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#2057697 - 04/01/13 09:31 AM Can't decide...help me shop!
joce Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 03/31/13
Posts: 9
Hi everyone on PW! I'm an adult looking for a piano to start practising with. Last time I touched a piano was more than 10 yrs ago, shortly after passing grade 6 ABRSM.

I'm primarily looking for a piano as an accompaniment to singing although I aspire to eventually play some Chopin. I will need to connect it to my computer to record. Size isn't a huge factor but aesthetics are. I have a bulldozer of a dog that will get herself caught in wiring and then tear all sorts of electronics down, so slabs (?) are out of the question.

I really like the sound of Roland HP505 (US$3125) but it's slightly over my initial budget. Is it worth the extra $ over the F120 ($1860) and HP503 ($2450)?

Has anyone tried the vocal harmonizing and mic inputs of HPi series? Seems like an interesting thing to have for a piano. At my local piano store, HPi-6F is sold for the same price as HP505. Does anyone know how they differ for regular playing? I'm not yet good enough to differentiate between some of the higher end pianos.

Thanks in advance!
Jocelyn

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#2057706 - 04/01/13 09:52 AM Re: Can't decide...help me shop! [Re: joce]
toddy Online   content
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/30/11
Posts: 1861
Loc: Portugal
I believe the HPi-6f is different mainly because it has a screen for displaying the music music (on staves), incorporated into the music rest. It's a bit of gimmick in my opinion - paper probably still works better. And if you want the music displayed on screen, you can get free apps to do it on an ipad etc.

So the HP505 is better, I think: better keyboard (with quicker 3-sensor response) and more recent range of piano sounds (including a set of 'historical' 17/18 century forte-pianos etc.

I would be most interested in the difference between the keyboard feel of the HP505 compared with the HP503 - if they don't feel different in their touch response, I'd go for the 503, I think, which also has a smaller sound system , but basically is the same as the 505 in all other respects.


Edited by toddy (04/01/13 09:55 AM)
_________________________
Roland HP 302, Yamaha SY85

Reaper / NI Komplete 9 /Kontakt 5// EWQL Sym Choirs/ Sym Orchestra Silver/ MOR2
Mics: SP B1 & MXL V67g/ Alesis MicTube Preamp/ Xenyx302/ Yamaha HS7s .

"Only a fool is fooled" pv88, All Fools' Day 2014.

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#2057707 - 04/01/13 09:52 AM Re: Can't decide...help me shop! [Re: joce]
MacMacMac Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/24/09
Posts: 3900
Loc: North Carolina
I'd recommend the Kawais over the Rolands. Have you tried them?

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#2057717 - 04/01/13 10:19 AM Re: Can't decide...help me shop! [Re: joce]
joce Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 03/31/13
Posts: 9
The only higher end kawai they have is the CA13 which doesn't have audio in/out function. A pity really...I quite liked the sound and feel.

HP505 feels way better than the HP503 in my humble opinion. Don't know how to elaborate but just feels more responsive. On the other hand, HP505 and HP507 feel virtually the same to me.

What do you guys think of yamaha? I haven't really had a chance to try them yet. Which is the yamaha equivalent to HP505?

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#2057723 - 04/01/13 10:31 AM Re: Can't decide...help me shop! [Re: joce]
Kawai James Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 9679
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Originally Posted By: joce
The only higher end kawai they have is the CA13 which doesn't have audio in/out function. A pity really...I quite liked the sound and feel.


How about the CN34?

James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#2057729 - 04/01/13 10:46 AM Re: Can't decide...help me shop! [Re: joce]
toddy Online   content
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/30/11
Posts: 1861
Loc: Portugal
Originally Posted By: joce
The only higher end kawai they have is the CA13 which doesn't have audio in/out function. A pity really...I quite liked the sound and feel.

HP505 feels way better than the HP503 in my humble opinion. Don't know how to elaborate but just feels more responsive. On the other hand, HP505 and HP507 feel virtually the same to me.

What do you guys think of yamaha? I haven't really had a chance to try them yet. Which is the yamaha equivalent to HP505?



Then I'd go for the HP505, for sure. But not before trying the Kawai CN34 and CA15 first, if possible, as James and Mac suggest. As for Yamaha, the equivalent might be a mid range Clavinova such as the CLP440 or CLP470.
_________________________
Roland HP 302, Yamaha SY85

Reaper / NI Komplete 9 /Kontakt 5// EWQL Sym Choirs/ Sym Orchestra Silver/ MOR2
Mics: SP B1 & MXL V67g/ Alesis MicTube Preamp/ Xenyx302/ Yamaha HS7s .

"Only a fool is fooled" pv88, All Fools' Day 2014.

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#2057803 - 04/01/13 01:39 PM Re: Can't decide...help me shop! [Re: joce]
Derwishe Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 03/23/13
Posts: 12
Yeahn you should go for the HP505 you wont regret it smile also check the Clavinova CLP470 from yamaha like Toddy said.
_________________________
HP 505 ~~Piano Newbie~~

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#2057812 - 04/01/13 02:15 PM Re: Can't decide...help me shop! [Re: joce]
joce Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 03/31/13
Posts: 9
Thanks guys!

Unfortunately they only carry CA13 for mid-range kawai digitals. They had some under $1000 but felt flimsy.

I definitely will give the CLP440 a try. Is the CLP470 much better?

Will all these digital pianos be enough for me to progress to some of the Chopin nocturnes?

On another note, I just found out how much extra polished ebony costs.. frown

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#2057856 - 04/01/13 03:30 PM Re: Can't decide...help me shop! [Re: joce]
TheBlacknight Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/26/13
Posts: 52
Loc: Manchester, United Kingdom
I would personally try the CLP470 if you can at your local piano shop. However, if your looking on mastering some of those Chopin Nocturnes, you should seriously consider the Kawai CA65, which is miles head of the CLP470 on both feels and sound, not to mention about 4 years more up to date! Unfortunately as you say your local shop doesnt stock the higher end Kawai's but maybe they can order one in for you.
_________________________
DP: Kawai CA65. NI Komplete Audio 6, KRK Rokit RP6. Sennheiser HD 598's. Galaxy/Synthogy & NI VST's
DAW: Intel i7 4770K, Asus Z87 Pro, 32GB 1600Mhz RAM, XFX 2GB 7770 GPU,2 x OCZ Vector 256GB SSD, OCZ 850W GOLD PSU, 2 x 2TB Seagate Barracuda 7200RPM 64MB. Zalman LQ315 Liquid Cooler

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#2057956 - 04/01/13 05:50 PM Re: Can't decide...help me shop! [Re: TheBlacknight]
CarloPiano Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/21/12
Posts: 172
For playing well and expressively Chopin nocturnes or other delicate music, on absence of nice acoustic piano, the most suitable digital piano options in my humble opinion are:

- Roland V-Piano. It will return to you every nuance you need. Cons: Unfortunately its price tag is unreachable for many people. Aaltought its PHA III action is very good and responsive, is not a real wooden one. Too much perfect sound. Sometimes some atifacts are revealed. No speakers (except if you have 14000€ for the V-Grand)
- Roland HP series. IHMO the most expressive piano sound after V-Piano's. Sounds terrific from outside the players position. Cons: a little lightweight plastic action, its pseudo modelled piano sound is good but not as expressive as V's. Muffled sound from the perspetive of the player.
- Kawai CA 65/95. A complete wooden action based in some way on the real thing. It feels terrific under the fingers. Cons: I'm not quite fond of its sound engine. I think Roland Supernatural is still milles away.
- Yamaha CLP series. Very expensive. The sound is not very distictive. It uses a very outdated action that is a slight variant of a 1987 one. Only from the very expensive CLP-470 we get a decent touch (pseudo wooden action). As I said some time before, I think Clavinova is getting behind its competitors.

The solution I would like to have: a Kawai CA-65 connected to a Roland V-Piano/Supernatural module. Unfortunately this one doesn't exist (Integra 7 Module Supernatural pianos are pop oriented, they don't sound good for solo piano).

Just a few personal toughts.

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#2057964 - 04/01/13 05:57 PM Re: Can't decide...help me shop! [Re: joce]
personne Online   content
Full Member

Registered: 11/24/12
Posts: 127
Loc: Toronto, Canada
Originally Posted By: joce
Hi everyone on PW! I'm an adult looking for a piano to start practising with. Last time I touched a piano was more than 10 yrs ago, shortly after passing grade 6 ABRSM.

I'm primarily looking for a piano as an accompaniment to singing although I aspire to eventually play some Chopin. I will need to connect it to my computer to record. Size isn't a huge factor but aesthetics are. I have a bulldozer of a dog that will get herself caught in wiring and then tear all sorts of electronics down, so slabs (?) are out of the question.

I really like the sound of Roland HP505 (US$3125) but it's slightly over my initial budget. Is it worth the extra $ over the F120 ($1860) and HP503 ($2450)?

Has anyone tried the vocal harmonizing and mic inputs of HPi series? Seems like an interesting thing to have for a piano. At my local piano store, HPi-6F is sold for the same price as HP505. Does anyone know how they differ for regular playing?


HPi-6F have the same functionality as the previous model HP-305 + some educational features. HP-505 sounds closer to HP-307 than 305.

If you are going to play advanced staff, I would recommend going for HP-505 or even 507, if you can afford it.
You can play Chopin nocturnes with expression on them, but do not expect it fully replaces an acoustic piano if you are going to advance beyond grade 8.
Well, I can play Tchaikovsky nicely on my Roland-507, but it will not replace me a good acoustic, from the other side, no acoustic at 4K will do a better job with the same pieces.

Main difference between 503 vs 505 - more advanced action and sound projection system (makes sense if you play aloud from time to time).
Main difference between 505 and 507 for me - more clarity in sound required for more advanced staff, plus better sound from built-in speakers.
_________________________
Roland HP-507RW | Yamaha U1

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#2057970 - 04/01/13 06:03 PM Re: Can't decide...help me shop! [Re: joce]
CarloPiano Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/21/12
Posts: 172
Originally Posted By: joce
I really like the sound of Roland HP505 (US$3125) but it's slightly over my initial budget. Is it worth the extra $ over the F120 ($1860) and HP503 ($2450)?


Yes, it's quite better than the F120 as it has a way better action and better speakers. Regarding the 503, while they have almost the same action (Ivory Feel-S is, according to Roland, the same that PHA III but built on a single piece instead two, you also loose the wood like imitation), they feel different (!!!). It's maybe because of the amp+speakers, more powerful on the 505 but the 505 indeed feels quite better and more responsive than the 503. It happened something similar between the former models HP-302 and 305.

Quote:
At my local piano store, HPi-6F is sold for the same price as HP505. Does anyone know how they differ for regular playing?


The HPi-6F is a HP-305 with a tablet like builtin screen, as they said before. It features a PHA II action which is almost identical to PHA III (featured on the HP-505). But PHA III has a third sensor that makes it better a more responsive to some techniques such as repeated notes. I own a HP-305 with PHA II and I must say that while I'm quite happy with this little marvel instrument, it's repetition just simply sucks. I would decide the 505 for the slightly better action, the new Acoustic Proyection system and, as they said before, the aditional historic piano tones as I don't care a bit for the screen.

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