Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

SEARCH
the Forums & Piano World

This custom search works much better than the built in one and allows searching older posts.
(ad 125) Sweetwater - Digital Keyboards & Other Gear
Digital Pianos at Sweetwater
(ad) Pearl River
Pearl River Pianos
(ad) Pianoteq
Latest Pianoteq add-on instrument: U4 upright piano
(ad) P B Guide
Acoustic & Digital Piano Guide
PianoSupplies.com (150)
Piano Accessories Music Related Gifts Piano Tuning Equipment Piano Moving Equipment
We now offer Gift Certificates in our online store!
(ad) Estonia Piano
Estonia Piano
Quick Links to Useful Stuff
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers
*Organs

Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano Accessories
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Piano Books
*Piano Art, Pictures, & Posters
*Directory/Site Map
*Contest
*Links
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Screen Saver
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords
Topic Options
#1945978 - 08/20/12 08:09 AM Time of day and tone
peabody Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/19/11
Posts: 57
Loc: nc
I have noticed that I enjoy the tone of my Estonia piano more in the early morning than the late afternoon on a consistent basis. In the early hours the tone is warmer and changes to become a bit more harsh in the late afternoon hours. Simple humidity does not seem to be the issue. Any thoughts?
_________________________
Peabody

Top
(ads 568) Hailun Pianos

 

#1945988 - 08/20/12 08:33 AM Re: Time of day and tone [Re: peabody]
ando Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/23/10
Posts: 3575
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Maybe you're more relaxed in the morning? The pressures of the day haven't had a chances to operate on your nerves yet.

Top
#1945996 - 08/20/12 08:52 AM Re: Time of day and tone [Re: peabody]
peabody Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/19/11
Posts: 57
Loc: nc
good point....
_________________________
Peabody

Top
#1946028 - 08/20/12 10:05 AM Re: Time of day and tone [Re: peabody]
backto_study_piano Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/28/10
Posts: 426
Loc: Australia
Even though I'm retired and can play at any time of the day, I more warm up to it - mornings are just OK, afternoons are better, evenings are my best, and improve till the clock tells me that I really should call it a night.

I'm not sure if it's the sound, or my perception of sound - or whether my muscles and joints are finally freed up enough. Or meds (BP etc) are starting to wear off.
_________________________
Alan from Australia (and Clara - my Grotrian Concert - she's 7'4" long and ebony) & 2 Allen Organs [long story - the first is for sale] - MDS312 and CF-15.

Top
#1946045 - 08/20/12 10:31 AM Re: Time of day and tone [Re: peabody]
rada Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/07/06
Posts: 1124
Loc: pagosa springs,co
I think time of day in regards to temperature makes a difference.

rada

Top
#1946094 - 08/20/12 12:11 PM Re: Time of day and tone [Re: peabody]
Johnkie Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/04/11
Posts: 717
Loc: England
_________________________
Concert Tuner & Technician for the past 49 years in the United Kingdom
and Member of the Pianoforte Tuners' Association (London)
www.jphillipspianoservices.freeindex.co.uk : E-mail jophillips06@aol.com

Top
#1946101 - 08/20/12 12:18 PM Re: Time of day and tone [Re: peabody]
Rickster Online   content


Registered: 03/25/06
Posts: 8527
Loc: Georgia, USA
Same with my Yamaha C7...

The time of day, temperature, relative humidity, and barometric pressure all have a very slight affect on an acoustic piano’s tone. It is very slight, but still there.

Me personally, I love playing my piano at 3:00am when the moon is bright. smile

Rick
_________________________
Piano enthusiast and amateur musician: "Treat others the way you would like to be treated". Yamaha C7. YouTube Channel

Top
#1946157 - 08/20/12 01:33 PM Re: Time of day and tone [Re: peabody]
Pianolance Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/28/09
Posts: 1192
Loc: Nashville, TN
I might suggest that the piano might sound best during the time of day when it was last tuned. I noticed that our church piano, a 6'10" Schimmel sounded great in the afternoon on a week day when no one was around but on Sunday morning, with the stage lights on and the room coming to temperature the piano didn't sound so good. I finally started having the tuner come at 10 am and about two hours before she got there I turned the air or heat on and all of the stage lights. From that point, the piano sounded its best on Sunday morning at 10 am with the room coming to temperature and the stage lights on. Of course it didn't sound as refined on a weekday afternoon in a dimmly lit room with minimal heat or air on. Even the piano tuner was amazed that I would notice the difference, but then again she was never there on Sunday morning to check out the difference herself. BTW our piano tuner was Robin Pitts from Maryland, an excellent tuner and PTG member.
_________________________
Knabe 5'2" Louis XV Walnut circa 1927
Very part time piano broker.

