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#2041210 - 03/01/13 07:18 AM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: rnaple]
theJourney Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/22/07
Posts: 3946
Loc: Banned
Originally Posted By: rnaple
Originally Posted By: Kawai James

How about something like this, from the same company (K&M)?
I hope this helps.

Cheers,
James
x


But James....What about my monkey!!!!!??????
My monkey isn't going to be happy!!!!!????
It's all Kawai's fault!!!!!


Very mature.
Shouldn't your Mom be getting you off to school by now?

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#2041220 - 03/01/13 07:46 AM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: theJourney]
rnaple Offline

Silver Supporter until April 24 2014


Registered: 12/23/10
Posts: 2106
Loc: Rocky Mountains
Originally Posted By: theJourney

Very mature.
Shouldn't your Mom be getting you off to school by now?


They kicked me out of school. It's all Kawai's fault.
_________________________
Ron
Your brain is a sponge. Keep it wet. Mary Gae George
The focus of your personal practice is discipline. Not numbers. Scott Sonnon

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#2041222 - 03/01/13 07:48 AM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: theJourney]
Kawai James Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 9196
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Bingo!



Actually, I've got to admit... that does look pretty slick. wink
'Hard Finish' surface too!

James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#2041227 - 03/01/13 08:14 AM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: Kawai James]
rnaple Offline

Silver Supporter until April 24 2014


Registered: 12/23/10
Posts: 2106
Loc: Rocky Mountains
Originally Posted By: Kawai James
Bingo!
Actually, I've got to admit... that does look pretty slick. wink
'Hard Finish' surface too!

James
x


Makes it look like Dolly Parton. I like the original.
Darn that thing looks classy. Without the Dolly music holder.

Oh....you forgot the miniature Empire State Building. So my monkey can act like King Kong. How about a Godzilla for him to play with? HHHhuuuummm?
Not that's an idea! James...
Kawai needs to come out with a Godzilla that bangs two sticks together. It can be the Godzilla Metronome! Straight from it's home in Japan! Kawai will sell a million of them!
_________________________
Ron
Your brain is a sponge. Keep it wet. Mary Gae George
The focus of your personal practice is discipline. Not numbers. Scott Sonnon

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#2041245 - 03/01/13 08:51 AM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: Kawai James]
JFP Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/19/10
Posts: 1336
Loc: The Netherlands
Originally Posted By: Kawai James
Bingo!



Actually, I've got to admit... that does look pretty slick. ;)x


Haha, perhaps it can be a bit bigger , I think it's rather small like this ;-) And I would really like to get my hands on the Godzilla metronome ; it will definitely make my playing-style better ! When is it out - can it be pre-ordered ?????


Edited by JFP (03/01/13 08:51 AM)

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#2041265 - 03/01/13 09:32 AM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: theJourney]
JFP Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/19/10
Posts: 1336
Loc: The Netherlands


Kawai already makes this stand. Only have to adjust the footprint (space between supporting legs). How hard can it be..., if there's a will... Still a missed opportunity IMHO.


Edited by JFP (03/01/13 09:33 AM)

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#2041267 - 03/01/13 09:37 AM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: theJourney]
gvfarns Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/16/07
Posts: 3483
Loc: Pennsylvania
My "music stand" is a computer monitor. Since I'm using the computer to run the VST anyway, I just scan my music and display it on the monitor.

I keep meaning to get around to mapping my soft pedal to page-down so I can flip pages without using my hands.

Back when I used paper I cut a piece of black foamboard and put it on the wire stand (my MP8 has this same music rest and I don't find it good for loose sheets, which I seem to use often). It looked pretty terrific and could hold like 6 sheets or something.

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#2041302 - 03/01/13 11:29 AM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: Kawai James]
anotherscott Online   content
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/20/10
Posts: 3225
So many people today have their sheet music on iPads, and there are plenty of iPad stands that should work fine on top of the VPC.

Originally Posted By: Kawai James
After market accessories such as a 'deluxe' music rest, pitchbend/modulation wheel add-on, or furniture stand are all worthwhile suggestions. However, as with any industry, proven demand must exist before development can be considered.

I like the external pitch bend + mod wheel box idea. 90% of the people on this forum may not care about it, but I think that would still leave a substantial number of people who would like it. Moreover, it would be a device you could market to a much bigger group of people, not just Kawai owners. Over in another forum, people periodically complain that there's no way to add wheels to any of a myriad of keyboards people are using. Yamaha used to make the MCS2 for that purpose, but that was a long time ago. In a way, you could even use it as a stealth marketing device, to get Kawai onto the radar of many players who haven't typically looked at any Kawai products.

To go a little further out on a limb, looking at the $2500 price of an MP10 and the $1850 price of a VPC-1, I wonder if Kawai could offer a rack module with the sounds of the MP10 for under a grand? Another thing you don't find in the market anymore are pianos in rack modules. Yamaha, Roland, Kurzweil, Korg have all offered them in the past... all that's left now are the piano patches in the high-end multi-purpose Motif and Integra modules, which is not the same thing. A half-width module would be ideal (with optional full-width mount brackets), but if it can't be that small, full-width is still okay. I think the MP10 sounds really nice, and it's a shame it's not possible to gig with that sound without a 70+ pound board. I think a lot of people with boards half the weight of an MP10 (or less) might consider a reasonably priced box that would give them a much better piano sound than what most of the lightweight boards provide.

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#2041314 - 03/01/13 11:53 AM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: theJourney]
JFP Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/19/10
Posts: 1336
Loc: The Netherlands
When tablets become more and more powerful and with bigger storage AND with more professional software synths and softare piano's , hardware modules will probably become absolete altogether. They may replace even laptops , cause a tablet is so much more compact, easy to operate and put in an ergonomically good position on the master keyboard. I think it will take a few more years to fully mature for playing music in a professional manner , but certainly not much longer.

I've followed and played with roughly all software instrument developments since the early days and toylike efforts and after initial sceptisism about quality of sound and speed of the laptops (90's remember ?) , it matured really fast and since several years laptops can be used as full blown HQ sound sources for almost every situation. I guess the same will happen with tablet based solutions. It would really provide for a much more compact , sturdy and flexible way of playing than with current laptops IMHO.

For now there are indeed too little seperate hardware boxes available, if you're reluctant to carry a laptop onstage. But I doubt there are any manufacturers still willing to invest in niche products like a piano module. Sad, but true. Only alternative option you have is buy an expensive Integra and use only 10% of the available sounds and features.

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#2041334 - 03/01/13 12:36 PM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: JFP]
anotherscott Online   content
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/20/10
Posts: 3225
I agree about the potential of the tablet. But I think it may well be a few years yet before you'll be able to get...
... a tablet capable of running a high quality piano sound, rock solid and glitch free, with no noticeable latency, plus
... the audio interface, plus
... the piano software itself,
all for under a grand.

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#2041387 - 03/01/13 02:37 PM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: theJourney]
thercman Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/15/12
Posts: 135
Loc: Spokane WA, United States
Learn to play by ear then there is no need for the stand. smirk


Edited by thercman (03/01/13 02:38 PM)
_________________________
NP2, Arturia Laboratory 61

Addictive Keys, Kawai EX Pro
Heil PR-40 Mic, Allen & Heath Mixer, Yamaha HS80

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#2041434 - 03/01/13 03:21 PM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: theJourney]
JFP Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/19/10
Posts: 1336
Loc: The Netherlands


Both made and sold by Kawai. When your 'ear' fails you and the iPad battery is drained - which one would you prefer considering thick books , multiple sheets and 3-on a row. Really my last post on this subject, sorry to bore you all...

