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#2052621 - 03/22/13 05:14 PM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: Mark_C]
-Frycek Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/06/05
Posts: 5921
Loc: SC Mountains
Originally Posted By: Mark_C
Originally Posted By: bennevis
I think we should all get together to write a script for a new B-movie, using all the latest CGI technology, which might interest a Mr. Steven S.... grin

Great post, and excellent choice! ha

I think it could also work with Quentin Tarantino, or by exhuming Alfred Hitchcock....


Hey, I'd watch it. I think it could actually work. Sort of a cyberage version of the Mephisto Waltz. (Alan Alda, not Liszt)
_________________________
Slow down and do it right.

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#2052628 - 03/22/13 05:25 PM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: bennevis]
outo Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/02/12
Posts: 527
Loc: Finland
Originally Posted By: bennevis
Originally Posted By: patH
Originally Posted By: bennevis
I sense a Hollywood blockbuster coming to a screen near you Death by Piano......(which pays homage to Alfred Hitchcock).

Or maybe to Tom and Jerry? wink
There was already a short T&J movie where Tom gets killed by a piano while chasing Jerry. Then he ascends to heaven, where he is told that he has one hour to make Jerry forgive him, otherwise he'll end up in heck. And at the end:
Click to reveal..
Tom wakes up, and it was all a dream.





I think we should all get together to write a script for a new B-movie, using all the latest CGI technology, which might interest a Mr. Steven S. grin

My idea involves a new piano competition where competitors have to play on a brand new 110-key grand designed by the founder of the competition, who also composed a concerto that all finalists must play.

Competitors start disappearing mysteriously as they begin practicing on the amazing Böstéînfåzyám piano, trying desperately to master the intractable difficulties of the 90 minute concerto. Everyone thought they were getting cold feet, and pulling out one by one, but too embarrassed to let the organisers know they were flying off home.

Then people began noticing that the piano was 'developing' more and more keys, and its tone was getting more mellifluous as competitors disappeared off into the ether. One of the favored pianists put a hidden video camera to see what was happening during the practice sessions....... wink

....and saw, to her horror, that when the pianist played a wrong note, the piano lid suddenly expanded and curled out, and turned into a huge upper jaw to gobble up the hapless pianist, sucking him into its innards.........grin



Can't wait, never could resist B-horror...

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#2052860 - 03/23/13 09:15 AM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: Mark_C]
wouter79 Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/14/10
Posts: 3446
Lemon Pledge +1. Speakers suck at reproducing piano sound. Maybe the speaker approach is flawed completely. But the elecronic sound boards are not really much better either. So my vote is 'no'

But I realize that many people don't hear the difference so 'democracy' may determine otherwise...


Edited by wouter79 (03/23/13 09:16 AM)
_________________________

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#2053295 - 03/24/13 06:37 AM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: wouter79]
-Frycek Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/06/05
Posts: 5921
Loc: SC Mountains
Originally Posted By: wouter79

But I realize that many people don't hear the difference so 'democracy' may determine otherwise...


Not "democracy." Captitalism.
_________________________
Slow down and do it right.

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#2053339 - 03/24/13 08:32 AM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: -Frycek]
theJourney Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/22/07
Posts: 3946
Loc: Banned
Originally Posted By: -Frycek
Originally Posted By: wouter79

But I realize that many people don't hear the difference so 'democracy' may determine otherwise...


Not "democracy." Captitalism.


Captitalism sounds like the economy of the red light district...

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#2053345 - 03/24/13 08:44 AM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: -Frycek]
patH Online   content
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/09/13
Posts: 547
Loc: Germany
Originally Posted By: -Frycek
Originally Posted By: wouter79

But I realize that many people don't hear the difference so 'democracy' may determine otherwise...


Not "democracy." Captitalism.

And capitalism says: As long as there are people willing to shell out good money for quality acoustic instruments, they (the acoustic instruments) won't die out.

The instruments that will possibly die out are the cheaply made acoustic instruments, with mediocre sound and not-so-great action. Because these instruments don't offer more value for their money than good digital pianos. But who knows; maybe people who buy pianos will somehow still like acoustic instruments.

That's why capitalism is good: It gives people a choice as to decide what will survive in the market.
_________________________
Everything is possible, and nothing is sure.
XXXI

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#2053556 - 03/24/13 04:07 PM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: Mark_C]
wouter79 Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/14/10
Posts: 3446
Yes maybe that's right, if it's just market work yet then it is capitalism.

But government also plays a role. If it's decided that it's too expensive to *educate* the people that build, tune and maintain these pianos, then it's more a political choice?
_________________________

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#2053558 - 03/24/13 04:13 PM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: wouter79]
Damon Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/22/06
Posts: 6063
Loc: St. Louis area
Originally Posted By: wouter79

But government also plays a role. If it's decided that it's too expensive to *educate* the people that build, tune and maintain these pianos, then it's more a political choice?


