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#2023823 - 01/30/13 04:31 AM quiet student
ten left thumbs Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/22/09
Posts: 3336
Loc: Scotland
I have a beginner (girl, 7yo) who resists anything other than pp, and I'm wondering how others would handle this.

She is on MFPA book B, progressing well, bright, practices at home. She only speaks when asked a direct question, and then only in a whisper. She will only play pp and when asked to play louder she will get to about mp but visibly doesn't like it.

We do all the usual stuff about arm weight, and you can see her relaxing her arm down to an inch above the key, then tensing up and, well, what comes out is pp.

I'm beginning to wonder whether she really dislikes loud noises. (My son had this, and he was really phobic of cinemas, etc). She has a DP at home, and perhaps by comparison, my noisy piano is frightening to her? I was wondering whether I should ignore this just now, let her play quiet and wait for her to mature?

What would others do?
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#2023826 - 01/30/13 04:38 AM Re: quiet student [Re: ten left thumbs]
Nikolas Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/26/07
Posts: 5245
Loc: Europe
Spend a lesson listening to music. To classical music, and perhaps not only. Find works with a great dynamic range. Get the Bolero for example, or some other work, or some movie soundtrack. Show her the difference between loud and soft, and why it's nice to have variations...

Alternatively just get her to laugh... Make jokes, be funny, etc... That should help out the situation a bit I think.

Best of luck!
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#2023880 - 01/30/13 07:31 AM Re: quiet student [Re: ten left thumbs]
ten left thumbs Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/22/09
Posts: 3336
Loc: Scotland
Good idea. She's not the easiest kid to get to laugh, but we could do some listening.
_________________________
I am a competent teacher.


www.justfingers.co.uk
www.babysinging.co.uk

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#2023886 - 01/30/13 07:44 AM Re: quiet student [Re: ten left thumbs]
TimR Online   content
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/17/04
Posts: 3190
Loc: Virginia, USA
I have a DP at home.

If I turn the master volume down, I need a good bit of weight to make any sound.

If I turn the master volume up, I almost can't play softly enough not to get an explosive bang out of it that's quite disconcerting.

I've tried to set the volume to respond as near to an acoustic as I can, just like I set the incline on a treadmill to match the effort on a real track. Perhaps the child's DP needs some adjusting. Maybe it should be set artificially soft for a while.
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#2023916 - 01/30/13 08:57 AM Re: quiet student [Re: ten left thumbs]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 11756
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
It could be a few things: the DP at home if it's turned down or if she uses headphones, she will be used to a lower volume. However, the fact that she is very soft-spoken too may hint at some things. I would ask her parents if she appears to be sensitive to loud noises. Knowing whether or not this is a physical issue vs. psychological would be helpful.
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#2023971 - 01/30/13 10:43 AM Re: quiet student [Re: ten left thumbs]
Peter K. Mose Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/06/12
Posts: 1337
Loc: Toronto, Ontario
Ask her if she can throw a tantrum at the keyboard, just as a game.

Or tell her to adopt another persona, just as a game. Have her put on a scarf, or a hat, or a mask, and then tell her to play like a Canadian.

You might see a new girl inside.


Edited by Peter K. Mose (01/30/13 10:43 AM)

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#2023976 - 01/30/13 10:55 AM Re: quiet student [Re: Peter K. Mose]
Minniemay Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/07/09
Posts: 1702
Loc: CA
Originally Posted By: Peter K. Mose
tell her to play like a Canadian.


Angela Hewitt, perhaps?
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B.A., Piano, Piano Pegagogy, Music Ed.
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#2023977 - 01/30/13 10:57 AM Re: quiet student [Re: ten left thumbs]
R0B Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/03/08
Posts: 1439
Loc: Australia
Nothing wrong with waiting.
If it's in there, it will come out in time.
_________________________
Rob

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#2023985 - 01/30/13 11:20 AM Re: quiet student [Re: Peter K. Mose]
AZNpiano Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/07/07
Posts: 5459
Loc: Orange County, CA
Originally Posted By: Peter K. Mose
Ask her if she can throw a tantrum at the keyboard, just as a game.

Oh, don't give these children any ideas about throwing a tantrum.

Maybe relate forte sound with a big animal (elephant, whale, dinosaur) and piano sound with a small animal (mouse, kitten, puppy). Or associate different sound levels with different moods (happy = loud, sad = soft). But if it doesn't work with this girl, you might want to wait a few more months. It just might be a confidence issue.
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#2024011 - 01/30/13 11:58 AM Re: quiet student [Re: Peter K. Mose]
landorrano Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/26/06
Posts: 2457
Loc: France
Originally Posted By: Peter K. Mose
Ask her if she can throw a tantrum at the keyboard, just as a game.

