Piano World Home Page Forums Our Most Popular Forums Piano Tuner-Technicians Forum So, what did you do today?

I totally agree with this. We, if we are not careful, will preside over the destruction of the last of the American Piano manufactured instruments...many that were actually quite nice little pianos, all things considered. Jane and I here are two years backlogged with melodeon and pump reed organ rebuilding. 20 years ago you couldn't give these instruments away, and now people pay many thousands to have these heirlooms rebuilt. I'm with Bill on this one, totally.

RPD

Thanks RPD. I have 6 pianos today at the college, one Steinway B, one Kawai KG-2E and four Yamaha P-22's.

Monday, I will have a Baldwin Acrosonic reconditioning. Same story again. An unplayable instrument as it is but when I am done with it, the four boys in the family will have an instrument to learn music upon. I told the owner who had always had the piano in his family that although it had very little to no market value now, it could well become an American built treasure in the future that his grandchildren would treasure.

dbl posting

Ken please,

Here is some objectivity for you to consider;

The moderators have not done this in my view. You can read PLENTY, PLENTY of Bill’s postings in which he is stating nothing meaningful or appropriate unless you consider veiled insults to other members appropriate for this place. Tooting your own horn as Bill continually does here is just poor conduct in ANY culture.

I have read many of your comments in PM’s. In my view they have been inappropriate responses nothing short of threats to a member. Since when is a moderator to have a personal interest in the outcome of any threads.



It appears like you are up to the identical activity with another member. Touché mon ami


Plenty of members on Piano World spend their time in the juvenile pursuit of insulting each other; as a matter of fact I have not come across more small and petty people in any other forum and I am on plenty of them.

There is a veiled insult in Bill’s posting that has remained here all week;




Every technician that posts here on a regular basis and even ones that do not are aware of which member this insult is directed towards. Do you know who this is directed towards Mr. Knapp?

Heck, this could be me your talking about...jk

Yes EXACTLY Les, very good. This is an insult plain and simply directed to other members of which have yet to be determined. And this has been left since January 15 2011. No moderator has chosen to deal with this very clear insult directed to others.

I note directly from Bill’s previous postings on the same matter that this is directed towards our member BDB.It is very clear.

So what is it here anyways? Do we deal with insulting remarks in an equal way or do we do this selectively? Do we have members here that are more equal then others? How does this indicate a CLEAR POLICY for all members in this place?

Let settle this once and for all; not next week … not tomorrow… now……… today.

I mean look back just 2 short years and see the good technical people who never post here any longer; any thoughts on why that is?

I have spoken directly to many of them by email or telé; most are fed up with the continual nonsense including myself.

Dan,

You're making a common mistake here. You're assuming I follow all the posts here with the same fervor you imply you do. Not so. Nor do any of the other moderators.

The problem is that in the eyes of some, Bill cannot say anything right. So unless he says nothing there is going to be a member who is upset with what he says.

If that quote of Bill's is directed at a particular person you'll have to enlighten me. I have no idea what you're talking about nor do I see an insult in his statement. But then, there you go assuming that I actually read all the posts on here. Sorry, no, I've got more important things to do.

I also don't know what you mean by having a personal interest in the outcome of a thread. I do know that if this thread becomes all about what the moderators do and don't it's going to get locked. Nobody has time to deal with bickering.

OK, now back to our regularly scheduled Topic.

After hearing a customer try out their freshly tuned piano I exclaimed, “That was Pathetic!” And after the expected head turn I corrected myself and said, ”Uh, I mean that was Pathétique.” I know it’s an old one, but the player was a young teen and so I got away with it. (Bad tuner! Bad tuner!)

Back and forth to the hospital yesterday for my wife's post-operative appointments. We were supposed to have been able to do it in one trip, but one was rescheduled-That happens to doctors, too! Then I went to the annual cioppino dinner at my club. One of the members brought his mother to celebrate her 100th birthday!

Sorry Ken, I don’t spend my time assuming anything of you or any other moderator. As you have stated yourself, I have more important things to accomplish. A difference of opinion is not bickering, it is discussion.



I already did this in my previous posting.



This is a threat and a personal interest in the outcome of a thread; that interest being yours as a moderator. Do whatever your perception of a moderator tells you to do.

For myself I am voluntarily withdrawing from PW just as I have over the past several weeks. In this particular instance there is no apparent fairness, or balance in the moderation.

Hmmm, multiple lines, no wise-cracks.

I have to agree that SOME members toot their own horn too much. I am so glad I am blessed with a humble spirit; that I am not like others. In fact I am very proud (and rightfully so) of my humility! I am merely pointing this out so that you all have my example to follow, not to receive accolades. I am far above anything so trivial.

Tuned one of my favorite pianos this morning...an 1892 Steinway upright...yes, 119-years-old (this Sunday, to be exact). I restrung it (plus new hammers, dampers, springs, etc.) 9 years ago. Such a sweet tone and an absolute joy to tune.

Come on, let's not go there again shall we??? I would suggest not reading this person posts then. I choose to do that with certain members all the time. I like this thread and don't wish to see it closed up.

Been working as I could, at my college since the first of the month. Some days I can tune more than others but, with all of the repair work these new pianos need like today for example, a brand new Boston studio UP 118 S. High C was rubbing on the cheek block forcing the key to stay down. I had to sand it to stop that problem. Then, the pedals were clanking. Seems to be a constant problem with Kawai built pianos with that particular pedal system which I do not care for. Then, the bass dampers were not working in conjunction with the tenor and treble when the sustaining pedal was depressed. Turns out, the bass pedal rod was jammed up into the back of the damper rod. How the heck it got there is beyond me. Then, I find a damper rubbing on the neighboring damper in the bass only to find that the damper flange is broken in half. So, I had to replace that. Then, I find several bobbling hammers. 1.5 hours later....... I have all of these problems fixed and then, I can tune the piano. The piano was delivered in December. I raised it 1/2 tone to 440. Temp was 72 degree's RH was 35 %. Not horrible but, that certainly tells you the piano was NOT prepped in any way whatsoever at the store prior to delivery.

When I went to tune the next piano, a Kawai K-3, I found more clanking pedals and discovered the whole piano needs to be flipped and the bottom board tightened. When the pedals are depressed, the whole board moves and creaks. I was quite disgusted by this point so, I called it an early day and left. I came home and called someone else to go in there and flip it (I can't with my current back issues) fix the bobbling hammers and whatever else they discover... I'll tune it later. Oh, and this one too, along with most of the other brand new Kawai's delivered there, was 1/2 tone flat. I see no reason for this!

Finished another college! Phew...glad for the work but glad the three-week marathon is done too! Back to primarily private tunings next week.

I had pedal noise on my 118's at the U as well. I've been loosening the trap lever pivot screw at the bracket 1/2 turn or so to stop it. Lube did nothing for it. A right angle phillips head driver is needed for this, preferably the cam type, not fixed.

I've encountered much of that too, in recent years...but especially in RECENT years. Michigan's economy has apparently forced the store(s)to "economize" and not prep the pianos.

Perhaps this might be a topic for another thread; "Who works for stores and takes store referrals, etc".

But yeah, it drives me to distraction to arrive and get all that prep work thrown at me because a salesman calculated his percentages without planning on any store tunings etc... and I agree with you that there isn't a good reason for it. I'm actually considering not taking follow-up tuning referrals from one of the stores since it always ends up with either the store, or me looking bad. Its just not worth it when pianos are just plopped into circulation without any meaningful prep work. I'm probably going to end up telling that store's clients to call the store back and have them send their in-house "tech" out. Once they're eventually done with the store (or too disgusted to keep trying) I'll be very happy to assist the customer.

The solve for this is for clients to take a qualified technician WITH them to pick out their new piano. Once the stores get the message that technicians are showing up who work for the customers, they'll need to go back to prepping the pianos properly or they may lose the sale.

JMHO

RPD

A very hard day, third in a row, tuning six pianos for a solo & ensemble event. I don't often participate in this particular thread but it has its place and I wish for it to continue.

