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#1945813 - 08/19/12 09:44 PM Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098
piano75 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 08/19/12
Posts: 13
I am looking to buy a piano and have some options:
1. New Yamaha P22 for little less than 5000 dollars
2. Used Steinway 1098 - 4200 (1979 model)
3. New U1 for 6700 dollars

I know these are different pianos but wanted to get an idea about what people think about these three piano and the prices.

Thank you.

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#1945817 - 08/19/12 09:48 PM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: piano75]
Dave B Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/01/11
Posts: 1979
Loc: Philadelphia area
A new U1 for 6700 is a good price. Are you limited to just these three choices?

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#1946051 - 08/20/12 10:41 AM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: piano75]
piano75 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 08/19/12
Posts: 13
I am not limited to these choices but after looking at several pianos (new and used), I did like these three pianos. I am a intermediate player and don't want to spend 25k for a new steinway upright.

After reading reviews, it is hard to decide in the long term which piano is right. I have read the U1 is too bright or tinny especially on hard wood floors. Also read P22 might not be a piano for advanced players or if you want to advance.

The 6700 for the U1 is for a ebony gloss finish. I want a satin finish and found out that the price goes up to 7700. Is the satin finish that much more expensive? Is the Steinway 1098 worth the money?

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#1946169 - 08/20/12 01:55 PM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: piano75]
gnuboi Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/26/10
Posts: 2349
Loc: USA
Most pianos sound loud, bright, and "live" on hard surfaces. You might need to treat the room.

There are lots of pro's here who mentioned that they started out with consoles and pianos lesser than new P22s until they made it into music school (where they might use P22s in practice rooms, heh) or got jobs. So if you are really that good, a P22 might not sound great but shouldn't prevent you from playing great. Why, in a nearby post, someone said that they recently got to grade 8 with a digital piano!

In general, the U1 is made to a higher price point and incorporates better design, materials, QC, and craftsmanship.

The Steinway's price isn't bad but condition is everything. If the hammers are worm and the strings are rusty, it wouldn't be much better than used pianos with a different brand name.


Edited by gnuboi (08/20/12 01:56 PM)

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#1946653 - 08/21/12 12:25 PM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: piano75]
Bokeh Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/27/12
Posts: 23
I say go for the Steinway--I just bought a 1956 and I am loving it.

As I posted elsewhere, for me it was partly a psychological thing. Always wanted a Steinway. Also, with the money saved vs. the U1 you can get the S&S regulated and voiced to your liking (assuming it is in good shape)

Plus, the S&S will likely not depreciate in price any further going forward, vs. a newer piano.

IMHO

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#1946810 - 08/21/12 06:18 PM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: piano75]
piano75 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 08/19/12
Posts: 13
How much did you pay for a 1956 Steinway? Did you get a independent tuner to look over the piano?

I saw another Steinway 2005 for 15k. What is the fair value for a used 1098 Steinway that is in good shape.

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#1946827 - 08/21/12 06:50 PM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: piano75]
rocket88 Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/04/06
Posts: 3191

Steinway 1098 upright studio pianos do not have a stellar reputation. I wish I knew that back in the l980's when I bought one, (which I no longer have).

They are IMHO an average piano, with a elevated price because of the S&S name, and piano tuners usually do not like them.

ps...I sold mine for 5K, after trying for several years to find anyone who would buy it.
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#1946843 - 08/21/12 07:17 PM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: piano75]
Dave B Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/01/11
Posts: 1979
Loc: Philadelphia area
15K will get you a nice grand. Why bother with an upright?

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#1946884 - 08/21/12 08:22 PM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: piano75]
thetandyman Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/27/12
Posts: 443
Loc: Indiana
I have to agree with Bokeh. If the Steinway is in decent shape, it shouldn't depreciate much in the future. Like it or not, the Steinway name has magic powers when selling. I'm sure the Yamaha is superb, however, Steinway?....You know!
_________________________
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#1946895 - 08/21/12 08:40 PM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: piano75]
piano75 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 08/19/12
Posts: 13
Currently 15k is out of my price range to buy a upright. The one Steinway I saw was not in good shape. What about buying a new Yamaha P22 - I was told by different sellers that they liked this piano over the T118 or even the U1. It sounded nice but since this is my first purchase of a piano, wanted to get opinions on a this piano that is under 5000 dollars. Thanks.

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#1946924 - 08/21/12 09:43 PM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: piano75]
Minnesota Marty Offline

Platinum Supporter until October 5 2014


Registered: 05/15/12
Posts: 7439
Loc: Rochester MN
Piano75,

Everyone, always prefers something, over everything. It's the nature of asking for advice.

That's a very good price on a new U1. Only you can decided if it the right piano for you.

(Is there a Yamaha factory sale in progress on U1's? Good prices are popping up all over.)
_________________________
Marty in Minnesota

It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.

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#1947112 - 08/22/12 09:22 AM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: piano75]
piano75 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 08/19/12
Posts: 13
That is a group price on a U1. He said he can just add me to the group. Also one dealer said that in the last few years they have not sold as many pianos as they used to.

