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#1988855 - 11/20/12 08:30 AM Kurzweil PC2R vs Yamaha Motif Rack ES / XS
keyboardologist Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 09/23/12
Posts: 12
Loc: Athens, Greece
Hello,
I've been reading a lot here and I really need a "fast" advice/opinion!

I play all-around music (rock, pop, jazz, world, ethnic etc) and I do professional album/studio recordings and lives. I have a Numa Nano as a controller and my main rack synth ROMpler is a Roland XV5080 (almost full expanded with 4x SRX, 3x SR-JV80, SCSI cdrom and hdd for sample playback, full RAM and Smartmedia).

I've been looking for a hardware upgrade, most of to my realistic sounds library, I believe I need more modern sounds.
I will not give away my XV5080, cause I have good pads/some special e-pianos/strings/guitars/basses/effects that I really like, so I will keep it as a second synth.

So, if money isn't really an issue since prices for used rack synths aren't too different... what would you suggest as my main all-around synth rack?
I've been reeding a lot about Kurzweil PC2R and Yamaha Motif ES or XS, or any other suggestion, because I don't have the ability to test any by myself!
General thoughts? Alternatives?

P.S.
1. I would prefer an 1U rack
2. Although Nord Electro 2 rack option has excellent rhodes/hammonds, I couldn't use it as an all-around without the Roland.
3. I admire kurzweil piano patches and Yamahas motif classic '03 e-pianos (wurlies/cp/fm) but what about Rhodes? Hammond? Orchestral or World sounds?

Thank you!
_________________________
My Home Studio Gear: Young Chang E121, Kawai ES100, Yamaha MX49, Yamaha Reface DX, Roland D70, Roland XP30, Roland XV5080, Kurzweil PC2R, Emu Xboard, Studiologic SL161, RME Fireface UC, Tascam VL-X5.

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#1988885 - 11/20/12 09:55 AM Re: Kurzweil PC2R vs Yamaha Motif Rack ES / XS [Re: keyboardologist]
anotherscott Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/20/10
Posts: 3929
Originally Posted By: keyboardologist

3. I admire kurzweil piano patches and Yamahas motif classic '03 e-pianos (wurlies/cp/fm) but what about Rhodes? Hammond? Orchestral or World sounds?

If the PC2R has the Classic Keys ROM, I like its Rhodes (and Wurli) better than any Motif racks, but I'm not sure about the stock PC2R EPs, I never tried them, because the only PC2R I used had the CK ROM in it. Though I've read that, in the case of Rhodes, the CK only had new programs, not new samples (i.e. it used the stock samples) so they may not be TOO different.

For acoustic piano, personally, I would take the Kurz over the original Motif rack, but not the XS,

For Hammond, the PC2R gives you full clonewheel drawbar functionality, the Motif racks basically give you presets, though there are some pretty usable presets, especially in third-party add-on libraries like B's Knees. A Ventilator pedal would probably greatly help either one.

The PC2R orchestral sounds are strong if it has the Orchestral ROM in it. Many of them were shipped that way, so it's easier to find models with that than with the CK ROM... though I think the Rack XS is strong orchestrally as well.


Edited by anotherscott (11/20/12 09:57 AM)

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#1988945 - 11/20/12 12:37 PM Re: Kurzweil PC2R vs Yamaha Motif Rack ES / XS [Re: keyboardologist]
LesCharles73 Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/24/07
Posts: 744
Loc: Denton Texas
I concur with the above.

Regarding orchestral sounds (which I do the most with), I have found the Kurzweil strings to be very rich and lush when compared to that of Yamaha and others, which sound colder and thinner in my opinion. I owned an S90 a while back and while the strings were very realistic, they were also very "what you see is what you get" in terms of 'you wanted strings, so here's strings'.
Many of Kurzweil's strings are actually multi-layered samples of strings, flutes, brass etc which adds a lot of "texture" to the sound.

I also agree that you may need to be sure and have the Orchestral Rom for those sounds. I'm used to the K-series which have multiple orchestral presets built-in, but I'm not sure if the PC2 had as many stock. My PC88 only had a few select presets from the K-series, but the PC2 may have more of an offering.

You may be hit or miss in the arena of modern presets with Kurzweil, but my experience with that is limited.
_________________________
Les C Deal





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#1989004 - 11/20/12 04:10 PM Re: Kurzweil PC2R vs Yamaha Motif Rack ES / XS [Re: keyboardologist]
JFP Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/19/10
Posts: 1374
Loc: The Netherlands
I would wait for NAMM. New Kurzweil products. What if they also have a rack expander in development ? The PC2R is really quite old by todays standards (with all respect), I personally wouldn't invest in that anymore. For the short term, if your in a hurry , the Roland Integra7 might be interesting ??

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#1989729 - 11/22/12 10:36 AM Re: Kurzweil PC2R vs Yamaha Motif Rack ES / XS [Re: keyboardologist]
keyboardologist Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 09/23/12
Posts: 12
Loc: Athens, Greece
Hello and thanks everyone!

The price of the used pc2r (with orchestral rom installed) was good so I decided to give it a try, I bought it for 300euro and in case I regret this in the future I will not lose much money.

I know I will have to "sacrifice" some more time in searching, reading, configuring, programming and controlling a new rack synth (I've never had any kurzweil gear in the past).
I will try to get some experience through it because as I had the opportunity to hear and test some presets for about two hours before buying, I found some good sounds(sources) and features that my XV5080 hasn't and good functionality for all-around use in studio, live and mixed music genres.
The motif rack classic doesn't enchants me at all (I have a close friend so I had borrowed this in the past) although it has some excellent particular presets I love, that's why I asked for ES or XS.

anotherscott, unfortunately classic keys are not installed, so I will first give some time to myself (before buying the classic keys rom) to examine some fair good EPs and see how far from the preset can I go. I've listened some good demo samples of the CK on the kurzweil website, some good rhodes and CP80 I really like. I think that the KB3 is not excellent but it stands good in the mix, are you sure if the vintage keys have only KB3 presets or if they add more hammond source files???

LesCharles73, orchestral sounds and some sessions are really good, as well as some pads so the orchestral rom is a good plus!

JFP, Roland Integra7 is completely out of my budget and I think that it will overlap the XV5080 in the magority of the sounds/uses. I know that selling the XV5080 would be an option but as long as I will have to pay more cash, I'm not ready yet. New gears loses its value really fast, I can wait for 2 or 3 years and upgrade my gear with just a small amount of cash.

The only alternative option I found was a used motif ES or XS, but I don't have the ability to test them anywhere by myself, that's why I asked for your opinions.

Overall I think I've made a good choice, I've upgraded my orchestral sounds, I have some good Pianos and a good all-around machine. A very big plus for the pc2r is it's small size (really sh╬┐rt in depth) and very lightweight because power adapter is external, so I may transported in a medium bag, even without a rack instead of my big and heavy 2U XV5080 that I can't fit or carry it easily!

I've started reading the manual, it's quite good (really better than yamaha's or roland's), any suggestions from where to start for the eps, clavs and rhodes tweeking???

P.S. How can I enable (through forum's settings) email notifications on new replies in topic I create or after posting something?
_________________________
My Home Studio Gear: Young Chang E121, Kawai ES100, Yamaha MX49, Yamaha Reface DX, Roland D70, Roland XP30, Roland XV5080, Kurzweil PC2R, Emu Xboard, Studiologic SL161, RME Fireface UC, Tascam VL-X5.

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#1989764 - 11/22/12 12:27 PM Re: Kurzweil PC2R vs Yamaha Motif Rack ES / XS [Re: keyboardologist]
anotherscott Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/20/10
Posts: 3929
Originally Posted By: keyboardologist
I think that the KB3 is not excellent but it stands good in the mix, are you sure if the vintage keys have only KB3 presets or if they add more hammond source files???

There is no change to the KB3 engine when you add the Classic Keys ROM, but there are a few new KB3 presets on it.

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