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#2068238 - 04/21/13 08:59 PM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: Piano*Dad]
Morodiene Offline
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Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 12391
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Originally Posted By: Piano*Dad
Originally Posted By: Morodiene
Originally Posted By: Piano*Dad


But Red Rose did not say that this was her general policy. Maybe it is, but that did not come across in the post.


Who cares? She can do whatever she wants, and it doesn't have to be in her policy.

If she gets weirded out by a potential student or parent, then she has every right to make a judgment call. If the guy and daughter turned out OK, then I'm sure she would want to see the girl at her studio to give her a thorough check through.

Any guy who would begrudge a woman doing this probably isn't right for her studio anyways.


Please tell me where I said she can't do what she wants? Please tell me where I said that she doesn't have the right "to make a judgment call."

Please read what I wrote and stop treating people as the enemy because you presume you know their deepest attitudes. Frankly, I'm getting sick of being smeared because of other peoples' hot buttons. Your hot button doesn't give you the right to condescend or to deliberately misread.


You said: "But Red Rose did not say that this was her general policy."
I said: "who cares?"

Did you mean something other than: "She should have it stated in her policy that the first meeting will be at Starbucks"?
_________________________
private piano/voice teacher FT
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Petrof 9'2, Roland FP-7, Yamaha MOX6, Kawai MP11


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#2068248 - 04/21/13 09:15 PM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: P.M.]
Piano*Dad Offline
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Registered: 04/12/05
Posts: 10429
Loc: Williamsburg, VA
If you read the rest of my long post to Keystring, i.e. go beyond that one sentence of mine that you quote, you will see the rest of the context. I was addressing Keystring's very specific contention that we needed to get beyond feelings. Please read all of Keystring's post, and all of my response. Keystring said, among other things,

Originally Posted By: keystring
I see it a somewhat different angle. I think that what I am countering is a general notion that we do things based on vague feelings and instincts,


I replied that RR had indeed used her instincts and feelings, appropriately so in this case. It was her instinct that caused her to behave the way she did, not a formal policy. Then you berate me for callousness? What the ...???

I said this:

Originally Posted By: Piano*Dad
First, let me say that RR's approach here seems quite sensible. But from what she said, this Starbucks approach for a first meeting is NOT her general policy. She did it in this case because she sensed something amiss.

That is why I said that these kind of experiences are hard to comment upon, beyond the usual forum "head nodding" in agreement. What lesson do I learn? Well, I learn that if I feel that a person is suspicious, based on what they say in emails or phone calls, that I should not let them into my house. OK, I think most of us knew that already.


How do you jump from this to me saying she ought to have a business policy before taking someone to coffee instead of to her house?
_________________________
Grotrian 192 #156455

https://www.youtube.com/user/dhfeld/videos

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#2068280 - 04/21/13 10:23 PM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: Piano*Dad]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 12391
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Originally Posted By: Piano*Dad
If you read the rest of my long post to Keystring, i.e. go beyond that one sentence of mine that you quote, you will see the rest of the context. I was addressing Keystring's very specific contention that we needed to get beyond feelings. Please read all of Keystring's post, and all of my response. Keystring said, among other things,

Originally Posted By: keystring
I see it a somewhat different angle. I think that what I am countering is a general notion that we do things based on vague feelings and instincts,


I replied that RR had indeed used her instincts and feelings, appropriately so in this case. It was her instinct that caused her to behave the way she did, not a formal policy. Then you berate me for callousness? What the ...???

I said this:

Originally Posted By: Piano*Dad
First, let me say that RR's approach here seems quite sensible. But from what she said, this Starbucks approach for a first meeting is NOT her general policy. She did it in this case because she sensed something amiss.

That is why I said that these kind of experiences are hard to comment upon, beyond the usual forum "head nodding" in agreement. What lesson do I learn? Well, I learn that if I feel that a person is suspicious, based on what they say in emails or phone calls, that I should not let them into my house. OK, I think most of us knew that already.


How do you jump from this to me saying she ought to have a business policy before taking someone to coffee instead of to her house?



OK, I see you were responding to keystring's statement about making a decision logically vs. emotionally. I apologize for jumping to conclusions. I got all riled up with the Journey's idiotic post and read into what you wrote. I'm sorry for that.

For what is worth, I personally have no problems with making emotional decisions. We are human beings and have emotions as well as intellectual, spiritual, and physical needs upon which we can base our decisions. Not any one is necessarily more or less important than another, although one may tend toward using one over another.
_________________________
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Petrof 9'2, Roland FP-7, Yamaha MOX6, Kawai MP11


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#2068283 - 04/21/13 10:29 PM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: Gary D.]
malkin Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/18/09
Posts: 2920
Loc: *sigh* Salt Lake City
Originally Posted By: Gary D.
Originally Posted By: keystring
Originally Posted By: Piano*Dad
But it's always wise to step back and ask just how many knots do you want to tie yourself into in order to feel comfortable existing in this world of ever present risk.

I don't think that what red-rose did is anything close to tying herself into knots. It was reasonable and prudent. I know you were responding to TimR, but I'd like RR's post not to be lost.

I love it when men have a private conversation about something that mainly involves women.

The word clueless comes to mind. smile


It would be clueless for men (or women) to have a "private conversation" about anything on a public internet internet forum.
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#2068292 - 04/21/13 10:45 PM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: Piano*Dad]
keystring Offline
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Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 12087
Loc: Canada
Originally Posted By: Piano*Dad

Is it, "can one rationalize the Starbucks approach "for occasional potential clients who rub you the wrong way over the phone" as a good formal business approach? Yeah, sure, I guess. That seems pretty obvious to me.

You are using quotation marks, but I can't tell whom you are quoting. Are you quoting someone, or are these your own words? If the latter, then it is again ridiculing and trivializing. "Who rub you the wrong way over the phone" sounds ridiculous.

If you are having problems with this, I wonder if it's due to experience. You are wondering about business practices - whether meeting a potential client at a public place to discuss business is a waste of time, for example. If you run your own business then this is not something you would wonder about, because it is common practice. I don't know if it can be explained.

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#2068299 - 04/21/13 10:53 PM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: P.M.]
Piano*Dad Offline
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Registered: 04/12/05
Posts: 10429
Loc: Williamsburg, VA
Yes, I'm quoting "myself" in those sentences. But you knew that.

Keystring, I'm not having problems with this. I'm wondering why you are expending so much effort constructing arguments about efficient business practice for this increasingly weird thread. My only comment about efficiency (if I recall correctly) was to note that a two-stage interview process starting at Starbucks and ending in the house, and doing this for every potential student, would probably be a drag on someone's time.
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https://www.youtube.com/user/dhfeld/videos

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#2068302 - 04/21/13 10:57 PM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: P.M.]
Piano*Dad Offline
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Registered: 04/12/05
Posts: 10429
Loc: Williamsburg, VA
Originally Posted By: Malkin
It would be clueless for men (or women) to have a "private conversation" about anything on a public internet internet forum.


Hah! Good one.
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Grotrian 192 #156455

https://www.youtube.com/user/dhfeld/videos

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#2068334 - 04/21/13 11:48 PM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: P.M.]
Gary D. Online   content
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/30/08
Posts: 4824
Loc: South Florida
Originally Posted By: malkin

It would be clueless for men (or women) to have a "private conversation" about anything on a public internet internet forum.

OK. Let me clarify. I want to be crystal clear.

Piano Dad replies to a comment from TimR, written February 05, 2013 10:51 AM as if it were something rather current.

Originally Posted By: TimR

Humans as a group are not very good at evaluating real risk as opposed to perceived risk.

OK. So if we are going more than two months back, let's look at this:
Originally Posted By: adak

Violence against women is never right. The quickest way to end violence against women is if women fight back. If news got out that women are beating or killing their attackers then they would think twice before attacking women. Problem solved.

I won't comment.

So then we get this today:
Originally Posted By: red-rose
I actually had this *exact* same thing happen to me! I put up fliers, and I listed on craigslist, and someone found me from craigslist. It was a guy and we emailed a couple times, and he mentioned his daughter (but he never actually told me her name - first warning sign.) But the weirdest thing was how in his emails he didn't really talk about his daughter, he just talked a bit about how he was in a band and played the drums and stuff. So, OF COURSE I was no way going to let him in my house without at least meeting him in a public place first. So as it neared our appointed meeting time at a coffee shop, I emailed him again and very specifically was like, "Ok, so I'll see you and your daughter, and make sure she brings her old piano books so I can look at them," (hint hint...don't even think about coming without her!)

Well, after waiting 15 minutes past the decided time, he never showed, and never emailed again to apologize. I was GLAD.

That earns a response, not TO the person who posted, but to TimR, going back in time I suppose two months.
Originally Posted By: Piano Dad

Indeed.

This is such a sad discussion.

Everyone will evaluate this situation as they see fit, based on their experiences, their fears, and their attitudes about the world around them. But it's always wise to step back and ask just how many knots do you want to tie yourself into in order to feel comfortable existing in this world of ever present risk.

Now, I will concede that calling this a “private discussion” is inaccurate. What went through my mind, instead, is that a often a man would rather comment on a comment that is over two months old by another man, in public, in a way that totally ignores the woman as if she was not even here, rather than to answer the woman who has just expressed a thought and a worry.

So the word “private” is not accurate. But I do not have a word for what happens when one man replies to another as if the woman is not there and does not deserve to have her ideas directly addressed. That in my opinion was what happened today. I stand by that. I further suggest that this happens a lot in this world, where I further insist men have more power and assume that they deserve to have it.
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#2068351 - 04/22/13 12:33 AM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: Gary D.]
keystring Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 12087
Loc: Canada
Originally Posted By: Gary D.
But I do not have a word for what happens when one man replies to another as if the woman is not there and does not deserve to have her ideas directly addressed. That in my opinion was what happened today.

Gary, you have finally put into words what has been bothering me all day, and I could not put my finger on it.

It started when Red Rose came on and talked about a real situation, and the first response had nothing to do with what she had said. Instead it was some abstract speculation between two men. The various things that were put forth were further trivialized. I don't know what to call what happened with the things that I wrote. Is that much incomprehension really possible? In any case, earlier in the day I bumped today's original post up twice, because it seemed extremely important to do that - for this person to be heard.

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#2068378 - 04/22/13 01:43 AM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: Piano*Dad]
theJourney Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/22/07
Posts: 3946
Loc: Banned
Originally Posted By: Piano*Dad
1. It's a sad commentary on the state of society that women feel such risk.


That's exactly the point I was trying to make.

Not saying the fears are not justified, just pitying those who live in (unequal, anti-social, violent, misogynistic, drugged-up, poverty riddled, poorly educated, etc.) societies where one is condemned to live one's life in fear and not even feel free to act and safe in one's own home/studio.

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#2068381 - 04/22/13 01:45 AM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: P.M.]
Polyphonist Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/03/13
Posts: 8102
Loc: New York City
My opinion on this subject is as follows:







Lock the thread.
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Regards,

Polyphonist

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#2068453 - 04/22/13 03:56 AM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: Gary D.]
theJourney Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/22/07
Posts: 3946
Loc: Banned
Originally Posted By: Gary D.
Right. Like the massacre that just took place in Boston was in a third world country...


Right! On just about every factual, critical social dimension you can think of that is relevant to this thread, the country recently bombed Iraq-style in Boston by its very own domestic terrorists who lived there and whose characters were formed in said country (like the domestic terrorist bombings before them in Oklahoma City and the long, proud tradition of institutionalized domestic terrorism embodied by the wildly popular Ku Klux Klan in years past) can, sadly, indeed be considered to be, for all practical purposes, a third-world country.

Here are some dimensions to consider to put some meat on the bone of PianoDad's justified lament:

Well-being of children
Of the so-called richest countries, kids in the US find themselves relatively unsafe & unhappy, at or close to the bottom of almost all measures, barely doing better than their poorest-from-the-list peers in: Latvia, Romania & Lithuania.
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/04/18/opinion/blow-the-kids-are-not-all-right.html?nl=todaysheadlines
As go the kids, so goes a society.

Inequality
The US has some of the worst, heart-wrenching, humanity distorting socio-economic inequality of any country in the world making it look both on paper and on the streets a lot more like Colombia or Guatemala than a civilized, first-world Western democracy. http://newsfeed.time.com/2013/03/04/watch-video-on-wealth-inequality-in-the-u-s/

Freedom & Human Rights
The US has the lowest percentage of its citizens actually living in freedom outside of its fast-growing, for-profit industrial-prison complex. More prisoners by far than any other country in the world including Communist China or the old Soviet Gulag. The problems is compounded by not having an independent judiciary and conducting a $1 trillion war (ostensibly on drugs) against its own citizens. US citizens may also today be disappeared, executed or tortured on command by their government without recourse to constitutional protections. Sounds like junta-era Argentina to me.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/23/world/americas/23iht-23prison.12253738.html?pagewanted=all

Social Mobility
Increasingly there is less and less social mobility in the US. How far you go depends mostly on your parents, your family wealth and who you know or who you paid off more than your own study or hard work as in a functioning meritocracy. Just like most banana republics.
http://www.economist.com/news/leaders/21...repairing-rungs

Lethal Violence
Despite having 500% more of its population locked up behind bars, with more guns than people, hundreds of thousands of untreated mental patients roaming the streets, millions addicted to illicit drugs & heroin-grade, addictive painkillers, unimaginable income inequality with almost all gains in wealth and income going to the top 5%, with 30% of children growing up in poverty, rampant racial discrimination, a culture that worships materialism, the most bloody & violent entertainment on earth being consumed an average of 5 (!) hours per day per household, the levels of lethal violence, murder & Columbine/Newton/etc. mass-murder mayhem are completely off the chart.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/12/17/us-gun-violence-connecticut_n_2318704.html

Abuse of Women
Almost one in five (!) American women have survived a rape (attempt). An estimated 17.000 girls are trafficked each year into sexual slavery. The US has some of the highest rates of venereal disease, teenage pregnancy & infant mortality of developed countries.
http://www.feminist.com/antiviolence/facts.html#statistics

Crumbling Infrastructure
http://www.brookings.edu/blogs/up-front/posts/2013/01/23-crumbling-infrastructure-galston

Here is another point of view ranking developments in the US over the past thirty years using the original defining criteria for "1st world" versus "3rd world/banana republic" countries:
http://www.activistpost.com/2012/11/us-continues-descent-toward-third-world.html
http://www.activistpost.com/2010/08/10-signs-us-is-becoming-third-world.html

So sad and so unnecessary.
As to those who accuse me of not empathizing, I assure you I do empathize. I also stand by my previous statement and associated question:

Wow. Until reading a thread like this, how easily one forgets that a great number of those posting here seem to (believe that they) have to cope with the paranoia of living in a dangerous, threatening, disintegrating, third-world country filled with drug-addled, psychopathic piano teacher slashers. Sad. Tragic.

What kinds of communities are these?

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#2068499 - 04/22/13 07:56 AM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: P.M.]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 12391
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Thank you for clarifying, but what you wrote previously, the Journey, was poorly written at best if you meant to say the exact opposite. The big things that come across are "believe that they", referring to it as "paranoia", referring to anyone who posts here as being from a 3rd-world country, and calling those who victimize women "drug-addled, psychopathic piano teacher slashers" when it's not about piano teachers who live in 3rd world countries being paranoid at all! Your choice of words leaves much to be desired.
_________________________
private piano/voice teacher FT
www.valeoconservatory.com
Petrof 9'2, Roland FP-7, Yamaha MOX6, Kawai MP11


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#2068502 - 04/22/13 08:01 AM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: Gary D.]
malkin Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/18/09
Posts: 2920
Loc: *sigh* Salt Lake City
Originally Posted By: Gary D.

... But I do not have a word for what happens when one man replies to another as if the woman is not there and does not deserve to have her ideas directly addressed. That in my opinion was what happened today. I stand by that. I further suggest that this happens a lot in this world, where I further insist men have more power and assume that they deserve to have it.


I thought "clueless" worked pretty well, "rude" and "dehumanizing" fit the bill as well. I'm sure there are others, but I'm still sleepy this morning.
I find myself in situations at work where adult "care providers" will discuss children's 'deficits' while the kids are sitting there. I find it offensive and objectifying and almost always unnecessary.

I agree with you that this behavior is caused by a power differential.
_________________________
Ladies and Gentlemen: This is not a competition, merely an exhibition. No wagering please.

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#2068527 - 04/22/13 09:00 AM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: theJourney]
Gary D. Online   content
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/30/08
Posts: 4824
Loc: South Florida
Originally Posted By: theJourney
Originally Posted By: Gary D.
Right. Like the massacre that just took place in Boston was in a third world country...


Right! On just about every factual, critical social dimension you can think of that is relevant to this thread, the country recently bombed Iraq-style in Boston by its very own domestic terrorists who lived there and whose characters were formed in said country (like the domestic terrorist bombings before them in Oklahoma City and the long, proud tradition of institutionalized domestic terrorism embodied by the wildly popular Ku Klux Klan in years past) can, sadly, indeed be considered to be, for all practical purposes, a third-world country.

I'll let others comment on that. At least it is clear that you recognize that the problems we have been talking about exist.

But look at what you wrote:
Quote:

Wow. Until reading a thread like this, how easily one forgets that a great number of those posting here seem to (believe that they) have to cope with the paranoia of living in a dangerous, threatening, disintegrating, third-world country filled with drug-addled, psychopathic piano teacher slashers. Sad. Tragic.

When you write "psychopathic piano teacher slashers" it seems clever, not real. I don't know if that is your intention.

And paranoia?

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/paranoia

Get off the fence, please.

Either we are paranoid as we talk about such things, in which case we are irrationally suspicious and distrustful.

Or we are simply dealing with the world as it is, or more precisely (in this case) life in the US, as it is.

And then this whole thread has NOTHING to do with paranoia. It has to do with coping with violence, and protecting ourselves.
_________________________
Piano Teacher

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#2068531 - 04/22/13 09:29 AM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: P.M.]
TimR Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/17/04
Posts: 3299
Loc: Virginia, USA
It may be possible to take reasonable precautions without living in a state of fear.

The US has had a steady 25 year long decline in gun violence. You wouldn't know that from the news. It might lead to a falsely inflated sense of fear, and maybe exaggerated reactions to a perceived threat.

The world is at a 13,000 year low in violence. Ditto. https://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=the-decline-of-violence

I checked auto accidents back to 1994. Again, steady decline in fatalities per driver and per population from then to now.

Still makes sense to wear a seat belt.

And wear sunscreen, and get vaccinated.
_________________________
gotta go practice

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#2068534 - 04/22/13 09:39 AM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: P.M.]
keystring Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 12087
Loc: Canada
The "reasonable precautions" part sounds good, TimR.

An aspect of the term "reasonable precautions" is that they are seen as reasonable - not paranoid, not irrational fearfulness (change your attitude and you can stop worrying) - but it's reasonable, it makes sense, it should be talked about in order to find good solutions (it's ok to talk about), and it should be taken seriously. Those involved should be taken seriously. We're also talking about ordinary, everyday things most of the time, rather than the extremes that grab the headlines. Walking to the grocery at night. Answering a knock at the door. Whom to let in the door and how far they get into your house. This goes for anyone that is considered an easy mark, including the elderly.

When discussing precautions it should be taken seriously. I have a funny feeling that our society is more at ease when discussing the protection of property, than when discussing the protection of persons. Could that be so?

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#2068569 - 04/22/13 10:35 AM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: TimR]
Gary D. Online   content
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/30/08
Posts: 4824
Loc: South Florida
Originally Posted By: TimR
It may be possible to take reasonable precautions without living in a state of fear.

Tim, I'm not sure anyone here was talking about living in a state of fear. Were they?
Quote:

The US has had a steady 25 year long decline in gun violence. You wouldn't know that from the news. It might lead to a falsely inflated sense of fear, and maybe exaggerated reactions to a perceived threat.

Tell that to the parents of the the children who were gunned down in Newtown.

Maybe things are less violent here, statistically. Does that really matter if you are the person being stalked?

I'm suggesting there is a kind of "tone-deafness" common to people who view the world through pure logic and statistics. It has its place. I'm not denying that. But there is more to being human than a dispassionate objectivity that does not take into consideration the pain of personal experience.