(Translucent one should tilt a little more upward , but no time do do extra photoshopping)


Edited by JFP (03/01/13 03:23 PM)

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#2041588 - 03/01/13 07:55 PM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: JFP]
rnaple Offline

Silver Supporter until April 24 2014


Registered: 12/23/10
Posts: 2106
Loc: Rocky Mountains
Originally Posted By: JFP
When tablets become more and more powerful and with bigger storage AND with more professional software synths and softare piano's , hardware modules will probably become absolete altogether. ...For now there are indeed too little seperate hardware boxes available, if you're reluctant to carry a laptop onstage. But I doubt there are any manufacturers still willing to invest in niche products like a piano module. Sad, but true. Only alternative option you have is buy an expensive Integra and use only 10% of the available sounds and features.


I don't know exactly how it is going to go. But...
My intuition tells me with the VPC, that it is going this direction.
The very first thing I expect to see is a Kawai Software Piano. Ivory? Whoever?

I don't know why people have problems going on stage with a Mac? PC I can understand...forget it.

Oh yes.... We need your votes to get James and the development team to finish the Godzilla Metronome. Not only will it look like he's hitting two sticks together. Really won't. Too expensive. He will have an adjustable tail that wags back and forth. Just like an old fashioned metronome!
_________________________
Ron
Your brain is a sponge. Keep it wet. Mary Gae George
The focus of your personal practice is discipline. Not numbers. Scott Sonnon

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#2041590 - 03/01/13 08:07 PM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: theJourney]
adak Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/27/12
Posts: 282
Loc: Canada
Out of all the mock-up stands that are posted, the original wire one still looks the best and I don't even like the wire one too much.
_________________________
Casio Privia PX-150


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#2041602 - 03/01/13 09:07 PM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: theJourney]
whitfit Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/13/11
Posts: 80
Loc: Toronto, Canada
I own an MP10. It is a great keyboard.

The music rest sucks.

James, I really appreciate the feedback that you give, and your responsiveness here, but I don't really understand why you are so critical of those who recognize that the MP10/VPC is not a good music rest.

I agree that other professional stage keyboards have poor or no music rests. That is not an excuse for the MP10/VPC music rest.

For me, I have some larger score books that I copy pages out of so I don't have to lug the full score book around. Those sheets curl up and don't sit properly in the MP10 rest. If I put score books or other thinner music books on the stand, you can't get much on there before they fall over, or start to curl forward.

The music rest could be significantly improved. I would pay more for a good music rest that fits the keyboard mounts. I have my MP10 against a wall, so a big music stand behind the keyboard would be a big pain.

Not everything is perfect, and I wouldn't trade my MP10 for any other stage piano. But, don't be afraid of thinking that the music rest could be improved.

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#2041617 - 03/01/13 09:56 PM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: whitfit]
fizikisto Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/13/12
Posts: 528
Loc: Hernando, MS
Whitfit
Very well said, +1!

And James,
I am among those who are grateful for the time you take and the knowledge you share here on this forum. For some of us, a good music rest is an essential part of our piano playing process. I think you can see that this issue of music rests inspires quite a bit of passion for some of us. That's probably because so many manufacturers of DP's include such terrible music rests (if they have any available at all). It's very frustrating. Part of the reason why it is so frustrating is that it would be such an easy thing to remedy.

You're a Nord Owner. So you're probably familiar with the music rest they offer. The Nord's music rest is a best in class product (large, sturdy, not too heavy, well designed). It's also crazy expensive, but I was happy to shut up and give them my money for it. Maybe I'm spoiled by it, but I really just can't understand why so many other manufacturers ignore that segment of the market place.

I posted on one of the other threads that the Casio PX5S was very interesting to me but that the lack of a sheet music rest was a deal breaker for me. Some people probably think i'm crazy for that, but I just don't see why I should have to compromise on something that's important to me in an instrument, no matter how trivial it might seem to others.

Now I'm glad that the VPC-1 has a music rest, and it might even be adequate. But for a flagship product like the VPC-1, merely adequate is not something to aspire for. Nonetheless, I recognize EVERY product will of course make compromises. And as you point out the VPC-1 does have a music rest. I remain very interested in the VPC-1. I'm thinking seriously about saving up to get one this summer. Despite the fact that I wish that one aspect of the product were improved, I really hope that kawai has a massive hit on their hands with the VPC1. I can tell you this though, if I do pull the trigger and get one this summer, and kawai puts out an optional "improved" music rest, I'd buy it in a heartbeat.

Warm Regards
_________________________
Nord Stage 2 HA88
Roland RD800

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#2041628 - 03/01/13 10:45 PM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: theJourney]
PianoWorksATL Online   content
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/19/09
Posts: 2711
Loc: Atlanta, GA
Check out Adapt-A-Stand for keyboards. It looks like it can improve the wire stand and also make it much bigger.
_________________________
Sam Bennett
PianoWorks - Atlanta Piano Dealer
Bösendorfer, Estonia, Seiler, Grotrian, Weber & Hailun
Pre-Owned: Yamaha, Kawai, Steinway & other fine pianos
Full Restoration Shop
www.PianoWorks.com
www.youtube.com/PianoWorksAtlanta

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#2041690 - 03/02/13 02:48 AM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: gvfarns]
theJourney Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/22/07
Posts: 3946
Loc: Banned
Originally Posted By: gvfarns
...my MP8 has this same music rest and I don't find it good for loose sheets, which I seem to use often...


More latent market demand...

Originally Posted By: whitfit
I own an MP10. It is a great keyboard.

The music rest sucks.

James, I really appreciate the feedback that you give, and your responsiveness here, but I don't really understand why you are so critical of those who recognize that the MP10/VPC is not a good music rest.

I agree that other professional stage keyboards have poor or no music rests. That is not an excuse for the MP10/VPC music rest.

For me, I have some larger score books that I copy pages out of so I don't have to lug the full score book around. Those sheets curl up and don't sit properly in the MP10 rest. If I put score books or other thinner music books on the stand, you can't get much on there before they fall over, or start to curl forward.

The music rest could be significantly improved. I would pay more for a good music rest that fits the keyboard mounts. I have my MP10 against a wall, so a big music stand behind the keyboard would be a big pain.

Not everything is perfect, and I wouldn't trade my MP10 for any other stage piano. But, don't be afraid of thinking that the music rest could be improved.


More latent market demand.
Originally Posted By: fizikisto
For some of us, a good music rest is an essential part of our piano playing process. I think you can see that this issue of music rests inspires quite a bit of passion for some of us. That's probably because so many manufacturers of DP's include such terrible music rests (if they have any available at all). It's very frustrating. Part of the reason why it is so frustrating is that it would be such an easy thing to remedy.
...

Now I'm glad that the VPC-1 has a music rest, and it might even be adequate. ... I remain very interested in the VPC-1.... if I do pull the trigger and get one this summer, and if kawai puts out an optional "improved" music rest, I'd buy it in a heartbeat.

And more...
Well said BTW.

Originally Posted By: Kawai James
After market accessories such as a 'deluxe' music rest, pitchbend/modulation wheel add-on, or furniture stand are all worthwhile suggestions. However, as with any industry, proven demand must exist before development can be considered.


It is certainly an interesting approach to marketing.

First we build something that doesn't meet market needs and when it doesn't sell then we can point to the lack of sales as a reason not to develop products that meet market needs.

Could this one elementary difference in philosophy explain the huge difference in size, success and market coverage between Yamaha and Kawai?


Edited by theJourney (03/02/13 02:52 AM)

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#2041691 - 03/02/13 03:02 AM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: PianoWorksATL]
theJourney Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/22/07
Posts: 3946
Loc: Banned
Originally Posted By: PianoWorksATL
Check out Adapt-A-Stand for keyboards. It looks like it can improve the wire stand and also make it much bigger.


Interesting that your pictures show the music desk where it belongs at the back of the keys rather than at the back of the (Kawai RM3 deep) keyboard on the VPC-1.

Solidity, angle, capacity and width are important.

However, positioning, depth and distance to eyes are also important.

A piece of clip on wire that is attached to the back of an historically deep keyboard rather than configured to the real-world piano playing process is just a piece of frustration-inducing wire.

From a wooden keys sporting, piano-only, virtual piano software controller from a real piano company a consumer should reasonabley be able to expect that the playing experience would be made the priority and point of departure in product design and development decisions.

Your proposed solution would work on a keyboard where the music stand is at a normal depth, but it only solves part of the problem for the VPC-1 unless there is a way to bring the distance of the music desk to the player to the same ranges of distance found on a real piano.

So, far the last solutions shown by James (before the photoshopped, oversized Kawai grand music desk) seem to be the most promising.

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#2041692 - 03/02/13 03:10 AM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: JFP]
theJourney Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/22/07
Posts: 3946
Loc: Banned
Originally Posted By: JFP
When tablets become more and more powerful


From the point of view of displaying scores, a tablet would have to have the following characteristics for me:

- at least A4 size but preferably the same size display as Henle urtext editions;

- a stylus that allows one to make annotations easily;

- library software to manage pdfs, versions, etc.;

- a page turning pedal or responsive touch screen;

- a mount for an adjustable stand such as suggested by James or a music desk that has the same functionality as a music desk on a real piano.

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#2041702 - 03/02/13 03:53 AM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: whitfit]
Kawai James Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 9196
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Hi whitfit,

Originally Posted By: whitfit
I own an MP10. It is a great keyboard.


I'm glad to hear you enjoy it!

Originally Posted By: whitfit
The music rest sucks.


It's not the best, I agree. but it serves a purpose and is surely better than no music rest at all.

Originally Posted By: whitfit
I don't really understand why you are so critical of those who recognize that the MP10/VPC is not a good music rest.


I don't believe I have been critical of others, however my apologies if I gave that impression.

Originally Posted By: whitfit
I agree that other professional stage keyboards have poor or no music rests. That is not an excuse for the MP10/VPC music rest.


I'm not sure I understand your point. Are you suggesting it would be preferable to not include a music rest?

Originally Posted By: whitfit
For me, I have some larger score books that I copy pages out of so I don't have to lug the full score book around. Those sheets curl up and don't sit properly in the MP10 rest. If I put score books or other thinner music books on the stand, you can't get much on there before they fall over, or start to curl forward.


Okay, I take your point - larger/thicker books may not sit comfortably on the MP10 music rest.

Originally Posted By: whitfit
The music rest could be significantly improved. I would pay more for a good music rest that fits the keyboard mounts.


And I'm sure others would too. However, the question is whether the majority of consumers would be willing to pay extra. For many, the included music rest is fine, while a large number of others might never use the music rest at all. The challenge is trying to produce an instrument with the right balance between features, quality, and price.

Originally Posted By: whitfit
I have my MP10 against a wall, so a big music stand behind the keyboard would be a big pain.


Yes, I too place my keyboards beside the wall.

Originally Posted By: whitfit
Not everything is perfect, and I wouldn't trade my MP10 for any other stage piano. But, don't be afraid of thinking that the music rest could be improved.


Thank you, I appreciate your feedback. For the record, I agree that the music rest is not perfect, and could be improved. However, I also appreciate the challenges that my R&D colleagues face in realising these improvements, while still keeping everything within the allocated budget.

Kind regards,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#2041707 - 03/02/13 04:22 AM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: theJourney]
JFP Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/19/10
Posts: 1336
Loc: The Netherlands
Do the R&D colleagues know anything at all about feedback from buyers who are not really happy with the rest and the suggested solutions ?? Like refitting the little metal legs of the translucent stand - you already make - so they fit on the MP6/MP10/VPC and perhaps older model ?

Or is everything being discussed here and on other fora being filtered and anxiously kept from them so they are still completely ignorant and in the assumption they made the best stand in the world and everybody is happily using the stand and know nothing about the complaints and so obvious and simple solution, that might even generate some nice sales in accessories (a big margin market).

