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#2009061 - 01/04/13 05:14 PM question on voicing
peabody Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/19/11
Posts: 57
Loc: nc
Hi to all....
Wondering....
Is it possible to voice a piano to sound more mellow but also to retain or imcrese the power of the notes/chords?

Thanks.... I want a more mellow tone but also a more powerful high end.

Estonia 168
_________________________
Peabody

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#2009138 - 01/04/13 08:28 PM Re: question on voicing [Re: peabody]
malkin Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/18/09
Posts: 2418
Loc: *sigh* Salt Lake City
If you don't get a reply you could ask over on the Tuners and Techs board.
_________________________
A good student is one who makes the teacher feel like a good teacher.

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#2009141 - 01/04/13 08:47 PM Re: question on voicing [Re: peabody]
Jerry Groot RPT Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/07/07
Posts: 6828
Loc: Grand Rapids Michigan
Yes.
_________________________
Jerry Groot RPT
Piano Technicians Guild
Grand Rapids, Michigan
www.grootpiano.com

We love to play BF2.

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#2009143 - 01/04/13 08:55 PM Re: question on voicing [Re: peabody]
Kurtmen Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/10/08
Posts: 632
Loc: San Mateo, CA

Voicing it is not as straight forward as it seems. Also the characteristics of the sound are related to other factors such as the type of hammers, hammers weight, the striking point of the hammers with relation to the speaking length of the string, strings down-bearing, just to name a few.
In my experience with Estonia pianos the tonal quality tends to be slender, crisp and with moderate to long sustain.
Trying to make the piano softer could make it lose its luster and create a very common effect in pianos with this type of tone; where the attack is muffle but the general characteristic of the tone remain the same.
My recommendation will be to do a very gradual voicing in multiple steps. Work the mid registers first from G3 to C5 see how it feels just mild voicing. Then move into the outer registers as need it at a different time after you play it for a while.
_________________________
San Mateo Piano
Purveyors of:
Kawai, Wilh. Steinberg.
Kawai Digital Piano, Pianodisc.
<a href="http://sanmateopiano.com" style="color:#FF0505;font-size:10px;font-family:Times New Roman;text-decoration:underline;" target="_blank" >http://sanmateopiano.com</a>

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#2009154 - 01/04/13 09:50 PM Re: question on voicing [Re: peabody]
Dave B Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/01/11
Posts: 1901
Loc: Philadelphia area
Could just need string seating and leveling. Get a tech who is experienced in all phases of concert prep.

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#2009157 - 01/04/13 09:53 PM Re: question on voicing [Re: peabody]
peabody Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/19/11
Posts: 57
Loc: nc
Thanks Kurtman...
You seem to be saying that, in your experience Estonia pianos sound best if the tone is allowed a brightness... Am I reading your opinion correctly? I am very interested in any guidance in that area. Currently I am not overly pleased with my tone and I know the dealer voiced it down a bit before purchase.
_________________________
Peabody

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#2009175 - 01/04/13 10:32 PM Re: question on voicing [Re: peabody]
Ed McMorrow, RPT Online   content
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/09/12
Posts: 1883
Loc: Seattle, WA USA
The mass of the hammer becomes most critical to the hammer string contact time, (and thus the overall damping of the hammer impact sound) from the portion of the compass where the fundamental pitch reaches 4 digits, IE 1,000 HZ. This is about one note above A-880HZ on up to note 88. Hammers are essentially "dampers" that excite.

Skilled shaping of the hammers to lower the mass without reducing the column of felt beneath the strike point is the overall goal. This will increase dynamic range, volume, sustain and tone color dynamic gradient. The touch resistance must be balanced at the same time so that dynamic control is enhanced as well.

Seek out a technician who understands these things and audition examples of their work to help you learn what is possible and the technician to learn what you expect.
_________________________
In a seemingly infinite universe-infinite human creativity is-seemingly possible

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#2009177 - 01/04/13 10:41 PM Re: question on voicing [Re: peabody]
Norbert Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/03/01
Posts: 14117
Loc: Surrey, B.C.
Quote:
Could just need string seating and leveling. Get a tech who is experienced in all phases of concert prep.


Plus stretching, i.e. "massaging" strings.

That's our own experience with Estonias having had excellent outcomes in virtually every single case.

Norbert
_________________________
www.heritagepianos.com
Greater Vancouver B.C. piano dealers for : C.Sauter, Estonia, Brodmann, Ritmuller
604-951-8642

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#2009194 - 01/04/13 11:23 PM Re: question on voicing [Re: peabody]
peabody Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/19/11
Posts: 57
Loc: nc
Norbert...
Tell me more about massaging strings and your experience with it on estonia pianos please
_________________________
Peabody

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#2009694 - 01/05/13 08:34 PM Re: question on voicing [Re: peabody]
Kurtmen Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/10/08
Posts: 632
Loc: San Mateo, CA
Originally Posted By: peabody
Thanks Kurtman...
You seem to be saying that, in your experience Estonia pianos sound best if the tone is allowed a brightness... Am I reading your opinion correctly? I am very interested in any guidance in that area. Currently I am not overly pleased with my tone and I know the dealer voiced it down a bit before purchase.


Correct. Exactly if I were you, just do what the dealer did (mild voicing). It is important to understand that any service done to the piano is not permanent.
I'm afraid that the current stage of the tone of your piano is just the normal changes in tone due to the use and lack of serious maintenance since you bought it.
Believe it or not, action regulation, tuning and voicing is all inter-related and affects your perception of the tone.
Get a full service including a mild voicing.


Edited by Kurtmen (01/05/13 08:35 PM)
_________________________
San Mateo Piano
Purveyors of:
Kawai, Wilh. Steinberg.
Kawai Digital Piano, Pianodisc.
<a href="http://sanmateopiano.com" style="color:#FF0505;font-size:10px;font-family:Times New Roman;text-decoration:underline;" target="_blank" >http://sanmateopiano.com</a>

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