Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

SEARCH
the Forums & Piano World

This custom search works much better than the built in one and allows searching older posts.
(ad 125) Sweetwater - Digital Keyboards & Other Gear
Digital Pianos at Sweetwater
(ad) Pearl River
Pearl River Pianos
(ad) Pianoteq
(ad) P B Guide
Acoustic & Digital Piano Guide
PianoSupplies.com (150)
Piano Accessories Music Related Gifts Piano Tuning Equipment Piano Moving Equipment
We now offer Gift Certificates in our online store!
(ad) Estonia Piano
Estonia Piano
Quick Links to Useful Stuff
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers
*Organs

Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano Accessories
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Piano Books
*Piano Art, Pictures, & Posters
*Directory/Site Map
*Contest
*Links
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Screen Saver
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords
Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 4 >
Topic Options
#2015066 - 01/15/13 06:21 PM young students with 2 teachers at the same time
Barb860 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/11/09
Posts: 1646
Loc: northern California
Is anybody in this situation where their student is studying with 2 piano teachers? I recall seeing a thread on this subject some time ago, but would like to revisit this discussion. 2 students of mine (siblings) are now studying with me and another teacher. They have been students of mine for 2 years.Their parents wanted them to have more than one lesson per week but I don't have time for that, nor do I think it's necessary in the first place, but just my opinion there. My lessons are 45 minutes (individual lessons). This started a couple of weeks ago. Not sure how this is going to work out, having never been in this situation before, or heard of it, actually. Any thoughts please?

Parents hired teacher #2 on their own, without discussing with me beforehand, and I don't know this other teacher.


Edited by Barb860 (01/15/13 06:23 PM)
Edit Reason: more info
_________________________
Piano Teacher

Top
(ad) Piano & Music Accessories
piano accessories music gifts tuning and moving equipment
#2015115 - 01/15/13 08:43 PM Re: young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: Barb860]
musicpassion Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/30/12
Posts: 1045
Loc: California, USA
I wouldn't allow this situation to continue if it were in my studio. This would not be an acceptable arrangment.
_________________________
Pianist and Piano Teacher

Top
#2015135 - 01/15/13 09:25 PM Re: young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: musicpassion]
Barb860 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/11/09
Posts: 1646
Loc: northern California
I tend to agree. What are your reasons for thinking it would not be acceptable?
_________________________
Piano Teacher

Top
#2015136 - 01/15/13 09:26 PM Re: young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: Barb860]
ezpiano.org Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/10/11
Posts: 1023
Loc: Irvine, CA
I am sure parents has their freedom to hire 2 piano teachers if both children can handle the homework and parents can handle the bill.
Just make sure a few things:
1. Make sure kids are still progressing in your class. If they ended up no having time to practice your material, maybe is better to have 1 piano teacher.
2. Make sure that both piano teachers will not cover the same material at the same time. For example, if both piano teacher are teaching Clementi Sonata Op. 36, No. 1, then students might confused about different expectation in the interpretation area.
3. I know different teachers use different method in teaching theory too. I know some teachers just give the facts to the students and have them memorize it, but some actually teaching the concept so that students can apply the same concept into different scenario.

Lastly, I would prefer student take class only with me if it is only the issues that you talked about (parents wanted them to have more than one lesson per week). Why don't you adjust some of your students to move a little bit of their time so that you can squeeze them in?

If it is different issues such as students want to explore into different area of education such as jazz or composition that you do not offer, then I think it is fine for them to have a second piano teacher.
_________________________
http://ezpiano.org
Piano lessons in Irvine, CA
Watch the introduction video on YouTube
@ http://bit.ly/Ready123

Top
#2015175 - 01/15/13 10:38 PM Re: young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: ezpiano.org]
Barb860 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/11/09
Posts: 1646
Loc: northern California
ezpiano, thank you for your comments. I don't have time to work the kids in to my schedule so they can each have 2 45min lessons per week, because parents want them to come back-to-back. But really they don't need 2 lessons per week anyway, in my opinion. They are very young. But I agree with you, if parents want more for their kids, why not, as long as it works. I'm not sure this will work though. Situation is very new. I need to set some guidelines and appreciate comments and ideas here.
_________________________
Piano Teacher

Top
#2015177 - 01/15/13 10:40 PM Re: young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: Barb860]
ezpiano.org Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/10/11
Posts: 1023
Loc: Irvine, CA
Barb,
I think in your case here, it is better to have communication with second piano teacher to make sure that your materials are not overlap.
_________________________
http://ezpiano.org
Piano lessons in Irvine, CA
Watch the introduction video on YouTube
@ http://bit.ly/Ready123

Top
#2015181 - 01/15/13 10:47 PM Re: young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: ezpiano.org]
Barb860 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/11/09
Posts: 1646
Loc: northern California
perhaps a good idea, thank you, I may do that. Do you think I should tell the parents I am contacting teacher #2 or just call her on my own...? Again, this situation is brand new and I need to think things through and handle it professionally.
_________________________
Piano Teacher

Top
#2015186 - 01/15/13 11:01 PM Re: young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: Barb860]
Nikolas Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/26/07
Posts: 5305
Loc: Europe
I'm not sure I'd like it... Each teacher has its own style.

What if the 2nd teacher loves the suzuki method? That could certainly create problems... :-/

Personally I would contact the 2nd teacher, but I would be a bit grudgy of the family for not letting me know in advance...
_________________________
http://www.musica-ferrum.com

Top
#2015188 - 01/15/13 11:07 PM Re: young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: Barb860]
The Monkeys Online   content
Full Member

Registered: 01/13/12
Posts: 428
Loc: Vancouver BC
How did you find out they hired the second teacher? Did the parents or the kids tell you?

Top
#2015191 - 01/15/13 11:12 PM Re: young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: The Monkeys]
Barb860 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/11/09
Posts: 1646
Loc: northern California
parents told me.
_________________________
Piano Teacher

Top
#2015193 - 01/15/13 11:16 PM Re: young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: Barb860]
Minniemay Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/07/09
Posts: 1702
Loc: CA
They're nuts. This will only cause confusion for the child. I would never agree to it.
_________________________
B.A., Piano, Piano Pegagogy, Music Ed.
M.M., Piano

Top
#2015197 - 01/15/13 11:36 PM Re: young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: Barb860]
MaggieGirl Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/18/11
Posts: 488
I would ask the parents what their goal is with you and the other teacher.

I think this can only work in a real partnership with the other teacher.

Not two teachers doing their own things - that is just confusing.

Top
#2015203 - 01/16/13 12:00 AM Re: young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: Barb860]
rlinkt Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/08/12
Posts: 320
Loc: CA
Ask the parents directly about the motivation behind getting the second teacher. Perhaps it something like you teach classical piano while the other teacher teaches jazz.

Top
#2015219 - 01/16/13 12:53 AM Re: young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: Barb860]
Opus_Maximus Online   content
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/27/04
Posts: 1494
Normally I would disagree with it, but I do think there is something to be said for having multiple lessons a week - even at a young age.

Possibly the most important aspect that one can take from piano lessons, even at the early stages, is that of regular, structured practice sessions. What a student does between lessons is EVERYTHING. If these students' parents have never played and don't know anything about monitoring practice, I can see the logic in them wanting to have a second session a week to serve as quasi-practice time, or to ingrain more of an incentive to practice at home. Of course, some kids and parents just don't ever practice, at all, or do not really see any purpose of playing outside the lesson, but it would seem as if parents who would WANT this are a cut above the average parent.

If they care enough about piano to go out of their way and hire a second teacher, I'd second EZN's comments about trying to make room in your schedule to see them twice a week. I suppose if this is not possible, the best would be for YOU to choose that other teacher, so they can sort of work as your assistant, or - in the very least - you are in close communication and agreement with the goals and procedures. I do think it was unacceptable for them to do so without consulting you.


Edited by Opus_Maximus (01/16/13 12:55 AM)

Top
#2015220 - 01/16/13 12:56 AM Re: young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: Barb860]
The Monkeys Online   content
Full Member

Registered: 01/13/12
Posts: 428
Loc: Vancouver BC
Maybe they read this forum and believed having 2 lessons a week would progress 4 times as fast :-)

I think this is the time to provide some parent education.
Things can work out only if all parties, the teacher, the parent and the students work toward the same goal.

If I were the parent, I would appreciate an honest discussion, tell me the pros and cons of the having 2 teachers, and how to help the kids to practice.

If they still insist to have 2 lessons a week, and you cannot offer the time, offer to co-coordinate with second teacher.

I would not by-passing the parent to call the second teacher directly. Doesn't matter how good the intention is, it would look bad.

Top
#2015236 - 01/16/13 01:35 AM Re: young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: Barb860]
AZNpiano Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/07/07
Posts: 5512
Loc: Orange County, CA
I think the student at this level will be very confused.

Working with two teachers might have its merits at the college/conservatory level.
_________________________
Private Piano Teacher and MTAC Member

Top
#2015254 - 01/16/13 02:53 AM Re: young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: AZNpiano]
Michael_99 Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/28/12
Posts: 935
Loc: Canada Alberta
My gut feeling is that the parents may be trying to change the teacher and that can be difficult and takes time so they keep 2 separate teachers neither teacher knows each other or which one of them is going to be axed. How else can you explain it? Lots of employers have employees and only axes the ones they don't want. This is just a smaller scale.

Top
#2015271 - 01/16/13 03:44 AM Re: young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: Barb860]
musicpassion Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/30/12
Posts: 1045
Loc: California, USA
Originally Posted By: Barb860
I tend to agree. What are your reasons for thinking it would not be acceptable?


If they are working on different music with each teacher, progress could be too slow. If they are working on the same music with different teachers, it could be confusing for the child.

I think their reason is based on an incorrect assumption. I think they are assuming this will make their child learn faster. Practicing more and working harder will make their child learn faster.

Also I wouldn't be allowed to enroll the child in CM. The program requires that I be their primary teacher, teaching almost all of their lessons.

Finally the emotional aspect: Part of the "job satisfaction" for our work is that we get to bring music into our student's lives and mold their understanding and capability. I don't want to have strife with another teacher's perhaps different musical ideas. I could deal with it, but it just wouldn't be worth it. It would be taking the fun out of the work.

By the way someone else mentioned college students or very advanced students - I think I would feel differently about that.
_________________________
Pianist and Piano Teacher

Top
#2015386 - 01/16/13 10:22 AM Re: young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: Michael_99]
Barb860 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/11/09
Posts: 1646
Loc: northern California
Originally Posted By: Michael_99
My gut feeling is that the parents may be trying to change the teacher and that can be difficult and takes time so they keep 2 separate teachers neither teacher knows each other or which one of them is going to be axed. How else can you explain it? Lots of employers have employees and only axes the ones they don't want. This is just a smaller scale.


Yes, I wonder about this and certainly hope it's not the case.

Thanks everyone for your thoughts on this situation. It's weighing on me and I need to talk with the parents now, after thinking it through. Honestly I feel kind of disrespected and bothered by it. And on another note, how does the other teacher feel? Like she is stealing students or possibly undermining the program the kids are currently doing?
_________________________
Piano Teacher

Top
#2015387 - 01/16/13 10:23 AM Re: young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: AZNpiano]
Barb860 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/11/09
Posts: 1646
Loc: northern California
Originally Posted By: AZNpiano
I think the student at this level will be very confused.

Working with two teachers might have its merits at the college/conservatory level.


Absolutely agree, and these points will be brought up with the parents.
_________________________
Piano Teacher

Top
#2015392 - 01/16/13 10:30 AM Young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: Barb860]
LoPresti Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/07/10
Posts: 1304
Loc: New York
Barb,

Prior to engaging another teacher, did the parents ask you about giving the siblings a second of set of lessons each week? If so, did you ask them why they wanted this?

Tell us a little more about that conversation.
Ed
_________________________
In music, everything one does correctly helps everything else.

Top
#2015499 - 01/16/13 01:45 PM Re: Young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: Barb860]
Piano*Dad Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/12/05
Posts: 10385
Loc: Williamsburg, VA
I will reiterate what I have said on this topic many times.

For a number of years my son studied with two teachers, but sequentially during the year instead of simultaneously. His primary teacher did not teach during the summer, and I did not want him to go three months without formal instruction. But at some point, his primary teacher began to teach in the summer. Instead of using her, I kept him with the other teacher during the summer. He worked well with both teachers. They had different styles and personalities. And I saw real benefit to him of working with this other teacher over the summer. They tended to work more on lighter music, more popular stuff, and on lots of sight reading. The work he did with her was largely complementary with his other teacher's style and program. The two teachers knew each other as well, and they got along just fine.

I would not be inclined toward simultaneous lessons with two teachers unless those teachers coordinated quite fully and completely, and this would be especially true if the student is quite young. The potential for confusion and misunderstanding seems too great.
_________________________
Grotrian 192 #156455

https://www.youtube.com/user/dhfeld/videos

Top
#2015521 - 01/16/13 02:34 PM Re: Young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: LoPresti]
Barb860 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/11/09
Posts: 1646
Loc: northern California
Originally Posted By: LoPresti
Barb,

Prior to engaging another teacher, did the parents ask you about giving the siblings a second of set of lessons each week? If so, did you ask them why they wanted this?

Tell us a little more about that conversation.
Ed


I was asked to come to their home to work with them in the evenings and said no.
(this would have been in addition to their 45 minute lessons with me once per week, at my studio). Parents wanted more teaching time for the kids. I said 45 minutes per week (kids are ages 6 and 8) for lessons was enough in my opinion.
_________________________
Piano Teacher

Top
#2015523 - 01/16/13 02:37 PM Re: Young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: Piano*Dad]
Barb860 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/11/09
Posts: 1646
Loc: northern California
Originally Posted By: Piano*Dad
I will reiterate what I have said on this topic many times.

For a number of years my son studied with two teachers, but sequentially during the year instead of simultaneously. His primary teacher did not teach during the summer, and I did not want him to go three months without formal instruction. But at some point, his primary teacher began to teach in the summer. Instead of using her, I kept him with the other teacher during the summer. He worked well with both teachers. They had different styles and personalities. And I saw real benefit to him of working with this other teacher over the summer. They tended to work more on lighter music, more popular stuff, and on lots of sight reading. The work he did with her was largely complementary with his other teacher's style and program. The two teachers knew each other as well, and they got along just fine.

I would not be inclined toward simultaneous lessons with two teachers unless those teachers coordinated quite fully and completely, and this would be especially true if the student is quite young. The potential for confusion and misunderstanding seems too great.


I understand what you are saying and agree completely. Thanks for your take on this.
_________________________
Piano Teacher

Top
#2015572 - 01/16/13 03:36 PM Re: young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: Barb860]
ezpiano.org Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/10/11
Posts: 1023
Loc: Irvine, CA
Quote:
I was asked to come to their home to work with them in the evenings and said no.


To work with them means to learn a new piece or to monitor the practice?

I had some parents ask me if I can introduce anyone in high-school for them to "babysit the practice session" at home twice a week for a cheaper price of taking real piano lesson.

Just curious what is the motivation of the parents.
_________________________
http://ezpiano.org
Piano lessons in Irvine, CA
Watch the introduction video on YouTube
@ http://bit.ly/Ready123

Top
#2015596 - 01/16/13 04:11 PM Re: young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: ezpiano.org]
Barb860 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/11/09
Posts: 1646
Loc: northern California
I called and spoke with both parents on a conference call. They want the kids to be "the best they can be" and therefore want as much teaching as possible.
They have asked teacher #2 to help the kids practice, 2 nights per week, one hour per kid each night. They will practice the material we cover at lessons at my studio .
This teacher will also help the kids with their school homework as well.

We'll see how this goes. I brought up the concern of confusing the kids with possible conflicting information and the parents seemed to be on board with me on that. I'll report back here, hoping this situation works. thanks for your suggestions and comments.
_________________________
Piano Teacher

Top
#2015600 - 01/16/13 04:14 PM Re: Young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: Barb860]
childofparadise2002 Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/13/04
Posts: 542
Originally Posted By: Barb860


I was asked to come to their home to work with them in the evenings and said no.
(this would have been in addition to their 45 minute lessons with me once per week, at my studio). Parents wanted more teaching time for the kids. I said 45 minutes per week (kids are ages 6 and 8) for lessons was enough in my opinion.


What I hear from my friends in Asia is that it is not at all unusual for parents to hire a piano tutor (usually college students in music majors) to supervise their children's practice at home. These are very different from lessons. The tutors are there to make sure that the kids follow teachers' instructions during practice. For parents who don't have any training in music, this adds structure and guidance in addition to weekly lessons.

Top
#2015609 - 01/16/13 04:21 PM Re: Young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: Barb860]
ezpiano.org Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/10/11
Posts: 1023
Loc: Irvine, CA
Hi Barb
I think this is a best scenario you could have. Looks like they are having a "piano tutor" that will follow your instruction when supervising the practice.
I hope I can have more parents like this.

You know some people hire math tutor to teach at home to supplement the teaching at school. I think it is the same idea.
_________________________
http://ezpiano.org
Piano lessons in Irvine, CA
Watch the introduction video on YouTube
@ http://bit.ly/Ready123

Top
#2015625 - 01/16/13 04:42 PM Re: Young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: Barb860]
The Monkeys Online   content
Full Member

Registered: 01/13/12
Posts: 428
Loc: Vancouver BC
So maybe this is a language thing?
What they hired is actually a tutor/monitor, not a teacher.

Very common among the wealthier Asian families. You, the teacher's instruction will still be taken as Bible.

Top
#2015631 - 01/16/13 04:53 PM Re: Young students with 2 teachers at the same time [Re: Barb860]
Piano*Dad Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/12/05
Posts: 10385
Loc: Williamsburg, VA
Supervised practice is great adjunct to learning. In fact, that was my role at home to some extent, especially when my son was a beginner/intermediate student.

But it's not restricted to annoying parents and young students. Look at how many of the good summer festivals work (Interlochen, for example). You get a certain amount of lesson time and you get a certain amount of supervised practice over your 4 or 8 week experience. Supervised practice is not a pedagogical novelty. It's well used.
_________________________
Grotrian 192 #156455

https://www.youtube.com/user/dhfeld/videos

Top
Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 4 >

Moderator:  Ken Knapp 
What's Hot!!
8 Live Ragtime Piano Players on the Cape!
-------------------
HOW TO POST PICTURES on the Piano Forums
-------------------
Sharing is Caring!
About the Buttons
-------------------
(125ad) Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
Ad (Seiler/Knabe)
Seiler Pianos
Sheet Music
(PW is an affiliate)
Sheet Music Plus Featured Sale
(ad) HAILUN Pianos
Hailun Pianos - Click for More
(ad) Lindeblad Piano
Lindeblad Piano Restoration
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Coolest Back Action I have Seen
by Steve Jackson
30 minutes 58 seconds ago
Steinway piano with two offset keyboards
by guyl
Today at 10:36 AM
Black and white dampers
by iLaw
Today at 09:55 AM
AUGUST FORSTER
by Karl Watson
Today at 09:05 AM
Piano lessons: every week or every two weeks?
by Pover
Today at 06:34 AM
Who's Online
143 registered (Anne'sson, ando, ajames, Almaviva, Alexander Borro, anamnesis, 41 invisible), 1527 Guests and 16 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Stats
76639 Members
42 Forums
158470 Topics
2327173 Posts

Max Online: 15252 @ 03/21/10 11:39 PM
(ads by Google)

Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
|
Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World | Donate | Link to Us | Classifieds |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter | Press Room |


copyright 1997 - 2014 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission