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#1962377 - 09/22/12 01:58 AM Re: Taking Advantage of YouTube [Re: etcetra]
LoPresti Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/07/10
Posts: 1304
Loc: New York
Originally Posted By: etcetra
Of course all those media formats have their advantages/disadvantages, but one thing that can be said for sure is that the newer generations of media format are more portable&convienient. People aren't buying mp3's over CD's and cassettes because they are brainwashed, but in a society that values portability, mp3's are the preferred format. It's just meeting the demand of the market.


My point precisely.

At its heart, music is SOUND. I am uncertain how convenience and portability relate to that. And how do you suppose this "demand of the market" came about? Somehow, folks are being diverted away from sound, and toward these unrelated characteristics. And for what reason?
_________________________
In music, everything one does correctly helps everything else.

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#1962402 - 09/22/12 05:45 AM Re: Taking Advantage of YouTube [Re: LoPresti]
beeboss Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/18/09
Posts: 1198
Loc: uk south
Originally Posted By: LoPresti

I was not referring specifically to you, or any of your arguments, but rather to the wide-spread belief that things among musical artists, and in the music business in general, are better now than in the past. The facts contradict that notion, yet we are told to believe it. That is textbook Propaganda.



It depends on what you mean by better, and from whose perspective you are looking.
You brought up the example of McCoy Tyner and how you thought youtube was bad for him, but maybe you know that at the end of the 60's McCoy was so short of gigs he had to get a job driving a cab. And that was only a few years after he recorded one of the greatest jazz albums ever (and probably one of the best selling). Now he plays to packed concert halls everywhere he goes. I doubt he misses driving the cab!

Looking at the past with rose tinted spectacles is also a false view of reality.
_________________________
http://www.youtube.com/davebeeboss

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#1962419 - 09/22/12 06:52 AM Re: Taking Advantage of YouTube [Re: LoPresti]
etcetra Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/25/08
Posts: 1446
Originally Posted By: LoPresti


At its heart, music is SOUND. I am uncertain how convenience and portability relate to that. And how do you suppose this "demand of the market" came about? Somehow, folks are being diverted away from sound, and toward these unrelated characteristics. And for what reason?


Do you want to carry a record player with you every time you want to listen to music outside of your home?

Most of us don't want to a carry a separate device for listening to music when we are on the go Personally I am glad I can use my phone to listen to music on the subway. There are other practical concerns, like not wanting to clutter your living spaces with 100's, if not thousands of CDs, and environmental concerns(imagine all the plastic you save by going all digital), better indexing of your library...etc

Technology just makes it easier and more practical to consume music(and media), it doesn't divert your attention away from music, if anything, it allows people to enjoy music in ways they couldn't before.

If you want to go back to carrying camera, cassette player, and portable TV with you, we wouldn't stop you, but to say that new technology is somehow taking you away from the experience of music is absurd.

Beeboss

Not to mention the kind of racial tensions Miles Davis and others have to go through back then. There are many media "propaganda" that appeals to nostalgia too. The Tea Party in America is running on the whole idea that things used to be so much better back then.



Edited by etcetra (09/22/12 07:13 AM)

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#1962934 - 09/23/12 01:02 AM Re: Taking Advantage of YouTube [Re: etcetra]
LoPresti Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/07/10
Posts: 1304
Loc: New York
Originally Posted By: etcetra
Most of us don't want to a carry a separate device for listening to music when we are on the go Personally
I am glad I can use my phone to listen to music on the subway. There are other practical concerns, like not wanting to clutter your living spaces with 100's, if not thousands of CDs, and environmental concerns(imagine all the plastic you save by going all digital), better indexing of your library...etc

With due appologies to Al for moving his thread even further afield . . . . .

Long before I was born, there was an "invention" known as the Swiss Army Knife. In addition to the normal and expected blade of a jack-knife, it had various gadgets: a bottle opener, a sort of screw driver, a leather punch, a kind of spoon, tiny scissors, and the deluxe models even sported a micro saw! It was a great idea -- IN THEORY.

The main problem was this: none of the devices, with the exception of the jack-knife blade, worked very well. Each represented a massive compromise from the real thing it was intended to emulate. When I was growing up, I knew some kids who owned them and thought they were great. Now I know someone who uses his telephone to listen to music . . . and on it goes.
_________________________
In music, everything one does correctly helps everything else.

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#1962992 - 09/23/12 05:20 AM Re: Taking Advantage of YouTube [Re: TromboneAl]
etcetra Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/25/08
Posts: 1446
So what's the major compromise of listening to music on your phone as opposed to using a dedicated Cassete CD, or record player? In what ways does it not "work well"? Have you actually used a smartphone to listen to music?

What do you mean by the "real thing" anyways? If you are claiming that listening to music on your phone from listening to real, live music, then that's a absurd statement, and there's no evidence to support that.. Technology doesn't take anything away from experience, its up to the individual to figure out if you want to use it or be used by it.



Edited by etcetra (09/23/12 05:20 AM)

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#1963104 - 09/23/12 11:46 AM Taking Advantage of YouTube [Re: etcetra]
LoPresti Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/07/10
Posts: 1304
Loc: New York
I would rather not embark here on a side discussion of "really listening", or "listening in depth", as I used to call it. Suffice to say that whenever possible, I prefer to listen to good music live, as you, yourself, have mentioned as your preference. My next favorite way is pre-recorded music THAT IS RECORDED AND REPRODUCED AS FAITHFUL TO THE SOURCE SOUND as possible. The instruments sound AND FEEL like they would if you were sitting in the studio, or concert hall, or nightclub.

While I must confess that I have not listened in depth to music over an iPhone, I have a feeling that, if I did, I would come away disappointed. I suspect that all the notes are there, but without many of the overtones, and without much resonance.

I might ask you if you have listened to a real sound system, with a high quality source?
_________________________
In music, everything one does correctly helps everything else.

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#1963231 - 09/23/12 03:43 PM Re: Taking Advantage of YouTube [Re: TromboneAl]
TromboneAl Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/12/04
Posts: 794
Loc: Northern, Northern California
Now you know why I said "leaving aside issues of copyright and fairness" in my original post. smile
_________________________
- Al

My Book: Becoming a Great Sight-Reader -- or Not!
My Blog: The Year of Piano Sight-Reading

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#1963259 - 09/23/12 04:35 PM Re: Taking Advantage of YouTube [Re: TromboneAl]
etcetra Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/25/08
Posts: 1446
Well I guess I should leave this issue to rest too. Just to answer the question, Yes I have listened to music on high quality systems. Bottom line is, I agree that things are not changing for the better. But nor is it changing for the worse either. We live in different times which requires different needs. The fact that we prefer mp3 isn't because we are brainwashed into thinking it's better, but it's because people have different needs/demands nowdays. most younger people like me don't have a place of permanent residence, and getting a quality sound system&record/CD to listening to music is just too expensive and impractical. Besides when you are listening to mp3s on the phone, you are usually doing it outside in a noisy environment, which is totally different than listening at home. They are apples and oranges.


Btw if you are serious audiophile you can make high bitrate/quality mp3s and invest in expensive sound-isolation earphones too.

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#1963461 - 09/24/12 12:34 AM Taking Advantage of YouTube [Re: etcetra]
LoPresti Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/07/10
Posts: 1304
Loc: New York
Etcetra,

While we continue to think about the subject from different perspectives, I have enjoyed the "discussion".

Ed
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