Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

SEARCH
the Forums & Piano World

This custom search works much better than the built in one and allows searching older posts.
(ad 125) Sweetwater - Digital Keyboards & Other Gear
Digital Pianos at Sweetwater
(ad) Pearl River
Pearl River Pianos
(ad) Pianoteq
Latest Pianoteq add-on instrument: U4 upright piano
(ad) P B Guide
Acoustic & Digital Piano Guide
PianoSupplies.com (150)
Piano Accessories Music Related Gifts Piano Tuning Equipment Piano Moving Equipment
We now offer Gift Certificates in our online store!
(ad) Estonia Piano
Estonia Piano
Quick Links to Useful Stuff
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers
*Organs

Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano Accessories
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Piano Books
*Piano Art, Pictures, & Posters
*Directory/Site Map
*Contest
*Links
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Screen Saver
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >
Topic Options
#1984020 - 11/08/12 06:08 AM What should I play for Andras Schiff?
fnork Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/01/04
Posts: 1709
Loc: Helsinki, finland
So, Andras Schiff is coming to town around mid-december not only to play the complete Bartok concerti in two concerts (plus one Bach), but he'll be giving a masterclass to three of the students of the academy as well. Naturally, I signed up for it right away, suggesting to play Hammerklavier - or rather, parts of it, as we get an hour each. The decision on who gets to play for him will be made next week. Would it be wiser to play something else, however, in a situation like this? Does anyone have experience with his masterclasses? The repertoire suggested was very expected - Baroque, classical, the romantics minus the russians and Liszt, and Bartok in addition to that. Of the latter, I've played the 3rd concerto, the etudes, the sonata....and as a matter of fact, the 2nd concerto was a planned "next project" for me - but would one dare putting that into a masterclass program one month ahead, even if it would just be one movement of the piece? Time to start thinking.
_________________________
http://www.martinmalmgren.com/

Top
(ad) Piano & Music Accessories
piano accessories music gifts tuning and moving equipment
#1984046 - 11/08/12 08:18 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: fnork]
pianoloverus Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 19228
Loc: New York City
I cannot suggest what to play but I can warn you to be prepared for some sarcastic or highly critical remarks. I have seen at least one of his master classes at Mannes in NYC, and he was one of three most unpleasant ones of the 150+ classes I've seen. So much so that for a while, I could not separate those classes from his playing which I generally find sensationally good.

I'd guess that anyone ready to play for Schiff has already has some experience with difficult master class teachers or at least knows this is always a possibility.

Top
#1984048 - 11/08/12 08:30 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: fnork]
fnork Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/01/04
Posts: 1709
Loc: Helsinki, finland
As for expecting to hear critical/negative remarks, I can perhaps imagine him being that way, but then, I don't know how the pianists at Mannes were prepared. Perhaps not well enough? As for Hammerklavier, in case I'd be doing the first movement I am absolutely sure he'd make a huge deal out of that I normally play the opening jump with two hands - something he considers "disgusting" (he says so in his lectures on the complete sonatas - the one on Hammerklavier is overall very interesting). If I'd get to play for him, though, perhaps I'd focus on the 2nd and 3rd movements instead.
_________________________
http://www.martinmalmgren.com/

Top
#1984050 - 11/08/12 08:31 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: fnork]
fnork Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/01/04
Posts: 1709
Loc: Helsinki, finland
unlpeasant in what way, by the way? I've been fortunate not to have that many nasty masterclass experiences - I just never really understood the approach some seem to have where the student is ripped to pieces or laughed at. I spoke about this with Jerome Lowenthal this summer and he felt the same way.


Edited by fnork (11/08/12 08:33 AM)
_________________________
http://www.martinmalmgren.com/

Top
#1984073 - 11/08/12 09:20 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: fnork]
RonaldSteinway Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/11/08
Posts: 1474
If one is afraid of hearing the true assessment of the person who gave the master class, one should not join the master class. I'd rather know the honest opinion, I do not need to do what I was told. But, at least, we are aware what other think about our playing.

If you do not want other to hear, you should just take a private piano lesson.

Top
#1984078 - 11/08/12 09:34 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: fnork]
Mark_C Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 19655
Loc: New York
When you play those first chords with separate hands, are you making sure to still have there be an impression of a bold leap?

If you're not and if he makes hay with it, it won't be just because of 'cheating,' but because of missing a musical point.

If you don't miss the musical point and he still makes hay with it, you can have a lively debate over it with him.

I think that things like this are too often argued as though the only issue is whether it's cheating and how one feels about cheating, and ignoring musical points.

Top
#1984080 - 11/08/12 09:38 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: fnork]
JoelW Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/25/12
Posts: 4762
Loc: USA
I believe Horowitz was so harsh he made his students cry.

Top
#1984081 - 11/08/12 09:40 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: fnork]
JoelW Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/25/12
Posts: 4762
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: fnork
That's very much my impression as well. As for Hammerklavier, in case I'd be doing the first movement I am absolutely sure he'd make a huge deal out of that I normally play the opening jump with two hands - something he considers "disgusting". In this situation I cannot help but wonder what a bloodbath I'd create if I'd ask him whether doing the opening jump that way is any more "disgusting" than leaving out notes which he does just a few bars later in his recording. I do believe I better stay more diplomatic though, if I'd get to play for him, and therefore playing the 2nd and 3rd movements might be an easy way out of this hassle.


He sounds like a snob.

Top
#1984089 - 11/08/12 10:01 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: Mark_C]
fnork Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/01/04
Posts: 1709
Loc: Helsinki, finland
Originally Posted By: Mark_C
When you play those first chords with separate hands, are you making sure to still have there be an impression of a bold leap?

If you're not and if he makes hay with it, it won't be just because of 'cheating,' but because of missing a musical point.