Some people seem to read far more into certain comments that I make than I evener imagined or intended. I had noticed from the time I first participated in any on line piano discussion forum that what many people wrote on a daily basis were indeed "one line wisecracks", (my opinion or them, of course) so that remark was not directed at nor did I think about any individual in particular.

Yes, I have noted that BDB has made an extraordinarily large number of posts and in fact, I admire him for such a record. Sometimes, yes, those posts I have found a bit irritating in their brevity but they have always been to the point and reflected his opinion. Often, I have wished that he would have taken the time to write more but I have also seen that he does take the time when he feels the need or inclination to do so. I respect his opinions, even though I don't always agree with them.

I am a very competitive person by nature. If someone mocks or ridicules me, it is easy for me to demonstrate that I can out do whatever has been hurled at me 100 times more forcefully. So, yes, anyone could look back through posts I have made and pick out things I have said that may seem insulting but all one has to do is look further into what had provoked such remarks.

There are certain people who seem to like to pick fights. I always felt if I were challenged in such a way, I could surely win that fight but that is not what this forum is supposed to be about. We are here to discuss piano technology. We will always have differences of opinion. I will always hold firmly to my opinions. I have spent all of my adult life working on pianos, so I have a firm basis for them.

Instead of resorting to mockery and ridicule of my own, which I could surely exceed that which has been directed at me, I have simply chosen to report it. I would rather state my opinions and experiences, discuss them with others who have similar interests or engage in a civil discussion and perhaps have my mind changed by what someone else may say than to merely bicker back and forth with any particular individual.

My life's experiences have left me with several core values. Number one is the value of PTG and RPT. Yes, I know that there are some very exceptional individual piano technicians who have never participated with PTG but I do not like to see that fact directed at young and aspiring technicians with the idea that either PTG membership or RPT status is basically meaningless or frivolous.

Number two is that tuning, voicing and regulation are all an art. There is not among each of these, one way that is always right and the only right way. There is room for discussion and diversity in each of these subjects.

Number three is that all pianos of any make, size, value or age have merit. They are the property and treasure of the people or entities who own them. Personally, we may be fond of or dislike any of them but it is our duty as technicians to treat them all with respect and to service them appropriately according to the wishes of their owners.

Number four is that I make my living by tuning and servicing pianos. To remain in business, I must respect each and every client and the instrument they own and do my best to please each one of them. I personally may thoroughly enjoy or thoroughly dislike any particular piano but what I must keep in mind at all times is that it is not my property or possession, I am being trusted with its proper and best possible service under the circumstances.

Number five is the benefit I, as a piano technician provide to the people I serve. I must provide a service which will keep the client satisfied and wanting my services in the future. That includes the client, children and grandchildren so that the industry itself will survive. If too few people are ever interested in the piano, whatever shape, size or form it may have, the industry will die and there will be no need for piano technicians.

I must keep in mind that whatever spending is done for my services, it is discretionary spending, not essential for living. Individuals, families or entities such as schools, churches, hotels, restaurants, etc., can survive without a piano. It is my duty as a piano technician to make my services worth whatever is spent upon them to the client.

I hope this post will be seen as meaningful. This thread is about day to day experiences and deserves to continue. I posted not only what I did today but what I thought about when I read other posts in it.

Bill,

I consider that post to be open, honest, and from the heart.

Thanks Guys,

It's nice to know that techs from around the country are also encountering these same issues and that I'm not the only one seeing these things. But then, I've already known that in talking with other local technicians here too. Regardless, it's nice to read what others are running into.

It seems logical to me, maybe I'm just old fashioned, that if piano manufacturers would increase quality, not decrease it, especially those to whom my post refers too, they would sell more pianos. Is this a "DUH" moment?

Case in point. The Yamaha dealer prepped every piano they delivered to the college. There was nothing that needed addressing on any one of the pianos delivered there. Not one! How refreshing! Even the pitch was close.

Manufacturers and dealers sell the pianos once. We service them forever.... If it would soak in that technicians really do have a LOT of say over what pianos will be bought and sold, maybe we would be listened to more?

I could have recommended and they would have listened to me, that the college buy all Kawai's products but I didn't. We bought 25 new pianos this past fall. Instead, I recommended they also purchase at least 8-10 Yamaha's and so they did....