What government educates piano builders?
_________________________
It's been scientifically proven that Horowitz sucks.

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#2053562 - 03/24/13 04:23 PM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: Damon]
-Frycek Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/06/05
Posts: 5921
Loc: SC Mountains
Originally Posted By: Damon
Originally Posted By: wouter79

But government also plays a role. If it's decided that it's too expensive to *educate* the people that build, tune and maintain these pianos, then it's more a political choice?


What government educates piano builders?


Or piano tuners?
_________________________
Slow down and do it right.

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#2053565 - 03/24/13 04:24 PM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: BruceD]
JoelW Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/25/12
Posts: 4750
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: BruceD
Said, obviously, by a young starry-eyed romantic from a decidedly North American point of view. Given that the American divorce rate is almost 50% (46% in 2012), how strong an argument is that for "marrying for love"?


First of all, Pogo never said "marry for infatuation". Get it right.

Secondly, I'm so sick of older people who condescend to young people for being young. That s*** is obnoxious.

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#2053578 - 03/24/13 04:47 PM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: Mark_C]
wouter79 Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/14/10
Posts: 3446
Government pays the schools a lot. But only the official recognised institutions. And the government also judges the quality of the institutions and for accreditation of the diplomas. So I suppose they have quite some influence on WHAT is being teached.
_________________________

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#2053582 - 03/24/13 04:52 PM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: wouter79]
Damon Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/22/06
Posts: 6063
Loc: St. Louis area
Originally Posted By: wouter79
Government pays the schools a lot. But only the official recognised institutions. And the government also judges the quality of the institutions and for accreditation of the diplomas. So I suppose they have quite some influence on WHAT is being teached.


Perhaps in general education but what government document or instruction can you produce that outlines and refines the process of building and tuning a piano? Can't a home schooled person become an expert piano builder or tuner without the assistance of government? Or is it this?

_________________________
It's been scientifically proven that Horowitz sucks.

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#2053601 - 03/24/13 05:27 PM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: JoelW]
-Frycek Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/06/05
Posts: 5921
Loc: SC Mountains
Originally Posted By: JoelW
Originally Posted By: BruceD
Said, obviously, by a young starry-eyed romantic from a decidedly North American point of view. Given that the American divorce rate is almost 50% (46% in 2012), how strong an argument is that for "marrying for love"?


First of all, Pogo never said "marry for infatuation". Get it right.

Secondly, I'm so sick of older people condescending towards young people for being young. That s*** is obnoxious.


Hey, I'm a decidedly older person. I'm on your side.

(More or less happliy married for 30 years. One of my favorite songs is "Hello Young Lovers" from the King and I. It pretty much says it all.)
_________________________
Slow down and do it right.

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#2053609 - 03/24/13 05:42 PM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: Damon]
patH Online   content
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/09/13
Posts: 547
Loc: Germany
Originally Posted By: Damon
Originally Posted By: wouter79
Government pays the schools a lot. But only the official recognised institutions. And the government also judges the quality of the institutions and for accreditation of the diplomas. So I suppose they have quite some influence on WHAT is being teached.


Perhaps in general education but what government document or instruction can you produce that outlines and refines the process of building and tuning a piano? Can't a home schooled person become an expert piano builder or tuner without the assistance of government? Or is it this?

I don't know the situation in America; but in Germany there are schools ("Berufsfachschulen") where instrument building is taught as a profession. The schools are usually public schools and supervised by the government.

Another way to become an instrument builder is in a company; starting as an apprentice and eventually becoming a graduate and a master.
I don't know much about the training system in companies; but I believe that government agencies supervise them. After all, diplomas should be comparable.
_________________________
Everything is possible, and nothing is sure.
XXXI

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#2053616 - 03/24/13 06:07 PM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: patH]
-Frycek Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/06/05
Posts: 5921
Loc: SC Mountains
Originally Posted By: patH
Originally Posted By: Damon
Originally Posted By: wouter79
Government pays the schools a lot. But only the official recognised institutions. And the government also judges the quality of the institutions and for accreditation of the diplomas. So I suppose they have quite some influence on WHAT is being teached.


Perhaps in general education but what government document or instruction can you produce that outlines and refines the process of building and tuning a piano? Can't a home schooled person become an expert piano builder or tuner without the assistance of government? Or is it this?

I don't know the situation in America; but in Germany there are schools ("Berufsfachschulen") where instrument building is taught as a profession. The schools are usually public schools and supervised by the government.

Another way to become an instrument builder is in a company; starting as an apprentice and eventually becoming a graduate and a master.
I don't know much about the training system in companies; but I believe that government agencies supervise them. After all, diplomas should be comparable.


No such thing exists in the US. (Big surprize, right?)
_________________________
Slow down and do it right.

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#2053724 - 03/24/13 10:16 PM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: JoelW]
BruceD Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 17825
Loc: Victoria, BC
Originally Posted By: JoelW

First of all, Pogo never said "marry for infatuation". Get it right.


I never said she did. Get it right, dude!
_________________________
BruceD
- - - - -
Estonia 190

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#2053728 - 03/24/13 10:32 PM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: BruceD]
JoelW Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/25/12
Posts: 4750
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: BruceD
Originally Posted By: JoelW

First of all, Pogo never said "marry for infatuation". Get it right.


I never said she did. Get it right, dude!


That's what you seemed to imply.

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#2053729 - 03/24/13 10:34 PM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: -Frycek]
argerichfan Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/15/06
Posts: 8816
Loc: Pacific Northwest, US.
Originally Posted By: -Frycek
One of my favorite songs is "Hello Young Lovers" from the King and I. It pretty much says it all.)

But maybe not so intense as We Kiss in the Shadow?

wink
_________________________
Jason

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#2053734 - 03/24/13 10:51 PM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: JoelW]
Damon Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/22/06
Posts: 6063
Loc: St. Louis area
Originally Posted By: JoelW

Secondly, I'm so sick of older people condescending towards young people for being young. That s*** is obnoxious.


I'm sick of young people using adjectives in place of active verbs. laugh
_________________________
It's been scientifically proven that Horowitz sucks.

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#2053737 - 03/24/13 11:00 PM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: Damon]
JoelW Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/25/12
Posts: 4750
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: Damon
Originally Posted By: JoelW

Secondly, I'm so sick of older people condescending towards young people for being young. That s*** is obnoxious.


I'm sick of young people using adjectives in place of active verbs. laugh


Fixed. (I think?) grin

--

EDIT: Damnit, someone help me out with this grammar.

"don't condescend to me" or "don't condescend me"

I don't even care about my previous post, I just want to know!

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#2053785 - 03/25/13 02:44 AM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: JoelW]
ando Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/23/10
Posts: 3498
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Originally Posted By: JoelW
Originally Posted By: Damon
Originally Posted By: JoelW

Secondly, I'm so sick of older people condescending towards young people for being young. That s*** is obnoxious.


I'm sick of young people using adjectives in place of active verbs. laugh


Fixed. (I think?) grin

--

EDIT: Damnit, someone help me out with this grammar.

"don't condescend to me" or "don't condescend me"

I don't even care about my previous post, I just want to know!


Joel, there was actually nothing wrong with your sentence.

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#2053792 - 03/25/13 03:29 AM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: ando]
JoelW Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/25/12
Posts: 4750
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: ando
Originally Posted By: JoelW
Originally Posted By: Damon
Originally Posted By: JoelW

Secondly, I'm so sick of older people condescending towards young people for being young. That s*** is obnoxious.


I'm sick of young people using adjectives in place of active verbs. laugh


Fixed. (I think?) grin

--

EDIT: Damnit, someone help me out with this grammar.

"don't condescend to me" or "don't condescend me"

I don't even care about my previous post, I just want to know!


Joel, there was actually nothing wrong with your sentence.


I give up.

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#2053840 - 03/25/13 07:39 AM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: patH]
wr Offline
7000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/23/07
Posts: 7753
Originally Posted By: patH
Originally Posted By: -Frycek
Originally Posted By: wouter79

But I realize that many people don't hear the difference so 'democracy' may determine otherwise...


Not "democracy." Captitalism.

And capitalism says: As long as there are people willing to shell out good money for quality acoustic instruments, they (the acoustic instruments) won't die out.

The instruments that will possibly die out are the cheaply made acoustic instruments, with mediocre sound and not-so-great action. Because these instruments don't offer more value for their money than good digital pianos. But who knows; maybe people who buy pianos will somehow still like acoustic instruments.

That's why capitalism is good: It gives people a choice as to decide what will survive in the market.


No, that is not "why capitalism is good" - it's merely an assertion of some beliefs you have about the marketplace and about people and about musical instruments. To me, it amounts to "why capitalism is bad", because there's a false relationship between demand, worth, and cost.

A flaw in the premise that immediately pops into mind is this: the people who may find the most value in an instrument (or whatever) and can get the most use out of it, may also be the least able to afford that item. It's quite possible for something that has worth to the culture as a whole to fail in the marketplace.

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#2053867 - 03/25/13 08:39 AM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: wr]
ClsscLib Offline

Platinum Supporter until Jan 02 2013


Registered: 03/14/08
Posts: 1713
Loc: Northern VA, U.S.
Originally Posted By: wr
Originally Posted By: patH
Originally Posted By: -Frycek
Originally Posted By: wouter79

But I realize that many people don't hear the difference so 'democracy' may determine otherwise...


Not "democracy." Captitalism.

And capitalism says: As long as there are people willing to shell out good money for quality acoustic instruments, they (the acoustic instruments) won't die out.

The instruments that will possibly die out are the cheaply made acoustic instruments, with mediocre sound and not-so-great action. Because these instruments don't offer more value for their money than good digital pianos. But who knows; maybe people who buy pianos will somehow still like acoustic instruments.

That's why capitalism is good: It gives people a choice as to decide what will survive in the market.


No, that is not "why capitalism is good" - it's merely an assertion of some beliefs you have about the marketplace and about people and about musical instruments. To me, it amounts to "why capitalism is bad", because there's a false relationship between demand, worth, and cost.

A flaw in the premise that immediately pops into mind is this: the people who may find the most value in an instrument (or whatever) and can get the most use out of it, may also be the least able to afford that item. It's quite possible for something that has worth to the culture as a whole to fail in the marketplace.



Unfortunately, the only objective, universal measure of "value" that we have is money. By that measure, the people who find the most value in instruments (or anything else) are the people willing to pay the most for them.

Beyond that, there are various private and subjective measures of "value" capable of yielding any sort of argumentative conclusion clearly implied by the premises with which one begins the argument.
_________________________


"People may say I can't sing, but no one can ever say I didn't sing."

-- Florence Foster Jenkins

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#2053881 - 03/25/13 09:12 AM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: BruceD]
Pogorelich. Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 4526
Loc: in the past
Originally Posted By: BruceD
Originally Posted By: JoelW

First of all, Pogo never said "marry for infatuation". Get it right.


I never said she did. Get it right, dude!


... "dude"?
_________________________

'I want to invest my emotions only in music; it will never disappoint me or hurt me - it is a safe place to be.'

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#2053932 - 03/25/13 10:57 AM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: JoelW]
the nosy ape Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/10/08
Posts: 707
Loc: Westford, MA
Originally Posted By: JoelW
Originally Posted By: Damon
Originally Posted By: JoelW

Secondly, I'm so sick of older people condescending towards young people for being young. That s*** is obnoxious.


I'm sick of young people using adjectives in place of active verbs. laugh


Fixed. (I think?) grin

--

EDIT: Damnit, someone help me out with this grammar.

"don't condescend to me" or "don't condescend me"

I don't even care about my previous post, I just want to know!

Well, since you ask, "condescend" is a verb while "condescending" is an adjective. People can condescend, but they cannot condescending. People can, however, be condescending.

Top
#2053941 - 03/25/13 11:12 AM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: the nosy ape]
ando Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/23/10
Posts: 3498
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Originally Posted By: the nosy ape
Originally Posted By: JoelW
Originally Posted By: Damon
Originally Posted By: JoelW

Secondly, I'm so sick of older people condescending towards young people for being young. That s*** is obnoxious.


I'm sick of young people using adjectives in place of active verbs. laugh


Fixed. (I think?) grin

--

EDIT: Damnit, someone help me out with this grammar.

"don't condescend to me" or "don't condescend me"

I don't even care about my previous post, I just want to know!

Well, since you ask, "condescend" is a verb while "condescending" is an adjective. People can condescend, but they cannot condescending. People can, however, be condescending.


Not true. It is perfectly acceptable to use the verb as a present participle with an "ing" ending.

Example: I'm tired of people speaking to me like I'm a child.

The word speaking can be an adjective, but in this case, it functions as a verb and an alternative to the following sentence:

I'm of people who speak to me like I'm a child.

The use of "condescending" as a present participle makes it a verb in a continuously active form. It happens all the time in all sorts of situation.

I'm tired of driving to work.
I'm sick of people complaining.

It's the same thing as Joel's sentence.

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#2053942 - 03/25/13 11:12 AM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: the nosy ape]
JoelW Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/25/12
Posts: 4750
Loc: USA
Yes I understand that but I was asking about whether or not to use 'to' after 'condescend', see the edit in my post you quoted.

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#2053947 - 03/25/13 11:26 AM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: Pogorelich.]
BruceD Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 17825
Loc: Victoria, BC
Originally Posted By: Pogorelich.
Originally Posted By: BruceD
Originally Posted By: JoelW

First of all, Pogo never said "marry for infatuation". Get it right.


I never said she did. Get it right, dude!


... "dude"?


Isn't Joel a "dude"?
_________________________
BruceD
- - - - -
Estonia 190

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#2053949 - 03/25/13 11:27 AM Re: Poll (sort of): Will the 'acoustic piano' become a relic? [Re: JoelW]
BruceD Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 17825
Loc: Victoria, BC
Originally Posted By: JoelW
Yes I understand that but I was asking about whether or not to use 'to' after 'condescend', see the edit in my post you quoted.


The usual expression is to be condescending towards someone.

Regards,
_________________________
BruceD
- - - - -
Estonia 190

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