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#2013177 - 01/12/13 01:38 AM Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning)
Brittin Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 10/18/10
Posts: 11
It seems that piano prices in general are decreasing for used pianos. Recently some local folks had a "biggest burn party"
and the winner was someone who burned their piano. Also we have had several calls about abandoned pianos being given away.


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#2013265 - 01/12/13 07:45 AM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: Brittin]
David Jenson Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/22/06
Posts: 2178
Loc: Maine
I could venture a wild guess that they are decreased in value AFTER being burned!
_________________________
David L. Jenson
Tuning - Repairs - Refurbishing
Jenson's Piano Service
-----

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#2013541 - 01/12/13 04:21 PM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: David Jenson]
Ed McMorrow, RPT Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/09/12
Posts: 2337
Loc: Seattle, WA USA
The US economy has been hovering about the edge of disinflationary slope for several years now. Disinflation is when most people expect prices to go down in the future so the incentive to defer purchases increases which fuels more downward price pressures.

The supply of passable pianos from Asia and the fact that for many keyboard students a digital piano is the entry level reduces demand for used pianos. New pianos have shown very little disinflationary pricing because demand is growing in developing economies.

Burning a piano will make some nasty smoke from the finishing materials. I don't recommend it-too much pollution.
_________________________
In a seemingly infinite universe-infinite human creativity is-seemingly possible

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#2013559 - 01/12/13 04:55 PM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: Brittin]
beethoven986 Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/20/09
Posts: 3360
I agree with Ed. The economy is not helping. If you factor in the addition of all the newly manufactured instruments popping up at dealers each year and the fact that most digital pianos can run circles around the average spinet (and the best ones can match the average good-quality upright) then it's not surprising at all. Our market is over saturated.

Yesterday, I condemned another piano to the dump. It was a Wurlitzer spinet, 1/2 step flat in some places, heavily grooved hammers, loose and broken action parts on a good half of the keys, etc. A4 didn't even work. I have no qualms about tuning spinets because the checks cash the same, but only if they're in reasonable condition; if it costs several hundred dollars to get a piano like this back in working condition before I even tune it, that's where I draw the line. I wish more technicians would take this stand more often, because I think that with all the other options available today, fixing these basket cases up is not in the client's best interest, or the piano tuner's, or the piano industry in general.
_________________________
B.Mus. Piano Performance 2009
M.Mus. Piano Performance & Literature 2011
PTG Associate Member
Certified Dampp-Chaser installer

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#2013564 - 01/12/13 05:04 PM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: beethoven986]
kpembrook Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/10
Posts: 1316
Loc: Michigan
Originally Posted By: beethoven986
<snip>
Yesterday, I condemned another piano to the dump.
<snip>
. . . , fixing these basket cases up is not in the client's best interest, or the piano tuner's, or the piano industry in general.


The more deadwood that is cleared out, the better it will be for the industry. Way back in the 1890s, I believe, some major piano retailers held a "square piano burning". The idea was 1) to demonstrate that they really weren't worth much as musical instruments and 2) to remove them from circulation so that they wouldn't be a drag on the market.

Back in the '60s, my father had a small retail operation in addition to his tuning business. He had the same idea: He would allow $25 for any old upright as a trade. After delivering the new piano, we would load the old beater upright and take it straight to the city dump (what they had before landfill days).

It was great fun for me as a teenager . . . if we got it off the trailer just right at the end of the hill where the dump was, it would go down end over end with parts coming off left and right and making a wonderful noise as it travelled to the bottom of the ravine.

But Daddy's idea was not to provide entertainment for me but simply to take the old out of the market so there would be room for the new.
_________________________
Keith Akins, RPT
USA Distributor for Isaac Cadenza hammers and Profundo Bass Strings
Supporting Piano Owners D-I-Y piano tuning and repair

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#2013641 - 01/12/13 08:11 PM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: Brittin]
Nash. Piano Rescue Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/08/09
Posts: 386
Loc: East Nashville,TN Scottsville...
Well the economy has taught some people to be a little more thrifty and not just go drop 6K on a new piano. I don't know many people around here that can get financed on new. Self employed Musicians don't really exist in the loan making world as does any self employed person these days.

What is really funny is you can watch lets say 10 piano tuners. They wont recommend taking that worn out 8 foot Steinway Grand to the Dump or recommend torching it. Doesn't matter how old it is. What you will get are the 1-888 gotta have it now brokers calling you endlessly or climbing over your security fencing to try to get better glimses.

