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#2051855 - 03/21/13 10:29 AM Fingering for a succession of triads?
riley80 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/03/08
Posts: 406
Loc: Florida
OK - here's an example:

CEG, DFA, EGB, and so on up.

Are there some hints for fingering a long succession? How about a 'hill' of ascending and descending triads?

All I can play is a very non-legato mess with some notes missed entirely!! (6/8 time)

Is there a Hanon I can refer to for this situation?

I promise not to ask any more questions for a long while. Thanks.

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#2051858 - 03/21/13 10:35 AM Re: Fingering for a succession of triads? [Re: riley80]
chrisbell Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/11/07
Posts: 1379
Loc: Stockholm, Sweden
One way is this

C major:
4 5 4 5
2 3 2 3
1 1 1 1
C Dm Em F etc
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#2051912 - 03/21/13 12:20 PM Re: Fingering for a succession of triads? [Re: riley80]
BDB Offline
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Registered: 06/07/03
Posts: 22696
Loc: Oakland
The best reference is Moszkowski's School of Double Notes.
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#2051915 - 03/21/13 12:26 PM Re: Fingering for a succession of triads? [Re: riley80]
Dave Horne Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/07/04
Posts: 5293
Loc: Vught, The Netherlands
Tempo? Pedal use?

I might be tempted to use the same fingering for every triad.
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#2051951 - 03/21/13 01:20 PM Re: Fingering for a succession of triads? [Re: riley80]
BruceD Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 18841
Loc: Victoria, BC
It all depends upon context, doesn't it?

The opening of the fourth movement of the Beethoven Sonata in C, Op 2, No 3 begins with a series of ascending triads in first inversion, but because each is marked staccato, it is possible to play them all 1/2/5, although Schnabel suggests that some of the top notes can be taken with 4, when there is a momentary downward interval of a half-tone.

Regards,
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#2051993 - 03/21/13 02:26 PM Re: Fingering for a succession of triads? [Re: riley80]
Derulux Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/06/05
Posts: 5446
Loc: Philadelphia
The slower it is, and the more connected, the more likely I am to use alternating fingerings. The faster it is, the more likely I am to use the same fingering throughout the passage.

For the example you've provided, I would probably use 124 if it's fast. If it's slow, you can alternate like chrisbell describes.

A famous descending passage in Liszt's Mazzeppa is often played almost exclusively with 125, but there are a few chords in there where I alternate to 135 and 124. Why is it 125? The chords are all (I believe, off the top of my head) 2nd inversion chords, and the fingering "fits" better.

In the end, it's all about what fits best in your hand. smile
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#2052024 - 03/21/13 03:35 PM Re: Fingering for a succession of triads? [Re: BruceD]
riley80 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/03/08
Posts: 406
Loc: Florida
Bruce,

I looked at that Beethoven 'allegro assai' - it's noted staccato in my score too and NO fingering suggested.

I will just have to use pedal somewhat liberally and work in 4 and 5 at the crest of that hill. Fortunately, there is no singing during these passages, so I can relax a bit.

Thanks

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#2052030 - 03/21/13 03:46 PM Re: Fingering for a succession of triads? [Re: riley80]
BruceD Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 18841
Loc: Victoria, BC
Originally Posted By: riley80
[...]I promise not to ask any more questions for a long while. Thanks.


Don't make a promise like that. Many enjoy reading and responding to the questions of others, and many benefit from the answers given.

Keep 'em coming whenever you have them!

Regards,
_________________________
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- - - - -
Estonia 190

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#2052231 - 03/22/13 01:30 AM Re: Fingering for a succession of triads? [Re: riley80]
HNB Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/03/09
Posts: 73
Loc: Australia
I think it's a good question smile

Consider a couple of points:
1) you only really need to connect one voice (ie the soprano) to achieve an effective legato sound, and
2) notes don't have to be connected with your fingers to sound legato to your ears!

You could practice walking up the scale using 5,4,5,4 etc. When you have the knack and it's nice & relaxed, add the other voices with 3 & 1 or 2 & 1 respectively, and voila! legato triads smile

Descending, you would change fingers, ie 5, 4-5, 4-5, 4-5.

I would just add that it's VERY easy to injure yourself practicing stuff like this, so be careful not to grip the keys or twist your wrist, and if it feels at all uncomfortable don't do it!

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#2055053 - 03/27/13 11:31 AM Re: Fingering for a succession of triads? [Re: HNB]
riley80 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/03/08
Posts: 406
Loc: Florida
Originally Posted By: HNB
I think it's a good question smile


You could practice walking up the scale using 5,4,5,4 etc. When you have the knack and it's nice & relaxed, add the other voices with 3 & 1 or 2 & 1 respectively, and voila! legato triads smile
don't do it!


Thanks. I tried it, but was very awkward and not at all relaxed on the ascent, and not enough time to work on it. I think the sustain pedal will have to be my friend on this. I'll remember this for future use tho.

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