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#1995407 - 12/06/12 11:16 AM Is diet underestimated
DAVE_250 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/30/09
Posts: 23
I am starting to finally realize that diet is essential to learning this instrument. I am wondering if there are others out there who have found out that the cornerstone to playing well is through nutrition and exercise. Foods that strengthen proprioception, motor skills, processing and memory will give a student or professional an added advantage over others.

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#1995410 - 12/06/12 11:29 AM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: DAVE_250]
Piano*Dad Offline
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Registered: 04/12/05
Posts: 10349
Loc: Williamsburg, VA
Proprioception. I learned a new word today!

Now I have to mess with somebody's head by using it ... grin
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#1995411 - 12/06/12 11:30 AM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: DAVE_250]
pianoloverus Online   content
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Registered: 05/29/01
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Loc: New York City
I think good health improves virtually every aspect of life but I doubt there is a diet that is specifically beneficial to piano playing but wouldn't also be just as beneficial for everything else .

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#1995413 - 12/06/12 11:33 AM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: DAVE_250]
debrucey Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/18/06
Posts: 2600
Loc: Manchester, UK
I can't concentrate or be alert/comfortable enough to practice many hours a day without eating properly. You don't have to be a complete health nut, just eat generally nutritious food at regular times each day and go for a walk from time to time.

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#1995418 - 12/06/12 11:50 AM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: DAVE_250]
BruceD Offline
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Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 17837
Loc: Victoria, BC
"Underestimated" by whom? I have observed over several years that there is a continuous trend in society in general towards being more conscientious about maintaining a well-balanced diet along with a sensible exercise/activity program.

I strongly doubt, however, that there is any diet that would be considered "musician-specific." As in all things, common sense and moderation should be the guiding factors in all activities and life-style choices. [1]

[1]
Click to reveal..
A rather bland generalization, I admit, but true, I believe!


Regards,
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#1995420 - 12/06/12 11:54 AM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: DAVE_250]
DAVE_250 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/30/09
Posts: 23

The thing is, eating well for a healthy lifestyle and eating to strengthen the mind to make playing the piano easier are not always a match. For instance,
meal plan 1:
Breakfast: whole wheat bread with peanut butter, glass of milk, orange.
Lunch: yogurt with banana and mango, peppermint tea
snack: raisins, nut and seed mix
Dinner: Pork chop, steamed cauliflower, baked potatoes, glass of red wine; pumpkin pie.
Extra supplement. daily vitamin

Meal plan 2:
Breakfast: Oatmeal with blueberries, cinnamon , vanilla and honey; Decaf coffee.
Lunch: Omega 3 egg sandwich with whole wheat bread,carrots and spinach; green tea.
snack: walnuts, sunflower seeds with fresh strawberries; glass of almond milk.
Dinner: salmon with almonds, broccoli, whole grain brown rice; Jasmine tea with 80% dark chocolate.
Extras: b complex vitamin(25mg), zinc supplement,omega 3 supplement, cranberry supplement, vitamin D. Sage leaf before bed.

Meal plan 3:
Breakfast: Honeynut cherrios with milk and banana; two coffees
Lunch: kraft dinner , diet soda
snack: cookies,chocolate raisins, sport drink
Dinner: T-bone steak , mashed potatoes, and canned cream corn; ice cream , 2 glasses white wine.

So there's three meal plans. The first one is healthy and will help a bit, but there are no real mind building foods in the list. The second meal plan if full of mind strengthening foods, the brains supper foods. I make sure I eat the foods in Meal plan two, 2-4 times a week, and I really notice a huge difference in my playing, HUGE!!!. Meal plan three, in my own personal experience, has created learning and memory problems and helped create injuries and pain while playing. Now, playing is pain and injury free, and learning is easy.
Google the foods in meal plan three along with tag words: research,prevention, university, cancer, alzheimer's, dementia, memory,diabetes. You will notice a positive pattern.
Then google the foods in meal plan three along with the words sugar, processed food, alcohol and hearing loss to the tag list and you will find they are linked to the cause of the above mention diseases.

Foods that help with ________

motor skill and proprioception sense: strawberries, cranberries
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rkUir-ne7tg

Stage fright and perspiration:
sage, raw garlic
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2003/09/030901091846.htm
http://www.prevention.com/term/new-herb-ease-anxiety
http://www.wisegeek.com/what-are-the-best-tips-for-controlling-cortisol.htm

memory: salmon, walnuts, strawberries
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/03/110327191040.htm
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/11/071106122843.htm
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2012/03/120307145825.htm
Foods that slow us down(mentally), improve sight reading, help focus:
cranberries, strawberries; Flaxseed and almond milk drink.

Prevent hearing loss:
carrots,zinc supplement, Ginkgo Biloba

Love of playing: 80% dark Chocolate

Muscle joint strength: Brazil nuts(one a day is all you need), raw garlic, spinach, zinc, strawberries(yah, strawberries are a musicians super food), vitamin D.


Fewer mistakes: strawberries, exercise, cranberries, ginkgo

thats it
Disclaimer, I am a guy on the internet, not your Dr. . Do some research into the foods above -pro's and cons before taking them.Don't overdose.


Edited by DAVE_250 (12/07/12 12:45 PM)

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#1995422 - 12/06/12 11:59 AM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: Piano*Dad]
ju5t1n-h Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/13/12
Posts: 179
Loc: Vancouver, British Columbia
Originally Posted By: Piano*Dad
Proprioception. I learned a new word today!

Now I have to mess with somebody's head by using it ... grin



haha same for me!
_________________________
Essex EUP-123S


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#1995446 - 12/06/12 12:54 PM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: DAVE_250]
Piano*Dad Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/12/05
Posts: 10349
Loc: Williamsburg, VA
Is it possible to overdose on dark chocolate ...
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#1995455 - 12/06/12 01:07 PM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: DAVE_250]
Dave Horne Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/07/04
Posts: 5276
Loc: Vught, The Netherlands
Will this diet make my playing more organic?
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#1995456 - 12/06/12 01:11 PM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: DAVE_250]
MarkH Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/16/08
Posts: 853
Loc: Seattle, WA
I'm not a nutritionist, but based on my understanding of what data I've read along these lines, I think you're dramatically overstating the scientific evidence for the impact that particular food items have on very specific and often difficult to test physiologic and psychological processes. That being said, your ideal meal is certainly quite healthy, and if you feel that it makes you play much better, then more power to you smile
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#1995457 - 12/06/12 01:11 PM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: DAVE_250]
debrucey Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/18/06
Posts: 2600
Loc: Manchester, UK
A continuous trend in society in general certainly, but I think it's fair to say that the high stress lifestyle of a musician can often, if one is not careful, lead to the neglect of one's personal health.


Edited by debrucey (12/06/12 01:12 PM)

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#1995459 - 12/06/12 01:15 PM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: MarkH]
BruceD Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 17837
Loc: Victoria, BC
Originally Posted By: MarkH
[...] if you feel that it [diet] makes you play much better, then more power to you smile


Along with a reasonable diet, the realization may largely be in the perception.

Regards,
_________________________
BruceD
- - - - -
Estonia 190

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#1995469 - 12/06/12 01:31 PM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: DAVE_250]
gooddog Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/08/08
Posts: 4784
Loc: Seattle area, WA
Originally Posted By: DAVE_250

The thing is, eating well for a healthy lifestyle and eating to strengthen the mind to make playing the violin easier are not always a match. For instance...
If I ate that much food I'd wouldn't fit through a doorway! Eating well is simple: eat fresh, eat as many raw fruits and vegetables as you can, eat colorfully, avoid refined and processed foods, cook from scratch. And in my case, don't exceed 1200 calories a day to maintain weight. (Yeah, really.)
_________________________
Best regards,

Deborah

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#1995476 - 12/06/12 01:48 PM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: DAVE_250]
debrucey Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/18/06
Posts: 2600
Loc: Manchester, UK
Yikes. 2000 a day is the recommended average for women.

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#1995479 - 12/06/12 01:54 PM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: MarkH]
pianoloverus Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 19228
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: MarkH
I'm not a nutritionist, but based on my understanding of what data I've read along these lines, I think you're dramatically overstating the scientific evidence for the impact that particular food items have on very specific and often difficult to test physiologic and psychological processes.
Exactly. Also I don't see why brain health is the key area of health for piano playing in the sense that it is more important than any other area of health. Finally, brain power is so basic for so many endeavors that even if brain health were the most critical area that hardly makes the suggested diet a "piano" diet.


Edited by pianoloverus (12/06/12 02:26 PM)

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#1995482 - 12/06/12 02:00 PM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: DAVE_250]
debrucey Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/18/06
Posts: 2600
Loc: Manchester, UK
There is a lot of quackery in this arena.

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#1995487 - 12/06/12 02:09 PM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: DAVE_250]
Dave Horne Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/07/04
Posts: 5276
Loc: Vught, The Netherlands
A dietician is a protected vocation, a nutritionist is not.

... which reminds me of this ... smile

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#1995504 - 12/06/12 02:38 PM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: DAVE_250]
Diane... Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/16/06
Posts: 3443
Loc: Western Canada
Drink WATER!

Your body is 70% water. So why do people drink coffee, coke, tea, specialty coffees, energy drinks, and they never drink water. So no vitamins will get to your body without water.

Also, 8 glasses a day will give you a better good nights sleep too. And if you drink water, you will sleep at night!

Water. Pure and "simple" . . . grin
_________________________
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Jazz/Blues/Rock/Boogie Piano Teacher


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#1995516 - 12/06/12 03:30 PM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: Diane...]
BruceD Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 17837
Loc: Victoria, BC
Originally Posted By: Diane...
Drink WATER!

Your body is 70% water. So why do people drink coffee, coke, tea, specialty coffees, energy drinks, and they never drink water. So no vitamins will get to your body without water.

Also, 8 glasses a day will give you a better good nights sleep too. And if you drink water, you will sleep at night!

Water. Pure and "simple" . . . grin



That "myth" about drinking eight glasses of water a day has long since been debunked!
_________________________
BruceD
- - - - -
Estonia 190

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#1995536 - 12/06/12 04:17 PM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: DAVE_250]
Dave Horne Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/07/04
Posts: 5276
Loc: Vught, The Netherlands
As long as we're debunking things, I've switched to a low carb\high fat diet and my blood chemistry has improved. I eat as much meat, fish, or chicken as I want cooked in lots of butter or oil ... and my blood chemistry is stellar.

We were given a lot of bad nutritional information back in the 1970's with the lipid hypothesis of coronary heart disease.

My breakfast today was sliced chicken breast with blue cheese and zucchini baked in lots of butter. (I should add that by following this low carb\high fat diet I've managed to lose about 25 pounds\11 kg ... and I'm never hungry.) smile
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#1995539 - 12/06/12 04:25 PM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: BruceD]
Vid Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/12/01
Posts: 808
Loc: Vancouver, B.C.
Originally Posted By: BruceD

That "myth" about drinking eight glasses of water a day has long since been debunked!


Drink when you're thirsty your body will let you know.
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Kawai VPC1, Pianoteq, Galaxy Vintage D

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#1995543 - 12/06/12 04:36 PM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: BruceD]
Diane... Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/16/06
Posts: 3443
Loc: Western Canada
Originally Posted By: BruceD
Originally Posted By: Diane...
Drink WATER!

Your body is 70% water. So why do people drink coffee, coke, tea, specialty coffees, energy drinks, and they never drink water. So no vitamins will get to your body without water.

Also, 8 glasses a day will give you a better good nights sleep too. And if you drink water, you will sleep at night!

Water. Pure and "simple" . . . grin



That "myth" about drinking eight glasses of water a day has long since been debunked!

Geesh Bruce!
You probably think that a person doesn't need OXYGEN either!!!

Anyways, I read that as you get older your body looses its' desire for water, and it needs it but doesn't signal you until it's too late.

Drinking water has so many benefits. But do whatever you like, it's your body and I think dry up their brains for lack of water.

I drink way more than 8 glasses a day. I feel and sleep much better.

No need to comment . . . Bruce! grin
_________________________
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Diane
Jazz/Blues/Rock/Boogie Piano Teacher


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#1995556 - 12/06/12 04:57 PM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: DAVE_250]
debrucey Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/18/06
Posts: 2600
Loc: Manchester, UK
Coffee, coke, tea and energy drinks all contain quite a lot of water.