It's okay to have buildings full of those but if you have lets say 200 Baldwin Hamilton Studios then you are seeding the market and causing havock. The state of TN is just one state trying to eliminate used piano sales and sales of other used items as well. Should be a great court battle.

It has become more of a class war than who can really afford what. Plus there are plenty of other uses for old uprights other than fire. We delaminate them in De-Lam tanks for the wood and hardware. Pretty difficult today to go out and buy a Non Chinese 100 year old 5/4 thickness furniture grade Oak board or extinct wood for that matter.

J C
Nashville Piano Rescue
www.NashvillePianoRescue.com
Since 1918
Lascassas TN

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#2013686 - 01/12/13 10:03 PM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: Brittin]
Ed Foote Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/03/03
Posts: 1228
Loc: Tennessee
Greetings,
Equipment has a service life, pianos are no exception. The Steinways are still marketable because of their name, but others are not. There are numerous sad events I have seen where a family has spent the budget on a piano that can't be tuned and whose action is totally worn. This is usually involving an old upright made prior to 1940. Many of these fine old examples of woodworking should be burned before they are used to swindle other naive customers.
They were not made with a 100 year lifespan in mind.
Regards,

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#2013869 - 01/13/13 10:59 AM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: Brittin]
Jerry Groot RPT Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/07/07
Posts: 6828
Loc: Grand Rapids Michigan
It always amazes me how frequently I receive a call from someone that says "I was recently given a piano for FREE!!!!!" They are ecstatic about it! FREE. They do not say that it is a GOOD piano! They don't say it is a BAD piano. The don't say that it is NOT in tune. They don't say that it sat in a barn for 650 years. They don't say that strings are broken. But, they always say, that I got it for FREEEEE!

Then, they almost always inevitably add "there are a few keys that don't play - but I think it's only a minor problem - and there are a few others that stick, and it doesn't look very good. It has lots of scratches on it. It looks like something was spilled on the keys" and the list goes on. It's the word free, that catches their eye as if it is a bargain.

Next, their question is always, "what do you think it will cost to tune and fix it?" Like I have ESP or something?

I often wonder if they aren't the same people picking up the fridge that I just sat out to the curb because it ISN'T working any longer? And, it's always picked up AT NIGHT so nobody can see them grabbing another free item! smile It doesn't work folks.... I've had it fixed until I was sick of fixing it, then I tossed it out.... Go and get a nice one for yourselves, you really do deserve it. wink
_________________________
Jerry Groot RPT
Piano Technicians Guild
Grand Rapids, Michigan
www.grootpiano.com

We love to play BF2.

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#2013876 - 01/13/13 11:13 AM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: Brittin]
Silverwood Pianos Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/10/08
Posts: 4224
Loc: Vancouver B. C. Canada

I received a call recently from a fellow who picked up and transported not one but two of those gems Jerry.

The first one had a two inch separation under the top board and the second one had tuning pins pointing at the key tops.

Neither one was brand name but I have also come across brand names such as Steinway, Heintzman, and Blüthner etc that are basket cases too. Each piano is an individual case as has to be measured on its own merits or lack thereof.

The used piano market, like any other used goods market, has a lot of frogs to kiss, but there are princes out there to find. It is the natural culling process of the marketplace. Still thousands are being caught because of that four letter word you mentioned.
_________________________
Dan Silverwood
www.silverwoodpianos.com
http://silverwoodpianos.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/SilverwoodPianosDotCom
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur."

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#2013940 - 01/13/13 01:58 PM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: Brittin]
woodfab Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/06/05
Posts: 382
Loc: Stoneham, MA
There's no reason to get rid of old unplayable pianos.
They make great furniture such as tables.
_________________________
Dan (Piano Tinkerer)

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#2013950 - 01/13/13 02:47 PM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: woodfab]
Dan Casdorph Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/20/09
Posts: 365
Loc: Morgantown, West Virginia
It seems pretty common around here that the free pianos end up being the most expensive to get to playing condition. I actually think the question is whether pianos can have negative value, considering the cost to move and then repair.
_________________________
Casdorph Piano Service
Morgantown, WV
www.casdorphpiano.com
All pianos are bald ones.

