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#2074017 - 04/30/13 09:00 AM I've been accused of cheating......
dire tonic Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/17/11
Posts: 2344
Loc: uk south
In no uncertain terms I‘ve been accused of cheating in the Mendelssohn Songs Without Words recital.

A PW member – name unknown to me but I chose here, playfully, to call him S (for sneak) – saw fit to raise an alarm in a PM to Rossy (Rostosky) who in turn contacted me for a reaction. To put it mildly I was livid. Yes, I know this is the reaction not just of the innocent but also the apparent reaction of the guilty who believe they can maintain a screen of deception.

The charge is that I recorded my piece using midi and that I sped up the result artificially by 30%. S claims it is obvious for anyone to see that I have done that – he leaves no room for doubt and complains that I have cheapened the recital experience!

Yes, I agree, speeding up is easy to do. I agree also that my video does have the choppy appearance of being processed but being clear of conscience and believing that PW members would not think me so crass as to post up a video so patently tampered with might conclude that this was due to an equipment shortcoming –for that is exactly what it was. I demonstrate this at the end of the post in a short video clip.

Had it not been for the fact that I’m submitting for the upcoming Grieg recital and - creeping arthritis permitting - will play a piece with some faster passages which will inevitably exhibit exactly the quirks visible in the SWW 67-2 video, I wouldn’t have taken the trouble to issue this refutation. It was evidently above S’s nature to consider the possibility of PMing me for my reaction and my possible explanation, instead prefering to generate smoke by addressing a third party and, I fear, incautiously prejudicing others through the PM network. That finally persuaded me to air this matter and nip the potential PM gossip in the bud before further resentment is stoked up and I earn the reputation of a charlatan.

So, S - who has the authority of someone who has done video and film scoring work - spotted ‘evidence’ of altered play back speed throughout ALL of my three recordings. WHAT??!! I struggled for weeks over two of my pieces to REDUCE the tempo and, on the day of recording, raced through several takes before finally managing to nail one calm enough to submit! If I’d bothered to cheat at all I’d have slowed the damn things down!.....S is so determined to find mischief that he undermines his own case.

So take the 67-2. Yes, that needed to be bright. He cites 0:30 and 1:33 as clear signs of tampering so here’s a clip I’ve re-recorded, doing a repeat loop on those two spots, putting a clock in the frame with a second hand so that it’s clear there’s no skulduggery (maybe it’s possible to fiddle this but a) I don’t now how and b) I couldn’t be bothered if I knew.)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RX9Ii6W2CPo

So please note;
(the second hand is, I think, clear enough)

The figures can be played at the required tempo.
The video has the same choppy speeded-up look as the submitted video, particularly in the LH.
The wider jumps in the RH look odd.
Even though both the camera and the boxes supporting the clock are on a firm footing they appear to be shaking, along with the keyboard. S was suspicious of excessive shaking throughout the original vids. I suspect the camera and/or its drivers and software are making a mess of things as a result of 'intelligent' tracking of the hands. Of course there is some actual shaking of the keyboard but the laws of physics assure us that it is natural.

Incidentally, I’m getting on in years and I have slight tremors in the hands and fingers when they’re not resting on the keys. I think that too is troublesome for an HD video webcam which, basically, has a problem with motion!

...thank you and goodnight.



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#2074026 - 04/30/13 09:15 AM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 12921
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Diretonic: I understand completely where you are coming from, but my thought was, "So what?" There was no "winner" in this, no prize money awarded, no bragging rights. It was just people submitting what they could do. If someone wants to think you cheated and doesn't have the decency to speak to you about it privately before telling others, then well, their actions speak for themselves.

Professionals who concertize for a living will do many many takes of phrases and then piece them together to make recordings. It's not that they can't play it well, it is simply that the level of perfection that is expected on non-live recordings these days so high that to have any errors is unforgivable.

Anyways, I know you want to set the record straight regardless, and that you have done.
_________________________
private piano/voice teacher FT



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#2074029 - 04/30/13 09:19 AM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
Rostosky Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/30/11
Posts: 3339
Loc: Lost in cyberspace.in the UK.
I will have more to say about this later, but have to go out soon.
What I will say right now, is that I have no doubts about Dire tonics submissions whatsoever, and am very grateful to him for not bringing this up during the recital itself, he has excercised massive restraint,and not reacted hastily, if it was me, I would have been just as hurt, and so very angry: I may well have said something that I would regret.

Strike that, I would probably have said something that would have got me warned if not banned completely.

I had to try and deal with this during the later stages of the recital behind the scenes so to speak, and didnt quite know how to handle it for the best, I was very upset and my heart went out to Dire tonic.

I genuinely believe that there will be overwhelming support for him from both performers and listeners.
_________________________


Rise like lions after slumber,in unvanquishable number. Shake your chains to earth like dew
which in sleep has fallen on you. Ye are many,they are few. Shelley

Founder and creator ofRostoskys 13th crystal skull project

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#2074035 - 04/30/13 09:27 AM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
ElleC Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/12/13
Posts: 248
Loc: NJ, USA
Haters are always gonna hate! Unfortunately there's always 1 in a bunch. Don't let that discourage you, in fact, be proud of what you've been able to accomplish. If this person went out his/her way to make silly accusations that you cheated...then you obviously did wonderful on that piece!
_________________________
Adult beginner since January 2013. My only regret is that I didn't learn sooner.

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#2074038 - 04/30/13 09:29 AM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: Morodiene]
dire tonic Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/17/11
Posts: 2344
Loc: uk south
-Morodiene, Rossy, ElleC - many thanks for saying that.

It had occurred to me let it rest but with other recitals upcoming and with future vids exhibiting the same problem I felt it likely there would be continued suspicion. But it was in the balance....

Also, I was considerably put out by all this - 'S' didn't express suspicion but conviction. I wanted to hit back.



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#2074049 - 04/30/13 09:46 AM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
ElleC Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/12/13
Posts: 248
Loc: NJ, USA
Dire tonic, this reminds me of an incident couple of weeks ago at my teacher's studio when I came in for my lesson. There was a boy who just got done with his lesson. His mom was upset and was vocal about her concerns that her son still can't "count" right even after however long he's been taking lessons and went out to say that he does better when he's home. To lighten up the mood, I said "don't worry, I flubber all the time when she's (my teacher) next to me." The lady told me "oh I remember you from the recital...I don't believe you've only taken lessons for 3 months! Not at all!" And walked out. At first I was appalled but then I realized I don't have to justify myself to anyone who's already made up their mind about me. And then I thought "Efff you lady! I'll show you what I can do in 6 months!"

The point is...use it as a catalyst and don't let it get to you. Can't wait to hear your Grieg recital piece!
_________________________
Adult beginner since January 2013. My only regret is that I didn't learn sooner.

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#2074053 - 04/30/13 09:53 AM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: ElleC]
Andy Platt Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/28/10
Posts: 2466
Loc: Virginia, USA
Originally Posted By: ElleC
At first I was appalled but then I realized I don't have to justify myself to anyone who's already made up their mind about me. And then I thought "Efff you lady! I'll show you what I can do in 6 months!"


Love it! Wonder how much effort it would take to shove the piano ... never mind!

Quote:
The point is...use it as a catalyst and don't let it get to you. Can't wait to hear your Grieg recital piece!


+1
_________________________
  • Debussy - Le Petit Nègre, L. 114
  • Haydn - Sonata in Gm, Hob. XVI/44

Kawai K3

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#2074055 - 04/30/13 09:56 AM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
casinitaly Offline


Gold Supporter until March 1 2014


Registered: 03/01/10
Posts: 5689
Loc: Italy
I have no idea why anyone would not address you personally if they wanted to discuss your video. I have no idea why anyone would feel it necessary to even suggest that someone had tampered with their video.

I feel sad that you now feel obliged to defend yourself and can only offer condolences.
I haven't listened to your clip in this thread. I figure you didn't need to go public with this - and I believe you when you say you didn't tamper with the video.
_________________________
XVIII-XXXVII
Follow your teacher's instructions and practice wisely/much, and you'll soon wonder how you ever found it hard. BobPickle
Performance anxiety: make it part of your daily routine and deal with it...Cope! zrtf90

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#2074063 - 04/30/13 10:06 AM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
dynamobt Online   content
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/07/13
Posts: 860
Loc: NH
This makes me very sad and angry. If anyone could be accused of tampering with a recording, it is someone who records audio only. (Like I do) But, I trust that we are all on the honor system and abide by it. I choose to think the best of people. That the accuser did not come out in public with their comments speaks volumes. I applaud anyone who contributes to the recitals. No one should have to defend themselves here. I'm sad that this has happened. You have my full confidence dire tonic.
_________________________
1918 Mason & Hamlin BB





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#2074065 - 04/30/13 10:09 AM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
songwire Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 03/10/13
Posts: 12
Loc: NE Ohio
Perhaps some here are taking way too seriously what should be a pleasureable journey?

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#2074067 - 04/30/13 10:09 AM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
Dulcetta Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/11/11
Posts: 75
Loc: U.K.
I think S has too much time on their hands.

To be honest anyone here could have been playing for years more than they admit to. They could have a teacher, or even be a teacher, and claim they are self taught. Anyone could upload a midi file to Soundcloud or suchlike, which is not really them, or upload a video with just pictures, or even be a recording of their neighbour with no internet access to realise the false claim.

Trolls and liars trip themselves up, no-one needs to root them out. Anyone could be a fraud, but it shows the bitterness and jealousy of someone when they determine to accuse,instead of trusting that people here are genuine.
_________________________
It will be happened; it shall be going to be happening; it will be was an event that could will have been taken place in the future. Simple as that.

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#2074074 - 04/30/13 10:32 AM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
stumbler Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/22/10
Posts: 357
Loc: Toronto
dire tonic, I feel bad that someone would do this to you.
I enjoyed your performances and have no question that they are genuine.

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#2074078 - 04/30/13 10:39 AM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
Ragdoll Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/03/12
Posts: 774
Loc: Illinois
dire tonic,
want me to go punch him in the neck? I know the bridge where he collect tolls. grin
_________________________
Ragdoll

At first, she only flew when she thought no one was watching.


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#2074079 - 04/30/13 10:39 AM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
Kymber Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/25/08
Posts: 1348
Loc: MA
"S" needs to get a life.
_________________________
“The doubters said, "Man cannot fly," The doers said, "Maybe, but we'll try,"
And finally soared in the morning glow while non-believers watched from below.”
― Bruce Lee

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#2074167 - 04/30/13 12:26 PM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
Codi Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/09/13
Posts: 23
Loc: Missouri USA
Hello Dire Tonic. It is my opinion that you have the right to be hurt and angry. The section looks complex and fast to me, so it obviously took much work to get to playing it well. To be accused of cheating after putting in all the effort would T me off as well.

I am new to this forum and don't know much about the recitals yet or how something like that could (or should) be dealt with. But for your own sake of feeling good, I hope you don't let it get to you too much. Most who accuse others are suffering from severe jealousy. In fact maybe it be better to take it as a compliment on your speed and accuracy! (High five on job well done/Piece well played!)

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#2074176 - 04/30/13 12:41 PM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
Sam S Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/12/07
Posts: 1573
Loc: Georgia, USA
Sorry this had to happen to you dire tonic. The internet makes it easy for anonymous (and we are all anonymous, really) people to criticize in ways that they would not have the courage to do in person.

I'm surprised that we haven't had claims like this for the ABF quarterly recitals. Maybe we have and I just have never heard about it. Some people take themselves way too seriously.



Sam

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#2074178 - 04/30/13 12:43 PM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
keystring Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 12487
Loc: Canada
This happened to me in another forum. It was the first thing I ever submitted, and the main idea was to share ideas and grow together. My accuser did it publicly. It would be better to have your playing ripped to shreds for mistakes and weaknesses, because at least then they are talking about your work. It's the fact of denying what comes from your own hands and efforts. It hurts.
Originally Posted By: songwire
Perhaps some here are taking way too seriously what should be a pleasureable journey?

Exactly. It's a journey, and each of us has his or her own. But it's less lonely when you share, and it may take a long time to come out and dare share anything. It takes courage and a certain trust in your fellows.

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#2074192 - 04/30/13 01:13 PM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
Rickster Online   content


Registered: 03/25/06
Posts: 8839
Loc: Georgia, USA
Hi,

Don’t let it bother you too much. I know that is easy for me to say, but when they (S or whoever) are harassing you and criticizing you, they are letting someone else rest… smile

I’ve been informed that some members here make fun of me and my piano playing and criticize me behind my back in PM’s… hey, it’s just the animal nature of some people. Meanness comes in all shapes and forms and manifests itself in many ways; even here on PW.

As for me, well, I just keep on playing my piano(s) the way I want to and keep on smiling… in fact, I wrote a song entitled “Play it like you want to”. smile

Rick
_________________________
Piano enthusiast and amateur musician: "Treat others the way you would like to be treated". Yamaha C7. YouTube Channel

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#2074216 - 04/30/13 01:51 PM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: Morodiene]
Gary D. Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/30/08
Posts: 4879
Loc: South Florida
Originally Posted By: Morodiene
Diretonic: I understand completely where you are coming from, but my thought was, "So what?"

Easy. DT is a fine musician, and yet another viper in this forum has created something nasty. It is why I mostly don't come here any more.
Quote:

Professionals who concertize for a living will do many many takes of phrases and then piece them together to make recordings. It's not that they can't play it well, it is simply that the level of perfection that is expected on non-live recordings these days so high that to have any errors is unforgivable.

This is absolutely true. But being accused of speeding something up by 30% is not the same as doing many takes - splicing.

That kind of accusation is simply typical of trolls who have nothing better to do than to say horrible things about everyone, all from a place where they feel safe - and anonymous.
_________________________
Piano Teacher

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#2074218 - 04/30/13 01:55 PM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
Gary D. Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/30/08
Posts: 4879
Loc: South Florida
Originally Posted By: dire tonic
-Morodiene, Rossy, ElleC - many thanks for saying that.

It had occurred to me let it rest but with other recitals upcoming and with future vids exhibiting the same problem I felt it likely there would be continued suspicion. But it was in the balance....

Also, I was considerably put out by all this - 'S' didn't express suspicion but conviction. I wanted to hit back.

As well you should have!


[/quote]
_________________________
Piano Teacher

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#2074267 - 04/30/13 02:57 PM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
Peyton Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/02/06
Posts: 2679
Loc: Maine
DT, I haven't had a chance to listen to the recital but did , after reading this thread, listen to your performance. Wonderful playing. I don't doubt for a second that there was no tampering but you have to admit, that is some weird looking video. I can see why someone might think it was sped up. Good for you to go to the trouble of re-recording a few parts with the clock there. Whoever "accused" you of cheating might have phrased his/her question a bit milder and just asked if he was really that in doubt. You are owed an apology.
_________________________
"One's real life is often the life that one does not lead."- Oscar Wilde
www.youtube.com/Biffer5
www.peytonart.com


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#2074286 - 04/30/13 03:12 PM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
EdwardianPiano Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/29/11
Posts: 788
Loc: Rainy England
diretonic, sorry to hear you have been ill treated. I hadn't been on the Mendlessohn thread before and went to see your video- opus 30 no 6 right? There is one little good thing to come out of this- I LOVED your playing- beautiful. Your keyboard has a good sound. I had never heard this piece before and now you have introduced me to it. I am so happy to have heard it. You have won my friend- the sneak has not. I believe in your skill. It'll be a long time if ever that I could play this.
_________________________
https://edwardianpiano.wordpress.com/

Music is a higher revelation than all wisdom and philosophy.
Ludwig van Beethoven.

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#2074294 - 04/30/13 03:19 PM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: Gary D.]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 12921
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Originally Posted By: Gary D.
Originally Posted By: Morodiene
Diretonic: I understand completely where you are coming from, but my thought was, "So what?"

Easy. DT is a fine musician, and yet another viper in this forum has created something nasty. It is why I mostly don't come here any more.
Quote:

Professionals who concertize for a living will do many many takes of phrases and then piece them together to make recordings. It's not that they can't play it well, it is simply that the level of perfection that is expected on non-live recordings these days so high that to have any errors is unforgivable.

This is absolutely true. But being accused of speeding something up by 30% is not the same as doing many takes - splicing.

That kind of accusation is simply typical of trolls who have nothing better to do than to say horrible things about everyone, all from a place where they feel safe - and anonymous.


That is true Gary. My post was more to let DT know that feeding trolls like this is not really going to help, but I can relate 100% with wanting to defend yourself.
_________________________
private piano/voice teacher FT



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#2074297 - 04/30/13 03:20 PM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
Ganddalf Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/28/09
Posts: 753
Loc: Norway
DireTonic,

I was impressed by your performances in the Mendelssohn recital, but I would never suspect any kind of cheating.
Actually you should take the whole thing as a compliment. Obviously this is just a matter of envy.

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#2074309 - 04/30/13 03:34 PM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
Polyphonist Online   content
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/03/13
Posts: 8415
Loc: New York City
Yet another idiot who has no life and chooses to spend their (not-so-precious) time on the Internet falsely accusing people of speeding up a video. Trolls like this need to be removed from the site.

diretonic, I sympathize with you, and your response was completely appropriate.
_________________________
Regards,

Polyphonist

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#2074342 - 04/30/13 04:14 PM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
Derulux Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/06/05
Posts: 5446
Loc: Philadelphia
Originally Posted By: dire tonic
That finally persuaded me to air this matter and nip the potential PM gossip in the bud before further resentment is stoked up and I earn the reputation of a charlatan.

I, sir, believe you to be a liar, a charlatan and a cheat. Those clearly are not your hands. laugh


(Of course, I'm kidding. It's pretty obvious the video is jumpy, but I would never have suspected that you sped up the video. Out of curiosity, what kind of surface is the recorder sitting on?)
_________________________
Every day we are afforded a new chance. The problem with life is not that you run out of chances. In the end, what you run out of are days.

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#2074364 - 04/30/13 04:37 PM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
peterws Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/21/12
Posts: 4401
Loc: Northern England.
It might be observed, a speeded up track will also speed up the decay rates on the piano bring played. You`ll still discern this even on fast passages; they`ll sound unnatural. Dt`s piano, for me, was and still is the Best On The Planet . . .
_________________________
"I'm playing all the right notes � but not necessarily in the right order." Eric Morecambe

""

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#2074415 - 04/30/13 06:01 PM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
earlofmar Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/21/13
Posts: 2251
Loc: Australia
This incident is further indication of how committed and serious people take their piano playing and their involvement in the forum. I can well understand your hurt dire tonic but also understand another's suspicion of wrong doing and probably felt a duty to say something.

I applaud your rebuff dire tonic (use of the clock in your video is masterful) but for the sake of the forum it would be best to put this to bed asap.
_________________________
Learning piano starts by taking all your confidence and then over many years drip feeding it back to you smile

XXXVIII-9-XXX

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#2074470 - 04/30/13 07:36 PM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: earlofmar]
Peyton Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/02/06
Posts: 2679
Loc: Maine
Originally Posted By: earlofmar
This incident is further indication of how committed and serious people take their piano playing and their involvement in the forum. I can well understand your hurt dire tonic but also understand another's suspicion of wrong doing and probably felt a duty to say something.

I applaud your rebuff dire tonic (use of the clock in your video is masterful) but for the sake of the forum it would be best to put this to bed asap.


+1 At least the person in question PM'd and did not post his accusations on the forum. Of course if he had he would be eating some serious crow right about now.
_________________________
"One's real life is often the life that one does not lead."- Oscar Wilde
www.youtube.com/Biffer5
www.peytonart.com


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#2074475 - 04/30/13 07:41 PM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
LimeFriday Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/02/09
Posts: 303
Loc: Australia
dire tonic - I'm so sorry this happened. You stepped in and took up one of my pieces at VERY short notice when I was injured and unable to play - and I wanted to thank you for doing that. I'm sorry that your experience was marred by someone doubting your integrity. Glad you set the record straight! Your performance of all your Mendelssohn pieces were a joy to listen to.

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#2074495 - 04/30/13 08:27 PM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: Rickster]
Ragdoll Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/03/12
Posts: 774
Loc: Illinois
Quote:
As for me, well, I just keep on playing my piano(s) the way I want to and keep on smiling… in fact, I wrote a song entitled “Play it like you want to”. smile


So when are we going to hear it?

:::tosses back hair, arms crossed, tapping foot::: grin
_________________________
Ragdoll

At first, she only flew when she thought no one was watching.


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#2074501 - 04/30/13 08:49 PM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: Peyton]
Polyphonist Online   content
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/03/13
Posts: 8415
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: Peyton
Originally Posted By: earlofmar
This incident is further indication of how committed and serious people take their piano playing and their involvement in the forum. I can well understand your hurt dire tonic but also understand another's suspicion of wrong doing and probably felt a duty to say something.

I applaud your rebuff dire tonic (use of the clock in your video is masterful) but for the sake of the forum it would be best to put this to bed asap.


+1 At least the person in question PM'd and did not post his accusations on the forum. Of course if he had he would be eating some serious crow right about now.

Wouldn't that have been a good thing? laugh
_________________________
Regards,

Polyphonist

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#2074504 - 04/30/13 08:53 PM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: Ragdoll]
Sam S Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/12/07
Posts: 1573
Loc: Georgia, USA
Originally Posted By: Ragdoll
Quote:
As for me, well, I just keep on playing my piano(s) the way I want to and keep on smiling… in fact, I wrote a song entitled “Play it like you want to”. smile


So when are we going to hear it?

:::tosses back hair, arms crossed, tapping foot::: grin


Rick is too modest to toot his own horn. Here's the video:

Play it Like You Want to

Sam

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#2074519 - 04/30/13 09:14 PM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: Sam S]
ElleC Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/12/13
Posts: 248
Loc: NJ, USA
Rick = rockstar!

That was awesome! Enjoyed that very much. Thanks for tooting his horn Sam smile

Originally Posted By: Sam S
Originally Posted By: Ragdoll
Quote:
As for me, well, I just keep on playing my piano(s) the way I want to and keep on smiling… in fact, I wrote a song entitled “Play it like you want to”. smile


So when are we going to hear it?

:::tosses back hair, arms crossed, tapping foot::: grin


Rick is too modest to toot his own horn. Here's the video:

Play it Like You Want to

Sam
_________________________
Adult beginner since January 2013. My only regret is that I didn't learn sooner.

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#2074534 - 04/30/13 09:47 PM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
Nikolas Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/26/07
Posts: 5873
Loc: Europe
dire,

I don't know you, I don't really frequent the ABF too much, but this "case" got me interested...

Based on what I saw on the youtube video you posted here, I think that the video, due to the quality looks choppy and speed altered... This is not to say that it IS so, but that it LOOKS so, because of the frame rate, etc... So I don't think it's insane that someone thought there was something going on.

But this is where everything ends: Accusing someone of cheating in an e-recital, and doing so in a mod is silly, to say the least and rather nasty. Personally I would've approached you in person through a PM and see if I can sort out what's going on, without such certainty...

In any case best of luck and don't worry about the various nasty people that can be found everywhere: They indeed can be found everywhere, and can be ignored! wink
_________________________
http://www.musica-ferrum.com

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#2074536 - 04/30/13 09:54 PM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: Nikolas]
Ojustaboo Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/18/11
Posts: 155
Loc: Deleted
This sort of thing makes me plucking up the courage to ever submit something myself all the more harder frown

I play a couple of online games, characters that can sneak around invisible, my character names all have sneak in them such as Sneakaboo and I'm known as Sneak when chatting online.

So reading this and the culprit being referred to by my gamer name makes it all the worse smile

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#2074588 - 04/30/13 11:23 PM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
newest student Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/26/12
Posts: 24
Loc: Eastern PA
Dire Tonic, I suggest that you consider the source which criticized you, and then discount it.

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#2074640 - 05/01/13 12:20 AM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: newest student]
Saranoya Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/27/13
Posts: 738
Loc: Brussels, Belgium
Dire Tonic,

Try not to let this kind of thing get to you. I know that's easier said than done, but consider what Morodiene said: neither prizes, nor bragging rights are associated with any of the PW recitals. A person who engages in this kind of accusation (and certainly one who goes to a third person of perceived 'authority' to do it) is can probably be dismissed as someone who just had a little too much time on their hands.

If you say you didn't speed up the video, then I believe you. I see no reason for you to lie about that. But even if you did lie about it, and did speed up the video, I wouldn't care. No prize money, no bragging rights. You can do whatever the heck you want, as far as I'm concerned.
_________________________
Beginner with some priors since 9/2012

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#2074711 - 05/01/13 03:44 AM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
dire tonic Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/17/11
Posts: 2344
Loc: uk south
Thanks a lot, everyone, for your generous support , pertinent messages and plenty of laughs – the thread needed some light-heartedness. My face is still smarting from Derulux’s glove.

On the downside, I now feel like a rabid attention seeker – but that’s decidedly better than being made to feel like a cheat.

Let the work commence!

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#2074719 - 05/01/13 03:58 AM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: Ojustaboo]
peterws Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/21/12
Posts: 4401
Loc: Northern England.
"This sort of thing makes me plucking up the courage to ever submit something myself all the more harder frown"

Get on wi it man! We want to hear ya. . . . grin
_________________________
"I'm playing all the right notes � but not necessarily in the right order." Eric Morecambe

""

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#2074750 - 05/01/13 05:21 AM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: Ojustaboo]
Mickb Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/01/13
Posts: 14
Originally Posted By: Ojustaboo
This sort of thing makes me plucking up the courage to ever submit something myself all the more harder frown

I play a couple of online games, characters that can sneak around invisible, my character names all have sneak in them such as Sneakaboo and I'm known as Sneak when chatting online.

So reading this and the culprit being referred to by my gamer name makes it all the worse smile


Don't tell me, you play a Rogue in Wow?

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#2074772 - 05/01/13 06:41 AM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
Rostosky Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/30/11
Posts: 3339
Loc: Lost in cyberspace.in the UK.
I just thought I would post this video Of the Rickster for those that havent yet seen it.
On another thread that was about Adult beginners VS beginners and beyond I believe someone joked that Rickster should be thrown off for being Too GOOD!!!

Before anyone claims "cheat" on Ricksters eyebrows, he is certainly not cheating, the video is clearly OVER exposed and it is this that is making Ricksters eyebrows seem so , well, (sorry Rickster) : startling!



Nikolas: Thank you for coming over from PC where your opinions and skills as a musician/composer are so well respected to weigh in here with your thoughts.

I would like to mention to you that I said the same to the person that Pmed me: vis a vis that on less than adequate camcorders/phones/etc often the frame rate is poor to say the least.
I went on to say that I know of many videos both here on PW and on youtube/ the internet that I know for a certainty are absolutely genuine, yet these videos dont capture the hands and finger movements to such an extent that in some cases the fingers arent even where they are meant to be for the notes that are sounding.

This wasnt the case in Dire tonics video, but I cited this point to illustrate that discrepencies do appear in genuine recordings none the less.

I believed this would give the person an acceptable "out" as I think it is always best to do that, rather than back someone into a corner with no "out" other than kicking and screaming, which I wanted to avoid.

I got a PM back that disagreed with this .

A lot of folk who played in the mendelssohn recital were attempting pieces well out of their "comfort zone" and further to the musical difficulties that had to be overcome and the steep learning curve, there were also folk who had never uploaded a video to the internet, and therefore had to learn about and then overcome technical difficulties.

For the senior amongst us, that is never easy, to some windows movie maker itself was a monster that had to be defeated, and this after the stress of getting a "reasonable" recording with less than studio quality equipment.

To call "foul" unjustly after all the time and trouble , grief and in some cases trauma that a performer has gone through to share their contribution for the enjoyment and listening pleasure of the group as a whole , is, in my totally serious opinion; both hurtful and spurious.

Dire tonic is not just a name on a forum, he is a human being with feelings, hopes, aspirations and dreams,and had worked very hard on his pieces, (just like everyone else had), and this accusation was just not cricket as we say here in the UK.

I hope that the overwhelming and justified show of support given here by all other members will go a long way to helping Dire tonic throw off these feelings of hurt,sadness, and dismay and encourage him to continue contributing pieces for our enjoyment and listening pleasure.

May that be and end of it.



Edited by Rostosky (05/01/13 06:42 AM)
_________________________


Rise like lions after slumber,in unvanquishable number. Shake your chains to earth like dew
which in sleep has fallen on you. Ye are many,they are few. Shelley

Founder and creator ofRostoskys 13th crystal skull project

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#2074836 - 05/01/13 08:41 AM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
Nikolas Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/26/07
Posts: 5873
Loc: Europe
Rostosky and everyone: I seriously hope that my posts didn't come off as insulting to dire! My point was that "S" saw something and thought something that wasn't unreasonable, due to the image quality and low frame rate.

Other than that everything else that "S" did was unacceptable by me! smile

But exactly as you say, "S" could've gotten out of this, yet (s)he feels that (s)he's right. He can believe what he wants, but now with a clock to prove it... bah... to herim! grin

DIRE: Directly to you: Despite of what has happened and even despite the support that you got, think of it this way: Your music playing was SO GOOD that you got accused that you cheated! HA to everyone! "S" thinks that your video and your music is too good! Great then!

As a professional and a rather public figure (definitely not well known, but in any case quite vocal) I think that I get flamed a few times (thankfully not too frequently). Especially for my music, my performance, etc. I've decided that I can't please everyone and eventually (and to a great extent) even if I touch ONE SINGLE PERSON with my music then perhaps my job is done correctly! It's the rest who are at loss here!

So same with you! smile Cheer up, record more stuff and enjoy the music! It's all about love, life, cherish what you're doing and Mendelssohn (in this case)!
_________________________
http://www.musica-ferrum.com

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#2074846 - 05/01/13 08:55 AM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: Nikolas]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 12921
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Originally Posted By: Nikolas

As a professional and a rather public figure (definitely not well known, but in any case quite vocal) I think that I get flamed a few times (thankfully not too frequently). Especially for my music, my performance, etc. I've decided that I can't please everyone and eventually (and to a great extent) even if I touch ONE SINGLE PERSON with my music then perhaps my job is done correctly! It's the rest who are at loss here!
This is really the key to being a musician. In a way, we have to be thick-skinned. Even the best musicians of all time got horribly criticized. *They* aren't the people you are doing this for.


Edited by Morodiene (05/01/13 08:56 AM)
_________________________
private piano/voice teacher FT



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#2074869 - 05/01/13 09:40 AM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: Nikolas]
Rostosky Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/30/11
Posts: 3339
Loc: Lost in cyberspace.in the UK.
Originally Posted By: Nikolas
Rostosky and everyone: I seriously hope that my posts didn't come off as insulting to dire! My point was that "S" saw something and thought something that wasn't unreasonable, due to the image quality and low frame rate.


Of course your post didnt come accross as insulting Nikolas, I understood it and understood the spirit in which it was said.
_________________________


Rise like lions after slumber,in unvanquishable number. Shake your chains to earth like dew
which in sleep has fallen on you. Ye are many,they are few. Shelley

Founder and creator ofRostoskys 13th crystal skull project

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#2074874 - 05/01/13 09:46 AM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
Allard Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/27/12
Posts: 345
Loc: Netherlands
With online gaming, to be called a cheater by another player is kind of like a compliment. You play so well that someone thinks the only logical explanation is that you cheated. I'd take the compliment and move on.
_________________________
David Lanz - Dark Horse
Yiruma - River Flows In You

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#2074913 - 05/01/13 10:22 AM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: Nikolas]
dire tonic Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/17/11
Posts: 2344
Loc: uk south
Originally Posted By: Nikolas
Rostosky and everyone: I seriously hope that my posts didn't come off as insulting to dire!


Not at all Nikolas, on the contrary, I completely agree with you. It’s perfectly understandable that S’s suspicions were aroused. What followed from that was unfortunate.

The matter should be allowed to rest.

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#2074951 - 05/01/13 11:08 AM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
casinitaly Offline


Gold Supporter until March 1 2014


Registered: 03/01/10
Posts: 5689
Loc: Italy
Originally Posted By: dire tonic
Originally Posted By: Nikolas
Rostosky and everyone: I seriously hope that my posts didn't come off as insulting to dire!


Not at all Nikolas, on the contrary, I completely agree with you. It’s perfectly understandable that S’s suspicions were aroused. What followed from that was unfortunate.

The matter should be allowed to rest.


If you want to close the discussion, you could notify the moderators and ask them to close the thread.
_________________________
XVIII-XXXVII
Follow your teacher's instructions and practice wisely/much, and you'll soon wonder how you ever found it hard. BobPickle
Performance anxiety: make it part of your daily routine and deal with it...Cope! zrtf90

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#2074955 - 05/01/13 11:16 AM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: casinitaly]
dire tonic Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/17/11
Posts: 2344
Loc: uk south
Originally Posted By: casinitaly

If you want to close the discussion, you could notify the moderators and ask them to close the thread.



Cheryl, I expect it will just expire soon anyway... no problem..

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#2074971 - 05/01/13 11:38 AM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 12921
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Originally Posted By: dire tonic
Originally Posted By: casinitaly

If you want to close the discussion, you could notify the moderators and ask them to close the thread.



Cheryl, I expect it will just expire soon anyway... no problem..

...if people stop posting. Doh! I'm part of the problem!! whistle
_________________________
private piano/voice teacher FT



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#2076870 - 05/03/13 09:04 PM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
Zaidi Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 05/23/10
Posts: 3
Loc: Singapore
Ok the thread is now closed.
_________________________
From Singapore with love...

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#2078052 - 05/06/13 01:52 AM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: dire tonic]
Bobpickle Offline

Gold Supporter until July 10  2014


Registered: 05/24/12
Posts: 1389
Loc: Cameron Park, California
Originally Posted By: dire tonic
The charge is that I recorded my piece using midi and that I sped up the result artificially by 30%.


I think that their brain is just 30% slow. Especially in regards to how I spend my time on the internet, I live by the following mantra: "If it doesn't make you money and/or it doesn't make you happy, don't do it. Life's too short."
_________________________
Bernhard - Always Have a Plan

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#2078111 - 05/06/13 04:18 AM Re: I've been accused of cheating...... [Re: ElleC]
Newman Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/27/11
Posts: 708
Loc: Australia
Originally Posted By: ElleC
... I don't have to justify myself to anyone who's already made up their mind about me. ...


Absolutely true. To thine own self be true. It doesn't matter what someone else 'thinks' if it is something you 'know'.
_________________________
Guitar since 1966. Piano (Kawai DP80) since 2011.

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