If you don't miss the musical point and he still makes hay with it, you can have a lively debate over it with him.

I think that things like this are too often argued as though the only issue is whether it's cheating and how one feels about cheating, and ignoring musical points.

That's exactly what I believe the argument would end up becoming, in this case. I do try to "make the impression" of a bold leap with one hand - but it simply is safer to play it with two. I agree that the upbeat can be somewhat broad to give this impression, and that the bass must be strong - however, changing the upbeat from an 8th-note to almost a quarter-note (as is the case when Schiff plays it) is to my mind not an ideal solution. Especially not for a composer that thinks so motivically as Beethoven, and this figure (and the upbeat gesture in particular) plays such a substantial role for the entire movement (and, one may argue, the entire piece) that I'd say it's a rather serious violation to distort the rhythm as much as some "one-hand"-pianists do. Jerome Lowenthal argued differently in my masterclass with him, posted here a while ago, but I am not yet convinced.
_________________________
http://www.martinmalmgren.com/

Top
#1984098 - 11/08/12 10:22 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: fnork]
slava_richter Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/10/12
Posts: 160
Loc: Providence, RI
Why not just play the leap with one hand for the masterclass to avoid having this argument? While it's definitely a risk, especially since you're not used to it, I think that someone of your abilities can do it without distorting the rhythm too much (turning the eighth into a quarter).

I'm sure you play more difficult leaps in other pieces that you play (Liszt, for example).

Top
#1984099 - 11/08/12 10:23 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: JoelW]
gooddog Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/08/08
Posts: 4781
Loc: Seattle area, WA
Originally Posted By: mazurkajoe
I believe Horowitz was so harsh he made his students cry.
My teacher had several lessons with Horowitz in his home. He said the man and his wife were welcoming and courteous to the extreme.

I too have heard the Schiff can be quite cruel during master classes. I don't remember the source but it was probably here at PW.
_________________________
Best regards,

Deborah

Top
#1984119 - 11/08/12 11:09 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: JoelW]
Ridicolosamente Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/08/08
Posts: 1456
Loc: Miami, Florida, USA
Originally Posted By: mazurkajoe
I believe Horowitz was so harsh he made his students cry.
That's not unique to Horowitz, nor to piano/music teachers.

-Daniel
_________________________
Currently working on:
-Dane Rudhyar's Stars from Pentagrams No 3

Top
#1984137 - 11/08/12 11:52 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: fnork]
pianoloverus Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 19228
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: fnork
unlpeasant in what way, by the way? I've been fortunate not to have that many nasty masterclass experiences - I just never really understood the approach some seem to have where the student is ripped to pieces or laughed at. I spoke about this with Jerome Lowenthal this summer and he felt the same way.
There are a handful of mater class teachers who are unfotunately quite well known for their nasty master classes which I have dubbed NASTER classes. IMO there is absolutely no excuse for that kind of public(or perhaps even in private)kind of nastiness, and I'd love to see one of those teachers get yelled back to in public although this will never happen for obvious reasons. I even thought of saying something from the audience during one of those classes but I chickened out.

Top
#1984138 - 11/08/12 11:53 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: JoelW]
pianoloverus Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 19228
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: mazurkajoe
I believe Horowitz was so harsh he made his students cry.
Never heard or read anything like that and I have read several Horowitz bios.

Top
#1984139 - 11/08/12 11:59 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: RonaldSteinway]
pianoloverus Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 19228
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: RonaldSteinway
If one is afraid of hearing the true assessment of the person who gave the master class, one should not join the master class. I'd rather know the honest opinion, I do not need to do what I was told. But, at least, we are aware what other think about our playing.

If you do not want other to hear, you should just take a private piano lesson.
A private lesson can also be cruel or humiliating for the student, but I think most would at least rather hear those kinds of comments in a private lesson.

I don't think you understand that one can make the exact same criticism in different kinds of tones. The good teachers get the same result without being ridiculously mean and humiliating to the student in a public forum. Perhaps you have never seen a master class where the teacher is very cruel and humiliating to the student?


Edited by pianoloverus (11/08/12 12:01 PM)

Top
#1984146 - 11/08/12 12:09 PM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: pianoloverus]
RonaldSteinway Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/11/08
Posts: 1474
Originally Posted By: pianoloverus
Originally Posted By: RonaldSteinway
If one is afraid of hearing the true assessment of the person who gave the master class, one should not join the master class. I'd rather know the honest opinion, I do not need to do what I was told. But, at least, we are aware what other think about our playing.

If you do not want other to hear, you should just take a private piano lesson.
A private lesson can also be cruel or humiliating for the student, but I think most would at least rather hear those kinds of comments in a private lesson.

I don't think you understand that one can make the exact same criticism in different kinds of tones. The good teachers get the same result without being ridiculously mean and humiliating to the student in a public forum. Perhaps you have never seen a master class where the teacher is very cruel and humiliating to the student?


I agree with you, a teacher does not need to be nasty to convey the thought. But the student also does not need to go to the nasty teachers. Two months ago, I fired my teacher when he started getting unpleasant. There are many teachers who are very good and pleasant. Again, my point is that we do not need to put ourselves in that situation, we have a choice.

Top
#1984163 - 11/08/12 12:59 PM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: fnork]
Auntie Lynn Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/07/04
Posts: 1105
Loc: San Francisco, CA
Play Vers la Flamme - that ought to get his attention...

Top
#1984172 - 11/08/12 01:25 PM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: fnork]
ScottM Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/11/05
Posts: 553
Loc: Southern Oregon
You're in Finland, right? Play something by Melartin! Melancholy Garden, Noli me tangere, On High, or something else Finnish!
_________________________
Scott

Top
#1984178 - 11/08/12 01:37 PM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: RonaldSteinway]
pianoloverus Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 19228
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: RonaldSteinway
Originally Posted By: pianoloverus
Originally Posted By: RonaldSteinway
If one is afraid of hearing the true assessment of the person who gave the master class, one should not join the master class. I'd rather know the honest opinion, I do not need to do what I was told. But, at least, we are aware what other think about our playing.

If you do not want other to hear, you should just take a private piano lesson.
A private lesson can also be cruel or humiliating for the student, but I think most would at least rather hear those kinds of comments in a private lesson.

I don't think you understand that one can make the exact same criticism in different kinds of tones. The good teachers get the same result without being ridiculously mean and humiliating to the student in a public forum. Perhaps you have never seen a master class where the teacher is very cruel and humiliating to the student?


I agree with you, a teacher does not need to be nasty to convey the thought. But the student also does not need to go to the nasty teachers. Two months ago, I fired my teacher when he started getting unpleasant. There are many teachers who are very good and pleasant. Again, my point is that we do not need to put ourselves in that situation, we have a choice.
That's a completely different point. And I don't think it in any way justifies nastiness on the part of the mater class teacher.

It really shouldn't have to be a choice between not going a to master class or having to be humiliated.

Top
#1984181 - 11/08/12 01:45 PM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: pianoloverus]
sophial Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/11/05
Posts: 3446
Loc: US
Originally Posted By: pianoloverus
Originally Posted By: mazurkajoe
I believe Horowitz was so harsh he made his students cry.
Never heard or read anything like that and I have read several Horowitz bios.


Never read or heard anything to that effect either.

Top
#1984214 - 11/08/12 02:49 PM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: fnork]
pianoloverus Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 19228
Loc: New York City
Tell Schiif you're playing the Hammerklavier with the newly discovered autograph showing Beethoven intended pianists to USE TWO HANDS on the opening jump. Then stick your two hands in his face before beginning, smirk, and say something about those who thought Beethoven wanted the passage played with one hand. Then play the entire Sonata without stopping.


Edited by pianoloverus (11/08/12 02:54 PM)

Top
#1984219 - 11/08/12 02:55 PM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: Auntie Lynn]
fnork Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/01/04
Posts: 1709
Loc: Helsinki, finland
Originally Posted By: Auntie Lynn
Play Vers la Flamme - that ought to get his attention...

heh, that'd be pretty funny actually...unfortunately, he gets to teach the repertoire he wants to teach, so that'd be out of the question. Unless I'd put one thing in the program and then go on stage playing something else...
_________________________
http://www.martinmalmgren.com/

Top
#1984233 - 11/08/12 03:38 PM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: pianoloverus]
RonaldSteinway Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/11/08
Posts: 1474
Originally Posted By: pianoloverus
Originally Posted By: RonaldSteinway
Originally Posted By: pianoloverus
Originally Posted By: RonaldSteinway
If one is afraid of hearing the true assessment of the person who gave the master class, one should not join the master class. I'd rather know the honest opinion, I do not need to do what I was told. But, at least, we are aware what other think about our playing.

If you do not want other to hear, you should just take a private piano lesson.
A private lesson can also be cruel or humiliating for the student, but I think most would at least rather hear those kinds of comments in a private lesson.

I don't think you understand that one can make the exact same criticism in different kinds of tones. The good teachers get the same result without being ridiculously mean and humiliating to the student in a public forum. Perhaps you have never seen a master class where the teacher is very cruel and humiliating to the student?


I agree with you, a teacher does not need to be nasty to convey the thought. But the student also does not need to go to the nasty teachers. Two months ago, I fired my teacher when he started getting unpleasant. There are many teachers who are very good and pleasant. Again, my point is that we do not need to put ourselves in that situation, we have a choice.
That's a completely different point. And I don't think it in any way justifies nastiness on the part of the mater class teacher.

It really shouldn't have to be a choice between not going a to master class or having to be humiliated.


You cannot change the person who gave the master class. He/she can behave whatever way he/she likes. We are the student, we have a choice to give them a chance to be nasty or not to us.

Top
#1984312 - 11/08/12 06:50 PM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: RonaldSteinway]
pianoloverus Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 19228
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: RonaldSteinway
Originally Posted By: pianoloverus
That's a completely different point. And I don't think it in any way justifies nastiness on the part of the mater class teacher.

It really shouldn't have to be a choice between not going a to master class or having to be humiliated.


You cannot change the person who gave the master class. He/she can behave whatever way he/she likes. We are the student, we have a choice to give them a chance to be nasty or not to us.
Glad to see that you agree that the teacher is at fault here, which was not what you originally said. The student cannot change the teacher, but it's unfortunate that those who invite these few well known nasty teachers don't start refusing to invite them anymore. Those people could change things if they wanted to.


Edited by pianoloverus (11/08/12 06:51 PM)

Top
#1984335 - 11/08/12 07:54 PM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: pianoloverus]
ScriabinAddict Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/10/12
Posts: 333
Originally Posted By: pianoloverus
There are a handful of mater class teachers who are unfotunately quite well known for their nasty master classes which I have dubbed NASTER classes.


Not to get too off topic, but here's a good example:

Youtube.com

Most masterclasses I've attended have never been this way, I have a feeling it's a rare occurrence.


Top
#1984407 - 11/08/12 11:18 PM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: slava_richter]
ando Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/23/10
Posts: 3508
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Originally Posted By: slava_richter
Why not just play the leap with one hand for the masterclass to avoid having this argument? While it's definitely a risk, especially since you're not used to it, I think that someone of your abilities can do it without distorting the rhythm too much (turning the eighth into a quarter).

I'm sure you play more difficult leaps in other pieces that you play (Liszt, for example).


I would suggest practising it both ways - but playing it your preferred way in your performance. If he pulls you up on it, you can mount your argument respectfully and if you fail to convince him, you'll be able to at least play it the other way without making a mess of it. I would never avoid my own interpretation just to avoid trouble with somebody. I'm happy to alter my approach if the master requests it, but ultimately I am there to have a master critique my style, not my imagination of what he might like. I think that's a dishonest way to approach such a situation.

With anything you do that is controversial or unconventional, be prepared with sound arguments for why you are doing it - both musical and technical, and even historical if possible. If you show the right combination of strength and yielding, you will gain the respect of the master. Of course you should never enter an intense argument with somebody like this - that would not be smart politics in the narrow world of classical music, but you can push it reasonably far as long as you stay on point. Only argue itensely if he questions your parentage!

Top
#1984459 - 11/09/12 02:33 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: fnork]
Peter K. Mose Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/06/12
Posts: 1317
Loc: Toronto, Ontario
Forgive me for asking the obvious, but what is the allure of playing for a jerk? Even if the jerk is Andras Schiff? For example, I have read his published remarks on historically minded performance of Bach, for example, and he comes off as both uneducated and self-righteous. Like pianists of yesteryear.

Why put a guy like that in a teaching situation? What could one possibly gain from a public hour with him, aside from abuse?




Edited by Peter K. Mose (11/09/12 02:34 AM)

Top
#1984473 - 11/09/12 03:34 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: fnork]
Bobpickle Offline

Gold Supporter until July 10  2014


Registered: 05/24/12
Posts: 1383
Loc: Cameron Park, California
I agree with Peter.

On a side note, my teacher told me guitarist Andres Segovia once spat on the ground in disgust over a simple wrong note or minor mistake in a piece a student played for him in a Masterclass setting

Top
#1984474 - 11/09/12 03:41 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: Peter K. Mose]
landorrano Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/26/06
Posts: 2457
Loc: France
Originally Posted By: Peter K. Mose
he comes off as both uneducated and self-righteous.


Really!!!

Originally Posted By: Peter K. Mose


Why put a guy like that in a teaching situation?


I think that these artists are obliged to do masterclasses. I think that the situation is ridiculous: pretty much insulting to the artist, flattering for mediocre students and mediocre music fans. I can understand that an artist detests being in such a situation. And that he takes it out on the "student", well why not!

And then you have some fellow or gal who says "I am going to show him something about the Hammerklavier!"

Top
#1984500 - 11/09/12 06:20 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: Peter K. Mose]
pianoloverus Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 19228
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: Peter K. Mose
Forgive me for asking the obvious, but what is the allure of playing for a jerk? Even if the jerk is Andras Schiff? For example, I have read his published remarks on historically minded performance of Bach, for example, and he comes off as both uneducated and self-righteous. Like pianists of yesteryear.
I don't know what remarks you're referring to, but my impression is that Schiff is generally considered one of the leading performers of Bach's music on the planet. I also think the critical reviews of his performances and recordings have been extremely excellent. He fills major halls playing all Bach programs.


Edited by pianoloverus (11/09/12 06:20 AM)

Top
#1984505 - 11/09/12 06:25 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: ando]
pianoloverus Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 19228
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: ando

I would suggest practising it both ways - but playing it your preferred way in your performance. If he pulls you up on it, you can mount your argument respectfully and if you fail to convince him, you'll be able to at least play it the other way without making a mess of it. I would never avoid my own interpretation just to avoid trouble with somebody. I'm happy to alter my approach if the master requests it, but ultimately I am there to have a master critique my style, not my imagination of what he might like. I think that's a dishonest way to approach such a situation.

With anything you do that is controversial or unconventional, be prepared with sound arguments for why you are doing it - both musical and technical, and even historical if possible. If you show the right combination of strength and yielding, you will gain the respect of the master. Of course you should never enter an intense argument with somebody like this - that would not be smart politics in the narrow world of classical music, but you can push it reasonably far as long as you stay on point. Only argue intensely if he questions your parentage!
I have never been to a master class where the student argued with the teacher. Maybe a one sentence question about something the teacher said. I have gone to at least 150 master classes.


Edited by pianoloverus (11/09/12 06:26 AM)

Top
#1984519 - 11/09/12 07:21 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: pianoloverus]
ando Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/23/10
Posts: 3508
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Originally Posted By: pianoloverus
Originally Posted By: ando

I would suggest practising it both ways - but playing it your preferred way in your performance. If he pulls you up on it, you can mount your argument respectfully and if you fail to convince him, you'll be able to at least play it the other way without making a mess of it. I would never avoid my own interpretation just to avoid trouble with somebody. I'm happy to alter my approach if the master requests it, but ultimately I am there to have a master critique my style, not my imagination of what he might like. I think that's a dishonest way to approach such a situation.

With anything you do that is controversial or unconventional, be prepared with sound arguments for why you are doing it - both musical and technical, and even historical if possible. If you show the right combination of strength and yielding, you will gain the respect of the master. Of course you should never enter an intense argument with somebody like this - that would not be smart politics in the narrow world of classical music, but you can push it reasonably far as long as you stay on point. Only argue intensely if he questions your parentage!
I have never been to a master class where the student argued with the teacher. Maybe a one sentence question about something the teacher said. I have gone to at least 150 master classes.


There's a difference between "arguing" and having reasoned arguments for why you do something. Present arguments is a perfectly reasonable and peaceful thing to do. It just means you are explaining your reasoning for your choices. I have seen tense moments in masterclasses. They are not always obsequious yes sir/no sir affairs. I haven't ever seen a full blown argument, but I have seen disagreements and visibly upset parties on both sides. Not hard to see why when egos and passions run high. If somebody started to really insult me, I would push back, regardless of who they were. Once you have been humiliated there's not much left to lose. I consider it a matter of basic human respect not to belittle somebody. Fortunately I've never been treated that way in such a class, but I have seen people rather roundly rebuked and belittled. It almost always reflects badly on the teacher rather than the student.

Top
#1984526 - 11/09/12 07:51 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: landorrano]
pianoloverus Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 19228
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: landorrano

I think that these artists are obliged to do masterclasses. I think that the situation is ridiculous: pretty much insulting to the artist, flattering for mediocre students and mediocre music fans. I can understand that an artist detests being in such a situation. And that he takes it out on the "student", well why not!
I don't think famous pianists are ever forced to give master classes. They may do so as a favor to whoever's in charge, but if they accept this job they should do it with the best intentions and for the benefit of the student and the audience. I assume they get paid for these classes. The top pianists like Schiff don't teach "mediocre" students in their master classes. The students are always conservatory pianists and for someone like Schiff, I'd guess the best conservatory students.

"Mediocre music fans"?

Top
#1984528 - 11/09/12 07:58 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: fnork]
Ian_G Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/07/10
Posts: 168
Loc: Germany
That Demus clip was disgusting. Made worse by the fact that he was making rather shallow musical points.

There's a great clip on youtube of Rubinstein giving a masterclass on the 1st Ballade. Very old and near-blind, he imparts wonderful things.

Using music to lash out is really unforgivable in my opinion.

Top
#1984529 - 11/09/12 07:59 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: fnork]
Ian_G Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/07/10
Posts: 168
Loc: Germany
(btw, to the OP, I'd play the Bartok Etudes).

Top
#1984530 - 11/09/12 08:01 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: fnork]
bennevis Online   content
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/14/10
Posts: 4838
I've never understood why students would go to a masterclass with someone who has a known reputation for being nasty. No matter how well-known, there are pianists who enjoy massaging their egos by destroying hapless students to an adoring audience (who may have wanted to see blood spilled....). Personally, if I was to go to one such, I'd go armed with lots of sarcastic one-liners to put these egoistical and egotistical pianists back into their place.... grin

This is different from those pianists who are naturally volatile but not mean or obnoxious - I once watched a masterclass on Chopin given by Cristina Ortiz, who, after being unable (after several attempts) to get a student to play with any sort of expression, almost pushed him off his seat to demonstrate what she wanted at the piano - despite never having played the piece (an Etude) herself - which she admitted at the beginning -, and obviously sightreading. It turned out to be a masterclass in sightreading, complete with all expression, though she obviously left out a few notes here and there grin.

Top
#1984531 - 11/09/12 08:02 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: pianoloverus]
landorrano Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/26/06
Posts: 2457
Loc: France
Originally Posted By: pianoloverus
The top pianists like Schiff don't teach "mediocre" students in their master classes.


Oh yes they do. For example:

Originally Posted By: pianoloverus
The students are always conservatory pianists


Originally Posted By: pianoloverus
I assume they get paid for these classes.


"Money makes the world go round ..."

Top
#1984532 - 11/09/12 08:04 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: bennevis]
landorrano Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/26/06
Posts: 2457
Loc: France
Originally Posted By: bennevis
Personally, if I was to go to one such, I'd go armed with lots of sarcastic one-liners to put these egoistical and egotistical pianists back into their place.... grin


So, what is their place?

Egoistical and egotistical!

Top
#1984534 - 11/09/12 08:12 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: Ian_G]
landorrano Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/26/06
Posts: 2457
Loc: France
Originally Posted By: Ian_G
(btw, to the OP, I'd play the Bartok Etudes).


thumb

Or Bach.

A major part of Schiff's baggage is Kurtag (still alive, by the way) who was close to Bartok. There is a Bach lineage there that is simply insuperable.

What an opportunity for you, Fnork. This guy has a lot to say to you, don't go try to show him what you think, go to hear what he thinks. It is a master class: go to the master!

Or don't go.

Top
#1984537 - 11/09/12 08:16 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: landorrano]
bennevis Online   content
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/14/10
Posts: 4838
Originally Posted By: landorrano
Originally Posted By: bennevis
Personally, if I was to go to one such, I'd go armed with lots of sarcastic one-liners to put these egoistical and egotistical pianists back into their place.... grin


So, what is their place?

Egoistical and egotistical!


Back where they belong: a B-list concert pianist who needs to earn extra money by giving masterclasses because they can't get enough concerts and recordings grin.

Top
#1984538 - 11/09/12 08:23 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: bennevis]
landorrano Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/26/06
Posts: 2457
Loc: France
Originally Posted By: bennevis
Originally Posted By: landorrano
Originally Posted By: bennevis
Personally, if I was to go to one such, I'd go armed with lots of sarcastic one-liners to put these egoistical and egotistical pianists back into their place.... grin


So, what is their place?

Egoistical and egotistical!


Back where they belong: a B-list concert pianist who needs to earn extra money by giving masterclasses because they can't get enough concerts and recordings grin.


I'm afraid that it is much more likely you who will end up back in your place!

Top
#1984549 - 11/09/12 09:03 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: bennevis]
pianoloverus Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 19228
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: bennevis
I've never understood why students would go to a masterclass with someone who has a known reputation for being nasty. No matter how well-known, there are pianists who enjoy massaging their egos by destroying hapless students to an adoring audience (who may have wanted to see blood spilled....). Personally, if I was to go to one such, I'd go armed with lots of sarcastic one-liners to put these egoistical and egotistical pianists back into their place.... grin
Students play for very famous pianists to learn something or to put it on their resume. Your idea of sarcastic one liners shows you don't understand the realities of a master class, especially one with a world class pianist.