Top
#1946197 - 08/20/12 02:41 PM Re: Time of day and tone [Re: peabody]
Jeff Clef Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/05/08
Posts: 4414
Loc: San Jose, CA
"...Sorry my friend, even having the most experienced tuner who does an exceptionally stable tuning, will not manage to overcome tuning drift caused by humidity and temperature fluctuations..."

That is a nice, friendly post that pretty much says it. But I think all the factors you mentioned will split the pot in this sweepstakes. Your ears are a bit different in the afternoon (the tiny membranes and fluid-filled recesses are likely sensitive to blood flow and pressure, for one thing), and your brain--- which is, after all, where hearing really takes place--- would probably show a different pattern of firing of the neutrons at different times of the day. If you measure mine before and after coffee, I'm SURE the readings would be different.

Temperature and humidity are related in real weather, though they are independently different, truly speaking; anyway, the strings and soundboard are sensitive to them. A dealer once posted here that a cloud passing over the sun would affect the tunings of pianos in his store. Temperature alone affects how much lift an airplane can achieve with the same speed--- a fairly gross effect, compared to the delicacy of the tympanum.

Of course stabilizing conditions in your music room will help, but the slight drift in the piano's voice is part of its charm, at least to me--- within reason. Another member posted the saying, "It's easier to wear slippers than to carpet the world." I'm sorry to say, he was cast out of the forum for not following his own excellent advice. A good example, I suppose, of a beautiful and unique voice that drifted beyond the parameters of toleration.

"Learn to love it as it is," is easier to say than to do, sometimes.

You might try tuning your piano more frequently; maybe four times a year would help it become more stable than once or twice. If you've had it awhile, maybe a little attention to the voicing could help smooth it out.
_________________________
Clef


Top
#1946244 - 08/20/12 03:41 PM Re: Time of day and tone [Re: peabody]
Pianolance Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/28/09
Posts: 1192
Loc: Nashville, TN
Has anybody else noticed this. Music from the hifi just seems to sound better after dark. I'm not talking about a piano which is subject to fluxuations of temp and humidity, but recorded music. I first started noticing this in high school when I got a really good stereo for my car. I would listen to the same tape during the day, but it just sounded better at night. Don't know why, but that was my impression anyway.
_________________________
Knabe 5'2" Louis XV Walnut circa 1927
Very part time piano broker.

Top
#1946246 - 08/20/12 03:43 PM Re: Time of day and tone [Re: peabody]
pianoloverus Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 19336
Loc: New York City
I think the perception of tone can be very dependent on one's personal mood.

Sometimes I love my Mason BB and sometimes it sounds far less great. It's really impossible to know whether this is caused by the piano's tone, my mood, the particular piece, how well I'm playing, etc.

Top
#1946252 - 08/20/12 03:51 PM Re: Time of day and tone [Re: peabody]
Pianolance Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/28/09
Posts: 1192
Loc: Nashville, TN
I would like to add, your Estonia is a very highly refined and sensative instrument. Slight changes will affect it, but that's what makes it such a beautiful musical instrument. Think of it this way, you probably wouldn't be having this issue if it was a Kimball or a Wurlitzer. The very thing that makes the Estonia so expressive, with so much color, is that it's sensative. It responds to the slightest variations in touch, so it will also respond to the slightest variations of climate too.
_________________________
Knabe 5'2" Louis XV Walnut circa 1927
Very part time piano broker.

Top
#1946269 - 08/20/12 04:15 PM Re: Time of day and tone [Re: peabody]
Rickster Online   content


Registered: 03/25/06
Posts: 8527
Loc: Georgia, USA
I like to think of this scenario as the piano having somewhat of a personality… I know that sounds bogus, but its true. We are not always in a good mood either. smile

Rick
_________________________
Piano enthusiast and amateur musician: "Treat others the way you would like to be treated". Yamaha C7. YouTube Channel

Top
#1946376 - 08/20/12 07:23 PM Re: Time of day and tone [Re: peabody]
j&j Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/24/09
Posts: 444
Loc: Southwest
Just my perception but I think my musical ear, mood, and technique is affected much more by time of day and whether I've had my coffee, than variations in my piano's tune, voice, and regulation during the day.

Perhaps a more sensitive player could tell, but my Yamaha is pretty stable and I although I can notice some differences over time due to weather and humidity, it isn't so variable that I notice a difference between my morning practice session and when I play it after work.
_________________________
J & J
Yahama C3 PE
Casio Privia PX-330
"Inspiration exists, but it has to find you working." Pablo Picasso

Top
#1946409 - 08/20/12 08:21 PM Re: Time of day and tone [Re: Rickster]
KurtZ Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/13/10
Posts: 892
Loc: The Heart of Screenland
Originally Posted By: Rickster
I like to think of this scenario as the piano having somewhat of a personality… I know that sounds bogus, but its true. We are not always in a good mood either. smile

Rick


There's a scientific/mechanical/physical explanation for everything but sometimes it really is easier to call it magic/personality/voodoo.

We had a client who heard a friend's Fender Princeton (older guitar amp) that made his bits tingle. He went out and bought one but it didn't have that sound. He brought it to us and we suggested what is called a re-cap where all the electrolytic capacitors in the power supply and in the audio path are changed to bring the amp to original spec w/regard to original internal voltages. No good. Still not right. He tried two different speakers. Still no good. He sold the amp as heavily restored and started over with another used Fender that was as close in serial number as he could find (a nationwide search) and another tech with a "guru" reputation. He never did find the "tingle" sound but he make two tech's and two used amp vendors happy. : )

If I were going to guess about a physical cause to the OP's query it would be that the felt on the hammers is taking up or giving off enough moisture with humidity changes to effect the sound. Wool is hydrophobic (water repelling) on the outside and hydrophillic (water attracting) on the inside. If some part of the prep done to the wool strips the lipids from the surface of the wool fibers, they will very happily take up and give off water like a sponge.

My piano sounds different from day to day but it's a cheap korean studio so the "sensitivity" ascribed to the more expensive piano is probably specious.

Kurt
_________________________
I just wanted to be just "a" guy. That's enough of a life.

Top
#1946415 - 08/20/12 08:35 PM Re: Time of day and tone [Re: peabody]
Minnesota Marty Online   content

Platinum Supporter until October 5 2014


Registered: 05/15/12
Posts: 7414
Loc: Rochester MN
Another consideration, and I believe and important one, it that all of our senses are most acute just after waking from a sound sleep. They diminish throughout the day. The cycle repeats with the rest periods.
_________________________
Marty in Minnesota

It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.

Top
#1946432 - 08/20/12 09:24 PM Re: Time of day and tone [Re: peabody]
peabody Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/19/11
Posts: 57
Loc: nc
Thanks to all for the input. Very helpful.
_________________________
Peabody

Top

Moderator:  Ken Knapp, Piano World, Rickster 
What's Hot!!
HOW TO POST PICTURES on the Piano Forums
-------------------
Sharing is Caring!
About the Buttons
-------------------
Forums Rules & Help
-------------------
ADVERTISE
on Piano World

The world's most popular piano web site.
-------------------
PIANO BOOKS
Interesting books about the piano, pianists, piano history, biographies, memoirs and more!
(ad) HAILUN Pianos
Hailun Pianos - Click for More
ad (Casio)
Celviano by Casio Rebate
Ad (Seiler/Knabe)
Seiler Pianos
Sheet Music
(PW is an affiliate)
Sheet Music Plus Featured Sale
(125ad) Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
(ad) Lindeblad Piano
Lindeblad Piano Restoration
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Associate Diploma repertoire
by lacrymosa85
09/17/14 07:55 AM
Questions for those that use dremel for hammer shaping.
by UnrightTooner
09/17/14 07:29 AM
Pianoteq vs Digital Piano vs Acoustic Piano
by wildpig
09/16/14 11:57 PM
Baldwin Hamilton 1941
by JMN12
09/16/14 11:13 PM
Tucson, AZ: Is Arizona Room a bad place for a piano?
by Paul678
09/16/14 08:14 PM
Who's Online
114 registered (allakart, *windowlicker*, anotherscott, 39 invisible), 1171 Guests and 15 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Stats
76230 Members
42 Forums
157575 Topics
2314587 Posts

Max Online: 15252 @ 03/21/10 11:39 PM
(ads by Google)

Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
|
Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World | Donate | Link to Us | Classifieds |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter | Press Room |


copyright 1997 - 2014 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission