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#1996806 - 12/09/12 08:43 AM Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: BeccaBb]
JimF Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/08/09
Posts: 1718
Loc: south florida
Becca,

If you have a teacher you should definitely ask, as "flying fingers" is very common.

I'm no teacher, but I did notice that you hold your left pinkie straight out and play notes with it like that too. Have you tried keeping it in a relaxed natural curve like your other fingers?
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#1996829 - 12/09/12 09:36 AM Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Mark...]
fizikisto Online   content
Full Member

Registered: 02/13/12
Posts: 492
Loc: Hernando, MS
I can't see your thumb, but your pinky doesn't curve like your other fingers. I agree that your wrist is likely the culprit here. I would suggest trying to play it with your wrist raised in an exaggerated (but not uncomfortable!) fashion (not permanently, just as a test). Play it a few times like that and see if that makes the tension worse or better. Then try again with your wrists slightly lower. Keep lowering your wrists and see if you can find a sweet spot of minimum tension. Also, You seem to be playing pretty close to the black keys. You might also try moving your fingers closer to the edge of the keyboard (your fingers have more leverage on the keys that way, and it requires less force to depress them). If you simply put your hands where you normally play and raise your wrists your fingers will naturally come forward a bit. So try to isolate these experiments so that you're sure which is helping more.

Anyway, hope that works for you. possibly worth a try in any case.
_________________________
Nord Stage 2 HA88
Roland RD800

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#1998303 - 12/12/12 11:17 AM Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Mark...]
BeccaBb Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/09/11
Posts: 905
Loc: Thunder Bay, On Canada
Thanks everyone!

After watching to video I've started to play the note, then go back to a relaxed position, then play the next note. That is helping.

I've also raised my wrist and it is helping. I haven't lowered it yet. I will try playing a wee bit back further on the keys too.

Jim: I don't have a teacher. Raising my wrist though it letting me curve it, so I believe it's a wrist issue.

I'll keep everyone updated as I trudge along with this!
_________________________
Becca
Began: 01-12-11


Floundering and Lost
Roland RD300NX

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#1998391 - 12/12/12 01:58 PM Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: badgerops]
AnarKey Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 12/12/12
Posts: 4
Loc: NYC
Badger - I'm in the same boat. I bought a DP for my son who started taking lessons a couple months ago. I figured the best way to keep him interested (and to get my money's worth from the new DP) is to learn to play along with him so I picked up Alfred's Self-Teaching Book 1 for myself. I started about two weeks ago and I'm having a lot of fun despite what is starting to feel like tendinitis in my right thumb.

Things have progressed smoothly and I have worked my way up to When the Saints Go Marching In, but I'm at a roadblock there. When the RH has a half note while the LH has a quarter rest followed by a quarter note chord (i.e., chord ends at same time of RH half note) ... I just can't wrap my brain around it. I can read the music and my fingers find the keys just fine but I can't play it and without changing tempo. Part of it may be a dexterity issue but I am working on that and it's steady improving. I think the real issue for me is I just can't 'hear' what it's supposed to sound like or grasp how that bit in the harmony fits into the melody. Meh, maybe it will just click if I play it another hundred times.


Edited by AnarKey (12/12/12 01:59 PM)

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#1998394 - 12/12/12 02:03 PM Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Mark...]
BeccaBb Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/09/11
Posts: 905
Loc: Thunder Bay, On Canada
Hi Anarkey! Welcome to the group.

If your having trouble playing that section at tempo, then play it very very slowly until you get the feel of it right. Don't play through the whole song repeatedly, break it down into little sections and play it slow until your very comfortable with it. Once you have all the sections in your hands (smooth and even) then try putting the sections together, slowly. After you have been able to add them all together and are still even and smooth, then slowly bring your tempo up.

Also to hear what it should sound like, if you go to the beginning of this thread you will find a list of resources including links to many of the songs we find in our books. smile

Hope that helps some.
_________________________
Becca
Began: 01-12-11


Floundering and Lost
Roland RD300NX

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#1998408 - 12/12/12 02:32 PM Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: BeccaBb]
AnarKey Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 12/12/12
Posts: 4
Loc: NYC
Becca - Thanks for the feedback. I have been using the methods you suggest but for some reason this one thing is eluding me for now. When I get to the parts where the harmony is a quarter played into the end of the melody half note, I change the tempo. It doesn't seem to matter how slow my tempo is to start ... when I hit that part I slow down even more. Maybe I need to visualize it a bit more and then just bang my way through it with [even more] repetition.

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#1998410 - 12/12/12 02:35 PM Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Mark...]
BeccaBb Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/09/11
Posts: 905
Loc: Thunder Bay, On Canada
Well that is good. Okay let's really isolate this. Are you on the first song (rh melody) or the second one (left hand melody?) Which measure are you stuck on?
_________________________
Becca
Began: 01-12-11


Floundering and Lost
Roland RD300NX

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#1998412 - 12/12/12 02:39 PM Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Mark...]
BeccaBb Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/09/11
Posts: 905
Loc: Thunder Bay, On Canada
Okay I think I know where you at at. 2nd bar, 6th and 7th measure.
The trickiness with this is the rests. So slow down for just those two measures and count out loud, playing very slowly. (I had the same problem at first.)

It does seem to feel odd at first. Keep doing those two measures, at a super slow speed for 5 minutes a day. It will sort itself out just by doing that!
_________________________
Becca
Began: 01-12-11


Floundering and Lost
Roland RD300NX

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#1998432 - 12/12/12 03:18 PM Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Mark...]
AnarKey Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 12/12/12
Posts: 4
Loc: NYC
Thanks again. Maybe it would be easier if I could count and play at the same time wink

Seriously, though, I don't think it is a rhythm issue so much as just having trouble with taking this next step where the harmony hand is acting a little more independently -- i.e., harder than playing full note chords accompanying quarter/half melodies. FWIW, I've worked on the song in both versions (RH melody and LH melody) and have the same issue with both. Looks like repetition is the remedy. I'll probably just pause at this point of the book and work on that and keep playing the other songs from Jingle Bells to Saints.

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#1998456 - 12/12/12 04:11 PM Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: AnarKey]
PianoStudent88 Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/16/11
Posts: 3180
Loc: Maine
Originally Posted By: AnarKey
I'm having a lot of fun despite what is starting to feel like tendinitis in my right thumb.

Caution! Caution! Caution! Big red warning flag! You don't want to develop injury. Work on identifying what motions or tensions are causing pain to your thumb. Are you holding too much tension in your thumb? Are you twisting it? Something else? How are you using your right thumb differently from your left thumb? Then change how you're using or holding your thumb, to avoid pain.
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Ebaug(maj7)

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#1998756 - 12/13/12 04:58 AM Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Mark...]
sinophilia Offline

Gold Supporter until Sept. 05 2014


Registered: 06/26/12
Posts: 984
Loc: Italy
AnarKey, you will get there, I promise... just go through the difficult part very slowly (slower than you think), count out loud, and it will just click. I think this is one of the most difficult concepts for us beginners but once you get it everything becomes much easier.

You can also play each hand by itself while slapping your thigh with the other hand to count. That's really helpful.

And be careful with your thumbs... I have a habit of keeping them straight and tense and it's not good. Do your best to be aware of your fingers and keep them relaxed.
_________________________
Diana & Wally - Yamaha W110BW
Martha Argerich... is an incarnation of the artistic metaphor of the "eternal feminine" that draws us upward. (Sergio Sablich)

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#1998779 - 12/13/12 07:04 AM Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Mark...]
floydthebarber71 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/07/12
Posts: 178
Loc: South Africa
Hello all.

I am also a beginner, I am a self-taught renegade which I tried for about a year, before life took over and didn't have access to a piano for 4 years. I've just bought myself a digi piano and loving it. Trying to figure out all the pieces that muscle memory isn't bringing back wink I am thinking about getting a book like this, or a teacher to get me into the right habits, but will see.

AnarKey; I have had no teacher and have very little knowledge about this stuff, but there was one exercise I tried that helped with relaxation of my fingers and helped my mind be aware of it. I rested all my fingers on the keys and played them (like a C scale) without lifting my fingers off the surface of the keys (fingers all remain in contact with keys no matter what). It helped me to be mindful of what my fingers are doing, in terms of position in the air and tension (because the damn things picked up off the keys despite my mind trying to tell them to rest on the surface hehe), I don't know if this is correct or maybe this is the way one is supposed to play in the first place, but that did get my fingers loose.
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Zaahir

Self-taught renegade - Kawai CL-36

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#1998915 - 12/13/12 12:24 PM Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: BeccaBb]
fliper Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/31/09
Posts: 212
Loc: Angola (Africa)
Originally Posted By: BeccaBb
After watching to video I've started to play the note, then go back to a relaxed position, then play the next note. That is helping.

See this set of videos "Piano-ology: Piano Technique Fundamentals Video Series"
http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL21598D1259C2C8EE


It is nice to see new students here.

Finally I am starting to learn "Greensleeves" - page 130. I can play "The Stranger" but sometimes I have to look to the keyboard in the bigger jumps.
_________________________
Alfred Adult All-In-One - level 1 - "Go Down, Moses" - page 133



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#1999460 - 12/14/12 03:09 PM Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Mark...]
AnarKey Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 12/12/12
Posts: 4
Loc: NYC
Thanks to all for the tips and encouragement. As far as my thumb goes, it may or may not be a piano thing. I had a problem on the inductor side around the time I started playing which was most likely the result of non-piano activities. About a week later I noticed I had some soreness in the abductor side and playing does seem to aggravate it. That said, the problem itself may just be backlash from the original inductor issue. Obviously, it could also be the piano in which case the inductor/abductor pairing is a coincidence. But either way, I am paying attention to tension, etc. FWIW, I haven't notice anything different in how I use my L vs R thumb.

As far as the problem playing quarter note harmonies into half note melodies, that actually seems to be coming along. Playing s l o w l y did help as well as repetition of problematic measures. I think the real break through, though, was trying to keep my mind focused on the melody and letting the harmony sort of follow along. I was really shifting focus from hand to hand which seemed to make maintaining tempo nearly impossible. If I keep my focus on the melody and let the harmony hand just come along for the ride maintaining tempo is nearly effortless. Mentally, it was like I started out trying to read from two books at once and when I shifted focus I lost the thread. Now I've adjusted so it's sort of like reading one book but knowing I need to tap my foot each time I read a certain word.

TBH, I'm not sure if I am describing it clearly, but that's how it feels in my own little musical brain. It doesn't mean the harmony side always does what it is supposed to but when it doesn't that's a much easier problem to address.

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#1999672 - 12/15/12 03:13 AM Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Mark...]
BeccaBb Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/09/11
Posts: 905
Loc: Thunder Bay, On Canada
HA! I just figured it out! While holding my fingers in the proper position, if I tilt my wrist just a little to the left, I have no tension! (Thank you Bluoh for showing me proper positioning!)

K, whew, just had to shout that out. Back to regular programming!
_________________________
Becca
Began: 01-12-11


Floundering and Lost
Roland RD300NX

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#2001462 - 12/18/12 11:34 PM Warning about Alfred Publishing [Re: Mark...]
Dan Clark Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/27/12
Posts: 175
Loc: Bellevue, WA USA
I just posted this in the DP/synth forum: http://www.pianoworld.com/forum/ubbthrea...ml#Post2001458. Alfred distributes their midi files on Floppy disk!

It is completely bizarre to me that a company would distribute their product on a media that can't be used on the the vast majority of modern computers without any notice to the customer.

Dan.


Edited by Dan Clark (12/18/12 11:34 PM)

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#2001469 - 12/18/12 11:43 PM Re: Warning about Alfred Publishing [Re: Dan Clark]
Wish4 Thing Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/29/11
Posts: 137
Loc: TX, USA
Dan, mine is on CD. I guess if you email/call them, they might be able to replace it for you?
_________________________
self-taught, thus self-struggling a lotcrazy (My Recordings)

Unit 11 of Faber's Accelerated Lesson Book 2

Collections from Piano World for Adult Beginners

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#2001473 - 12/18/12 11:50 PM Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: BeccaBb]
Wish4 Thing Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/29/11
Posts: 137
Loc: TX, USA
Originally Posted By: BeccaBb
While holding my fingers in the proper position, if I tilt my wrist just a little to the left, I have no tension! (Thank you Bluoh for showing me proper positioning!)


The teacher for a couple of my friends' kids taught them to pay special attention to their hand "rotation". Here is a video clip showing how, I'm just amazed by the dynamics brought out by rotating their hands on a simple piece like this...
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self-taught, thus self-struggling a lotcrazy (My Recordings)

Unit 11 of Faber's Accelerated Lesson Book 2

Collections from Piano World for Adult Beginners

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#2007510 - 01/01/13 03:14 PM Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Mark...]
scorpio Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/30/12
Posts: 519
Loc: Connecticut, USA
I am looking forward to contributing to this thread. Today is Day 1 (official start date). I have been messing around in the book for a few weeks so I expect the first several pages to fly by. I do plan to upload some pieces as I go along (I need to work on recording my snippets); and hopefully receive some constructive critique.

I also plan to use some of Alfred's supplemental books (All-Time Favorites and Greatest Hits). We shall see how it goes. If anyone has other suggestions I am eager to hear about them.

I will not be starting with a teacher (yes I know it is highly recommended to have a teacher). At the same time I do expect to start looking for a teacher in the near future. For several reasons a teacher is not practical right now.

So on to page 4, "Preliminary Exercises"
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Kawai MP11 :: JBL LSR305 :: Focusrite 2i4 :: Pianoteq Standard

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#2007518 - 01/01/13 03:26 PM Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Mark...]
fizikisto Online   content
Full Member

Registered: 02/13/12
Posts: 492
Loc: Hernando, MS
Hi Scorpio! Welcome to the forum, and the Alfred's thread! Is piano your new year's resolution? smile If so, it's a good one. Good Luck!
_________________________
Nord Stage 2 HA88
Roland RD800

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#2007797 - 01/02/13 03:26 AM Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: scorpio]
fliper Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/31/09
Posts: 212
Loc: Angola (Africa)
Welcome Scorpio! In the supplemental books you have the page you should be in Alfred Book to start each piece.
You can also look those free web pages:
Theory
http://www.gmajormusictheory.org/Fundamentals/workbooks.html
Music
http://gmajormusictheory.org/Freebies/freebies.html
http://makingmusicfun.net/htm/printit_piano_sheet_music_index.htm
http://www.piano-play-it.com/free-piano-sheet-music.html
_________________________
Alfred Adult All-In-One - level 1 - "Go Down, Moses" - page 133



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#2007871 - 01/02/13 09:30 AM Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Mark...]
KeysAngler Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/14/10
Posts: 231
Loc: The Fabulous Florida Keys
Finally finished the lesson session and am now learning Somewhere Over The Rainbow ...

That took 18 months ... about an hour a day study and practice ...

soon on to book two

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#2007896 - 01/02/13 10:44 AM Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Mark...]
scorpio Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/30/12
Posts: 519
Loc: Connecticut, USA
fizikisto and fliper - thank you for the warm welcome.

I love the links, brilliant. gmajormusictheory site looks terrific, I will be visiting often.

I have to watch my overzealous behavior, I can easily get distracted. I am trying to be very disciplined and focused in my studies.
_________________________
Kawai MP11 :: JBL LSR305 :: Focusrite 2i4 :: Pianoteq Standard

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#2008125 - 01/02/13 06:01 PM Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Mark...]
hamlet cat Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/01/13
Posts: 103
Loc: Mojave Desert
Hello everyone. I'm on book 1 of Alfred's Basic book. I have a question about the song Little Brown Jug and wondering if someone can help. smile

In the forth measure, it goes Bb-E, Bb-E, Bb-D, and back to Bb-E. I use my thumb on the Bb and finger 4 on E, and finger 3 on D. What I find myself doing is playing the E or D by making contact with my finger to the key up where the black keys are. So I'm actually pressing the keys in between or next to the black key. Is this the correct way to do it? It seems I would have to turn my wrist to make contact with the D or E towards the front or away from the black key. Just don't want to learn any bad habits so asking.

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#2008384 - 01/03/13 07:04 AM Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: fliper]
hesmywatermelon Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 01/02/13
Posts: 1
Loc: UK
Originally Posted By: fliper
Welcome Scorpio! In the supplemental books you have the page you should be in Alfred Book to start each piece.
You can also look those free web pages:
Theory
http://www.gmajormusictheory.org/Fundamentals/workbooks.html
Music
http://gmajormusictheory.org/Freebies/freebies.html
http://makingmusicfun.net/htm/printit_piano_sheet_music_index.htm
http://www.piano-play-it.com/free-piano-sheet-music.html


Just wanted to say thank you!! I have JUST started to teach myself piano and am working through Alfred (im really near the beginning still) but im starting to get bored with mary had a little lamb and jingle bells already. So I came on here to ask if anyone knew what other music i could lay at various points throughout the alfred book, but can see that that third site you posted corresponds very well!!

THANK YOU!!!

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#2008412 - 01/03/13 08:30 AM Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: hesmywatermelon]
KeysAngler Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/14/10
Posts: 231
Loc: The Fabulous Florida Keys


Edited by KeysAngler (01/03/13 08:33 AM)

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#2008543 - 01/03/13 01:41 PM Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Mark...]
scorpio Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/30/12
Posts: 519
Loc: Connecticut, USA
Trying to work out the kinks in recording. Not sure I like the quality of the piece, but I will work on that.

In any case, here's my first upload, "Jingle Bells", page 30 (in my book).

https://www.box.com/s/tt0tz6q5qutvp4rshagd
_________________________
Kawai MP11 :: JBL LSR305 :: Focusrite 2i4 :: Pianoteq Standard

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#2008607 - 01/03/13 03:25 PM Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Mark...]
Allard Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/27/12
Posts: 339
Loc: Netherlands
Scorpio: there's always time for Christmas songs laugh In fact, I just ordered a songbook. At least this year it will be here on time.

Your recording seems fine. Not nervous, no mistakes. It could be played it a bit louder; the score is marked as forte. Maybe also a tad slower. I'd have trouble breathing when singing along! You do slow down a little by the end. For dramatic effect? Actually, I just sang along and it seems to work just fine smile
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David Lanz - Where the Tall Tree Grows
Nobuo Uematsu - Aerith's Theme (Final Fantasy VII Piano Collections)

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#2008774 - 01/03/13 10:52 PM Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Allard]
scorpio Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/30/12
Posts: 519
Loc: Connecticut, USA
Thank you Allard for the comments. I am definitely having issues with recording. The input was very low, even though my recorded version on the DP was much louder. I think it may have something to do with my cable. I won't upload any more songs until I get it all figured out.
_________________________
Kawai MP11 :: JBL LSR305 :: Focusrite 2i4 :: Pianoteq Standard

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#2008964 - 01/04/13 01:39 PM Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: KeysAngler]
hamlet cat Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/01/13
Posts: 103
Loc: Mojave Desert
Originally Posted By: KeysAngler


Thank you for posting the link, if it was intended for me.

I take it that any portion of a given key can be used. I guess the idea is to minimize unnecessary wrist or finger movement so striking the white key up high between the black keys is fine.

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