Top
#1984550 - 11/09/12 09:08 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: landorrano]
pianoloverus Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 19228
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: landorrano
Originally Posted By: pianoloverus
The top pianists like Schiff don't teach "mediocre" students in their master classes.

Oh yes they do. For example:

Originally Posted By: pianoloverus
The students are always conservatory pianists
My example was the opposite of what you said unless you think top conservatory pianists are mediocre or you have a very jaded definiton of mediocre.


Edited by pianoloverus (11/09/12 09:08 AM)

Top
#1984611 - 11/09/12 11:59 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: pianoloverus]
bennevis Online   content
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/14/10
Posts: 4838
Originally Posted By: pianoloverus
Originally Posted By: bennevis
I've never understood why students would go to a masterclass with someone who has a known reputation for being nasty. No matter how well-known, there are pianists who enjoy massaging their egos by destroying hapless students to an adoring audience (who may have wanted to see blood spilled....). Personally, if I was to go to one such, I'd go armed with lots of sarcastic one-liners to put these egoistical and egotistical pianists back into their place.... grin
Students play for very famous pianists to learn something or to put it on their resume. Your idea of sarcastic one liners shows you don't understand the realities of a master class, especially one with a world class pianist.


Nobody has to put up with gratuitous nastiness from anybody, least of all from so-called world class pianists. People will video masterclasses (furtively or otherwise) and put them on Youtube which will be humiliating - indefinitely - for the hapless student being subjected to this sort of thing. And what will happen if that student becomes a concert pianist himself and realises this sort of stuff is going to haunt him for the rest of his career?

Top
#1984653 - 11/09/12 01:19 PM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: bennevis]
BruceD Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 17836
Loc: Victoria, BC
Originally Posted By: bennevis
[...] And what will happen if that student becomes a concert pianist himself and realises this sort of stuff is going to haunt him for the rest of his career?


In the meantime, what happens to the reputation of already established, word-class pianists who can't control their nastiness when giving public master classes. Surely, they begin to attach a negative reputation to themselves which, in instances already expressed here, can have an equally negative effect on some of their public.

Regards,
_________________________
BruceD
- - - - -
Estonia 190

Top
#1984654 - 11/09/12 01:24 PM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: bennevis]
pianoloverus Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 19228
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: bennevis
Originally Posted By: pianoloverus
Originally Posted By: bennevis
I've never understood why students would go to a masterclass with someone who has a known reputation for being nasty. No matter how well-known, there are pianists who enjoy massaging their egos by destroying hapless students to an adoring audience (who may have wanted to see blood spilled....). Personally, if I was to go to one such, I'd go armed with lots of sarcastic one-liners to put these egoistical and egotistical pianists back into their place.... grin
Students play for very famous pianists to learn something or to put it on their resume. Your idea of sarcastic one liners shows you don't understand the realities of a master class, especially one with a world class pianist.


Nobody has to put up with gratuitous nastiness from anybody, least of all from so-called world class pianists. People will video masterclasses (furtively or otherwise) and put them on Youtube which will be humiliating - indefinitely - for the hapless student being subjected to this sort of thing. And what will happen if that student becomes a concert pianist himself and realises this sort of stuff is going to haunt him for the rest of his career?
Yes, but this has little or nothing to do with what I said which was an explanation of why students take master classes with teachers even when they know the teacher has a reputation for nastiness.

Schiff is not a "so-called" world class pianist. He is a world class pianist. The only person coming off looking bad are the teachers, and I'd guess the teachers that act this way couldn't care less. Students are aware if their master class is being video taped and aware that it could appear on YouTube.

You seem to be unaware of master class dynamics and how the real world works here.

Top
#1984661 - 11/09/12 01:48 PM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: pianoloverus]
bennevis Online   content
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/14/10
Posts: 4838
Originally Posted By: pianoloverus
Yes, but this has little or nothing to do with what I said which was an explanation of why students take master classes with teachers even when they know the teacher has a reputation for nastiness.

Schiff is not a "so-called" world class pianist. He is a world class pianist. The only person coming off looking bad are the teachers, and I'd guess the teachers that act this way couldn't care less. Students are aware if their master class is being video taped and aware that it could appear on YouTube.

You seem to be unaware of master class dynamics and how the real world works here.


As to whether Schiff is a world class pianist, that's a matter of opinion. I personally don't think he's in the top rank - here in London, he wouldn't be playing in the Royal Festival Hall along with the likes of Uchida, Pollini, Zimerman, Perahia, Hewitt et al.

I've read many young pianists' résumés which often boast of whose masterclasses they've been on (as if being on a masterclass with a big name pianist means they're good....) along with which competitions they've won. Which is precisely the reason why they need to choose carefully, if they want that fact to help them along their career path - because prospective agents and concert promoters will want to find out what impression they made in those masterclasses. Were they just tails being wagged (or bitten grin) by their owners?

Top
#1984668 - 11/09/12 02:03 PM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: bennevis]
pianoloverus Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 19228
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: bennevis
Originally Posted By: pianoloverus
Yes, but this has little or nothing to do with what I said which was an explanation of why students take master classes with teachers even when they know the teacher has a reputation for nastiness.

Schiff is not a "so-called" world class pianist. He is a world class pianist. The only person coming off looking bad are the teachers, and I'd guess the teachers that act this way couldn't care less. Students are aware if their master class is being video taped and aware that it could appear on YouTube.

You seem to be unaware of master class dynamics and how the real world works here.



I've read many young pianists' resumés which often boast of whose masterclasses they've been on (as if being on a masterclass with a big name pianist means they're good....) along with which competitions they've won. Which is precisely the reason why they need to choose carefully, if they want that fact to help them along their career path.
Which is why you should understand one of the two reasons I gave why young pianists want to or at least are willing to to play for people like Schiff. In order to play for people of this caliber it shows a certain amount of skill. That's why it's on their resume... precisely because it is indicative of something positive.

