapsody

Top
#2160185 - 09/30/13 06:19 PM Re: best piano microphone(s) - My Solution [Re: Steve Chandler]
AZ_Astro Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/19/12
Posts: 479
Loc: Tempe, Arizona
Originally Posted By: Steve Chandler


I recently recorded my Estonia using the following; Rode NT5s through a Focusrite Scarlett 2i4 preamp and interface. It sounds much better than the previous setup of the NT5s through a Presonus preamp into converters in my laptop (that's probably the weak spot). Here's a link.

http://soundcloud.com/pantonality/rhapsody


I'm no audio engineer but to my ear it sounds like a professional recording. The recording is clean and tight and it brings out nuances in the piano and your playing nicely.
_________________________
Kawai KG-5. Korg SP-250. Software pianos: Ivory II, Ravenscroft, Galaxy Vintage D, Alicia's Keys, et al.


Top
#2160186 - 09/30/13 06:20 PM Re: best piano microphone(s) - My Solution [Re: KurtZ]
AZ_Astro Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/19/12
Posts: 479
Loc: Tempe, Arizona
Originally Posted By: KurtZ
Tascam has been bought by Gibson. Based on what we're hearing from inside, It's not pretty.

Kurt


That would explain the fire-sale price of the IM2 microphone. Thanks for the note.
_________________________
Kawai KG-5. Korg SP-250. Software pianos: Ivory II, Ravenscroft, Galaxy Vintage D, Alicia's Keys, et al.


Top
#2160452 - 10/01/13 12:40 PM Re: best piano microphone(s) - My Solution [Re: AZ_Astro]
woodog Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/21/12
Posts: 430
Loc: Bowling Green, KY
Originally Posted By: AZ_Astro
Originally Posted By: KurtZ
Tascam has been bought by Gibson. Based on what we're hearing from inside, It's not pretty.

Kurt


That would explain the fire-sale price of the IM2 microphone. Thanks for the note.


Anyway to use this microphone with a newer iPad (and the tiny power connection)?

Forrest
_________________________
-------------------
current studies:
Debussy: Suite Bergamasque
Bach 848, 866
Schumann Op. 15

Top
#2160532 - 10/01/13 04:08 PM Re: best piano microphone(s) - My Solution [Re: richard_dup1]
AZ_Astro Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/19/12
Posts: 479
Loc: Tempe, Arizona
I don't think so, I think the connectors have a different number of pins on them.



But - maybe there is another microphone out there that works with the new iPhone and a smaller power connector?


Edited by AZ_Astro (10/01/13 04:09 PM)
_________________________
Kawai KG-5. Korg SP-250. Software pianos: Ivory II, Ravenscroft, Galaxy Vintage D, Alicia's Keys, et al.


Top
#2190350 - 11/30/13 01:07 AM Re: best piano microphone [Re: richard_dup1]
E. Christensen Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/29/13
Posts: 38
I use a similar set up but add a third mic in the middle to try to pick up more of the treble.

Top
#2270176 - 05/02/14 12:32 PM Re: best piano microphone [Re: richard_dup1]
Andrei Stegaru Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 05/02/14
Posts: 4
Hy Richard! I am usind Rode NT5 stereo pair and i find them really good! Additionaly i put another RODE NT1A for ambiance!
Greets!
_________________________
www.andreistegaru.de

Top
Page 6 of 6 < 1 2 3 4 5 6

Moderator:  Ken Knapp, Piano World, Rickster 
What's Hot!!
Christmas Header
- > Gift Ideas for Music Lovers < -
From PianoSupplies.com a division of Piano World.
-------------------
The December Free Piano Newsletter
-------------------
Forums Rules & Help
-------------------
ADVERTISE
on Piano World

The world's most popular piano web site.
-------------------
PIANO BOOKS
Interesting books about the piano, pianists, piano history, biographies, memoirs and more!
(ad) Yamaha CP Music Rest Promo
Yamaha CP Music Rest Promo
(ad) HAILUN Pianos
Hailun Pianos - Click for More
Ad (Seiler/Knabe)
Knabe Pianos
(125ad) Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
(ad) Lindeblad Piano
Lindeblad Piano Restoration
(ad) Piano Music Sale - Dover Publications
Piano Music Sale
Sheet Music Plus (125)
Sheet Music Plus Featured Sale
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Kawai Digital Piano
by Deegs23
12/18/14 03:28 PM
A new clip of the great Don Pullen in action
by rintincop
12/18/14 01:41 PM
A new clip of the great Don Pullen in action
by rintincop
12/18/14 01:38 PM
Digital piano Actions MP11,RD-800,CP4
by oliver123456
12/18/14 01:26 PM
Baldwin Howard Piano
by Deegs23
12/18/14 01:24 PM
Forum Stats
77340 Members
42 Forums
159958 Topics
2349123 Posts

Max Online: 15252 @ 03/21/10 11:39 PM
Gift Ideas for Music Lovers!
Find the Perfect Gift for the Music Lovers on your List!
Visit our online store today.

Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
|
Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World | Donate | Link to Us | Classifieds |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter | Press Room |


copyright 1997 - 2014 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission