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#2076331 - 05/02/13 11:54 PM Re: Young Rude Foreign Student-What to Do? [Re: Peter K. Mose]
RUSS SHETTLE Online   content
Full Member

Registered: 01/14/11
Posts: 301
Loc: Brandywine, Maryland
Originally Posted By: Peter K. Mose
In both instances cited, a parent was present during the lesson. So you've got a threesome situation going on, and that's always tougher than genuine one-on-one teaching. Dump the parents from your lessons, and see if she's a more decent kid on her own.

If she has some redeeming qualities, hang in there with her, and help her acclimate to a new culture. But if you genuinely don't like her, and she isn't happy with you, you must part ways with each other.


That's a possibility. She may be trying to impress her parents in the only way she knows how! Take them out of the picture and see if there's a change in her demeanor. Outside of that, you must respond to her as an adult, removed of all emotion. It may diffuse her because she have nowhere to go.
_________________________
Russ
Yamaha CP5
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#2076357 - 05/03/13 12:21 AM Re: Young Rude Foreign Student-What to Do? [Re: AZNpiano]
RUSS SHETTLE Online   content
Full Member

Registered: 01/14/11
Posts: 301
Loc: Brandywine, Maryland
Originally Posted By: AZNpiano
Originally Posted By: Morodiene
This always makes us question what did we do wrong? But the truth of it is, no matter how great a teacher you are, we don't always get great students.

Very nicely put.


Let me ask this of teachers: Of all the mainly young beginner students you get, do you know which ones who really want to be there? Do you know the ones who don't? What is your definition of a "Great Student"?
_________________________
Russ
Yamaha CP5
Casio PX130
Yamaha AP Upright

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#2076359 - 05/03/13 12:30 AM Re: Young Rude Foreign Student-What to Do? [Re: red-rose]
Bex Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/19/08
Posts: 95
Loc: Southern California
Originally Posted By: red-rose
While it's true that it might "not matter" what ethnicity a difficult student is from, it IS true, that there *could* be clues that you could learn from understanding that student's culture/country that might help us understand how different cultures view certain ways of relating as acceptable or not. What is rude here in the States MIGHT not be considered rude in China. I think that the OP was trying to determine that, but I'm not sure that anyone in this thread has either confirmed or denied that the issues *might* be stemming from a cultural difference.

Even in the interest of being "culturally open," I don't think it's helpful to DENY that there COULD be differences/misunderstandings.


As someone whose family is from an Asian culture, I can tell you that that little girl's bovine, rude behavior would NOT be tolerated in China. In Asia, teachers on the whole have a lot of power. Students do not talk back or question the teacher. Many teachers also apply corporal punishment (not that I sanction this).

I think the OP needs to be much more firm. Speak sharply and tell her that her behavior will punish her later in life, that she will have a reputation for being rough, unsophisticated, mean-spirited, and someone to avoid in general. Tough words? Yes, but she needs a good shaking. And if she tells her father, that's fine.

Tell her father that her behavior is unacceptable, and if she doesn't change her behavior, she is fired as a student.
_________________________
On the piano stand:
Widmung
Partita in c minor
Jardins sous la pluie

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#2076433 - 05/03/13 05:00 AM Re: Young Rude Foreign Student-What to Do? [Re: P.M.]
btb Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/21/04
Posts: 4261
Loc: Pretoria South Africa
Here's a bit of a giggle ... posted on a similar "rude" thread ...

I’ve never had trouble with child rudeness ...
but then I have a heavy set of eyebrows with a tortured rebel crease.

However, if I were in the shoes of the OP,
my solution would conjure the following scenario ...
when the rude student arrives (preferably with parent) ...
I would beg 5 minutes to conclude an earlier lesson in the main studio ... and with use of a trick recording which can be heard in the waiting room ... let waft upon the air the dire sound of knuckles being rapped and yowls of pain ... all heard above the daemonic roars of the angry PT ... with a closing shout “get out you useless waste of time “ ... ”use the back door and don’t come back”

If that doesn’t work ... resort to the blood-stained riding crop.

Please don't take me seriously,
regards btb

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#2076464 - 05/03/13 07:56 AM Re: Young Rude Foreign Student-What to Do? [Re: RUSS SHETTLE]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 12056
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Originally Posted By: RUSS SHETTLE
Originally Posted By: AZNpiano
Originally Posted By: Morodiene
This always makes us question what did we do wrong? But the truth of it is, no matter how great a teacher you are, we don't always get great students.

Very nicely put.


Let me ask this of teachers: Of all the mainly young beginner students you get, do you know which ones who really want to be there? Do you know the ones who don't?

Usually you can tell over time through their body language, but also how they prepare for lessons can be a hint as well. If they're not practicing, lessons will soon become something they don't want to do even if they enjoy you as a teacher.
Quote:
What is your definition of a "Great Student"?

A "great" student IMO is someone who practices regularly (6-7 times a week) and actually does the kind of practicing you tell them to do (rather than just run straight through the pieces). They also have some measure of talent, and obviously love the piano.

A "good" student is one that practices regularly (5-6 times a week), does what you assign, and loves piano like a "great" student does, but may not be talented.
_________________________
private piano/voice teacher - full time
MTNA member
www.valeoconservatory.com
Petrof 9'2 Concert, Yamaha G3, Roland FP-7, Yamaha MOX6, Kawai MP11

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#2076498 - 05/03/13 08:47 AM Re: Young Rude Foreign Student-What to Do? [Re: Bex]
TimR Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/17/04
Posts: 3220
Loc: Virginia, USA
Originally Posted By: Bex


I think the OP needs to be much more firm. Speak sharply and tell her that her behavior will punish her later in life, that she will have a reputation for being rough, unsophisticated, mean-spirited, and someone to avoid in general. Tough words? Yes, but she needs a good shaking.


That would be counterproductive and unnecessary.

It is the kind of response that temporarily makes the teacher feel good (and sometimes regret it later) but does little to change the behavior.

Kids don't absorb that many words. You can't give a lecture and expect to make meaningful contact at that age.


Instead, you keep it very short, very controlled, very calm.

"Don't do that." Use three words, but only if you can't make two work.

Then IMMEDIATELY redirect attention to something else.

Then as soon as possible reward some positive behavior with a big smile and "Great!" But only use one word if you can't think of half a word.

When my kids were in elementary school and I used to help out with field trips, the teachers always assigned me the "rottenest" kids. But they didn't misbehave for me. I conveyed that it wouldn't be tolerated and we just had fun. But I also did a lot of preemptive distraction and redirection - some of these kids were a handful.

I realize this is sort of a catch-22. I'm giving behavior management advice to someone assuming they can implement it. But of course if they could, they wouldn't really need the advice. Still, building the skill is a learning process, and anybody can get better at it.
_________________________
gotta go practice

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