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#1750407 - 09/10/11 10:30 PM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: PianoZac]
kippesc Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/30/09
Posts: 407
Loc: United States
Above, I spied actions, which are always fun to look at. Some might not remember this thread

http://www.pianoworld.com/forum/ubbthrea...20N2%20apa.html

where this picture of the interior of the Yamaha AvantGrand N2 was posted.



When I saw that, I thought, Cool, that might actually be worth $10k.
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Yamaha AvantGrand N2
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#1750411 - 09/10/11 10:43 PM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: MzrtFan]
Kona_V-Piano Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/16/11
Posts: 283
I found something interesting from Yamaha. Now I don't know if the natural wood keyboard in the CLP990 is the one they describe since GH3 did not exist yet when the CLP990 was released. To me it feels nothing like the GH3.

http://faq.yamaha.com/us/en/article/musi...last_page_id=10

What is the difference between the natural wood (NW), graded hammer (GH3) 3, graded hammer (GH), and graded hammer standard (GHS) keyboards?

*

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Go to Product Information

Last Update: 10/14/2010
Each of the keyboards is explained below.

NW keyboard: This keyboard has the same structure as a GH3 keyboard, but the white keys are are all cut from the same plank of natural wood, just like in an acoustic piano. Using our wood-working skills gained from making pianos, we are able to keep keyboard vibration and warping to a minimum. We have achieved the solid feeling of a grand piano.

GH3 keyboard: This keyboard has Yamaha's proprietary third sensor, the Damper Sensor. It enables the pianist to play the same note in rapid succession without cutting off the sound, enabling performances only possible on a grand piano. As with the GH keyboard, the lower keys are heavier and the higher keys are lighter, faithfully reproducing the differences in feel.

GH keyboard: In pursuit of the feel of playing on a grand piano, the lower keys are heavier and the higher keys become lighter, the touch response changing gradually through the different registers, thus creating a natural touch response on the keyboard.

GHS keyboard: This keyboard is based on the concept of the GH keyboard, but uses lighter parts. This decrease in weight all reduces the overall weight of the instrument. The selection of a keyboard is greatly influenced by the preferences and sense of the indiviudal, so we invite you to come and play several products for yourself.


Edited by Kona_V-Piano (09/10/11 10:45 PM)
_________________________
Roland V-Piano, Yamaha CLP990, Yamaha S90

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#1750414 - 09/10/11 10:47 PM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: kippesc]
MzrtFan Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/19/10
Posts: 86
Loc: United States
Now, that's a real grand piano action right there! Awesome pic! Thank you for posting this.

It almost makes me want to buy one... I'm still undecided... I'll probably come to a decision in another year or so, haha!

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#1750422 - 09/10/11 11:03 PM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: MzrtFan]
MzrtFan Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/19/10
Posts: 86
Loc: United States
Regarding my original question: today I went to the Kawai dealer in my area to play the CN33 again, and while I was there I asked the store owner about the possiblity of Kawai coming out with a product like the AvantGrand. His answer was probably not, due to the fact that Kawai spent a lot of time and effort developing the RM3 action to be as close as possible to the real thing. I actually think that's a very plausible answer, even though he's not an "insider" at Kawai, just a dealer.

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#1750537 - 09/11/11 04:59 AM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: MzrtFan]
Dave Horne Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/07/04
Posts: 5282
Loc: Vught, The Netherlands
I'll go out on limb here and give a common sense comment or two regarding actions - not based on any real knowledge per se.

The actions that use wood in the keys don't affect the action per se but give the guys in the advertising department something to differentiate their product form the rest. It looks nice, and for some gives it an organic feel (whatever that means) - it always comes across as a plus.

Graded hammers - this just means that the upper keys in the action require less downward force to depress because the keys themselves are lighter.

In a real piano action there are weights in the keys. As you travel from the lower notes to the top notes in an acoustic piano you'll see (and possible feel smile ) three to seven or so graduations of weighting. The makers of digital keyboard actions do the same but to a much less degree. This also give the guys in advertising something to write about.

Graded hammers in a digital keyboard action is just hype as far as I'm concerned since the actions in the overwhelming number of digital keyboards are already pretty light to begin with. Making some of the keys even lighter to make the action more 'realistic' borders on unnecessary hype as far as I'm concerned, but it does allow the guys in advertising to write wondrous claims.
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#1750545 - 09/11/11 05:57 AM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: MzrtFan]
reza Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/03/08
Posts: 77
Loc: Tehran, Iran
Schimmel also have Silent versions called Schimmel TwinTone


Edited by reza (09/11/11 06:08 AM)

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#1750548 - 09/11/11 06:12 AM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: MzrtFan]
reza Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/03/08
Posts: 77
Loc: Tehran, Iran
Even with this full acoustic piano action in models like N1/N2/N3, I think there is something missing in Dynamics part of the action especially regarding repeated notes.

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#1750570 - 09/11/11 07:54 AM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: Kawai James]
reza Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/03/08
Posts: 77
Loc: Tehran, Iran
Originally Posted By: Kawai James
Thank you for the information.

It seems like the CLP-990 was a really great instrument - I wonder why they took several backward steps with future generation models?

Cheers,
James
x


I also impressed with the features of the CLP990, it is still superior to the most of Clavinova series. Man 88 keys samples, 80 MB sample memory, 5 dynamics levels. It is wonderful. New Clavinowas are definite down grades.

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#1750828 - 09/11/11 05:23 PM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: MzrtFan]
PianoZac Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/22/10
Posts: 1425
80MB samples was very large for the time but some of the samples in my Nord NP88 are just shy of 200MB and those are tiny compared to the software samples. I wonder what the size of the samples are inside the CP5, RD700NX, MP10, and even inside the AvantGrands...
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Yamaha AvantGrand N1
Nord Piano 2


"Be who you are and say how you feel. Because those who mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind." - Dr. Seuss

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#1751135 - 09/12/11 05:23 AM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: MzrtFan]
Dave Horne Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/07/04
Posts: 5282
Loc: Vught, The Netherlands
The sample used for the GranTouch was 30 MB. I used that sample for 12 years and never felt that it lacked anything. (It also only had 32 note polyphony ... and I never felt or heard any notes dropping out as a result of hitting the limit.)
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#1751141 - 09/12/11 05:50 AM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: MzrtFan]
lisztvsthalberg Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/27/10
Posts: 121
+1

And it still sounds good!

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#1751254 - 09/12/11 10:30 AM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: Dave Horne]
PianoZac Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/22/10
Posts: 1425
Originally Posted By: Dave Horne
The sample used for the GranTouch was 30 MB. I used that sample for 12 years and never felt that it lacked anything. (It also only had 32 note polyphony ... and I never felt or heard any notes dropping out as a result of hitting the limit.)


Good points Dave. I guess, purely for technical reasons, I'm curious to see what the sample sizes are in most modern DPs. Also, as far as polyphony goes, if the number told the whole story, then I should be having some serious headaches with the NP88 since it boasts a mere 40-60 notes vs the 128-196 in most other DPs, and yet, I've never, not once experienced any note stealing in the NP88.
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Yamaha AvantGrand N1
Nord Piano 2


"Be who you are and say how you feel. Because those who mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind." - Dr. Seuss

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#1751259 - 09/12/11 10:37 AM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: PianoZac]
voxpops Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/20/07
Posts: 3101
Loc: Oregon
Originally Posted By: ZacharyForbes
I should be having some serious headaches with the NP88 since it boasts a mere 40-60 notes vs the 128-196 in most other DPs, and yet, I've never, not once experienced any note stealing in the NP88.

IIRC, the NP88's 40-60 notes polyphony is the equivalent of 80-120 in other DPs. The figures quoted are for the full stereo note samples, whereas other DPs use two mono units for each note played in stereo.
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#1751398 - 09/12/11 03:14 PM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: voxpops]
Kona_V-Piano Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/16/11
Posts: 283
Originally Posted By: voxpops
Originally Posted By: ZacharyForbes
I should be having some serious headaches with the NP88 since it boasts a mere 40-60 notes vs the 128-196 in most other DPs, and yet, I've never, not once experienced any note stealing in the NP88.

IIRC, the NP88's 40-60 notes polyphony is the equivalent of 80-120 in other DPs. The figures quoted are for the full stereo note samples, whereas other DPs use two mono units for each note played in stereo.


The only time I've ever run into polyphony issues that were noticeable is when using the ClP990's feature where I can have 4 different sounds played at the same time. It cuts the 192 polyphony down by four to 48 polyphony. Even then, I have to be holding down the sustain indefinitely for me to audibly hear notes drop. In the real world playing, 64 polyphony is enough to get by without noticing any note drop offs. That is why that was the standard amount for so long until it changed to 128 for most. On older Casio keyboards they had 5-10 polyphony max. Those ran out of notes real quick.
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Roland V-Piano, Yamaha CLP990, Yamaha S90

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#1751436 - 09/12/11 04:07 PM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: MzrtFan]
PianoZac Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/22/10
Posts: 1425
Why in the he*% did Yamaha back track so far from the CLP990 with their Clavinova series?? It was obviously a stand out board, and Yamaha appears to have totally backtracked in that lineup...
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Yamaha AvantGrand N1
Nord Piano 2


"Be who you are and say how you feel. Because those who mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind." - Dr. Seuss

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#1751507 - 09/12/11 06:16 PM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: PianoZac]
Kona_V-Piano Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/16/11
Posts: 283
Originally Posted By: ZacharyForbes
Why in the he*% did Yamaha back track so far from the CLP990 with their Clavinova series?? It was obviously a stand out board, and Yamaha appears to have totally backtracked in that lineup...


I never understood why myself as I followed each improvement in the CLP line over the years. I'm not a marketing major, nor do I pretend to be, however it would make sense to keep improving on previous numbers as that is what gets buyers to want to upgrade. I guess the market they wanted to sell it to became people who can care less about specs and more about price. That eliminated me from wanting to upgrade for sure. If you look around at all the other brands of cabinet digital keyboards, the specs really haven't changed over the last 10 years for most part either. I guess Yamaha and all the other companies have been waiting for each other to be the first to spend some R&D on an improvement and then study their sales numbers to see if they made any more money than before. I think it has to do with complacency as well. But it may boil down to simply lowering the cost of production at the various sweatshops.

As for Yamaha not coming out with their own modeled piano, I have to assume they have not been able to achieve it in the same manner Roland has. Remember that it took Roland 10 years to create the V-Piano technology from scratch.

So by 2009-2011, Yamaha has been able to model the soundboard, and hammer hardness, along with some other sounds, however they still want to use recorded samples for the most prominant main sound and allow that limitation of looping to continue.

Another reason would be that Yamaha feels 99.9% of people or potential buyers would not be able to tell the difference anyway..And they are probably right. We are a very very small group of people who can't afford or don't have the space for a concert grand piano in the house who want that particular sound.

Another area that has seen a standstill and is diminishing more than ever is in the hardware synthesizer market. That one is easy to figure out because everyone has multiple controllers in old keyboards and software is cheap, good and upgradeable. However latency is still a factor which is why I and many other musicians need and prefer a stage worthy synth to play. USB 3.0 may change all that if that spec is placed inside a controller keyboard for cheap.
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Roland V-Piano, Yamaha CLP990, Yamaha S90

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#1751715 - 09/13/11 05:23 AM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: MzrtFan]
bennevis Online   content
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/14/10
Posts: 5530
The vast majority of purchasers of DPs are after bells and whistles, not an acoustic piano substitute (from my experience of visting DP stores). Most have never played on an acoustic piano before. Hardly surprising that DP manufacturers target buyers with lots of space-age multi-colored displays, buttons, levers and dials on the consoles, and not bother trying to make the keyboard play or feel like an acoustic. If you're not into classical music, why would you want an acoustic piano substitute in your keyboard rather than lots of fun sounds and things to plug into?

It's like iPod/MP3 and downloads v CD. The sound quality of the former are nowhere near that of CDs, yet most people far prefer the convenience of those, even if they could hear the difference (and many probably don't).
_________________________
"I don't play accurately - anyone can play accurately - but I play with wonderful expression. As far as the piano is concerned, sentiment is my forte. I keep science for Life."

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#1751735 - 09/13/11 07:29 AM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: MzrtFan]
Kawai James Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 9678
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
bennevis, with the greatest respect, you're completely wrong.

Originally Posted By: bennevis
The vast majority of purchasers of DPs are after bells and whistles, not an acoustic piano substitute...


This is absolute rubbish.

Take this forum as an example - the majority of posts from individuals looking to purchase a new digital piano almost always emphasise the need for the instrument to "sound and feel as close to an acoustic piano as possible". We seldom, if ever, read posts that list requirements such as "...it's got to have a multi-coloured display and lots of buttons and flashing lights". If this was the case, I expect we'd recommend the individual purchase a cheap keyboard from their local Dixons or Argos (you're British, yes?), rather than a digital piano.

Originally Posted By: bennevis
Most have never played on an acoustic piano before.


Really? That's quite a broad, sweeping statement. What about those individuals who learn by playing their teacher's piano? Or those who own an acoustic, but wish to purchase a digital piano to facilitate silent practise? Or even those who - heaven forbid - decide to replace their ageing acoustic piano with a digital instrument?

Originally Posted By: bennevis
Hardly surprising that DP manufacturers target buyers with lots of space-age multi-colored displays, buttons, levers and dials on the consoles


Which instruments (brand and model numbers please) are you referring to specifically? It appears that you may be confusing console digital pianos with stage pianos - the latter of which which typically feature knobs, sliders, wheels, and buttons in order to adjust the character of the sound in real-time. Regardless, the presence or absence of LCD displays and buttons does not automatically mean that the instrument's keyboard action or piano sound has been compromised - your very own marvellous V-Piano is a case in point.

Originally Posted By: bennevis
...and not bother trying to make the keyboard play or feel like an acoustic.


Actually, this is usually the first priority for most digital piano manufacturers.

Originally Posted By: benneivs
If you're not into classical music, why would you want an acoustic piano substitute...


Perhaps to play other types of music - music that is often performed using an acoustic piano? Are you familiar with the various forms of popular music termed 'Jazz', for example?

Individuals purchase digital pianos for a variety of reasons, and are just as diverse in their demographic, playing ability, and ambition. For you to suggest that those who do not choose to play classical music are any less demanding (in terms of realism or authenticity) of their acoustic piano substitute is both condescending and incorrect.

Ah, and the CD vs MP3 analogy tagged onto the end of your post is completely irrelevant.

Kind regards,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#1751807 - 09/13/11 10:52 AM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: MzrtFan]
bennevis Online   content
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/14/10
Posts: 5530
I'm prepared to be corrected, but I base my opinions on my observations, as I've already stated, and from chatting to many prospective buyers, some of whom come up to me to ask my opinions when they see me playing. The majority are looking for a 'keyboard', not a piano substitute, and most have never played an acoustic - the fact that a DP can play like an acoustic is secondary to what accompaniments, different sounds, and rhythm stuff it provides. The DPs with few colored displays and knobs and dials on the consoles get scant attention from punters in DP stores, and a quick chat with the store assistants confirm what I suspected: some DPs fly out of the window; others just don't sell. People who post here have questions to ask or opinions to state, and don't necessarily reflect the majority of DP buyers. But, as you say, I'm currently based in the UK, so the situation in USA may be different, though the few times I've walked into DP stores there didn't seem any different to here in the UK.

Incidentally, I've two friends who are jazz pianists, one of whom is a semi-professional. They have their (Yamaha) acoustic baby grands voiced very brightly, and their priorities in a piano are very different to that of classical pianists, and they play very differently too. They also own several keyboards. I invited them to play my V-Piano (which I have to say they weren't that impressed with - they expected far more from a keyboard) and one of them wanted to do his own customization (only the very bright-sounding customizations that I did appealed to them, like my 'Yamaha' setting). To me, his version was well-nigh unplayable, even for the jazzy music I like playing (Gershwin's Rhapsody in Blue, Preludes etc). BTW, I've listened to lots of jazz pianists past and present and have several CDs of Oscar Petersen, Bill Evans, Keith Jarrett etc. I admire some of their playing, but it's obvious that their priorities are different from that of classical pianists (though Keith Jarrett switches to 'classical mode' when he plays Bach and Shostakovich). Different - I never said inferior.

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"I don't play accurately - anyone can play accurately - but I play with wonderful expression. As far as the piano is concerned, sentiment is my forte. I keep science for Life."

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#1751839 - 09/13/11 11:37 AM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: MzrtFan]
bennevis Online   content
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/14/10
Posts: 5530
My reference to CD v MP3 was in response to Kona V-Piano's post about Yamaha feeling that 99.9% of people 'would not be able to tell the difference anyway'.

I've got friends who're amazed that my ancient cassette tape Walkman still works perfectly, and even more amazed that its sound quality (especially recordings on CrO2 and metal tape) is better than that from their iPods - but some are so used to their iPod sound that they refuse to believe what their ears tell them.....
_________________________
"I don't play accurately - anyone can play accurately - but I play with wonderful expression. As far as the piano is concerned, sentiment is my forte. I keep science for Life."

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#1751864 - 09/13/11 12:54 PM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: MzrtFan]
voxpops Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/20/07
Posts: 3101
Loc: Oregon
My own opinions of course...

I think a lot of DP buyers are people who would love to be able to play the piano, but have never really learned. They may have dabbled a bit, but for whatever reason never stuck with it. The presence of "bells and whistles" - features that assist with accompaniment, rhythms, note illumination etc. - help the buyer to sound good with minimum input/effort. That may be one of the main reasons why "distractions" win out over authenticity for a good percentage of sales. Serious musicians will usually eschew these gizmos in favor of those models with the most refined action/sound.

But manufacturers are also in something of a rather slow race to be able to come up with an affordable and acceptable facsimile of an acoustic grand - hence the AvantGrand and V-Piano. To have a flagship model accepted, played and endorsed by famous musicians from across the musical spectrum is a major marketing triumph. In the non-classical world, the fact that you can watch a concert and pick out those red Nords, or the illuminated Yamaha logo, does wonders for sales, I'm sure. I feel just as certain that the day when a noted classical pianist sits down at a Roland or Kawai as his instrument of choice for a concert will be splashed across the DP brochures. So the quest for authenticity does matter to DP manufacturers.

The irony is that marketing seems to be a drag on innovation - rationing the use of the best technology, and maybe even holding back on the inclusion of new developments. It's perfectly understandable that higher-cost actions should be reserved for upper-echelon models, but parsimony with better software seems ludicrous when the gulf between PC and DP technology threatens to grow into a continental divide. But in the end, I really do think that these companies cannot survive without pushing the boundaries, and so would expect to see every major player with a flagship DP that rivals the AvantGrand.

For those that are following the parallel development of organ "clonewheel" technology, it is now the smaller companies that are in the forefront. The maker of VB3 software, for example, is helping to revive the Crumar name with a product that may wipe the floor with Hammond-Suzuki, Roland and others. Should Pianoteq choose to follow the same route, we could be in for some serious competition in the DP arena; that can only be good for all of us here.
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#1751919 - 09/13/11 02:20 PM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: MzrtFan]
PianoZac Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/22/10
Posts: 1425
I think that the DP manufacturers, in their defense, have a rather tough shoe to fill. It seems they are expected to produce the total feel, meaning an accurate acoustic piano action reproduction, the total sound, accurately reproducing the full spectrum of nuances that pianos produce, at a minimum cost and weight. The gigging musicians want a keyboard that sounds amazing, plays amazing, and weighs nearly nothing, and yet our home-use only DP buyer wants the look, sound and action of an acoustic, but at a fraction of the cost. I'd say the newest Yamahas and Kawais in particular are executing the home-based DP market well. Roland is too, but seem to be slightly more limited in the action department since they don't make their own acoustic actions. Needless to say, the big 3 DP makers are putting out some quality stuff. To be able to reproduce what a several hundred pound wood and metal instrument is capable of in an often portable, much smaller synthetic unit is a tough task to fulfill.


Edited by ZacharyForbes (09/13/11 02:24 PM)
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Yamaha AvantGrand N1
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"Be who you are and say how you feel. Because those who mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind." - Dr. Seuss

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#1752870 - 09/15/11 10:09 AM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: reza]
athomik Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/04/07
Posts: 299
Loc: England
Originally Posted By: reza
Schimmel also have Silent versions called Schimmel TwinTone


I believe that is an early (late '90's ?) Yamaha silent system.
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Adrian Thomas
Service Engineer - Hybrid Pianos & Strings

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#1752923 - 09/15/11 11:59 AM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: athomik]
PianoWorksATL Online   content
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/19/09
Posts: 2772
Loc: Atlanta, GA
Originally Posted By: athomik
Originally Posted By: reza
Schimmel also have Silent versions called Schimmel TwinTone


I believe that is an early (late '90's ?) Yamaha silent system.
I believe it is one generation newer than late '90s, but yes, it's a Yamaha product and I think one generation behind Yamaha's current offering.
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PianoWorks - Atlanta Piano Dealer
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#1753353 - 09/16/11 05:09 AM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: PianoWorksATL]
athomik Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/04/07
Posts: 299
Loc: England
Looking at the control box on the Schimmel website, they don't have a Reverb control, which some of the more recent Yamaha ranges did have. Either way, I don't think they are associated with Yamaha anymore.
On another note, the Kemble silent system (not that Kembles are very common in the US), as well as the one on Bösendorfers are the current Yamaha SG system.
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#2036309 - 02/20/13 09:34 AM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: Kawai James]
trandinhnamanh Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/19/13
Posts: 25
Loc: Paris, France

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#2036318 - 02/20/13 09:54 AM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: MzrtFan]
Dave Horne Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/07/04
Posts: 5282
Loc: Vught, The Netherlands
Was this mentioned ... ?

http://www.alpha-piano.com/en
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AvantGrand N3, CP5

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#2036342 - 02/20/13 10:36 AM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: PianoWorksATL]
trandinhnamanh Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/19/13
Posts: 25
Loc: Paris, France
I've just posted some pics about the CLP-990's action. Hope it'll help smile

http://www.pianoworld.com/forum/ubbthrea...tml#Post2036302

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#2036443 - 02/20/13 01:48 PM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: pv88]
krzyzowski Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/01/10
Posts: 108
Originally Posted By: pv88
Originally Posted By: Kona_V-Piano
I understand what you mean. If I ever need to take it apart, I will post the pictures.

@Kona:

Were you referring to your Yamaha, or, the Roland V-Piano?

Please do not take your V-Piano apart for any reason since that would void your warranty, and, only let a Roland technician take care of any issues, etc.

There has been talk of why the V-Piano has such a large outer case, and, both Steve & Zachary have been keen to note that it's probably due to a larger than usual action, giving the piano its nearly acoustic-like feel.

Perhaps "krzyzowski"* might eventually be willing to open his up, since I know he had acquired a used/damaged unit to begin with, as we all would be curious to know what's going on inside!

That could be a real eye opener to get a review... with photos?

*And, here is the quoted text of his post:


"V-Piano is a rugged machine; Bought mine damaged. Got a great deal. Big dent in it. UPS guy laughed as he carried the pieces out of the truck. He wondered why I didn't file a claim told him I bought it that way. Came in a plain box with no packing, just laid in there. Put it all back together and use it every day. Still has a dent in the keyslip."

Tnx for reminding me; I have to pop the cover and replace the slip. There are some open V pix showing the replacement of worn keys somewhere..

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#2036456 - 02/20/13 02:05 PM Re: Other manufacturers making their own AvantGrand-like pianos? [Re: MzrtFan]
krzyzowski Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/01/10
Posts: 108
IMHO, In 20 yr the acoustic instrument will become obsolete. Modern equipment has become accepted as the "Evolution" of sound. This is not a bad thing because technology has changed music ever since the vibrating string. The new kids on the block like the artifical sound and strive to create it. Bach can sound great played on anything..Its all about the: Composer> The Music> The Performer> not the instrument.

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