Top
#1984842 - 11/10/12 12:29 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: pianoloverus]
Opus_Maximus Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/27/04
Posts: 1479
[quote=pianoloverus I'd love to see one of those teachers get yelled back to in public although this will never happen for obvious reasons. out. [/quote]

I actually saw a student yell back at David Dubal during one of his nastier moments in an open class at the Manhattan School of Music. He was screaming at her at the top of his lungs while she was playing, and she slammed down the lid to the keys, got up, and shrieked at him "I can't even HEAR myself with your ranting".

He was quite shocked smile

Top
#1984851 - 11/10/12 12:51 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: Opus_Maximus]
argerichfan Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/15/06
Posts: 8822
Loc: Pacific Northwest, US.
Originally Posted By: Opus_Maximus

He was quite shocked smile

The nerve to question the great David Dubal. Pity, he could have screamed at Argerich for her Liszt sonata, then sit down and play it properly for her. (I must check out Dubal's recording of the Liszt. Anyone have it?)

smokin
_________________________
Jason

Top
#1984882 - 11/10/12 03:42 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: fnork]
Peter K. Mose Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/06/12
Posts: 1317
Loc: Toronto, Ontario
Bless that gal who fought back at David Dubal in public! I would love to have been there to applaud her. She should get a medal. What's her name and where is she now?

But in the bigger picture, it's master classes by their very nature that allow such bad teaching situations. More broadly, I'd say it's the nature of classical music instruction by its very nature that allows such bad teaching situations, though most of this abuse goes on in secret, behind closed doors.

It would be very interesting to interview both Dubal and this young pianist in retrospect about this sorry affair: I am sure there are wounds unhealed.

Top
#1984889 - 11/10/12 04:11 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: pianoloverus]
Peter K. Mose Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/06/12
Posts: 1317
Loc: Toronto, Ontario
In answer to an earlier comment, Schiff has indeed carved out a noted career as a Bach pianist. But his published remarks about playing 18th century music with any allegiance to its history sounded both uneducated and arrogant to me. I believe I have read interviews in Clavier Magazine and the New York Times some years back, but he gets so much press, it might have been elsewhere that I read his comments.

My reaction each time he spouted off about Bach performance was, "Oh, boy, another 19th-century-style, conservatory-trained pianist who should just shut up and play, before he makes things worse."

A guy like this would probably not make a good teacher, including master classes.

Top
#1984895 - 11/10/12 04:35 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: fnork]
Praeludium Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/19/11
Posts: 90
Loc: Besançon, France
Yelling back at a famous musician who is doing a masterclass could have terrible consequences. If he's very influential and nasty, he could make your life very hard as a musician. Isn't it probably why almost nobody do it ? You don't want Andras Schiff as an enemy.
I think it can goes very far - you can be bothered for MUCH less in any conservatory, for instance, where there's always some politics involved. So, "insulting" the great X could be seen as a kind of suicide. But I think it's the right thing to do - it depends on what are your goals as a music student I guess.


Edited by Praeludium (11/10/12 04:37 AM)

Top
#1984900 - 11/10/12 04:47 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: Praeludium]
landorrano Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/26/06
Posts: 2457
Loc: France
Originally Posted By: Praeludium
Yelling back at a famous musician who is doing a masterclass could have terrible consequences. If he's very influential and nasty, he could make your life very hard as a musician. Isn't it probably why almost nobody do it ? You don't want Andras Schiff as an enemy.
I think it can goes very far - you can be bothered for MUCH less in any conservatory, for instance, where there's always some politics involved. So, "insulting" the great X could be seen as a kind of suicide. But I think it's the right thing to do - it depends on what are your goals as a music student I guess.


Je ne crois pas, pas du tout! I really don't think so.

If a student doesn't "yell back" when a teacher is simply being nasty, it's because he has no spine. Too bad for him.

Salut les Franche-Comtois!

Top
#1984901 - 11/10/12 04:51 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: Peter K. Mose]
landorrano Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/26/06
Posts: 2457
Loc: France
Originally Posted By: Peter K. Mose

My reaction each time he spouted off about Bach performance was, "Oh, boy, another 19th-century-style, conservatory-trained pianist who should just shut up and play, before he makes things worse."

A guy like this would probably not make a good teacher, including master classes.



It's great isn't it, the internet, being able to write things like that and with a click send it out into the world wide web.

Top
#1984906 - 11/10/12 05:09 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: landorrano]
JoelW Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/25/12
Posts: 4762
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: landorrano
Originally Posted By: Peter K. Mose

My reaction each time he spouted off about Bach performance was, "Oh, boy, another 19th-century-style, conservatory-trained pianist who should just shut up and play, before he makes things worse."

A guy like this would probably not make a good teacher, including master classes.



It's great isn't it, the internet, being able to write things like that and with a click send it out into the world wide web.


But does that make it wrong?

I don't care how famous and/or knowledgeable someone is. If they don't have the decency to be respectful, especially when providing a masterclass in front of people, then they aren't worth the time of any self-respecting student.

Top
#1984907 - 11/10/12 05:13 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: JoelW]
landorrano Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/26/06
Posts: 2457
Loc: France
Originally Posted By: mazurkajoe
Originally Posted By: landorrano
Originally Posted By: Peter K. Mose

My reaction each time he spouted off about Bach performance was, "Oh, boy, another 19th-century-style, conservatory-trained pianist who should just shut up and play, before he makes things worse."

A guy like this would probably not make a good teacher, including master classes.



It's great isn't it, the internet, being able to write things like that and with a click send it out into the world wide web.


But does that make it wrong?


It is wrong.

