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I've seen this question posed, but I've never seen an answer. Does anyone know when Steinway changed from Adirondack spruce to Sitka spruce for soundboards?
Anne'sson
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If you cannot hear the difference, why would it matter to you?
Semipro Tech
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Anne'sson
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You might contact S&S-NY directly. They are always very helpful.
Marty in Minnesota
It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.
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I would presume that once other makers became interested in west coast timber most followed suit. I would think it has been in the last fifty-sixty years…since the early sixties or seventies…
Maybe earlier if the Adirondack supply became unreliable because of overcutting. Really doesn’t matter just play and be happy the piano has soundboard worth vibrating…..
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I think they got their lumber from N. Hudson Woodcraft. Here's some interesting lore on their site. http://www.northhudsonwoodcraft.com/aboutus.htm(NH Woodcraft is where I got my soundboard wood back in the '70s and '80s)
Last edited by kpembrook; 01/01/13 07:29 PM.
Keith Akins, RPT
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Same here. it was the late John Ford that turned me onto N. Hudson.
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David Kirkland is probably the best person to ask at Steinway. He's very knowledgeable about Steinway history. DKirkland@steinway.com
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Thanks for all the leads! Yes, I am happy with the sound of my piano--it's really amazing for a small grand from 1939. It would sound good no matter what it's made of. But I am interested in everything connected with its history.
Anne'sson
El Paso, TX
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Steinway can supply the history as far as year of manufacture, delivery date, original owner, and style and original finish. The only thing you need is the SN. The charge is $25.00 and you receive a very nice presentation. As a Steinway owner, you are entitled to receive a free subscription to the S&S Magazine.
One of the perks of owning the best.
(I'll duck and cover, now!)
Marty in Minnesota
It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.
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Thanks, Marty. I already got the information re date of manufacture etc. from Panni Talmadge. My mother was the original owner.
Anne'sson
El Paso, TX
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1896 Grand Piano Chickering and Sons 110b Should i replace the original soundboard, it has lost its crown an is NOT SINGING very well. If i just repaint the harp repair the board and redo the action, This piano will still not sound very good correct???
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1896 Grand Piano Chickering and Sons 110b Should i replace the original soundboard, it has lost its crown an is NOT SINGING very well. If i just repaint the harp repair the board and redo the action, This piano will still not sound very good correct??? What does this have to do with the topic of this thread? How about posting a new topic?
Keith Akins, RPT
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According to the book "Piano: The Making of a Steinway Concert Grand" by James Barron," p. 79, Steinway made their soundboards of eastern white spruce until the 1920s.
phacke
Steinway YM (1933)
...Working on:
J. S. Bach, Toccata (G minor) BWV 915
(and trying not to forget the other stuff I know)
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Anne'sson
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I would presume that once other makers became interested in west coast timber most followed suit. I would think it has been in the last fifty-sixty years…since the early sixties or seventies…
Maybe earlier if the Adirondack supply became unreliable because of overcutting. Really doesn’t matter just play and be happy the piano has soundboard worth vibrating…..
This is anyway an interesting question, and eventually can be related to some tone characteristics we hear, but this is about soundboards that are now very old. I discovered that most of the decisions taken was often because of the nonavailability of the part or material, of course looking for the better is part of the building process but if this implies more than minor problems the test is stopped soon. Could be that the tree went ill, that the cost was too high, that the Sitka was prooved to be really better. The dates should be of some interest anyway...
Last edited by Kamin; 01/02/13 01:01 PM.
Professional of the profession.
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I wish to add some kind and sensitive phrase but nothing comes to mind.!
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Marty, you were right that Steinway is very helpful. And Ryan, David Kirkland did get right back to me. According to David, they don't have an answer "at their fingertips" but "probably" the answer is at the end of WW2 because Adirondack spruce was used for gliders in the war. Steinway of course was one of the companies making those gliders.
So putting together the statement from Barron's book and the communication from David Kirkland, the question is still unresolved. It seems possible to me that Steinway could have been using both eastern spruce and western spruce up until WW 2-- possibly the bellyman picked whatever looked good and sounded good for individual instruments.
Anne'sson
El Paso, TX
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I would presume that once other makers became interested in west coast timber most followed suit. I would think it has been in the last fifty-sixty years…since the early sixties or seventies…
Maybe earlier if the Adirondack supply became unreliable because of overcutting. Really doesn’t matter just play and be happy the piano has soundboard worth vibrating….. In all probability, earlier. When the meetings of piano makers were being held that resulted in the book Piano Tone Building—i.e., from 1916 to 1919—there was already pressure on both the Adirondack (red) spruce and the Eastern (white) spruce forests. Attitudes among these men varied but in general they were of the opinion that, like ivory (there are plenty of elephants in Africa and India, just kill more of them), there were still adequate supplies of spruce (there are plenty of trees around, just cut more of them). Estimates varied but in general they looked forward to at least “two generations†worth of trees remaining. There was no discussion about doing anything to ensure a steady supply of trees for the future; that was a task for “governments.†Posey Manufacturing of Hoquiam, Washington started supplying both Sitka spruce lumber and glued-up soundboard panels to the industry in 1909 or 1910. By the 1920s it was a large and thriving manufacturing company so it must have been supplying lumber and/or soundboard panels to quite a few different pianomakers. ddf
Delwin D Fandrich
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Stupidity is a rare condition, ignorance is a common choice. --Anon
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I tune pianos in and around Dolgeville, New York, as that is part of my service area. I live about 30 minutes from Dolgeville. It's a beautiful area!
Anyway...this is purely anecdotal, but I'll still tell it. I once tuned an early 1970's Steinway "M" grand about 15 miles outside of Dolgeville. The owner, who bought the piano new, told me that "he" was told the soundboard was a North Hudson soundboard.
Eric Gloo
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Certified Dampp-Chaser Installer
Richfield Springs, New York
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I would presume that once other makers became interested in west coast timber most followed suit. I would think it has been in the last fifty-sixty years…since the early sixties or seventies…
Maybe earlier if the Adirondack supply became unreliable because of overcutting. Really doesn’t matter just play and be happy the piano has soundboard worth vibrating….. In all probability, earlier. When the meetings of piano makers were being held that resulted in the book Piano Tone Building—i.e., from 1916 to 1919—there was already pressure on both the Adirondack (red) spruce and the Eastern (white) spruce forests. Attitudes among these men varied but in general they were of the opinion that, like ivory (there are plenty of elephants in Africa and India, just kill more of them), there were still adequate supplies of spruce (there are plenty of trees around, just cut more of them). Estimates varied but in general they looked forward to at least “two generations†worth of trees remaining. There was no discussion about doing anything to ensure a steady supply of trees for the future; that was a task for “governments.†Posey Manufacturing of Hoquiam, Washington started supplying both Sitka spruce lumber and glued-up soundboard panels to the industry in 1909 or 1910. By the 1920s it was a large and thriving manufacturing company so it must have been supplying lumber and/or soundboard panels to quite a few different pianomakers. ddf Very good, thanks.Interesting to learn some of the history the west coast timber developments. In earlier times that was the mindset; the scorched earth policy of unlimited resources has us where we are today.
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