Piano World Home Page Forums Our Most Popular Forums Pianist Corner What should I play for Andras Schiff?

So, Andras Schiff is coming to town around mid-december not only to play the complete Bartok concerti in two concerts (plus one Bach), but he'll be giving a masterclass to three of the students of the academy as well. Naturally, I signed up for it right away, suggesting to play Hammerklavier - or rather, parts of it, as we get an hour each. The decision on who gets to play for him will be made next week. Would it be wiser to play something else, however, in a situation like this? Does anyone have experience with his masterclasses? The repertoire suggested was very expected - Baroque, classical, the romantics minus the russians and Liszt, and Bartok in addition to that. Of the latter, I've played the 3rd concerto, the etudes, the sonata....and as a matter of fact, the 2nd concerto was a planned "next project" for me - but would one dare putting that into a masterclass program one month ahead, even if it would just be one movement of the piece? Time to start thinking.

I cannot suggest what to play but I can warn you to be prepared for some sarcastic or highly critical remarks. I have seen at least one of his master classes at Mannes in NYC, and he was one of three most unpleasant ones of the 150+ classes I've seen. So much so that for a while, I could not separate those classes from his playing which I generally find sensationally good.

I'd guess that anyone ready to play for Schiff has already has some experience with difficult master class teachers or at least knows this is always a possibility.

As for expecting to hear critical/negative remarks, I can perhaps imagine him being that way, but then, I don't know how the pianists at Mannes were prepared. Perhaps not well enough? As for Hammerklavier, in case I'd be doing the first movement I am absolutely sure he'd make a huge deal out of that I normally play the opening jump with two hands - something he considers "disgusting" (he says so in his lectures on the complete sonatas - the one on Hammerklavier is overall very interesting). If I'd get to play for him, though, perhaps I'd focus on the 2nd and 3rd movements instead.

unlpeasant in what way, by the way? I've been fortunate not to have that many nasty masterclass experiences - I just never really understood the approach some seem to have where the student is ripped to pieces or laughed at. I spoke about this with Jerome Lowenthal this summer and he felt the same way.

If one is afraid of hearing the true assessment of the person who gave the master class, one should not join the master class. I'd rather know the honest opinion, I do not need to do what I was told. But, at least, we are aware what other think about our playing.

If you do not want other to hear, you should just take a private piano lesson.

When you play those first chords with separate hands, are you making sure to still have there be an impression of a bold leap?

If you're not and if he makes hay with it, it won't be just because of 'cheating,' but because of missing a musical point.

If you don't miss the musical point and he still makes hay with it, you can have a lively debate over it with him.

I think that things like this are too often argued as though the only issue is whether it's cheating and how one feels about cheating, and ignoring musical points.

I believe Horowitz was so harsh he made his students cry.

He sounds like a snob.

That's exactly what I believe the argument would end up becoming, in this case. I do try to "make the impression" of a bold leap with one hand - but it simply is safer to play it with two. I agree that the upbeat can be somewhat broad to give this impression, and that the bass must be strong - however, changing the upbeat from an 8th-note to almost a quarter-note (as is the case when Schiff plays it) is to my mind not an ideal solution. Especially not for a composer that thinks so motivically as Beethoven, and this figure (and the upbeat gesture in particular) plays such a substantial role for the entire movement (and, one may argue, the entire piece) that I'd say it's a rather serious violation to distort the rhythm as much as some "one-hand"-pianists do. Jerome Lowenthal argued differently in my masterclass with him, posted here a while ago, but I am not yet convinced.

Why not just play the leap with one hand for the masterclass to avoid having this argument? While it's definitely a risk, especially since you're not used to it, I think that someone of your abilities can do it without distorting the rhythm too much (turning the eighth into a quarter).

I'm sure you play more difficult leaps in other pieces that you play (Liszt, for example).

My teacher had several lessons with Horowitz in his home. He said the man and his wife were welcoming and courteous to the extreme.

I too have heard the Schiff can be quite cruel during master classes. I don't remember the source but it was probably here at PW.

That's not unique to Horowitz, nor to piano/music teachers.

-Daniel

There are a handful of mater class teachers who are unfotunately quite well known for their nasty master classes which I have dubbed NASTER classes. IMO there is absolutely no excuse for that kind of public(or perhaps even in private)kind of nastiness, and I'd love to see one of those teachers get yelled back to in public although this will never happen for obvious reasons. I even thought of saying something from the audience during one of those classes but I chickened out.

Never heard or read anything like that and I have read several Horowitz bios.

A private lesson can also be cruel or humiliating for the student, but I think most would at least rather hear those kinds of comments in a private lesson.

I don't think you understand that one can make the exact same criticism in different kinds of tones. The good teachers get the same result without being ridiculously mean and humiliating to the student in a public forum. Perhaps you have never seen a master class where the teacher is very cruel and humiliating to the student?

I agree with you, a teacher does not need to be nasty to convey the thought. But the student also does not need to go to the nasty teachers. Two months ago, I fired my teacher when he started getting unpleasant. There are many teachers who are very good and pleasant. Again, my point is that we do not need to put ourselves in that situation, we have a choice.

Play Vers la Flamme - that ought to get his attention...

You're in Finland, right? Play something by Melartin! Melancholy Garden, Noli me tangere, On High, or something else Finnish!

That's a completely different point. And I don't think it in any way justifies nastiness on the part of the mater class teacher.

It really shouldn't have to be a choice between not going a to master class or having to be humiliated.

Never read or heard anything to that effect either.