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#1995561 - 12/06/12 05:09 PM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: DAVE_250]
woodog Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/21/12
Posts: 377
Loc: Bowling Green, KY
I suppose my mid-20s diet of reefer, alcohol, acid and tobacco is out the window then!

I certainly FELT more creative then. :-)

Forrest
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Beethoven Op. 78
Bach WTC 1, C# Major (#3)

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#1995581 - 12/06/12 05:52 PM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: debrucey]
gooddog Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/08/08
Posts: 4784
Loc: Seattle area, WA
Originally Posted By: debrucey
There is a lot of quackery in this arena.
Yeah. That's why I can only eat 1200 calories a day; I'm really a duck. laugh
_________________________
Best regards,

Deborah

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#1995614 - 12/06/12 07:05 PM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: Dave Horne]
ando Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/23/10
Posts: 3509
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Originally Posted By: Dave Horne
As long as we're debunking things, I've switched to a low carb\high fat diet and my blood chemistry has improved. I eat as much meat, fish, or chicken as I want cooked in lots of butter or oil ... and my blood chemistry is stellar.

We were given a lot of bad nutritional information back in the 1970's with the lipid hypothesis of coronary heart disease.

My breakfast today was sliced chicken breast with blue cheese and zucchini baked in lots of butter. (I should add that by following this low carb\high fat diet I've managed to lose about 25 pounds\11 kg ... and I'm never hungry.) smile


You're on to something there Dave, but I would be cutting back on the butter. Butter, and cooking in butter is high in Trans-fats. You don't want those. Blood chemistry testing will not reveal this. Transfats are linked to all sorts of damaging processes in the body. You should stick with the more robust oils - especially olive oil. Even then, you should keep cooking times down to a minimum because any oil will start to produce transfats if it's boiling for long enough.

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#1995616 - 12/06/12 07:06 PM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: gooddog]
ando Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/23/10
Posts: 3509
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Originally Posted By: gooddog
Originally Posted By: debrucey
There is a lot of quackery in this arena.
Yeah. That's why I can only eat 1200 calories a day; I'm really a duck. laugh


I'm assuming that's mostly in insect and pellet form?

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#1995623 - 12/06/12 07:26 PM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: ando]
Dave Horne Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/07/04
Posts: 5276
Loc: Vught, The Netherlands
Originally Posted By: ando
Originally Posted By: Dave Horne
As long as we're debunking things, I've switched to a low carb\high fat diet and my blood chemistry has improved. I eat as much meat, fish, or chicken as I want cooked in lots of butter or oil ... and my blood chemistry is stellar.

We were given a lot of bad nutritional information back in the 1970's with the lipid hypothesis of coronary heart disease.

My breakfast today was sliced chicken breast with blue cheese and zucchini baked in lots of butter. (I should add that by following this low carb\high fat diet I've managed to lose about 25 pounds\11 kg ... and I'm never hungry.) smile


You're on to something there Dave, but I would be cutting back on the butter. Butter, and cooking in butter is high in Trans-fats. You don't want those. Blood chemistry testing will not reveal this. Transfats are linked to all sorts of damaging processes in the body. You should stick with the more robust oils - especially olive oil. Even then, you should keep cooking times down to a minimum because any oil will start to produce transfats if it's boiling for long enough.


I also use lots of olive oil ... and I keep the cooking times and temperature to a minimum whether it's butter or olive oil.

(As long as we're off topic here ... if anyone's interested, do a YouTube search for the Oiling of America ... for just one talk to view. )
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#1995697 - 12/06/12 11:41 PM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: DAVE_250]
Nikolas Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/26/07
Posts: 5221
Loc: Europe
My diet consists mainly on fat, meat and carb (spagheti, pizzas and the such). Oh... and lots of sugar too.

It's not recomended to anyone who actually wants to lose weight or at least keep his figure in a shape that doesn't resemble the pirelli man
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#1995712 - 12/07/12 12:27 AM Re: Is diet underestimated [Re: DAVE_250]
Diane... Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/16/06
Posts: 3443
Loc: Western Canada
If I went to Africa and saw this . . . I'd want my money back!

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Diane
Jazz/Blues/Rock/Boogie Piano Teacher


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