As indicated most wouldn't even care to spend some extra on extra accessories as long as they are available - so "keeping everything within budget" seems a lame excuse to me. I'm still under the impression the thought to include another stand never crossed ones mind, despite complaints about the stand on the MP10 and others in the past. However, the VPC is NOT a stage piano like the MP10 and mostly intended to sit in a studio or at home and function as a piano (!) - and a decent piano has a decent stand.

You agree the current stand is a compromise. Why not at least suggest the idea of a better stand to the R&D department and decision makers, instead of rephrasing " it's not perfect, but it is as it is and there's nothing we can do about it" ?

I thought I was done with this , but the remarks pushed me to open the subject ones more, cause I simply fail to understand why it "is as it is and can't be changed".

I understand many remarks here that state " Who needs a stand anyway. Play by the ears. Buy your own separate stand and put it behind the VPC. Stop whining ! " but

It's marketed as a Virtual Piano(!) Controller and targets mostly piano lovers who wish to couple the best keybed with the best piano software out there. Probably many classical and Jazz music players that use sheets and music books a lot. Giggers will buy another stage model or an MP10 and in that situation the stand may not be needed. Putting a separate stand behind the VPC is yet another thing, makes you reach even farther over the piano and readability much harder and in many situations - studio desk / against the wall - is not an option.

Please don't consider this a bunch of whining , never satisfied , boring customers , but take the suggestions for improvements seriously and have R&D etc take notice. The solution seems so easy and again might generate extra sales along the line...

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#2041710 - 03/02/13 04:42 AM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: fizikisto]
Kawai James Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 9196
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Hi fizikisto,

Originally Posted By: fizikisto
I am among those who are grateful for the time you take and the knowledge you share here on this forum.


Thank you.

Originally Posted By: fizikisto
For some of us, a good music rest is an essential part of our piano playing process. I think you can see that this issue of music rests inspires quite a bit of passion for some of us.


Yes, it's clear that for some folks posting in this topic, the music rest is very important.
However, as I pointed out in my response to whitfit, not everyone shares this opinion, moreover, not everyone would be willing to pay extra for a large music rest that they may never use.

Originally Posted By: fizikisto
That's probably because so many manufacturers of DP's include such terrible music rests (if they have any available at all). It's very frustrating. Part of the reason why it is so frustrating is that it would be such an easy thing to remedy.


Respectfully, I disagree. If it was so easy to accomplish, all DP manufacturers would be including perfect music rests, and you would not be frustrated.

Originally Posted By: fizikisto
You're a Nord Owner. So you're probably familiar with the music rest they offer.


Yes, it's a nice accessory.

Originally Posted By: fizikisto
The Nord's music rest is a best in class product (large, sturdy, not too heavy, well designed). It's also crazy expensive...


58 Euros on Thomann.de. To be honest, I'd say that's a fair price given the assumed quality and relatively small number of units Clavia produce.

Originally Posted By: fizikisto
...but I was happy to shut up and give them my money for it.


That's fine.

Originally Posted By: fizikisto
Maybe I'm spoiled by it, but I really just can't understand why so many other manufacturers ignore that segment of the market place.


So to clarify, you wouldn't have any objections to Yamaha, Roland, or Kawai, etc. charging a similar price for such an accessory?

Originally Posted By: fizikisto
Now I'm glad that the VPC-1 has a music rest, and it might even be adequate. But for a flagship product like the VPC-1, merely adequate is not something to aspire for. Nonetheless, I recognize EVERY product will of course make compromises. And as you point out the VPC-1 does have a music rest.


I agree with you on many of those points. It is all about finding the best balance between quality, features, and price that will appeal to the majority of consumers.

Originally Posted By: fizikisto
I remain very interested in the VPC-1. I'm thinking seriously about saving up to get one this summer. Despite the fact that I wish that one aspect of the product were improved, I really hope that kawai has a massive hit on their hands with the VPC1.


I'm sure the VPC team hope so too. wink

Originally Posted By: fizikisto
I can tell you this though, if I do pull the trigger and get one this summer, and kawai puts out an optional "improved" music rest, I'd buy it in a heartbeat.


Sounds like a plan!
Maybe I should set-up an online poll page on the VPC website, allowing folks to vote on which accessories they'd be most interested in?

Or perhaps even a Kickstarter project? wink

Thank you for your feedback.

Kind regards,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

Top
#2041712 - 03/02/13 04:46 AM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: PianoWorksATL]
Kawai James Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 9196
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Originally Posted By: PianoWorksATL
Check out Adapt-A-Stand for keyboards. It looks like it can improve the wire stand and also make it much bigger.


That looks like an interesting solution, good find!

Can anyone identify the board shown in the example images?



Cheers,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

Top
#2041714 - 03/02/13 05:00 AM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: Kawai James]
theJourney Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/22/07
Posts: 3946
Loc: Banned
Originally Posted By: Kawai James
For the record, I agree that the music rest is not perfect, and could be improved. However, I also appreciate the challenges that my R&D colleagues face in realising these improvements, while still keeping everything within the allocated budget.

Kind regards,
James
x


Or, perhaps even more accurately, the budgetary constraints that your manufacturing engineering colleagues had to deal with (simply use existing supplies and existing assemblies to put out what is basically just a stripped down existing product) rather than challenges of RESEARCH and DEVELOPMENT which would imply coming up with a built-from-the-ground up designed virtual piano controller starting with well-understood and investigated customer needs and designing a product to meet them.

It is tough being a small company. However, many small companies do have potential advantages such as being more nimble, more flexible, potentially closer to the market, etc. When small companies combine the disadvantages of a small company (not being able to afford to build what customers want) with the disadvantages of a big company (not listening) is when I begin to worry.

Top
#2041717 - 03/02/13 05:13 AM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: theJourney]
Kawai James Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 9196
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Hi theJourney,

Originally Posted By: theJourney
It is certainly an interesting approach to marketing.

First we build something that doesn't meet market needs...


My colleagues and I believe there is a market need for a professional-quality keyboard controller, geared towards the growing community of virtual piano software players.

Originally Posted By: theJourney
...and when it doesn't sell then we can point to the lack of sales as a reason not to develop products that meet market needs.


So far the response to the VPC1 has been extremely positive (pitchbend and music rest concerns aside...), which - fingers crossed - should help to pave the way for future accessories.

Originally Posted By: theJourney
Could this one elementary difference in philosophy explain the huge difference in size, success and market coverage between Yamaha and Kawai?


Possibly, although I hear they also make really great music rests. wink

Thank you for your feedback.

Cheers,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

Top
#2041721 - 03/02/13 05:26 AM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: theJourney]
Kawai James Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 9196
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
JFP, thank you for your post (and nice Photoshop work...).

I've already sent an email to my work email address, reminding me to raise this topic with the VPC team/R&D.

Cheers,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

Top
#2041722 - 03/02/13 05:29 AM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: theJourney]
Kawai James Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 9196
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Originally Posted By: theJourney
It is tough being a small company. However, many small companies do have potential advantages such as being more nimble, more flexible, potentially closer to the market, etc. When small companies combine the disadvantages of a small company (not being able to afford to build what customers want) with the disadvantages of a big company (not listening) is when I begin to worry.


Please don't worry tJ! wink

James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

Top
#2041723 - 03/02/13 05:36 AM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: Kawai James]
JFP Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/19/10
Posts: 1336
Loc: The Netherlands
Originally Posted By: Kawai James

That looks like an interesting solution, good find!

Can anyone identify the board shown in the example images?


Is there a bigger , more high res picture available ? Could it be a Croma , or old Roland - though Roland doesn't use mod/pitch wheels , mmmm ?

Top
#2041725 - 03/02/13 05:40 AM Re: Solution for Music Desk on Kawai VPC-1 [Re: JFP]
Kawai James Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 9196
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Originally Posted By: JFP
Is there a bigger , more high res picture available ?


Nope, that was all I could find. The fact that it's a .gif may also offer some clues as to the instrument's vintage - it might even be a Kawai! wink

James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

Top
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