Top
#1984908 - 11/10/12 05:19 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: landorrano]
JoelW Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/25/12
Posts: 4762
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: landorrano
Originally Posted By: mazurkajoe
Originally Posted By: landorrano
Originally Posted By: Peter K. Mose

My reaction each time he spouted off about Bach performance was, "Oh, boy, another 19th-century-style, conservatory-trained pianist who should just shut up and play, before he makes things worse."

A guy like this would probably not make a good teacher, including master classes.



It's great isn't it, the internet, being able to write things like that and with a click send it out into the world wide web.


But does that make it wrong?


It is wrong.


Missed my point.

Top
#1984938 - 11/10/12 07:05 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: JoelW]
landorrano Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/26/06
Posts: 2457
Loc: France
Originally Posted By: mazurkajoe


Missed my point.


Gee whiz, how dare you talk to me that way here on the internet! Have the decency to be respectful in front of the whole wide (piano) world!

Top
#1984939 - 11/10/12 07:10 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: landorrano]
JoelW Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/25/12
Posts: 4762
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: landorrano
Originally Posted By: mazurkajoe


Missed my point.


Gee whiz, how dare you talk to me that way here on the internet! Have the decency to be respectful in front of the whole wide (piano) world!



lol

Top
#1984986 - 11/10/12 09:59 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: landorrano]
Praeludium Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/19/11
Posts: 90
Loc: Besançon, France
Originally Posted By: landorrano
Originally Posted By: Praeludium
Yelling back at a famous musician who is doing a masterclass could have terrible consequences. If he's very influential and nasty, he could make your life very hard as a musician. Isn't it probably why almost nobody do it ? You don't want Andras Schiff as an enemy.
I think it can goes very far - you can be bothered for MUCH less in any conservatory, for instance, where there's always some politics involved. So, "insulting" the great X could be seen as a kind of suicide. But I think it's the right thing to do - it depends on what are your goals as a music student I guess.


Je ne crois pas, pas du tout! I really don't think so.

If a student doesn't "yell back" when a teacher is simply being nasty, it's because he has no spine. Too bad for him.

Salut les Franche-Comtois!



Well, from what I've been told, even just not pleasing someone, having studied in an "enemy" school, having a better level, etc. can be quite handicaping.
Some persons are just very influential. And I can only guess how Schiff's influence is like. And on the top of Schiff, there's the whole room looking at you, and you might well get a "bad" reputation for doing somethingof this kind.
Althrough I've not experienced it (in the bad way), I think this is really how it works. Peer pressure, reputation, relations, power, etc. are all things that can influence your studies and your carreer. And I bet a lot of students are willing to play the game - by lack of courage or by what they think of as intelligence, or both.
Just being seen in a masterclass might be worth it for them.

I personally just wouldn't attend a masterclass with a sh*tty teacher even if he's a world-class musician (:

Salut l'Andorran !

Top
#1985003 - 11/10/12 10:47 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: fnork]
Numerian Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 1075
You don't think Andras Schiff reads the internet? I know some of these artists live in another world altogether from everyone else, which might very well be necessary for them to concentrate on their art. Still, artists have to be mindful of what the public thinks of them, and the internet is a great tool for finding out what a select and informed section of the audience believes. The Forum is probably one of the better such sources, so why wouldn't Mr. Schiff be aware of and ready for someone who shows up at his master class to play the first movement of the Hammerklavier sonata?

Top
#1985012 - 11/10/12 11:30 AM Re: What should I play for Andras Schiff? [Re: Numerian]
bennevis Online   content
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/14/10
Posts: 4838
Originally Posted By: Numerian
You don't think Andras Schiff reads the internet? I know some of these artists live in another world altogether from everyone else, which might very well be necessary for them to concentrate on their art. Still, artists have to be mindful of what the public thinks of them, and the internet is a great tool for finding out what a select and informed section of the audience believes. The Forum is probably one of the better such sources, so why wouldn't Mr. Schiff be aware of and ready for someone who shows up at his master class to play the first movement of the Hammerklavier sonata?


The burning question is: will it change his attitude towards his victims (a.k.a. 'students')? grin

Top
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >

Moderator:  Brendan, Kreisler 
What's Hot!!
Our latest Issue is available now...
Piano News - Interesting & Fun Piano Related Newsletter! (free)
-------------------
HOW TO POST PICTURES on the Piano Forums
-------------------
Sharing is Caring!
About the Buttons
-------------------
Forums Rules & Help
-------------------
ADVERTISE
on Piano World

The world's most popular piano web site.
(ad) HAILUN Pianos
Hailun Pianos - Click for More
Ad (Seiler/Knabe)
Knabe Pianos
Sheet Music
(PW is an affiliate)
Sheet Music Plus Featured Sale
(125ad) Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
(ad) Lindeblad Piano
Lindeblad Piano Restoration
Who's Online
65 registered (AndrewJCW, 36251, Baudelaire, barmassimo, bennevis, beeboss, 15 invisible), 1146 Guests and 25 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Stats
75569 Members
42 Forums
156245 Topics
2294643 Posts

Max Online: 15252 @ 03/21/10 11:39 PM
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Gustav Lutz?
by MartaG
22 minutes 43 seconds ago
Can anyone help me identify Bach's music in this soundtrack?
by WellTemperedPizza
Today at 05:30 AM
Will a Damp-Chaser fill in the cracks in a sound-board?
by Paul678
Today at 12:36 AM
The Mason & Hamlin Tension Resonator: Help or Hype???
by Paul678
Today at 12:06 AM
What piano do i have?
by allana
Yesterday at 11:43 PM
(ads by Google)

Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World | Donate | Link to Us | Classifieds |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter | Press Room |


copyright 1997 - 2014 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission