Piano World Home Page Forums Our Most Popular Forums Piano Forum Pearl River/Perzina/Kawai which is better?

Hi everyone, due to lack fo budget(around $4000), compare to these 3 China made piano: Pearl River(or Ritmiiller), Perzina and Kawai(China made, NOT Japan made). Which is worth to buy? Also, I know Pearl river and Kawai both are authentic brand. Does Perzina too?

Thanks

Perzina is not just a piano brand but also the name of the company. They are European but set up their factory in China. I would say there's not a big difference at this price so go with the one you are most comfortable with. Kawai is the most established brand here, so I would expect the other two to offer a bit more in order to compete.

If it is the new Premium line Ritmuller designed by Lothar Thomma, they have nothing to do with stock Pearl Rivers.

It's an entirely different species incorporating vastly different designs, specs, built quality and certainly "sound".

Placed besides each other, the pianos perform entirely different.

This would become evident to anybody at virtually first touch.

Good luck in your choice!

Norbert

Hi, is the new Premium line LQ series? I've already have a play in my local shop. The model is Ritmuller LQ120. The key touch is almost perfect and sound also good. However, I prefer a red color one in my room and at least 122 size or higher. But they only have 120 size and LQ series only offers black color. But I will call them when they stock 125 tomorrow.

Why I am interested in Perzina is its special bass sound(obviousely better than other two).

Also, the Kawai is not made in China. They are made in Japan and Indonesia.

Could OP perhaps be looking at a KX-21?
Was this an older model or do they still make it?
It certainly was once available in Canada.

Perhaps OP is writing from outside the U.S.?

Norbert

Steve - beg to differ with you there. I just returned from China, and in deed, there are Chinese made Kawai's supposedly only made for the domestic market. These are made by Parsons and Beijing. I know, it was a surprise to me too - But I have pics to prove it!

As soon as I catch up with other work, I'm going to post on some of my findings and explorations .... and I have another moniker to add to my already lengthy signature

The lengths to which a dedicated forum retailer will travel to resolve a question are impressive.

Actually, member Chen (forum name) first reported on Kawai production at Parsons a couple of years ago. He described himself as a Kawai employee working inside the Pasons production complex. His reports never created any gasps here.

The first to report on the remarkable similarities between certain Kawai models and Beijing models was Glenn Treibetz.

The first to report on the fact that European retailers were going with Indoesian K-3's rather than the more expensive Japanese made ones (also available to them) was Chris Venables.

I think all this means is that Kawai is hedging its bets on the future, and why not? The Parsons connection in particular makes a lot of sense since Parsons' own retail stores sell oodles of Kawai pianos in China.

Master,

Once you unpack all your contraband CD's DVD's, and pharmaceuticals, maybe you could report your finding about PR's use of the Rimuller and Kayserberg labels on the home market.

Companies today still trying to call the word "China" a dirty word, better have their economic house in order.

[Piano] companies happy enough to sell only in Afghanistan,Luxemburg and Ghana don't have the trouble

All others take note that the Chinese are no longer the coolies of the world.
They got the most money, the largest markets and increasingly the most political power.

Rest assured China will not be impressed by goods made in Indonesia. China's own huge domestic market demands and will continue to obtain goods produced on their own terms. If this be within their own country, so be it. In fact, it long *is*.

Fools will deny and fight this but others including 8000 odd German corporations ["eight thousand"..] are meantime thriving.

So do virtually all our resource companies here in Canada.

"Hide and seek" is rapidly becoming a game for dedicated loosers.

What is for some a threat remaining a "dirty word" has long become opportunity for others. GREAT opportunity!

Here's from one you'd least expect:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lvl5Gan69Wo

Norbert

While I was aware that Kawai produced pianos in China for domestic distribution, I thought the imports to North America were limited to Japanese- and Indonesian-made instruments.

Norbert,

I really don't think the rest of your post breaks any new wind ground. However, this excerpt is a bit startling, even from you.

To the extent that their individual income permits, Chinese are keenly interested in and aspire to ownership of foreign goods from the West. As their level of income rises, so with it rises their level of interest in owning what a generation ago would have been inconceivable to them.

This is not an indictment of China's ability to produce quality goods. It is simply a social phenomenon that has repeated itself throughout Asia since WW2.

I don't know what you mean exactly when you say that Chinese demand goods produced on their own terms, but if you mean by that statement that Chinese are demanding Chinese-made products, you are simply wrong.

I also think you're off target in attacking fools who think that the Chinese are a race of coolies. Only a backwoods cretan whose sole cultural acquaintance with China is a pair of disposable chopsticks from the take-ot has that cultural image today. The operative word in 2012 is scary, not dirty.

ops...Let's back to the topic not China.
master88er is correct, because I am in China now. But only Parsons will produce China Kawai, Beijing will no longer OEM Kawai.
However, you will still find both Beijing Kawai(a few inventory) and Parsons Kawai in the market.

Babyloneden:

Your situation in China is really no different than that of any other piano shopper.

Congratulations: today we sold a piano "made in China" against another one which was not.

Tomorrow, it may be the other way around.

Touch and sound is really what counts most.

There's no quick advice giving outside that.

Good luck!

P.S. Your English is excellent!

Norbert

... and you expected anything else?

Well, yea! You're a real sweetheart , but.......

I don't know that you let him know that he was in China, and even if you had, I would wager that he already knew that without your help.

Could you help him out on the question of the Ritmuller model he describes (a company you represent) instead of exploring the dark secrets of Kawai outsourcing (the copany you don't represent)?

I would find it useful as well because from what I understand the use of the names Ritmuller and Kayserberg on pianos is different in Asia from their use in the Western market.

The question of 'outsourcing' only came up after Steve Cohen claimed Kawai pianos were only made in either Japan or Indonesia.
I later tried to make the point that in today's market the quality of these uprights had less to do with *where* they were made than their musical quality and preference by owner.

If it were 9'concert grands, the discussion would most likely be somewhat different.

Don't forget these are simple uprights and it would be more interesting to hear what OP has to say and his own impressions than we constantly telling *him*

Happy choosing!

Norbert

Norbert,

I realize that Russell was clariying a misstatement and I realize that you were trying to be helpful in sorting out which Kawai it might be.. I'm only pulling Russell's chain to get him (if he can) to speak to the use of the Ritmuller and Kayserberg's names in the Asian market. It's a little selfish because I peronsally find it very confusing.

Unfortunately you are right there....sigh

Norbert

Hi there,

I still haven't bought yet.

1. As piano "OEM in China", in my opinion, unlike digital products, the "skill level" of works fully as important as piano parts. So I think there will be still slight diffeence between a outsourced piano and original one. At least for me, outsourced Kawai and original Kawai have noticeable difference. Yamaha seems to be better because they own factory in China and that ensure better quality control.

2. Some native Chinese brand piano really impress me at both workmanship and tone including Pearl River, Ritmuller, Kayserburg. Compare to Japanese Yamaha/Kawai, these are really very good(at least in term of performance price ratio). But why they are my first choice is just because too many people buy them here and I don't want to follow(might sounds ridiculous).

3. I did a research about Ritmüller LQ120 I mentioned before and this modle doesn't appear on Pearlriver company's official website. And other people told me this is just a custom modle not a common modle. Other Pearlriver shop still recommend me to choose common models such as Ritmüller R6/UP120R4 or etc(I don't know if Pearlriver name thier product same name in oversea).

4. Why I post the thread here is just want to hear more differnect voices. For example, Perzina salesclerk emphasizes their product was in group 3A(The Piano Book by Lary Fine). However, businessmen in China is used to "buy a ranking", so that list is highly doubted in China's piano forum. Do you think that list is reliable or just a joke?

5. I just found a new choice today - May Berlin. Will do more rearch.

Thanks

If I were the OP, when it comes to Pearl River product in the domestic (China) market, I would be LESS concerned with the brand name on the product than the model of the product. For example, I would probably opt for the UH series upright pianos over the UP series upright pianos whether they say Pearl River, Ritmuller, Kayserburg, Essex, or Jing Zhu ( ) . Again, ONLY IN THE DOMESTIC MARKET, the pianos with identical model numbers have, well, pretty identical features.

The above being said, I would HIGHLY encourage the OP to look at the new products with the Pearl River, Ritmuller and Kayserburg labels on them that say "Pearl River Beijing piano" on the lower right hand corner of the fall board. These instruments come from Pearls factory in Beijing and are new models not available outside of China, yet. They are absolutely FABULOUS!

In the USA and Europe, we have not yet seen what we will know as Kayserburg yet (other than in one retail store in the USA), but NAMM will probably correct that situation. These pianos will be TOTALLY different than the Kayserburgs alluded to above (and those sold in Australia), and have models starting with KA and KD. I'll go into those in another thread at another time, or maybe not ... given the recent tone of postings on PW.