Also the price is for a ebony gloss finish. I said I wanted the satin finish and he said it would be 1000 dollars more! I can't believe it is that much more for a satin finish.

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#1947135 - 08/22/12 09:59 AM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: rocket88]
Bokeh Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/27/12
Posts: 23
Originally Posted By: rocket88

They are IMHO an average piano, with a elevated price because of the S&S name, and piano tuners usually do not like them.

ps...I sold mine for 5K, after trying for several years to find anyone who would buy it.


5-6 K for a good specimen seems to be a good average price for the 1098's. I have seen a lot of these. It depends on the market, of course. Atlanta seems to have a lot of them right now.
I agree they are overpriced new, and even 15k is too much. But for under 5 k I think there is a valid argument that you can't loose money on the resale.
I got mine for 2,300, in top shape. But that was below market.

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#1947755 - 08/23/12 10:19 AM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: piano75]
piano75 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 08/19/12
Posts: 13
A couple of general questions:

is the satin finish 1000 dollars more expensive than the gloss finish. That is what one dealer told me about the price of the U1.

has anyone bought the P22 or U1 through the Costco roadshow lately and what are their prices? I have heard good things about this roadshow.

the P22 is now made in China however I have heard that the new U1 string action is not made in Japan either (assembled in Japan). Is the P22 made in China a really big concern or not?

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#1947763 - 08/23/12 10:38 AM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: piano75]
Minnesota Marty Offline

Platinum Supporter until October 5 2014


Registered: 05/15/12
Posts: 7439
Loc: Rochester MN
Originally Posted By: piano75
Is the satin finish 1000 dollars more expensive than the gloss finish. That is what one dealer told me about the price of the U1.

The "Piano Buyer" lists the same price for both. Could it be that with the "group price" all of the pianos need to match? It might be that the different finish pulls you out of the group.

Just speculation, of course.
_________________________
Marty in Minnesota

It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.

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#1947768 - 08/23/12 10:46 AM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: piano75]
Bob Newbie Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/02/06
Posts: 1555
I've been on this board since 2006..and have yet to hear anyone get excited over a
Steinway upright..this tells me its just another "upright" like any other piano
you'd be better off with the U1..that's a popular model among uprights..
just my 2 cents.. smile


Edited by Bob Newbie (08/23/12 10:47 AM)

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#1947775 - 08/23/12 11:04 AM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: Bob Newbie]
Minnesota Marty Offline

Platinum Supporter until October 5 2014


Registered: 05/15/12
Posts: 7439
Loc: Rochester MN
Originally Posted By: Bob Newbie
I've been on this board since 2006..and have yet to hear anyone get excited over a
Steinway upright..this tells me its just another "upright" like any other piano
you'd be better off with the U1..that's a popular model among uprights..
just my 2 cents.. smile


The Steinway uprights are fine pianos and are compared to a different level of pianos. Often the comparison here is a used S&S to a new Yamaha or Kawai and that is most usually a purchase cost comparison. For the most part, there has not been much discussion of the upper level verticals of any make. The attitude seems to be, "If you can afford that much, buy a grand."
_________________________
Marty in Minnesota

It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.

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#1947783 - 08/23/12 11:20 AM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: Minnesota Marty]
Karl Watson Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/20/11
Posts: 383
On the subject of Steinway uprights in general and the model 1098 in particular, it strikes me as rather like Stanwood actions. One either adores them or one has absolutely NO use for them. In the matter of Stanwood, I have the full treatment and can't imagine myself w/o it.

In the matter of the 1098, one of the finest piano men in our country and a frequent contributor to this forum has high regard for them, no doubt as he has developed a technical approach/solution to their commonly-known ills. On the other hand, mention of them to many techs, both high and low, is tantamount to reading the Riot Act.

Even the Model K is not free from its detractors. Last month, when speaking to one of Chicago's respected retailers, he mentioned to me that he'd taken in a newish K on trade and, upon delivery, found the fit and finish shockingly poor.

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#1947787 - 08/23/12 11:26 AM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: Bob Newbie]
Bokeh Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/27/12
Posts: 23
Originally Posted By: Bob Newbie
I've been on this board since 2006..and have yet to hear anyone get excited over a
Steinway upright..this tells me its just another "upright" like any other piano
you'd be better off with the U1..that's a popular model among uprights..
just my 2 cents.. smile


Well you can count me as anecdotal evidence of at least one person excited by the 1098. Am I going to grow old and die with it? no...and when I trade up, I will get my money back, vs. 50 cents on the dollar that I would have gotten out of trading in a U1.


Edited by Bokeh (08/23/12 11:58 AM)

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#1947807 - 08/23/12 12:09 PM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: Bokeh]
Mike Carr Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/20/09
Posts: 714
Loc: BANNED


This forum is fairly anti-steinway to begin with, probably due to the over abundance of Stein-was dealers, so, I wouldn't use anything said here to form a consensus. I've owned two of the 1098's and liked them both. As with all used pianos, at least for me, play them and if they grab you they grab you. Resale or marquee value or any sort of dream fulfillment should be secondary considerations at best.

Mike
_________________________
smoke 'em if you got 'em

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#1948095 - 08/23/12 08:30 PM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: piano75]
piano75 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 08/19/12
Posts: 13
I am now against buying a 25-30 year old used U1. The price seems too high and some of them sound tinny. The dealer seems to say the new one costs 10,000 but nobody pays MSRP. I have seen new U1 at 6700 so why would you pay 5000 for a 30 year old piano.

The prices vary so much from each dealer to craigslist that if you are not a educated shopper, you will pay thousands more. Also the dealer said 6700 is the group price but even after a month, he is still willing to give that deal. Maybe that is the price if you are a serious buyer.

I saw a brand new P22 selling for 4500.00 - is this a good deal?
For Steinway 1098 - I saw a 2005 for 15k, another one 2006 for 11k and 1979 one for 4200.

I am tempted to just buy the new P22 as the older ones require an expert opinion. There are so many factors to consider for price, that is it hard to compare prices.

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#1948099 - 08/23/12 08:34 PM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: piano75]
Dave B Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/01/11
Posts: 1979
Loc: Philadelphia area
I don't consider this forum "anti-Steinway" at all. People who know better are just saying how they see things.

Steinway uprights are expensive instruments. Finding one in good shape for under 5K is very unlikely. The price range tends towards a number of 'new' very good full sized uprights. I would encourage Piano75 to use this time to learn about and enjoy playing different instruments. Their feedback would be great.

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#1948210 - 08/24/12 01:40 AM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: piano75]
gnuboi Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/26/10
Posts: 2349
Loc: USA
That's not a bad price for the P22. Have you compared prices with Kawai? The K3 and K5 are priced somewhat below and above the U1, respectively.

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#1948978 - 08/25/12 01:05 PM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: piano75]
piano75 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 08/19/12
Posts: 13
I have not compared the Kawai, have not played them very much either. There were more Yamaha dealers and also the saw the Costco roadshow with Yamaha.

There were also used 1098 here with several dealers but the prices with them are very high.

I might just buy the P22 to begin with and maybe upgrade later.

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#2261678 - 04/14/14 05:45 PM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: piano75]
Karl Lee Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 03/21/14
Posts: 2
I was on the market for a used piano for months thinking it's going to be a Yamaha or Kawai. I went up to the top models such as YUX and remained unimpressed untill I came across a 1960 Steinway 1098.

I don't understand why many parents went for the U1 or U3 when you can get these wonderful 1098 for just a little more money. I also don't understand why for some people it's an 'either or' question.

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#2261697 - 04/14/14 06:38 PM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: piano75]
LarryShone Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 1034
Loc: Darlington, UK
If a U1 is too bright how about a U3, with a mellow board.
_________________________
If the piano is the King of instruments then I am its loyal servant.

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#2261723 - 04/14/14 07:21 PM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: LarryShone]
terminaldegree Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/03/06
Posts: 2820
Loc: western Wisconsin
Hello Karl - welcome to the forum. I'm not sure if you noticed you're responding to a 2 year old thread, where often the original poster is long gone from the forum...

Originally Posted By: LarryShone
If a U1 is too bright how about a U3, with a mellow board.


LarryShone,

What the heck is "a mellow board", and how do you identify such a condition?
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#2261728 - 04/14/14 07:36 PM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: piano75]
Minnesota Marty Offline

Platinum Supporter until October 5 2014


Registered: 05/15/12
Posts: 7439
Loc: Rochester MN
A Stoned Surfer?
_________________________
Marty in Minnesota

It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.

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#2261951 - 04/15/14 05:41 AM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: terminaldegree]
LarryShone Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 1034
Loc: Darlington, UK
Originally Posted By: terminaldegree
Hello Karl - welcome to the forum. I'm not sure if you noticed you're responding to a 2 year old thread, where often the original poster is long gone from the forum...

Originally Posted By: LarryShone
If a U1 is too bright how about a U3, with a mellow board.


LarryShone,

What the heck is "a mellow board", and how do you identify such a condition?

I was viewing videos made by a shop here in Manchester that specialises in Yamaha and he explained how U3s are all different. Some sound bright, some slightly mellower, and others very mellow. In contrast he explained that the U1 is much more consistent.
By playing 3 pieces on each upright he showed that there was a marked difference in tone between the different U3s. It was clear that it's possible to get a U3 to suit the tone colour you favpur.


Edited by LarryShone (04/15/14 05:43 AM)
_________________________
If the piano is the King of instruments then I am its loyal servant.

My Soundcloud
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#2261952 - 04/15/14 05:44 AM Re: Yamaha Upright vs Steinway 1098 [Re: piano75]
LarryShone Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 1034
Loc: Darlington, UK
_________________________
If the piano is the King of instruments then I am its loyal servant.

My Soundcloud
Casio Celviano AP-450

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