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#2013987 - 01/13/13 04:06 PM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: woodfab]
j&j Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/24/09
Posts: 445
Loc: Southwest
Dan - that picture's really scary.
_________________________
J & J
Yahama C3 PE
Casio Privia PX-330
"Inspiration exists, but it has to find you working." Pablo Picasso

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#2013994 - 01/13/13 04:31 PM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: Brittin]
woodfab Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/06/05
Posts: 382
Loc: Stoneham, MA
It's someone woman's apartment. I think she's a person who accumulates things and hides them away for future use.

I was unable to get close enough to see how well it plays.

I would think that all the clothes might have a dampening effect on the room acoustics.


Edited by woodfab (01/13/13 04:38 PM)
_________________________
Dan (Piano Tinkerer)

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#2013999 - 01/13/13 04:42 PM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: Dan Casdorph]
beethoven986 Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/20/09
Posts: 3360
Originally Posted By: Dan Casdorph
I actually think the question is whether pianos can have negative value, considering the cost to move and then repair.


A philosophy that I absolutely agree with!
_________________________
B.Mus. Piano Performance 2009
M.Mus. Piano Performance & Literature 2011
PTG Associate Member
Certified Dampp-Chaser installer

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#2014008 - 01/13/13 05:11 PM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: Jerry Groot RPT]
kpembrook Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/10
Posts: 1316
Loc: Michigan
Originally Posted By: Jerry Groot RPT
It always amazes me how frequently I receive a call from someone that says "I was recently given a piano for FREE!!!!!" They are ecstatic about it! FREE. They do not say that it is a GOOD piano! They don't say it is a BAD piano. The don't say that it is NOT in tune. They don't say that it sat in a barn for 650 years. They don't say that strings are broken. But, they always say, that I got it for FREEEEE!

Then, they almost always inevitably add "there are a few keys that don't play - but I think it's only a minor problem - and there are a few others that stick, and it doesn't look very good. It has lots of scratches on it. It looks like something was spilled on the keys" and the list goes on. It's the word free, that catches their eye as if it is a bargain.

Next, their question is always, "what do you think it will cost to tune and fix it?" Like I have ESP or something?

I often wonder if they aren't the same people picking up the fridge that I just sat out to the curb because it ISN'T working any longer? And, it's always picked up AT NIGHT so nobody can see them grabbing another free item! smile It doesn't work folks.... I've had it fixed until I was sick of fixing it, then I tossed it out.... Go and get a nice one for yourselves, you really do deserve it. wink


thumb

My experience exactly. What I have been trying to comprehend is how people would never do this with a car:

<Customer to auto mechanic> I got a free car. It started and all the tires are still on. But it runs rough and the steering wheel doesn't turn all the way to the right but I think it's basically OK. Can you tell me how much its worth and how much it would cost to fix it?

<Mechanic> Um, what make, model and year is it?

<Customer> Well, it's blue.
laugh

What is it that causes people to completely lose their common sense with pianos in a way that they wouldn't with so many other things?
_________________________
Keith Akins, RPT
USA Distributor for Isaac Cadenza hammers and Profundo Bass Strings
Supporting Piano Owners D-I-Y piano tuning and repair

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#2014153 - 01/13/13 11:26 PM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: Brittin]
Del Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/04/03
Posts: 5317
Loc: Olympia, Washington
Originally Posted By: Brittin
It seems that piano prices in general are decreasing for used pianos. Recently some local folks had a "biggest burn party"
and the winner was someone who burned their piano. Also we have had several calls about abandoned pianos being given away.

Most of these things are close to a century old. Some older. And, while some of them were designed and built reasonably well many, if not most, of them were of indifferent quality.

Given this it is always a mystery to me why we are so puzzled the some of them have actually "decreased in value."

ddf
_________________________
Delwin D Fandrich
Piano Research, Design & Manufacturing Consultant
ddfandrich@gmail.com
(To contact me privately please use this e-mail address.)

Stupidity is a rare condition, ignorance is a common choice. --Anon

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#2014239 - 01/14/13 05:25 AM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: Brittin]
Olek Offline
7000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/14/08
Posts: 7904
Loc: France
_________________________
It is critical that you call your Senators and Representatives and ask them to cosponsor S. 2587 and H.R. 5052. Getting your legislators to cosponsor these bills


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#2014262 - 01/14/13 07:04 AM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: Ed Foote]
Steven Bolstridge Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/13/05
Posts: 200
Loc: Fitzgerald ,GA
Originally Posted By: Ed Foote
Greetings,
Many of these fine old examples of woodworking should be burned before they are used to swindle other naive customers.

My local landfill has 15 or more that I've deposited. They call it furniture and don't charge. Customers generally respect an honest evaluation. I have been called to "tune" a piano that I had clearly condemned weeks earlier. "They said all it needed was a good tuning. It's for my grand daughter. We saved the money and got it for only $250." I hauled it to the dump and gave them a very good deal on a used one I had.
They walk among us.
_________________________
piano tuner/technician

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#2014320 - 01/14/13 10:05 AM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: Brittin]
TimR Online   content
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/17/04
Posts: 3240
Loc: Virginia, USA
My Dad who was a high school band director back in the 60s was frequently asked about the value of an old cornet, etc., somebody found in the closet.

His advice was usually the same: do NOT throw it away, do not take it to the dump. Take it to the driveway and run over it with your car. Then discard it.

Bitter experience had taught him the junk instrument would inevitably be retrieved from the dump and would appear in his beginning band class, and he would be teaching somebody on an unplayable instrument.
_________________________
gotta go practice

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#2014326 - 01/14/13 10:21 AM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: kpembrook]
Jerry Groot RPT Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/07/07
Posts: 6828
Loc: Grand Rapids Michigan
Yeah Keith and even though we post this sort of thing frequently, that these pianos are JUNK and should be discarded, 100 years is old....... how frequently are we still reading, several times a day STILL about people wanting advice about some old piece of junk yet, again.... and again, and again.... Either they aren't listening, aren't reading or they won't believe US. I guess?

I like that Tim R. Run it over then bring it to the dump! haha. I used to smash the crap out of them, return the cast iron for $30 or so 30 years ago and trash the rest of it. That was fun too!
_________________________
Jerry Groot RPT
Piano Technicians Guild
Grand Rapids, Michigan
www.grootpiano.com

We love to play BF2.

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#2014336 - 01/14/13 10:32 AM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: Brittin]
Minnesota Marty Offline

Platinum Supporter until October 5 2014


Registered: 05/15/12
Posts: 7439
Loc: Rochester MN
The grand bookcase is very handsome. Flattened brass instruments can become art. I have a french horn on my wall, with the rim of the back of the bell bent up, and it is a delightful planter for ivy. But, that only recycles about .0001% of dead instruments.

May all of the others R.I.P.
_________________________
Marty in Minnesota

It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.

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#2014913 - 01/15/13 01:02 PM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: Brittin]
Nash. Piano Rescue Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/08/09
Posts: 386
Loc: East Nashville,TN Scottsville...
Well the problem exists because people call the pros out to look at their piano like lets say a 1914 Richmond just to pick a name out. The tech walks in and stops 25 feet from the piano and exclaims... " It's older than 1959 so it can't be tuned". Does this happen? Yes and we document each time it does... Last year we had over 2300 instances of this within a 900 mile radius and people paying for a service are pretty put off by that.

So they call another guy who walks in, pitch raises and tunes it and the people are happy with it. That is why you have all these people writing in to these boards. I think when those techs realize that not every single person on earth plays die hard whiz bang classical or Chopin or is interested in Victorian Temperments then maybe there will be a realization that those antique boat anchors are still useful.

There has been a massive re-surgence in antique uprights. Who wants them? I have 6 filing cabinets behind me with NDAs Non disclosure agreements from big name recording artists. They love antique uprights, they dont care what they look like, they just want them to play the type of music they play. Oh and keep in mind these same people do have that 9 ft Steinway or equivilant but other famous people go to parties, they see the old boat anchor piano and they want one. This "fad" if you want to call it that drives some people crazy that think there should be something new in it's place but the guy playing knows what he wants.

Not trying to put anyone off but someone said no one is listening to advice and they are listening to all the different opinions. So sure some get burnt, some go to the dump. Some are used for photo and video and some go back into service. I'm pretty sure LOTS of them go pre-maturely
_________________________
J. Christie
Nashville Piano Rescue
www.NashvillePianoRescue.com
East Nashville
Bowling Green, KY
Scottsville KY.
Chamber of Commerce
Member/Sponsor

Putting inspiration in the hands of area musicians
Through restoration/renovation

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#2014951 - 01/15/13 02:11 PM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: Nash. Piano Rescue]
kpembrook Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/10
Posts: 1316
Loc: Michigan
The old uprights certainly had one thing going for them -- the laws of physics.

Other things being equal (and often they are not) a piano with longer strings and full-size action parts and keys will sound better and play better than one with shorter strings and keys. So that is a plus on the side of the old uprights.

On the down side is the reality that in many cases the components have outlived their normal life. Then the question becomes one of how good does it need to be, for whom and for how long? Properly determining these answers will produce a reasonable course of action. In the case of a child taking lessons, my criteria are that they need consistent touch and tone and the thing should last for a few years. How much to get there? When it approaches the cost of a more modern decent used home piano, the economics just aren't there.

On the other hand, if someone wants to get to the performance level of a new M&H upright or a S&S model K, you can get to that performance level for much less than the cost of new or slightly used. I just did an old upright restoration for a young woman just out of college on an Ivers & Pond. The piano will blow any cheap grand piano out of the water -- and she has well less than $5000 into it.

When someone calls with a need to get a piano out of the house immediately, and the piano is in poor condition, I'm afraid there simply isn't an active market justifying an alternative to the landfill.

So, there are different answers to the question of what the value of an old upright might be.
_________________________
Keith Akins, RPT
USA Distributor for Isaac Cadenza hammers and Profundo Bass Strings
Supporting Piano Owners D-I-Y piano tuning and repair

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#2014972 - 01/15/13 02:43 PM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: Nash. Piano Rescue]
Jerry Groot RPT Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/07/07
Posts: 6828
Loc: Grand Rapids Michigan
Originally Posted By: Nash. Piano Rescue
Well the problem exists because people call the pros out to look at their piano like lets say a 1914 Richmond just to pick a name out. The tech walks in and stops 25 feet from the piano and exclaims... " It's older than 1959 so it can't be tuned". Does this happen? Yes and we document each time it does... Last year we had over 2300 instances of this within a 900 mile radius and people paying for a service are pretty put off by that.

So they call another guy who walks in, pitch raises and tunes it and the people are happy with it. That is why you have all these people writing in to these boards. I think when those techs realize that not every single person on earth plays die hard whiz bang classical or Chopin or is interested in Victorian Temperments then maybe there will be a realization that those antique boat anchors are still useful.

There has been a massive re-surgence in antique uprights. Who wants them? I have 6 filing cabinets behind me with NDAs Non disclosure agreements from big name recording artists. They love antique uprights, they dont care what they look like, they just want them to play the type of music they play. Oh and keep in mind these same people do have that 9 ft Steinway or equivilant but other famous people go to parties, they see the old boat anchor piano and they want one. This "fad" if you want to call it that drives some people crazy that think there should be something new in it's place but the guy playing knows what he wants.

Not trying to put anyone off but someone said no one is listening to advice and they are listening to all the different opinions. So sure some get burnt, some go to the dump. Some are used for photo and video and some go back into service. I'm pretty sure LOTS of them go pre-maturely


The problem is that they don't just call in the "pro's." More often than not, they call in the half pro's. People that will do anything for a buck. Tell them anything they want to hear. They will tune it 1/2 tone flat without even trying to raise it to pitch. They will tune it wherever. They will spend money fixing something that isn't worth fixing just because it's money in the 1/2 pro's pocketbook.

A real pro comes in and may, or may not, condemn it as the other person probably should have done if they were honest about it to begin with but, they weren't.

That's where the confusion comes in. Why didn't so and so condemn it? Well? I can't and won't be responsible for that persons actions. That's their responsibility, not mine. I just tell it like it is and answer the questions according to what's right and what's not right giving my most honest opinion of the situation under all given circumstances.

_________________________
Jerry Groot RPT
Piano Technicians Guild
Grand Rapids, Michigan
www.grootpiano.com

We love to play BF2.

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#2015080 - 01/15/13 06:49 PM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: Brittin]
RestorerPhil Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/26/12
Posts: 212
Loc: Georgia, USA
I first entered the piano market in retail sales in 1976. My livelihood quickly transitioned toward tuning, service, and rebuilding. Back then there were a few dealers who dumped every upright they could, just as Keith Akins said his father used to do. At that time, probably 80% of the uprights I saw were salvageable. In the south, some uprights were "native" but many had been transported from the northeast after having been bought from wholesalers. We are all familiar with the "cut-down" mirror uprights which we dread seeing, but many of these imports from the northeast were just spruced up, had new keytops and bridles put on, and sold as beginner pianos.

Fast forward to today and at least 80% of the uprights I see are not practically salvageable. Depending upon criteria and intended use that percentage can be higher.

HOWEVER,... help
This past Saturday I saw an upright- one of the many Hallet Davis products, but not that name on the fall board - which the family wanted to rebuild. It had been the late grandfather's piano. His daughter plays piano. Her daughter and son-in-law both play. When asked about cost to make that piano do what they would require, my reply was "$4K to $7K, since you want the piano to be a solid musical instrument again.” When I sent the formal letter with firm prices, the two options were very close to that range. I enclosed a bill for my time. (The lesser option simply delayed some of the work until later.)

When I was asked what the value of the rebuilt piano would be I said, "No, you could not come near to recovering your investment. The piano is worth only what value your family places on it. You can buy a piano to replace it for not much more money.” I gave them a couple of examples of particular instruments and gave them an idea of what the post-haggling prices might be on those new models. I also told them that the piano was beyond patches and minor work. It was 112 years old and worn out.

With that clear picture painted for them, will they do work on it? I doubt it. If they do call, however, I will do which ever option they choose. I will enjoy doing it and will warranty the work for five years. They will enjoy the piano.

If they don’t do the work, I deeply hope that it does go to the landfill. thumb
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#2015124 - 01/15/13 09:07 PM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: Jerry Groot RPT]
BDB Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/07/03
Posts: 21818
Loc: Oakland
Originally Posted By: Jerry Groot RPT


The problem is that they don't just call in the "pro's." More often than not, they call in the half pro's. People that will do anything for a buck. Tell them anything they want to hear. They will tune it 1/2 tone flat without even trying to raise it to pitch. They will tune it wherever. They will spend money fixing something that isn't worth fixing just because it's money in the 1/2 pro's pocketbook.


Hey, I resemble that remark! Of course, I am the other half of that half-pro, the one who knows the stuff, but does not need the money, as opposed to the one who needs the money but does not know the stuff! smile
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#2015143 - 01/15/13 09:35 PM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: Brittin]
Jerry Groot RPT Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/07/07
Posts: 6828
Loc: Grand Rapids Michigan
So, you're telling me that you're stuffed full? You'd make a good teddy bear BDB! thumb
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Piano Technicians Guild
Grand Rapids, Michigan
www.grootpiano.com

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#2015151 - 01/15/13 09:57 PM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: Brittin]
BDB Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/07/03
Posts: 21818
Loc: Oakland
A lot of people tell me I am full of stuff!
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#2015276 - 01/16/13 03:54 AM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: Nash. Piano Rescue]
JohnSprung Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/02/11
Posts: 1549
Loc: Reseda, California
Originally Posted By: Nash. Piano Rescue
The state of TN is just one state trying to eliminate used piano sales and sales of other used items as well. Should be a great court battle.


Can you tell us more about that? I'm amazed to hear of such a dumb idea originating in a state other than California.... ;-)

If used piano sales are outlawed, only outlaws will sell used pianos??? ;-)
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Knabe Grand # 10927
Yamaha CP33
Kawai FS690

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#2015784 - 01/16/13 09:00 PM Re: Are pianos decreasing in value? (piano burning) [Re: Brittin]
Craig Hair Online   content
Full Member

Registered: 06/03/11
Posts: 205
Loc: Holyoke, MA
Decreased in value? Today I couldn't give away a bunch of Steinway uprights. We need to make room in our shop, and as we like our neighboring rebuilders we thought they might want them. They are in rough, original condition, but I was offering them to professional rebuilders. I thought at least one of them would want at least one of them. I'm still a little shocked. I knew the upright market was weak, but when free Steinways don't spark any interest it implys collapse.
Before our economic malaise, we all put out many nice rebuilt uprights. As many as you could, as nicely as you cared to. The market was there for quality at a premium. So I guess we could easily have flooded the local market, and our past work has become our worst competitor. But this never seemed to be the case with Steinways. There was always a demand for those, not always ravenous but never absent.
Its like the entire industry is eroding from the bottom up.
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Hampshire Piano
Holyoke, MA

hampshirepiano.co
soundboardrecrown.com

If I seem slow, I simply must be stopped

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