Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2.5 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

Gifts and supplies for the musician

SEARCH
the Forums & Piano World

Trying Something New with Search
(125ad)
Piano Life Saver - Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
(ad)
Accu-Tuner
Sanderson Accu-Tuner
(ad)
Pianoteq
Grotrian Concert
Royal
for Pianoteq out now
(ad)
Piano Buyer Guide
Acoustic & Digital Piano Buyers Guide
Who's Online
146 registered (agraffe, Alex2018, 36251, ajames, agent8698, 36 invisible), 2427 Guests and 7 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
(ad)
Estonia Pianos
Estonia Pianos
Quick Links to Useful Piano & Music Resources
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers
*Organs

Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano & Music Accessories
*Live Piano Venues
*Music School Listings
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Piano Books
*Piano Art, Pictures, & Posters
*Directory/Site Map
*Contest
*Links
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Screen Saver
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords
Topic Options
#2062295 - 04/10/13 06:18 AM Pure CF Sound Engine
peterws Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/21/12
Posts: 5929
Loc: Northern England.
Yahaha pianos. What on earth is it? AWM`s been around since the 80`s I think. And it`s still used on loads of DPs ascribed to this manufacturer. Is CF new, any good? Would an old fart like me be able to tell the difference? Dammitt they all sound pretty good on Youtube (well, nearly all . . .)
_________________________
"I am not a man. I am a free number"

""

Top
(ad) ROLAND

Click Here

#2062519 - 04/10/13 06:44 PM Re: Pure CF Sound Engine [Re: peterws]
peterws Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/21/12
Posts: 5929
Loc: Northern England.
Bladdy Hill. this is popular . . .Any New Zealanders looking in?
_________________________
"I am not a man. I am a free number"

""

Top
#2062524 - 04/10/13 06:58 PM Re: Pure CF Sound Engine [Re: peterws]
Marko in Boston Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/30/12
Posts: 1303
Loc: Boston, Massachusetts
Hi peterws,

Seems like you're not felling the love today ;-) I do not have the answer and im not sure what youre looking for but this might be a start until someone helps you:

http://ezinearticles.com/?Features-and-Benefits-of-the-Yamaha-P-155-Digital-Piano&id=6769715



Edited by Marko in Boston (04/10/13 06:59 PM)
_________________________
KAWAI ES7 | ROLAND RD-800 | YAMAHA CP4 | YAMAHA STAGEPAS 400i | PRESONUS ERIS5 & T10 | SHURE SRH1540 | SENNHEISER HD650 | K&M OMEGA

Top
#2062528 - 04/10/13 07:12 PM Re: Pure CF Sound Engine [Re: peterws]
Scott Hamlin Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/11/12
Posts: 736
Lil' Petey -
The "Pure CF" means they use the CF line
of pianos to sample from - and use AWM
to encode and playback. so it uses both...

Top
(ad)
Piano & Music Accessories
piano accessories music gifts tuning and moving equipment
#2062577 - 04/10/13 08:54 PM Re: Pure CF Sound Engine [Re: Scott Hamlin]
4evrBeginR Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/27/09
Posts: 1607
Loc: California
Pure CF Sound is a marketing term. It is completely meaningless. AWM is another marketing term, which stands for Advanced Wave Memory. It is also meaningless. Sampling is sampling. Don't worry about what they call it. Today's DP sampling sounds better than those from the 80's even for the untrained ear.
_________________________
Art is never finished, only abandoned. - da Vinci

Top
#2062607 - 04/10/13 10:01 PM Re: Pure CF Sound Engine [Re: 4evrBeginR]
Scott Hamlin Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/11/12
Posts: 736
Originally Posted By: 4evrBeginR
Pure CF Sound is a marketing term. It is completely meaningless. AWM is another marketing term, which stands for Advanced Wave Memory. It is also meaningless. Sampling is sampling. Don't worry about what they call it. Today's DP sampling sounds better than those from the 80's even for the untrained ear.


Just because it is marketing hype doesn't mean
meaningless.. the terms do have "meaning".

Sampling: Pure CF for splendid tonality

The technicians for Yamaha chose a CFIIIs complete concert grand having top sound quality and managed to tune it to the best possible condition. They next used one of a kind Pure CF sampling method to sample all sounds to build the sound on the instrument. You can then enjoy the natural sounding reaction as a high-quality piano.

Advanced Wave Memory or AWM: 4-level Dynamic Stereo Sampling

The Advanced Wave Memory (AWM) is a system of sampling which builds sound that is close to the sound of an audio instrument by utilizing digital technology for recording the instrument sound and using the top-quality digital technology for filtering to the audio samples recorded. The Advanced Wave Memory Sampling evaluates these samples and can build such different nuances by taping samples of different playing strengths. The higher amount of samples utilized, the higher will be the potential outcomes and expressive quality.



Article Source: http://EzineArticles.com/6769715

Top
#2062639 - 04/10/13 11:06 PM Re: Pure CF Sound Engine [Re: peterws]
PianoWorksATL Online   content
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/19/09
Posts: 3268
Loc: Atlanta, GA
AWM isn't always 4 layers. Quite a few have 3 layer and some have just 1 layer.
_________________________
Sam Bennett
PianoWorks - Atlanta Piano Dealer
Bösendorfer, Estonia, Seiler, Grotrian, Hailun
Pre-Owned: Yamaha, Kawai, Steinway & other fine pianos
Full Restoration Shop
www.PianoWorks.com
www.youtube.com/PianoWorksAtlanta

Top
#2062707 - 04/11/13 02:01 AM Re: Pure CF Sound Engine [Re: peterws]
peterws Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/21/12
Posts: 5929
Loc: Northern England.
Thank you guys! My bro in law`s just bought a piano. . . .I looked at a few with similar spec and - they didn`t all sound the same!
_________________________
"I am not a man. I am a free number"

""

Top
#2062721 - 04/11/13 03:02 AM Re: Pure CF Sound Engine [Re: peterws]
MagicK Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/20/12
Posts: 70
Loc: Germany
@plinky88: They might have meaning, but what you posted there was only more marketing bulls excements. From that mumble bumble i couldn't say which is better.

Top
#2062726 - 04/11/13 03:37 AM Re: Pure CF Sound Engine [Re: peterws]
CarloPiano Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/21/12
Posts: 182
The original Yamaha AWM, designed AFAIK in 1987, was a PCM sampling engine (Pulse Code Modulation) with an advantage for piano sounds: it used a filter that changed slightly the "color" of the sound depending on the force (velocity) the note is stroked.

As PianoWorksATL noted, at the beginning it only used one sampled layer, and today there are still Yamaha instruments that only use 1 layer with that coloring filter (I guess the P35 is one of them).

It has been many variations on AWM. The original AWM was mono, they added stereo samples a time after. During a brief time existed AWM-2.

Another thing we must have in account is that not every AWM engine is based on CF pianos: there are many AWM models that got the samples from the smaller S6 piano. That, in my humble opinion, could be the origin of the distinction between plain AWM and Pure CF (although this doesn't exclude the possibility that some AWM models use CF samples).

The last step of AWM has been RGE (Real Grand Expression). It promises many things that Roland's SuperNatural already does: natural decays, transitions between layers and so. In the opinion of many forum members this isn't completely true as they say RGE is almost identical to AWM. I don't even know if it has 88 keys sampling. I tried it but not at that detail level frown


Edited by CarloPiano (04/11/13 04:16 AM)
Edit Reason: Changing RGE, adding info

Top
#2062731 - 04/11/13 03:51 AM Re: Pure CF Sound Engine [Re: CarloPiano]
EssBrace Online   content
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/01/09
Posts: 2843
Loc: Suffolk, United Kingdom
Originally Posted By: CarloPiano
RGE (Real Grand Engine)


RGE = Real Grand Expression
_________________________
Roland RD-1000 | Yamaha CP1 | Physis H1

Top
#2062734 - 04/11/13 04:10 AM Re: Pure CF Sound Engine [Re: EssBrace]
CarloPiano Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/21/12
Posts: 182
Originally Posted By: EssBrace
Originally Posted By: CarloPiano
RGE (Real Grand Engine)


RGE = Real Grand Expression


Sorry blush (thanks for the correction, modifying original post).

Top
#2062735 - 04/11/13 04:13 AM Re: Pure CF Sound Engine [Re: peterws]
EssBrace Online   content
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/01/09
Posts: 2843
Loc: Suffolk, United Kingdom
Don't apologise! I think the term is pretty meaningless, just like Pure CF. But Yamaha does claim some advancement for RGE over the previous sound engines. There's a Peter Baartmans video where he tries to explain it for the (then new) Yamaha CLP 400 series. But the use of the terminology (Pure CF, RGE etc) is obviously down to marketing people, NOT engineers!

The video (2nd one down):

http://uk.yamaha.com/en/products/musical...audio_and_video

Actually, having now watched it, it doesn't really say anything with the exception of improved polyphony and "smooth release" (whatever that is!)


Edited by EssBrace (04/11/13 04:21 AM)
_________________________
Roland RD-1000 | Yamaha CP1 | Physis H1

Top
#2062806 - 04/11/13 09:07 AM Re: Pure CF Sound Engine [Re: peterws]
Kawai James Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 12455
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
I believe "smooth release" is the same as Kawai's "key-off release", in that the 'release' portion of the sample changes, depending on how quickly the key is released (e.g. staccato vs legato).

Cheers,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

Top
#2062839 - 04/11/13 10:30 AM Re: Pure CF Sound Engine [Re: peterws]
peterws Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/21/12
Posts: 5929
Loc: Northern England.
This is all very knowledgeable. I thank you gentlemen for the information. At the end of the day, whatever it is- you try before you buy!

As a point of interest, I had a CLP 250 (76 noter) which dated from about `87 or so. It had 2 line outs and 2 line ins, but it was unashamedly mono! The tone hardly altered with increase/decrease in volume; yet I did like it. They sell for around £250 on Ebay. Unbelievable!
_________________________
"I am not a man. I am a free number"

""

Top

Moderator:  Piano World 
ad
Pierce Piano Atlas


(ad)
Lindeblad Piano
Lindeblad Piano Restorations and sales
(ad)
Pearl River
Pearl River Pianos
Piano Acc. & Gift Items in
Piano World's Online Store
In PianoSupplies.com ,(a division of Piano World) our online store for piano and music gifts and accessories, party goods, tuning equipment, piano moving equipment, benches, lamps Caster Cups and more.


Free Shipping on Jansen Artist Piano Benches
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Sampled vs. Modeled...
by polo1
01/17/17 12:24 PM
"Best" piano sound - Kawai, Yamaha, or Roland?
by polo1
01/17/17 12:16 PM
any pre NAMM rumors?
by Dave Horne
01/17/17 11:45 AM
Pianists Planning a Holiday in Paris?
by Polytrops
01/17/17 10:56 AM
Weighted keys on CLP535 and CN35
by Ammar956
01/17/17 10:52 AM
(ad)
Sheet Music Plus
Sheet Music Plus Featured Sale
Forum Stats
86,269 Registered Members
44 Forums
177,814 Topics
2,589,233 Posts

Most users ever online: 15,252 @ 03/21/10 11:39 PM

Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
|
Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World | Donate | Link to Us | Classifieds |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter | Press Room |


copyright 1997 - 2017 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission