Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

SEARCH
the Forums & Piano World

This custom search works much better than the built in one and allows searching older posts.
(ad) End Stage Fright
End Stage Fright
(ad) Pianoteq
Latest Pianoteq add-on instrument: U4 upright piano
(ad) Pearl River
Pearl River Pianos
(ad) P B Guide
Acoustic & Digital Piano Guide
PianoSupplies.com (150)
Piano Accessories Music Related Gifts Piano Tuning Equipment Piano Moving Equipment
We now offer Gift Certificates in our online store!
(ad) Estonia Piano
Estonia Piano
Quick Links to Useful Stuff
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers
*Organs

Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano Accessories
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Piano Books
*Piano Art, Pictures, & Posters
*Directory/Site Map
*Contest
*Links
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Screen Saver
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords
Page 2 of 2 < 1 2
Topic Options
#2025629 - 02/01/13 10:20 PM Re: ACTUAL cheating? (scherzo 4, Chopin competition) [Re: Kuanpiano]
JoelW Online   content
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/25/12
Posts: 4138
Originally Posted By: Kuanpiano
Great = Fantasie Impromptu, parts of the 4th ballade.
Weird - Revolutionary etude. Where's the dynamic contrast? Heroic Polonaise - why is everything so perky and staccato?


There's nothing abnormal about his etude's dynamics. It's all there.

As for the polonaise, that I understand. I guess it's a matter of taste. I love his polonaise. I can't even listen to others' renditions anymore. They're all so overly done with rubato. It spoils the piece.

Top
(ad) Piano & Music Accessories
piano accessories music gifts tuning and moving equipment
#2025863 - 02/02/13 12:00 PM Re: ACTUAL cheating? (scherzo 4, Chopin competition) [Re: JoelW]
Kuanpiano Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/06/10
Posts: 2048
Loc: Canada
He doesn't respect the "piano" markings, but instead just plays forte all the way through. Like it works in a live performance, but if you listen to it a few times it gets a bit monotonous.

Just FYI, my favourite interpretation of the 4th scherzo is by Richter, who makes it sparkle like nobody else.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EF0orKWbP-c
_________________________
Working on:
Ravel - Ondine
Debussy - Suite Bergamasque
Schubert - Drei Klavierstücke D. 946
Rachmaninoff - Piano Sonata op.28

Top
#2025867 - 02/02/13 12:05 PM Re: ACTUAL cheating? (scherzo 4, Chopin competition) [Re: Kuanpiano]
JoelW Online   content
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/25/12
Posts: 4138
Originally Posted By: Kuanpiano
He doesn't respect the "piano" markings, but instead just plays forte all the way through. Like it works in a live performance, but if you listen to it a few times it gets a bit monotonous.

Just FYI, my favourite interpretation of the 4th scherzo is by Richter, who makes it sparkle like nobody else.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EF0orKWbP-c


sick Sorry...

Top
#2025913 - 02/02/13 01:32 PM Re: ACTUAL cheating? (scherzo 4, Chopin competition) [Re: Kuanpiano]
Damon Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/22/06
Posts: 5913
Loc: St. Louis area
Originally Posted By: Kuanpiano
Great = Fantasie Impromptu, parts of the 4th ballade.
Weird - Revolutionary etude. Where's the dynamic contrast? Heroic Polonaise - why is everything so perky and staccato?


Agreed, on all counts! I would add that the polonaise is nearly unbearable.
_________________________
Prepositions are not words to end sentences with.

Top
#2025918 - 02/02/13 01:46 PM Re: ACTUAL cheating? (scherzo 4, Chopin competition) [Re: Kuanpiano]
argerichfan Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/15/06
Posts: 8695
Loc: Pacific Northwest, US.
Originally Posted By: Kuanpiano

Just FYI, my favourite interpretation of the 4th scherzo is by Richter, who makes it sparkle like nobody else...

Ashkenazy's earlier Decca recording is quite nifty also.

And try Godowsky. He is very special:
_________________________
Jason

Top
#2025920 - 02/02/13 01:49 PM Re: ACTUAL cheating? (scherzo 4, Chopin competition) [Re: argerichfan]
Mark_C Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 19285
Loc: New York
Thanks!
I didn't know we even had any recordings of his, even though I'm a big fan of those old-old recordings.

Top
#2026011 - 02/02/13 07:07 PM Re: ACTUAL cheating? (scherzo 4, Chopin competition) [Re: Damon]
JoelW Online   content
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/25/12
Posts: 4138
Originally Posted By: Damon
Originally Posted By: Kuanpiano
Great = Fantasie Impromptu, parts of the 4th ballade.
Weird - Revolutionary etude. Where's the dynamic contrast? Heroic Polonaise - why is everything so perky and staccato?


Agreed, on all counts! I would add that the polonaise is nearly unbearable.


You know, he won 'best polonaise' award.

Top
#2026096 - 02/02/13 11:24 PM Re: ACTUAL cheating? (scherzo 4, Chopin competition) [Re: JoelW]
Mark_C Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 19285
Loc: New York
Originally Posted By: JoelW
You know, he won 'best polonaise' award.

Well, I don't think it would have won "best polonaise" at the amateur Chopin competition there. ha

Top
#2026099 - 02/02/13 11:30 PM Re: ACTUAL cheating? (scherzo 4, Chopin competition) [Re: Mark_C]
JoelW Online   content
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/25/12
Posts: 4138
Originally Posted By: Mark_C
Originally Posted By: JoelW
You know, he won 'best polonaise' award.

Well, I don't think it would have won "best polonaise" at the amateur Chopin competition there. ha


I don't get it.

Top
#2026106 - 02/02/13 11:50 PM Re: ACTUAL cheating? (scherzo 4, Chopin competition) [Re: JoelW]
Mark_C Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 19285
Loc: New York
Originally Posted By: JoelW
I don't get it.

Good for you -- because it's just stupid. grin


And what's stupider is that I really think it's not as good as some of the polonaise performances at the amateur Chopin competitions. ha

And this isn't a first.
While I realize that most people would indeed think this is just stupid, and that it's ridiculous to think otherwise, and heck, they could be right ha
.....a couple of years ago, our guy fuzzy8balls posted a recording of himself playing the Op. 22, and another member who thought it needed a lot of improvement posted a couple of recordings of it from the Chopin competition, for him to use as models. I thought fuzzy's was already better, in the sense of being more interesting, more in the feeling of a polonaise, and more distinctive, which for me trumped things like little flaws here and there.

Top
#2026108 - 02/02/13 11:59 PM Re: ACTUAL cheating? (scherzo 4, Chopin competition) [Re: Mark_C]
JoelW Online   content
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/25/12
Posts: 4138
Originally Posted By: Mark_C
Originally Posted By: JoelW
I don't get it.

Good for you -- because it's just stupid. grin


And what's stupider is that I really think it's not as good as some of the polonaise performances at the amateur Chopin competitions. ha

And this isn't a first.
While I realize that most people would indeed think this is just stupid, and that it's ridiculous to think otherwise, and heck, they could be right ha
.....a couple of years ago, our guy fuzzy8balls posted a recording of himself playing the Op. 22, and another member who thought it needed a lot of improvement posted a couple of recordings of it from the Chopin competition, for him to use as models. I thought fuzzy's was already better, in the sense of being more interesting, more in the feeling of a polonaise, and more distinctive, which for me trumped things like little flaws here and there.


Bunin's polonaise... whistle

Top
#2026109 - 02/03/13 12:00 AM Re: ACTUAL cheating? (scherzo 4, Chopin competition) [Re: Mark_C]
JoelW Online   content
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/25/12
Posts: 4138
Originally Posted By: Mark_C


And what's stupider is that I really think it's not as good as some of the polonaise performances at the amateur Chopin competitions. ha



I agree, this is stupid. grin

Top
#2026143 - 02/03/13 01:54 AM Re: ACTUAL cheating? (scherzo 4, Chopin competition) [Re: JoelW]
Mark_C Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 19285
Loc: New York
Originally Posted By: JoelW
I agree, this is stupid. grin

Seems pretty safe. ha

Top
#2026155 - 02/03/13 02:42 AM Re: ACTUAL cheating? (scherzo 4, Chopin competition) [Re: Kreisler]
wower Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/13/10
Posts: 242
Loc: Calgary
Originally Posted By: Kreisler
Judges reward musicianship. They don't punish a lack of pedantry.


QFT
_________________________
Bad spellers of the world untie!

Top
#2026206 - 02/03/13 06:44 AM Re: ACTUAL cheating? (scherzo 4, Chopin competition) [Re: JoelW]
Damon Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/22/06
Posts: 5913
Loc: St. Louis area
Originally Posted By: JoelW
Originally Posted By: Damon
Originally Posted By: Kuanpiano
Great = Fantasie Impromptu, parts of the 4th ballade.
Weird - Revolutionary etude. Where's the dynamic contrast? Heroic Polonaise - why is everything so perky and staccato?


Agreed, on all counts! I would add that the polonaise is nearly unbearable.


You know, he won 'best polonaise' award.


Good for him. I won't ever listen to it again. I've never heard a performance of it that I liked less.
_________________________
Prepositions are not words to end sentences with.

Top
#2026208 - 02/03/13 06:50 AM Re: ACTUAL cheating? (scherzo 4, Chopin competition) [Re: Damon]
JoelW Online   content
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/25/12
Posts: 4138
Originally Posted By: Damon

Good for him. I won't ever listen to it again. I've never heard a performance of it that I liked less.


Hehehe...

Top
#2027054 - 02/04/13 06:15 PM Re: ACTUAL cheating? (scherzo 4, Chopin competition) [Re: JoelW]
SlatterFan Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/13/09
Posts: 783
Loc: Brighton, UK
Joel, thanks for sharing that performance. I don't feel as strongly as Mark_C, perhaps because I see that moment as being one of several weird moments! Bunin's playing comes across as full of warmth and heart, with plenty of sensitivity along with some choices that strike me as weird. I like that he *really* has the technique to do what he wants with the piece, and I think there are relatively few pianists who could claim that. He also mostly produces a large tone without banging unpleasantly.

Onto the weird bits... in several places Bunin opts for a detached sound where Chopin (and the music itself I feel) call for more fluidity. For example, right at measure 9 there is Ped. marked with the low staccato B, but Bunin plays without pedal there, and at every similar place throughout the piece. He fairly bounces off measure 151 (the D sharps in the treble that are written as lasting for six beats with ten. for good measure!!!) - pretty radical changes. I'm sure he had his reasons, but... hmmm. I also don't think he integrates some of the later details well, for example, the octaves from measure 614 sound more like a new idea interrupting another rather than organic impetuosity. And measures 752? He almost seems to get quieter at the end, rather than the ingenious 'crescendo within a chord' effect. I do like the performance as a whole though, honestly.

P.S. Is it just me, or does anyone else see measure 28 and similar as having written-out grace notes, 'enforced' in this case as occurring on the beat? I would play the initial quarter note slightly quicker than its strict metronomic value, to give the grace note feel.
_________________________
Julian

Top
Page 2 of 2 < 1 2

Moderator:  Brendan, Kreisler 
What's Hot!!
HOW TO POST PICTURES on the Piano Forums
-------------------
Sharing is Caring!
About the Buttons
-------------------
Forums Rules & Help
-------------------
ADVERTISE
on Piano World

The world's most popular piano web site.
-------------------
PIANO BOOKS
Interesting books about the piano, pianists, piano history, biographies, memoirs and more!
(125ad) Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
Sheet Music
(PW is an affiliate)
Sheet Music Plus Featured Sale
Download & Print Sheet Music Instantly
sheet music search
sheet music search

sheet music search
(ad) HAILUN Pianos
Hailun Pianos - Click for More
(ad) Lindeblad Piano
Lindeblad Piano Restoration
Who's Online
159 registered (Almaviva, ando, adanepst, 49 invisible), 1498 Guests and 42 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Stats
74206 Members
42 Forums
153496 Topics
2249288 Posts

Max Online: 15252 @ 03/21/10 11:39 PM
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Teaching memorization
by clarikeys
Today at 07:45 AM
Accepted Procedure for Having a Piano Tech look at a piano?
by Paul678
Today at 07:19 AM
Tips for playing a piece through
by Hemmingway
Today at 06:40 AM
Temperature and tuning
by Beemer
Today at 04:46 AM
Tired Fingers
by adanepst
Today at 01:45 AM
(ads by Google)

Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World | Donate | Link to Us | Classifieds |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter | Press Room |


copyright 1997 - 2014 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission