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My brother waxes lyrical about Bartok and Satie and their works for beginning piano. I can't bear them. I don't think music is fun just because the composer adds some words about cabbage soup and a sick doll. I have been working through mikrocosmos looking for some redeeming features, halfway through vol 2, I haven't found a single one.

I try to keep an open mind, I just don't find anything there that speaks to me in a musical way.

What do you do when there's a whole genre or era you don't like? I don't especially want to put my students off it, or close their doors, I just find it quite inaccessible personally and I don't know where to start.

If possible, I try to look for another composer of the same genre/era (for example instead of Bartók try Kabalevsky or another Russian composer / or instead of Satie try something like movie music from 'Amélie' - I know, it's not the same, but it requires similar sound). I think it's important that we like what we teach.

I also try not to force my students to learn a certain piece, if they don't like it at all. They have to practise it, and if they don't like it, you know what happens...

By the way, have you tried Bartók's 'Children's Pieces'? They're much more accessible and less abstract than 'Mikrokosmos'.

Of course, I adore Kabalevsky!

The Bartok Children's Pieces look much more enjoyable.

Then don't teach it! There are always other things to teach.

Aside from abandoning Bartók, there is another option, which you may already have tried: Expose your ears to MORE Bartók. Most of us have to "grow into him".

Frequently, it is the first "door" we open on a composer, that colors our opinion of all his/her works. I happen to love Bartók, but if I had been first introduced to his work through his Sixth String Quartet, for instance, I probably would have out-of-hand rejected anything else composed by him, ever.

Have a listen to a good recording of the “Miraculous Mandarin”, or “Music for Strings, Percussion, and Celeste”, or the blockbuster “Concerto for Orchestra”, and then venture into his “Third Piano Concerto”, played by someone who has the guts for it. One learns to listen BEYOND melody and harmony, and to get carried along by the sweep and current of the music, and stand in awe of the textures, and the massive density of the sound. There is profound joy, and unbelievable pathos. (It just is not found in a major chord, or a melody written in a minor key.)

Then, with new ears, and a new understanding of the language, return to Mikrokosmos.

Ed

There is that. I just don't especially want to limit their tastes just because of mine!

Wonderful Ed, I will do just that! I did try playing through some of the 'For Children' album, and they are quite delightful. I think there's just something I haven't got yet.

But didn't you say that it was because of your teachers not teaching what they didn't like that your exposure to modern music was music from a hundred years ago?

I'd say look into modern composers - many of whom write in other genres that have 'classical and great master composers' that some of us may not enjoy (ie, Bartok for me as well, though there are quite a few in the Children's Album that I love!).

If you haven't come across it yet, there is one called either
"Love Song" or "The Girl in White" - definitely not what you expect from Bartok!

No, I don't think so! I'm sure my teachers have influenced me but I don't remember anything they didn't like.

In any case, I want to avoid anyone saying such a thing about me down the line. Hence the thread.

Love Song is quite beautiful.

Yes. But there's also the issue of good music vs. bad music. Don't teach bad music.

Bravo! Can we frame those four words? Can we engrave them on something? This is what forms musical taste!

Sorry, I should have clarified that I was asking AZNpiano that - he recently mentioned it about modern music, I had thought.

I completely agree with his sentiment of "don't teach bad music though" Plenty of examples of that... I didn't teach for long, but one student wanted me to help her with a Lady Gaga song... easy to say, she didn't last long with me!

Hem...

It's so 'not nice' to be putting down an entire genre or era because of two books (collections, or whatever)... I also don't enjoy mikrocosmos very much, and although I have all 6 books, I tend to teach other things (and compose other things as well for the same purpose).

There are tons of other stuff to that approximate level, or a bit more difficult that could work very well for you.

Just don't teach bad music! But make sure you understand what is bad music and what not. One mans garbage is another mans treasure they say...

Now, apart from the ones mentioned in this thread (Kabalevsky, etc) there's also this other collection of 21 sketches for solo piano... Perhaps you've heard them or watched a youtube video, or something! :P

(And, btw, Ben Crosland has a collection (in 3 different books) of 41 jazz tunes which are brilliant. Give them a go, if you fancy this type of music. You won't regret it and neither will Ben, I'm sure! )

I don't think my posts have demonstrated how I really feel about 20th/21st-century piano music.

The easy Satie and Bartok Mikrokosmos (at least the first three volumes) are not great music. There is music of redeeming value in the later Mikrokosmos, but I just haven't had the chance to teach those pieces yet. I also don't really enjoy Bartok's "For Children, vol 1 and vol 2" except for a select few pieces like the Rhapsodie from vol 2. "Easy" Bartok just doesn't sound fun to play.

In contrast, Kabalevsky wrote tons of great music for children. His Op. 39 and Op. 27 are grossly overplayed, but I still like to teach out of those books because the music is excellent. I also like his Op. 89, which isn't as popular as the other two sets, but I think sounds much better. I thoroughly enjoy teaching the Op. 51 variations, the Op. 60 rondos, and the Op. 13 sonatinas.

I do teach a lot of contemporary music. The great thing is that there is a ton of choices out there, and bad music should just be ignored.

Hi AZNpiano,

Are there any contemporaries you find yourself teaching a lot of these days?

I try not to overlap repertoire (or composers) from student to student. I get bored teaching the same pieces, unless they are in method books. Within the past year, I've had more than one student work on Kabalevsky, Bartok, Liebermann, Starer, and Robert Vandall.

AZN: Just to be clear. I wasn't talking to you about not being fair, etc... I was talking to the OP (ten thumbs)... I know you teach contemporary music, very much so!

Don't teach bad music. Jings. Well, then, how do I know what is bad?

Lady Gaga has been mentioned and I have to say I don't have a problem with popular music - I don't see it as 'bad'. It may not be complex. It may be synthesised by an industry rather than specific creative artists who know what they're doing, but does that necessarily make it 'bad'?

I certainly wasn't trying to put down a whole genre or era just because of Mikrokosmos. There's a lot in the 20th/21st centuries I like (e.g a certain 21 sketches). Now, I discover, many thanks to this thread, that some of it was indeed written by Bartok.

Perhaps I should say that my brother had specifically and strongly recommended Microkosmos as 'good'. But I'm really struggling to find anything half-way musical. Perhaps it is just bad. Education, maybe. But not good music. I don't know.

Nikolas - I was rather hoping your 21 sketches might become available from some of the usual outlets, just so I don't need to pay special postage. Perhaps you could update us?

Ben Crosland writes great stuff. I had never put him in the same genre with Bartok, though. They tick rather different boxes.

I do not wish to turn this thread into something else, but anyhow, some information may be interesting...

I've contacted a few (4-5) from the usual online vendors: Sheetmusicplus, jwpeppers, musicroom (this is a UK one), etc... The only to have replied as of yet is SMP, who kindly denied access to their portal for the scores of Editions Musica Ferrum. They have a rule that a publisher needs to have at least 100 titles in their catalog and we currently have 35, so there's a little more to be found... And it's not exactly easy with the rather strict quality standards that EMF has.

Now, if I may extend a bit: Sheetmusicplus offers 'flat rate budget shipping' at 4$ (around 2.5 quid I assume?), so it's not free shipping. musicroom, which is based in the UK offers free shipping for orders more than 15 quid (which again wouldn't apply for a single copy, but then of course you can buy as many scores as you wish)...

In our website, right now, we have some discounts for multiple copies of 'Sketch Music'. So if you get 2 copies you save 10% (which is around the amount of shipping) and for 3 copies you save 20% and so on... Plus shipping for 2 copies remains the same as for 1 copy (since the post office changes rates at a bigger weight than 2 scores, at least for now).

That's all the analysis I can offer right now.

We do hope to have more offers in the future, and we certainly want our scores to be found in as many music stores, online and offline as possible! That's a given for us. It's just that access is not exactly easy (and the field is vast...).

When my assistant find some time we intend to start calling around the various online vendors and put some pressure on...

That's about it.

EDIT: Nope, that's not it completely...

We actually have arranged for ALL our scores (the new ones are on their way) to be available through our N. American warehouse (in Canada). This doesn't affect people living in the UK, but for those living in the States, Canada and general American grounds, it largely affects shipping time and fees...
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I know that Ben composes differently than Bartok, but my older student (aged 15) had such a positive reaction to Ben's score, that he's studying harder now! That makes it all worthwhile for me (though I'm not a huge fan of jazz...).

Thanks Nikolas. My local shop is Musicroom.

Not that I know how to get in touch with these people, but a good thing to do would be to make sure the Associated Board are aware, because it is the kind of stuff they like to include in syllabuses, anthologies (e.g. Spectrum), etc.

I think I will go ahead and order, a copy for myself and one for my brother for Christmas. If he likes it, great, if he doesn't, then it will serve him right for bothering my brain with all this guff about Microkosmos!