Or tell her to adopt another persona, just as a game. Have her put on a scarf, or a hat, or a mask, and then tell her to play like a Canadian.

You might see a new girl inside.


That's great, fantastic! Love it!

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#2024031 - 01/30/13 12:35 PM Re: quiet student [Re: Peter K. Mose]
Peter K. Mose Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/06/12
Posts: 1337
Loc: Toronto, Ontario
Originally Posted By: Peter K. Mose


Or tell her to adopt another persona, just as a game. Have her put on a scarf, or a hat, or a mask, and then tell her to play like a Canadian.



Ask her to try playing like a Scot.


Edited by Peter K. Mose (01/30/13 12:37 PM)

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#2024039 - 01/30/13 12:51 PM Re: quiet student [Re: Peter K. Mose]
Forstergirl Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/02/09
Posts: 59
Loc: Ontario
Highland or Lowland?

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#2024044 - 01/30/13 12:57 PM Re: quiet student [Re: ten left thumbs]
Matt Walker Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 01/23/13
Posts: 16
Loc: Birmingham, UK
I also have a girl who is quite reluctant to play forte. Everytime I go round her piano volume is set quite low, and I have a feeling it's because her parents don't like her playing loudly.

Still, IMO students find playing pianissimo very hard; your pupil sounds like a natural!

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#2024059 - 01/30/13 01:26 PM Re: quiet student [Re: ten left thumbs]
ten left thumbs Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/22/09
Posts: 3336
Loc: Scotland
Thanks for the suggestions.

I can't ask her to throw a tantrum - she's very well behaved and I don't think she knows the meaning of the word.

As for playing like a Scot: well it is a particularly Scottish trait, especially for girls, to be very shy and retiring. Not to say a word in class, and never to speak above a whisper to an adult. So, I don't think that's going to cut it really.
_________________________
I am a competent teacher.


www.justfingers.co.uk
www.babysinging.co.uk

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#2024083 - 01/30/13 02:29 PM Re: quiet student [Re: ten left thumbs]
keystring Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 11656
Loc: Canada
Isn't it possible that she is taught to be polite, unobtrusive, and maybe never make mistakes - that kind of thing?

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#2024092 - 01/30/13 02:43 PM Re: quiet student [Re: keystring]
ten left thumbs Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/22/09
Posts: 3336
Loc: Scotland
Something like that.

She's also one of the few kids around who is black.
_________________________
I am a competent teacher.


www.justfingers.co.uk
www.babysinging.co.uk

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#2024109 - 01/30/13 03:21 PM Re: quiet student [Re: ten left thumbs]
Vid Online   content
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/12/01
Posts: 831
Loc: Vancouver, B.C.
And how do Canadians play? Like Glenn Gould??? smile
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Kawai VPC1, Pianoteq, Galaxy Vintage D

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#2024178 - 01/30/13 05:23 PM Re: quiet student [Re: ten left thumbs]
Peter K. Mose Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/06/12
Posts: 1337
Loc: Toronto, Ontario
We try to mimic hockey players like Rocket Richard and Wayne Gretzky. At least I do.

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#2024191 - 01/30/13 05:49 PM Re: quiet student [Re: Peter K. Mose]
keystring Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 11656
Loc: Canada
Originally Posted By: Peter K. Mose
We try to mimic hockey players like Rocket Richard and Wayne Gretzky. At least I do.

Yeah, we have some pretty butchy women up here. It's the weather.

Actually can usually tell by excessive reverb and politeness of the kind "Thank you kindly!" (See Due South). The reverb is a technical problem we're still working out. We have tried getting rid of the smoothness on our igloos, but alas, the ice melts and refreezes, and the reverb is back.

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#2024214 - 01/30/13 06:30 PM Re: quiet student [Re: ten left thumbs]
MaggieGirl Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/18/11
Posts: 477
I tease my daughter's coach that he should be glad she is getting taller so he doesn't have to bend over almost double to hear her. I have audacity and you can play an mp3 file and "see it" on the screen. Maybe you could have her play and record until it gets to "so high" on the volume scale. Maybe there is some sort of tool like that as an app?

You could also ask her parent to help her play louder - as them to listen from another room in the house.

Let mom or dad know as well about her not being heard easily while speaking. Her piano teacher doesn't mind my daughter being soft spoken but it also doesn't effect her playing. Her class teacher is a little tired of it so we have "practice" at home and she volunteered to lead the class recitals to help her project her voice. I didn't realize it was effecting class discussions so i was glad her teacher mentioned it to both of us.

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