Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

Gifts and supplies for the musician

the Forums & Piano World

This custom search works much better than the built in one and allows searching older posts.
(ad) Yamaha CP4 Rebate
Yamaha CP4 Rebate
(ad) Pianoteq
(ad) Pearl River
Pearl River Pianos
(ad) P B Guide
Acoustic & Digital Piano Guide
(ad) Lindeblad Piano
Lindeblad Piano Restoration
Who's Online
173 registered (Aceituna, 36251, accordeur, Abby Pianoman, 42 invisible), 1655 Guests and 10 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
(ad) Estonia Piano
Estonia Pianos
Quick Links to Useful Piano & Music Resources
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers

Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano & Music Accessories
*Music School Listings
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Piano Books
*Piano Art, Pictures, & Posters
*Directory/Site Map
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Screen Saver
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords
Page 3 of 3 < 1 2 3
Topic Options
#2023383 - 01/29/13 10:55 AM Re: Spirtual pieces... [Re: SlatterFan]
pianoloverus Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 19944
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: SlatterFan
Originally Posted By: debrucey
Incurably romantic? Hmmmm.
To me Ravel is all surface. Pristine, cultivated, remarkable surface, but surface nonetheless. The closest he got to romanticism was Gaspard, and that was only intended as a caricature. Of all composers I can't think of one who wore his heart on his sleeve less than Ravel.
This isn't a criticism, it's what makes him great.

Ravel might agree with you, and from what I have read he was far more interested in the craft of composing than expressing emotions. But I think much of his music tells a different story. For example, whatever his intentions were when he composed Gaspard de la Nuit, genuine romanticism is there, especially in Le somber and chilling Gibet(!) and the more menacing aspects of Scarbo. I already felt that about Ravel before I heard him play, and then his piano roll recordings confirmed it: reserved in some aspects perhaps, but still emotional.

However much Ravel denied being a romantic, and however we see things about his personality and life that confirm this, taking his music on its own terms, it is romantic and emotional and occasionally "spiritual" to some of us. I'm sure that it isn't a unique phenomenon, that some people are able to express qualities in their art that they could never reveal in the rest of their lives, giving the best of themselves and reaching beyond themselves, whether consciously or not.

This touches on a subject that has been debated on this forum a few times: whether it is beneficial, or always beneficial, to know a lot of background information about a composer's life, personality, and the circumstances surrounding the creation of their works. At times like this I wonder if it can be a hindrance. For decades last century lots of people were taught that Chopin was this frail, delicate creature who composed mostly delicate, ornamental music, and I wonder how much that stereotyping hindered people's appreciation of Chopin's art? So when I see Ravel's music described as "all surface", I wince. To me there is more to be discovered and felt in Ravel's music than that.
For me the pieces in Gaspard paint beautiful, horrifying, or scary images but contain little emotion. In all of Ravel's piano music I see little about love, sadness, desire, joy, spirituality, etc. I feel the same about almost all of Debussy's piano music. OTOH I think the piano music of Bach, Mozart, Beethoven, Chopin, Schumann, Schubert, Brahms, Liszt, Rachmaninov, etc. is filled with depiction human emotion.

Ad 800 (Pearl River)
Pearl River World's Best Selling Piano
#2023489 - 01/29/13 02:29 PM Re: Spirtual pieces... [Re: Mark_C]
FSO Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/03/12
Posts: 854
Loc: UK, Brighton
Originally Posted By: Mark_C

Oh -- this isn't also about spritetual pieces? grin

I'm sorry but if nobody else is going to speak up...you *will* be held accountable for your crimes, faerie funny though they may be.
Sometimes, we all just need to be shown a little kindness <3

#2023502 - 01/29/13 03:13 PM Re: Spirtual pieces... [Re: Mark_C]
ChopinAddict Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/29/09
Posts: 6222
Loc: Land of the never-ending music
Originally Posted By: Mark_C
Originally Posted By: beet31425
Not for me....This music is a glimpse into the perfect glittering world of the naiads and water-sprites....

Oh -- this isn't also about spritetual pieces? grin

I think sprite-ual would be easier to pronounce! grin

Music is my best friend.

#2023829 - 01/30/13 04:45 AM Re: Spirtual pieces... [Re: wr]
SlatterFan Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/13/09
Posts: 791
Loc: Brighton, UK
Originally Posted By: wr
I hear most of Ravel's music as being extremely intense emotionally, but under equally extreme control.
I agree.

Originally Posted By: wr
I think it is a more interesting spiritual exercise to try to be open to the spiritual in places where you don't expect it, and maybe even in music you think is vulgar junk. Stuff that is culturally branded as being "spiritual" is, in a way, too easy (not to mention that it won't have the same effect on everyone).

Originally Posted By: pianoloverus
For me the pieces in Gaspard paint beautiful, horrifying, or scary images but contain little emotion. In all of Ravel's piano music I see little about love, sadness, desire, joy, spirituality, etc.
The emotion I feel in Ravel's music is closest to sadness, with some love and desire mixed in, but these tend to permeate the music in a very constrained way rather than being expressed directly, in a very different way from most other composers of that era. It is difficult to put into words, but I feel in Ravel's music yearning and loneliness, associated with feeling somewhat isolated and disconnected from life; a fascination and appreciation of the beautiful, horrific, scary, interesting, etc.; and thus an attempt to connect and no longer be isolated and lonely. Someone who is somewhat on the outside looking in. I think there is a childlike nature as well, as others have pointed out: someone who hadn't fully grown up, which contributed to the feeling of isolation and disconnection. I'm sure other composers felt some of these things too, but Ravel is the one who particularly seems to capture them in his music.

I think that part of what makes Ravel's music special is that listeners can enjoy the fascination and appreciation of the beautiful, horrific, scary, interesting, etc., and have a fine experience, with or without feeling emotion within the music.

#2028008 - 02/06/13 10:48 AM Re: Spirtual pieces... [Re: JoelW]
pianomandb95 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/03/13
Posts: 12
Loc: England
I think this is pretty spiritual... But maybe in more of a religious way;


Valentina is amazing!

Edited by pianomandb95 (02/06/13 12:04 PM)
“Music is enough for a lifetime, but a lifetime is not enough for music.”
― Sergei Rachmaninoff

Page 3 of 3 < 1 2 3

Moderator:  Brendan, Kreisler 
Shop our Store for Music Lovers!
PianoSupplies.com is Piano World's Online Store
Please visit our store today.
circle of 5ths coaster
(ad 125) Sweetwater - Digital Keyboards & Other Gear
Digital Pianos at Sweetwater
(ad) Hal Leonard Teacher VIP
Hal Leonard Teacher VIP Your Source for Piano Music
Ad (Seiler/Knabe)
Seiler Pianos
(125ad) Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Prokofiev flute sonata, op. 94
by TwoSnowflakes
Today at 11:31 AM
Roland RP401 or Kawai CN25 ?
by Nitran
Today at 11:02 AM
Voicing down a piano
by lewisk1811
Today at 10:57 AM
How to play by ear correctly, how to improvise
by Aceituna
Today at 10:53 AM
The Mellow sound of Chopin's piano
by acortot
Today at 09:40 AM
What's Hot!!
Trade Regrets: Gary Trafton - Piano Rep
Historic Piano Documents
Posting Pictures on the Forums
Forums Rules & Help
on Piano World

The world's most popular piano web site.
Forum Stats
78,699 Registered Members
43 Forums
162,840 Topics
2,390,228 Posts

Most users ever online: 15,252 @ 03/21/10 11:39 PM
Sheet Music Plus (125)
Sheet Music Plus Featured Sale

Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World | Donate | Link to Us | Classifieds |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter | Press Room |

copyright 1997 - 2015 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission