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#2035479 - 02/18/13 08:30 PM What's wrong with the metal parts?
pinkbabydoll Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 05/13/12
Posts: 7
Dear friends,

I bought a brand new upright piano 4 months ago.

Recently, I found the gold colour metal parts which is located lower part of middle C Key area is getting rust, looks not very good. Also, some of the printing logo and letter's colour is getting lighter and have many spots on it. I'm very care for the new piano.

Don’t know what's wrong with that? Please help me! Thanks








Edited by pinkbabydoll (02/18/13 08:33 PM)

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#2035481 - 02/18/13 08:38 PM Re: What's wrong with the metal parts? [Re: pinkbabydoll]
BDB Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/07/03
Posts: 20747
Loc: Oakland
That is oxidation, which is like rust. It occurred because the lock was not finished to seal it against oxidation.
_________________________
Semipro Tech

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#2035487 - 02/18/13 08:46 PM Re: What's wrong with the metal parts? [Re: pinkbabydoll]
pinkbabydoll Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 05/13/12
Posts: 7
Dear BDB, thanks for your reply.
Does every new piano like this? or it always happened? Couldn't imagine 2 years later how terrible look my piano will be...

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#2035505 - 02/18/13 09:25 PM Re: What's wrong with the metal parts? [Re: pinkbabydoll]
BDB Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/07/03
Posts: 20747
Loc: Oakland
Brass parts on some pianos are coated with a clear finish to prevent oxidation. I do not know whether that was done with your piano.

Brass polish will shine it up again. But if it bothers you, you should ask the dealer about it. It may be normal for the brand, or maybe not.
_________________________
Semipro Tech

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#2035520 - 02/18/13 09:45 PM Re: What's wrong with the metal parts? [Re: pinkbabydoll]
Minnesota Marty Online   content

Platinum Supporter until October 5 2014


Registered: 05/15/12
Posts: 6054
Loc: Rochester MN
I suggest you contact the dealer and ask for an explanation. It's good you have a photo and it would be beneficial to take photos of the fallboard logo. This is not usual on any new piano.
_________________________
Marty in Minnesota

It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.

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#2035559 - 02/18/13 11:53 PM Re: What's wrong with the metal parts? [Re: pinkbabydoll]
Supply Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/11/06
Posts: 3919
Loc: Vancouver Island, BC, Canada
I find this is fairly common in the pianos I service, especially the more entry level instruments. Mostly, it is caused by touching with the fingers, which leaves behind acids. Sometimes you can even see a fingerprint of corrosion.
Polish it carefully with brass polish, and give the lock a wipe after touching it with bare hands.
This is definitely not a warranty issue, it is a maintenance issue.
_________________________
Jurgen Goering
Piano Forte Supply
www.pianofortesupply.com

Piattino Caster Cups distributor

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#2035787 - 02/19/13 11:00 AM Re: What's wrong with the metal parts? [Re: pinkbabydoll]
KurtZ Online   content
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/13/10
Posts: 774
Loc: The Heart of Screenland
I would tape off the finish with either blue or orange painters tape (less residues than tan tape) before going after it with any kind of polish. Even better, it looks like that cover will come off without having to disassemble the lock. If so, you can be a little more agressive with the polish and then give the plate a shot of spray lacquer.

Kurt
_________________________
I just wanted to be just "a" guy. That's enough of a life.

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#2035797 - 02/19/13 11:11 AM Re: What's wrong with the metal parts? [Re: KurtZ]
Silverwood Pianos Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/10/08
Posts: 4182
Loc: Vancouver B. C. Canada
Originally Posted By: KurtZ
I would tape off the finish with either blue or orange painters tape (less residues than tan tape) before going after it with any kind of polish. Even better, it looks like that cover will come off without having to disassemble the lock. If so, you can be a little more agressive with the polish and then give the plate a shot of spray lacquer.

Kurt


Better results are discovered by removing the lock and polishing.
_________________________
Dan Silverwood
www.silverwoodpianos.com
http://silverwoodpianos.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/SilverwoodPianosDotCom
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur."

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#2035842 - 02/19/13 12:31 PM Re: What's wrong with the metal parts? [Re: pinkbabydoll]
Minnesota Marty Online   content

Platinum Supporter until October 5 2014


Registered: 05/15/12
Posts: 6054
Loc: Rochester MN
The piano is only four months old.

This should be an embarrassment to both the dealership and the builder. The problem with the fallboard decal hasn't even been addressed.

It doesn't matter if it is an entry level instrument, or is priced at the top of the range, a defect of this type is not acceptable. It is a matter of fit and finish and should be covered as a manufacturing defect.

Gone are the days of un-lacquered brass being supplied as original equipment on pianos.
_________________________
Marty in Minnesota

It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.

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#2036088 - 02/19/13 08:42 PM Re: What's wrong with the metal parts? [Re: pinkbabydoll]
Silverwood Pianos Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/10/08
Posts: 4182
Loc: Vancouver B. C. Canada

Also gone are the days of solid brass. That one looks similar to faulty plating I have come across.
_________________________
Dan Silverwood
www.silverwoodpianos.com
http://silverwoodpianos.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/SilverwoodPianosDotCom
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur."

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#2036110 - 02/19/13 09:41 PM Re: What's wrong with the metal parts? [Re: Minnesota Marty]
pinkbabydoll Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 05/13/12
Posts: 7
Originally Posted By: Minnesota Marty
I suggest you contact the dealer and ask for an explanation. It's good you have a photo and it would be beneficial to take photos of the fallboard logo. This is not usual on any new piano.


Dear Marty,

Thank you for your reply and very useful info.

I have contacted the local dealer to ask those problems. He said that is common problem, all their new pianos have this kind of “rust” appearance. Let me to remove the oxidation by myself. Therefor, I contacted Germany company to ask those problems, I got feedback today, they apologised the problem with the brass parts. Their technical department could exchange the lock and repair the keyboard lid if I agree.

I'm worried if remove all the 22 screws form the lid and re-fitted, will the 22 screws nailed to the original screw holes completely? Will the screw holes becoming bigger and the wood will deformed? Also, where can I put the music during the keyboard lid removed and send to repair period, it might be few of weeks or few of months. How can i cover the keyboard.....

So worried my piano, does my piano pass the quality control? Is there other problems with it?

Thank you again, Marty

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#2036122 - 02/19/13 10:16 PM Re: What's wrong with the metal parts? [Re: pinkbabydoll]
Minnesota Marty Online   content

Platinum Supporter until October 5 2014


Registered: 05/15/12
Posts: 6054
Loc: Rochester MN
Pinkbabydoll,

I'm sorry that your local dealership is giving you the run-a-round.

You mentioned that it was a German piano. This seems to put it out of the entry level category. Are you in the USA? It becomes hard to advise you without knowing where you are located.

If you would like, please send me a PM and I'll see what I can research for you and maybe a suggestion on how to proceed.

Just trying to help,
_________________________
Marty in Minnesota

It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.

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#2036167 - 02/20/13 12:04 AM Re: What's wrong with the metal parts? [Re: Minnesota Marty]
pinkbabydoll Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 05/13/12
Posts: 7
Originally Posted By: Minnesota Marty
Pinkbabydoll,

I'm sorry that your local dealership is giving you the run-a-round.

You mentioned that it was a German piano. This seems to put it out of the entry level category. Are you in the USA? It becomes hard to advise you without knowing where you are located.

If you would like, please send me a PM and I'll see what I can research for you and maybe a suggestion on how to proceed.

Just trying to help,


Dear Marty,

Thank you for helping. I sent you a PM, please check it.

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#2036169 - 02/20/13 12:07 AM Re: What's wrong with the metal parts? [Re: Silverwood Pianos]
pinkbabydoll Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 05/13/12
Posts: 7
Originally Posted By: Silverwood Pianos

Also gone are the days of solid brass. That one looks similar to faulty plating I have come across.


Hope my piano is not the unlucky one.....

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#2036746 - 02/21/13 03:30 AM Re: What's wrong with the metal parts? [Re: Silverwood Pianos]
musicpassion Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/30/12
Posts: 785
Loc: California, USA
Would brass polish be risky if it's only a thing brass plating?
_________________________
Pianist and Piano Teacher

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#2036904 - 02/21/13 11:26 AM Re: What's wrong with the metal parts? [Re: musicpassion]
Silverwood Pianos Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/10/08
Posts: 4182
Loc: Vancouver B. C. Canada
Originally Posted By: musicpassion
Would brass polish be risky if it's only a thing brass plating?


As brass polishes are a fine cut polish usually the plating comes off with the Brasso.
_________________________
Dan Silverwood
www.silverwoodpianos.com
http://silverwoodpianos.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/SilverwoodPianosDotCom
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur."

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#2037043 - 02/21/13 04:05 PM Re: What's wrong with the metal parts? [Re: pinkbabydoll]
BDB Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/07/03
Posts: 20747
Loc: Oakland
It is probably solid brass, as there is not much point in plating such a small piece.
_________________________
Semipro Tech

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#2037098 - 02/21/13 05:21 PM Re: What's wrong with the metal parts? [Re: Silverwood Pianos]
musicpassion Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/30/12
Posts: 785
Loc: California, USA
Originally Posted By: Silverwood Pianos
Originally Posted By: musicpassion
Would brass polish be risky if it's only a thing brass plating?


As brass polishes are a fine cut polish usually the plating comes off with the Brasso.


Ok thanks that's what I was wondering.
_________________________
Pianist and Piano Teacher

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#2037106 - 02/21/13 05:41 PM Re: What's wrong with the metal parts? [Re: pinkbabydoll]
Supply Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/11/06
Posts: 3919
Loc: Vancouver Island, BC, Canada
If the piano is above entry level, that plate will be solid brass.
_________________________
Jurgen Goering
Piano Forte Supply
www.pianofortesupply.com

Piattino Caster Cups distributor

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#2037115 - 02/21/13 05:51 PM Re: What's wrong with the metal parts? [Re: pinkbabydoll]
Minnesota Marty Online   content

Platinum Supporter until October 5 2014


Registered: 05/15/12
Posts: 6054
Loc: Rochester MN
The OP stated that it was a German instrument. I think we can assume it is not a choice cheapie entry level piano.
_________________________
Marty in Minnesota

It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.

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#2037213 - 02/21/13 08:45 PM Re: What's wrong with the metal parts? [Re: pinkbabydoll]
SteveM732 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/30/12
Posts: 25
Loc: Beaverton, OR, USA
I would go so far as to guess that it is a Sauter 130.
_________________________
-Steve
1969 Yamaha U3

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#2037843 - 02/23/13 07:42 AM Re: What's wrong with the metal parts? [Re: pinkbabydoll]
ZBGM0 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/07/11
Posts: 96
HI!

I don't think I have to open new topic, I will ask here. This topic made me curious. So I check my lock at close and guess what I also found some sort of corrosion. I would like to ask for opinion about the product Never Dull which should be good for polishing metals, especially brass (Jerry Groot RPT recommended it), but on the description it writes that you should not use it on the lacquer surfaces. I don’t knot if there is lacquer on the surfaces of the lock (like on the picture that was posted by OP) and the pedals (Kawai RX series). I even found a fingerprint on the pedal (weird) that must be polished somehow. I would be very grateful for any advice


Edited by ZBGM0 (02/23/13 07:48 AM)

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#2037850 - 02/23/13 08:33 AM Re: What's wrong with the metal parts? [Re: pinkbabydoll]
backto_study_piano Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/28/10
Posts: 388
Loc: Australia
I use a very fine auto polish on brass on my piano - it has the advantage of leaving a wax coating, and shouldn't damage the finish. I avoid silicone products, though.

I've done it a couple of times on my Grotrian.

I had several previous pianos which had a lacquer coating over some of the brasswork. It was great for the first 5-8 years, but then it started oxidising under the lacquer. And, without removing the lacquer, it was impossible to clean. Yamaha advised that it was a non-warranty issue at the time, and the Ronisch was out of warranty.
_________________________
Alan from Australia (and Clara - my Grotrian Concert - she's 7'4" long and ebony) & 2 Allen Organs [long story - the first is for sale] - MDS312 and CF-15.

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#2037878 - 02/23/13 09:48 AM Re: What's wrong with the metal parts? [Re: pinkbabydoll]
Silverwood Pianos Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/10/08
Posts: 4182
Loc: Vancouver B. C. Canada

All metal polishes have a wax component to them. If a polish product does not state on the label it is silicone free then it has silicone in the content.
_________________________
Dan Silverwood
www.silverwoodpianos.com
http://silverwoodpianos.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/SilverwoodPianosDotCom
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur."

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#2038396 - 02/24/13 11:01 AM Re: What's wrong with the metal parts? [Re: pinkbabydoll]
ZBGM0 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/07/11
Posts: 96
OK, on the description of Never Dull doesn't state that it is silicone free, so it probably contains silicone. But there is product called Wenol and it is silicone free. So, is it better to try with Wenol then?

Thanks

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#2038405 - 02/24/13 11:43 AM Re: What's wrong with the metal parts? [Re: pinkbabydoll]
Silverwood Pianos Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/10/08
Posts: 4182
Loc: Vancouver B. C. Canada
Well,

I was responding to the caution about silicone by another poster. Silicone polishes are problematic to remove if there is touch-up involved with the finish.

Along with the silicone that some do not like to handle, polishing products contain, non-photochemically reactive solvent, aliphatic petroleum distillates, water, elthoxylated monyl phosphate, pine oil, toluene.

These can be looked up on the internet to see if one would like to handle these kinds of products.

I would suggest gloves and breathing protection, along with a warning that many polish products contain cancer causing agents, along with birth defects and other reproductive disorders.

Warm water with a capful of white vinegar is the best cleaner. Most pianos are high gloss these days and do not require being kept knee deep in polish.

For brass, which is the original question from the OP, I use Brasso, double zero steel wool or Tripoli on a buff wheel.

Tripoli is an old product from the 1800’s. In dentistry Tripoli is used to polish a gold crown, however that is the hypoallergenic compound; not necessary for this application and fairly pricey.

This is only a guess but with the Never Dull it could be the coating of silicone that prevents further oxidation. Not familiar with that one.
_________________________
Dan Silverwood
www.silverwoodpianos.com
http://silverwoodpianos.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/SilverwoodPianosDotCom
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur."

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