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#1950570 - 08/28/12 08:01 PM Used Vogel or new Kawai baby grand
BBM Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/29/11
Posts: 30
Loc: USA
My two options are……
I can get a used 2000 Vogel V177 (5’10”) for the same price as the new from the box for a Kawai GE-30(5’5”). They are in separate store and I like them both while playing at the stores. Cannot make up my mind, help please?!
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Alfred Adult Book 2;

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#1950594 - 08/28/12 09:10 PM Re: Used Vogel or new Kawai baby grand [Re: BBM]
ZoeCalgary Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/01/11
Posts: 748
Loc: Calgary Alberta
I haven't played a Vogel so can't comment on that piano. I would be tempted more by the new Kawai. Unless the bigger piano has a much nicer tone and/or action. Play them both again and again until one comes out in the lead.

Good luck.
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Preparing Grade 6 RCM.


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#1950614 - 08/28/12 10:14 PM Re: Used Vogel or new Kawai baby grand [Re: BBM]
PianoWorksATL Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/19/09
Posts: 2942
Loc: Atlanta, GA
Vogel from 2000? That's very, very early for Vogel. The design and action have way more potential than the GE-30, but you really have to look over the details of that Vogel, the finish, fitting of case parts and other cabinetry issues. The V177 got better in a hurry, but I remember the Meyer, the immediate predecessor to the Vogel, arriving around 2000. The Meyer was not a good piano and back it went. The very first Vogels had numerous silly issues and less serious issues that lingered a couple of years into production like proper leg construction, fitting of legs & pedals, and numerous finish issues. Also, in the beginning, they used Renner parts, but the assembly needed a dealer to step in and correct things. It took a while for Schimmel to influence the factory in Poland.

To be fair, if issues like these didn't develop right away, or were taken care of under Schimmel's warranty which was absolutely top notch at that time, then the piano is in the clear and is probably very musical, but if they were camouflaged or overlooked, you'll need a pro to inspect it over carefully.

A later V177 in very good condition would smoke a GE-30, but one so early definitely raises some questions for me. They didn't fail on people, but issues like those can interrupt the joy of owning a piano.
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Sam Bennett
PianoWorks - Atlanta Piano Dealer
Bsendorfer, Estonia, Seiler, Grotrian, Weber & Hailun
Pre-Owned: Yamaha, Kawai, Steinway & other fine pianos
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www.youtube.com/PianoWorksAtlanta

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#1950870 - 08/29/12 11:27 AM Re: Used Vogel or new Kawai baby grand [Re: PianoWorksATL]
Tom Burgess Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/06/10
Posts: 46
Loc: Norman, OK
Originally Posted By: PianoWorksATL
Vogel from 2000? That's very, very early for Vogel. The design and action have way more potential than the GE-30...



Are you aware that the GE30 has the Millenium III action? That's a pretty serious piece of work for a relatively moderate priced piano.
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Pro Presenters - Norman, OK

Opinions expressed by me on this forum are my own and not necessarily that of the company for which I work.

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#1950904 - 08/29/12 12:27 PM Re: Used Vogel or new Kawai baby grand [Re: PianoWorksATL]
BBM Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/29/11
Posts: 30
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: PianoWorksATL
Vogel from 2000? That's very, very early for Vogel. The design and action have way more potential than the GE-30, but you really have to look over the details of that Vogel, the finish, fitting of case parts and other cabinetry issues. The V177 got better in a hurry, but I remember the Meyer, the immediate predecessor to the Vogel, arriving around 2000. The Meyer was not a good piano and back it went. The very first Vogels had numerous silly issues and less serious issues that lingered a couple of years into production like proper leg construction, fitting of legs & pedals, and numerous finish issues. Also, in the beginning, they used Renner parts, but the assembly needed a dealer to step in and correct things. It took a while for Schimmel to influence the factory in Poland.


Just verified with the seller, they puchased it new late 2004. From the Piano book, the Vogel brand started at 2002, not sure if this is still the first generation of Vogel.... tough one
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Playing since May 2011
Alfred Adult Book 2;

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#1951168 - 08/29/12 08:20 PM Re: Used Vogel or new Kawai baby grand [Re: BBM]
PianoWorksATL Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/19/09
Posts: 2942
Loc: Atlanta, GA
An inspection of the Vogel can clear the air quickly as everything that happens would have by now. Is the dealer offering warranty and does that warranty extend to the finish? If so, I would lean toward the Vogel.
_________________________
Sam Bennett
PianoWorks - Atlanta Piano Dealer
Bsendorfer, Estonia, Seiler, Grotrian, Weber & Hailun
Pre-Owned: Yamaha, Kawai, Steinway & other fine pianos
Full Restoration Shop
www.PianoWorks.com
www.youtube.com/PianoWorksAtlanta

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