I'm not sure being very careful about who we let in our front door and wearing sunscreen are analogous. Seat belts? Maybe...
_________________________
Piano Teacher

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#2068579 - 04/22/13 10:50 AM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: P.M.]
theJourney Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/22/07
Posts: 3946
Loc: Banned
According to your Merriam link, paranoia is:

Quote:

excessive or irrational suspiciousness and distrustfulness of others


which I do believe could potentially apply to the fear displayed in this thread.

According to the statistics, most female Americans are much more likely to be assaulted, raped or murdered by their fathers, husbands or boyfriends than by any random prospective piano student...yet, until the abuse starts the fear is usually not directed towards them and Starbucks rendezvous won't be able to do anything to help them.

It is also probably more dangerous to walk alone at night as a woman in most American cities than to meet with a prospective piano student in your own studio.


My sentence was meant to be readable with or without the content in parentheses. I agree that more of the sentence should have been parenthesized.

Wow. Until reading a thread like this, how easily one forgets that a great number of those posting here seem to (believe that they) have to cope with (the paranoia of) living in a dangerous, threatening, disintegrating, third-world country (filled with drug-addled, psychopathic piano teacher slashers). Sad. Tragic.

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#2068581 - 04/22/13 10:51 AM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: P.M.]
red-rose Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/20/13
Posts: 177
Loc: Cleveland, OH
Good grief, everyone, I wasn't exactly looking for validation, but thanks, anyways, lol!

FTR, that was the first (and only so far) time I'd ever gotten contacted by someone that wasn't "through" someone I know, so I don't really have a "policy" in place, since I don't feel the need to take any extra precautions when someone has a personal connection to someone I already know and trust.

Finally, I do not believe that my decision to meet in a public place was "emotional" in the slightest. I think it was completely logical. (Aside from the fact that I would probably require *anyone* to whom I was going to give my address to and potentially be alone in my house with to meet me in a public place first - and wouldn't they also want to do the same, before coming to my house?) there were some *logical* inconsistencies to what this person who was emailing me was saying. Like has been already mentioned; not talking about his daughter who I would be teaching, and giving me unnecessary details about his own life and interests.

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#2068583 - 04/22/13 10:54 AM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: theJourney]
red-rose Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/20/13
Posts: 177
Loc: Cleveland, OH
Originally Posted By: theJourney
According to your Merriam link, paranoia is:

Quote:

excessive or irrational suspiciousness and distrustfulness of others


which I do believe could potentially apply to the fear displayed in this thread.

According to the statistics, most female Americans are much more likely to be assaulted, raped or murdered by their fathers, husbands or boyfriends than by any random prospective piano student...yet, until the abuse starts the fear is usually not directed towards them and Starbucks rendezvous won't be able to do anything to help them.

It is also probably more dangerous to walk alone at night as a woman in most American cities than to meet with a prospective piano student in your own studio.


My sentence was meant to be readable with or without the content in parentheses. I agree that more of the sentence should have been parenthesized.

Wow. Until reading a thread like this, how easily one forgets that a great number of those posting here seem to (believe that they) have to cope with (the paranoia of) living in a dangerous, threatening, disintegrating, third-world country (filled with drug-addled, psychopathic piano teacher slashers). Sad. Tragic.

So. Freaking. What.
Just because someone takes precautions does not mean they are "paranoid."

I've completely lost track of who said what in this thread so far, but like has been pointed out, people who lock their front doors must be "paranoid" by your logic.

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#2068595 - 04/22/13 11:11 AM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: P.M.]
theJourney Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/22/07
Posts: 3946
Loc: Banned
I guess it depends on the your mental state, the rational and factual basis of a risk assessment underlying the fear and the kinds of precautions taken and whether they interfere with your quality of life.

If someone's suspiciousness or distrustfulness of others is irrational or becomes so excessive that one is unnecessarily hindered, then that would be paranoid. For example, using 5 or 6 different locks on their front door and then still not daring to leave the house. Or, having to conduct 2 interviews with every new piano student, 1 in a public Starbucks under video surveillance and a second one at their studio with an armed guard or bodybuilding nephew present.

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#2068596 - 04/22/13 11:12 AM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: theJourney]
keystring Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 12087
Loc: Canada
Originally Posted By: theJourney

which I do believe could potentially apply to the fear displayed in this thread.

No such thing has been displayed.
Quote:

It is also probably more dangerous to walk alone at night as a woman in most American cities ...

This is the piano teacher forum, and it deals with issues and decisions that must be made by piano teachers. Again I will deal with a different business analogy. If small business owners were to discuss how to protect themselves from common financial risk, how appropriate would it be to talk about the danger of muggings while walking through a bad part of town at night?

Red Rose, a teacher, gave a concrete example in a thread about a teaching concern, and how she handled it professionally. It's that simple. And it deserves consideration.

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#2068597 - 04/22/13 11:13 AM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: red-rose]
keystring Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 12087
Loc: Canada
Originally Posted By: red-rose

So. Freaking. What.

thumb

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#2068606 - 04/22/13 11:28 AM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: keystring]
theJourney Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/22/07
Posts: 3946
Loc: Banned
Originally Posted By: keystring
This is the piano teacher forum, and it deals with issues and decisions that must be made by piano teachers. Again I will deal with a different business analogy. If small business owners were to discuss how to protect themselves from common financial risk, how appropriate would it be to talk about the danger of muggings while walking through a bad part of town at night?

A better business analogy would be if retail shop owners were to discuss how to protect themselves against shoplifting theft by customers ... only to realize that there might actually be much more risk and losses come from thefts from the company's own employees leaving with goods through the back door rather than shoplifting.

Originally Posted By: keystring

Red Rose, a teacher, gave a concrete example in a thread about a teaching concern, and how she handled it professionally. It's that simple. And it deserves consideration.


Of course it deserves consideration. Everyone needs to take responsibility for their own safety to the degree they deem necessary given their environment and their own circumstances.

I still would love to have an answer to my question: what kinds of communities are these that have prospective piano students, of all people, showing up high on meth or planning a rape during their first sample lesson with a new piano teacher. Would hate to have anyone I know have to live in a such a place...

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#2068612 - 04/22/13 11:49 AM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: theJourney]
red-rose Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/20/13
Posts: 177
Loc: Cleveland, OH
Originally Posted By: theJourney

A better business analogy would be if retail shop owners were to discuss how to protect themselves against shoplifting theft by customers ... only to realize that there might actually be much more risk and losses come from thefts from the company's own employees leaving with goods through the back door rather than shoplifting.

But what's wrong with the shop owners making plans to prevent BOTH from happening? NOTHING is wrong with that! (In fact, that would be wise!)


Edited by red-rose (04/22/13 11:50 AM)

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#2068615 - 04/22/13 11:53 AM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: theJourney]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 12391
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Originally Posted By: theJourney


I still would love to have an answer to my question: what kinds of communities are these that have prospective piano students, of all people, showing up high on meth or planning a rape during their first sample lesson with a new piano teacher. Would hate to have anyone I know have to live in a such a place...


Your question is unreasonable and so it doesn't deserve an answer. You are trying to take something very real and serious and stretch to the point of hyperbole. Who said anything about meth? You can go on assuming that no one means another person harm.


Edited by Morodiene (04/22/13 11:55 AM)
_________________________
private piano/voice teacher FT
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Petrof 9'2, Roland FP-7, Yamaha MOX6, Kawai MP11


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#2068616 - 04/22/13 11:55 AM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: P.M.]
keystring Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 12087
Loc: Canada
Don't feed the troll.

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#2068618 - 04/22/13 11:57 AM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: keystring]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 12391
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Originally Posted By: keystring
Don't feed the troll.


wise words smile
_________________________
private piano/voice teacher FT
www.valeoconservatory.com
Petrof 9'2, Roland FP-7, Yamaha MOX6, Kawai MP11


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#2068623 - 04/22/13 12:01 PM Re: Screening Suspicious Sounding "Students" [Re: keystring]
AZNpiano Online   happy
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/07/07
Posts: 5698
Loc: Orange County, CA
Originally Posted By: keystring
Don't feed the troll.

I agree.
_________________________
Private Piano Teacher and MTAC Member

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