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THANK YOU! You got it

Edit: "he has found an opportunity and motivation to dedicate his life to his dreams" Actually you really really got it. Thank you for the encouragement. That is exactly how I feel and I began to wonder if I shouldn't be doing this based on some comments. I have the opportunity and motivation so why not right? Thank you very much

It's not that we don't get it...in fact I think most of us responded are people who love piano this much as well. The point in the article that I found to be true in my experiences with my students is that if you aren't practicing efficiently, you will not progress as quickly as you should. That can lead to frustration and boredom in practice. You are in the "honeymoon" stage right now, so be sure to do as much reading up as you can on how to practice efficiently. This website has many threads on that very subject. Your teacher is another great resource. I also recommend the book "The Perfect Wrong Note" by William Westney. He also talks about performing, but there is a section in there on practice that is priceless.


edited to add: That website has some great articles. Here's another one!

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog...me-ways-practice-are-more-perfect-others

(Edit: meant to address this to Morodeiene, not Mermilylumpkin)

I wasn't saying you guys didn't get it or I would have said "finally, someone who gets it" not "you got it!" Haha

I know I am in the honeymoon stage big time.

I really got a lot out of the last link you gave me that I bookmarked. And understood it clearly. Planned, efficient practise for reasonable lengths of time, for each sitting and per day. Rather than countless hours of repetitive practise that can lead to all sorts of problems. I am learning a lot so far.

I have to go to sleep now but will read this new one tomorrow

Thanks

I guess I would equate it to anyone attempting to live their dreams. Someone who's always wanted to be a doctor, sitting through their finals in pre-med.

Someone who's always wanted to act, going to audition #240.

While piano is something that I personally have always wanted to do, I'll be working my day job, and playing with my dog, and watching TV along with practicing. I make no promises to commit every hour of my day to my dream.

But OP definitely has...so good on him.

mattmorgan44, I have read your post, here:


I would really appreciate hearing people's answer to this hypothetical question:

If a beginner / beginner-intermediate player wanted to completely dedicate their life to piano and become the best pianist they could possibly become, what would you advise they do every day for their first year?

While answering, please presume the following:

They have 10 hours per day to spend on piano and anything piano related.
They will NOT give up. From getting tired of piano or any other reason.
They are extremely passionate and they have a lot of life experience to draw from.

I think the question could be answered in two parts:
1) Any advice and or steps to take to develop their skill as much as possible.
2) The routine (with however many hours would yield best results. The person is completely willing and happy to spend 10 hours if it would be of benefit).

I appreciate any advice you guys have as I begin my journey smile

Kindest regards, Matt

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matt, millions of people around the world, own pianos/keyboards. Few of them actually play them - and there is a reason for that. I loved your subject line > Re: If you had 10 hours per day for piano

Playing any instrument is a very slow process. When you play the piano you cannot make a mistake else you are going too fast. You also must review pieces you have learned so you can play them flawlessly day after day. IF you don't play them every day you will not be able to play the without mistakes.

A beginner piece is usually 4 measures, So the reality is you would play that piece everyday without mistakes until you know it well - but you have to keep playing that piece and every piece that follows. What surprises people is that it is a lot of work. I have been playing for one year and I don't think I will be able to play anything but a beginner piece for another 1 or 2 years.

Guys strumming on a guitar on the street corner for spare change have usually been playing for about 10 years.

Knowing that you have to play perfectly everytime you sit down at the piano means the reality is that you can't play for very long if it has to be perfectly played.

I disagree - with a smile - when you say someone would be happy playing the piano for 10 hours a day.

Any kid that could play the piano well never went outside and played with friends so they had a different childhood. Most artists spend their life time perfecting their art - missing out lots of stuff - but to be fair - they enjoy what they are doing.

But learning the piano is very easy. All you have to do is play each piece slowly and perfectly. Anything you play on the piano has to be played perfectly. That is all there is to learning the piano.

I love playing slowly and perfectly, but most people on the planet don't want to play it perfectly everytime and they don't want to play the same music/piece hundreds of times.

With or without a teacher, if you play the pieces that you have been given you should not have any problems as long as they are played without mistakes everytime. After you have been playing about a year, you will see how it is that you will continue to do what you have done since day one and what you will do every other day for the rest of your life.

Oh, and before I forget, you must never look at your fingers - ever - you will when you do jumps and leaps but that is very advanced so a different situation.

cheers,

Were you joking about this? I cannot tell. I remember reading this when I've been looking around the internet about learning piano.

http://www.soundfeelings.com/free/piano_myths.htm

I doubt it was a joke - it's very good advice.

JazzyMac, I have read your post, here;

Oh, and before I forget, you must never look at your fingers - ever - you will when you do jumps and leaps but that is very advanced so a different situation.

cheers,


Were you joking about this? I cannot tell. I remember reading this when I've been looking around the internet about learning piano.

http://www.soundfeelings.com/free/piano_myths.htm

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Hobby 1: Photography. Bucket List 1: Learning Piano

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Let me tell the story this way. I am old, 63, have had a stoke, failed 2 grades 1 and 3 and I am dyslexic. I started playing the pieces from the Leila Fletcher piano course 1 book a year ago.

In ALL piano books - I have several I can quote what they say. They say - say the note as you read it and play the note. Do not look at your hands.

There is no reason to look at your hands. If you look at any piano player that isn't a beginner - his fingers are hard to see because they are moving quickly, so why would you look at your fingers because if you can't read the music and play the music without looking at your fingers, you are in trouble if you want play the flight of the mumblebee.


I have not had to look at my fingers in a year - except - to find hand position if it changes -

I had lots of new experiences as a beginner but this one is funny. I am playing this piece with a one note extention in the left hand.- well it drove me mad because I read the note and I knew what to do but I wanted to look.

It is in A major and home position G is for the little finger but then I had to do a one note extention shifting my little finger over to the F note. So here is how it went.

When I got to the point when I had to play the F I desperately, very desperately wanted to look at my fingers to see if I was going play the F correctly. So I would slide my little finger across the crack between F and G - play the note and then I would always laugh everytime because my brain would say to me you have to bring the finger back to G because you have to play G in the next measure. Remember, no errors are allowed.

Now after playing this piece and other pieces, I am making the transition so there is no desire to look at my hand/finger/the crack because it is like any sharp or flat that you might feel awkward at first but it gets to feel comfortable after a while.

But I politely invite you to tell me, a beginner, when anyone looks at their fingers/hands beyond leaps, jumps and hand position change.

Oh, yes, and I almost forgot. Position is everything and I was not enjoying my digital - until I solved the problem - I stuck a black manhasset music stand that has been around for ever. You see, when I look at the music on my 3 legged piano it is like looking out the front window of a vehicle but when you look at the music stand on a Clavanova/keyboard with weighted keys, it is like looking at the rear license plate of the car in front of you. With the Manhasset music stand at the same hight as the 3 legged piano - I love it - I feel at home.

I would spend no more than 4 1/2 hours of concentrated time at the keyboard. I would spend 1 1/2 hours on technique, and 3 hours building repetoire. Lots of Bach to start.

I would spend 1 hour a day on theory and composition, including improvisation. Improvisation was important in earlier times, and has been largely underemphasized in teaching.

I would spend time understanding the history and context of each piece I was playing. What was the composer experiencing, what was the political environment at the time he or she was composing the work. What else was the composer working on. Putting pieces in historical context really helps flesh out the interpretations of the works and makes the pieces less esoteric.

I would go to as many live performances as possible. Off topic-a good opera must be experienced in a darkened hall where you can escape into the story. Tickets are more reasonable than you might expect. Back on topic: watch and listen to historic performances. Listen to all genres of music. You might find you are drawn to chamber music might prefer conducting to playing. Always listen carefully. You will learn about phrasing and breathing in your music from listening and watching singers.

Finally, I would set aside time just to good around with the instrument.

That being said, this would be my personal approach.

Hi again,

I got a chance to read this second aticle. It was good also.

Thanks

I agree with most of the things on this site, however, this I believe to be flat-out wrong:


Our brains are note like large muscle groups as in weight lifting, nor are our fingers and hands. And while playing does involve other muscles, playing piano is more a matter of efficient arm-weight and use of the fast-twitch muscles than effort comparable to weight-lifting. Taking a day off from practicing is detrimental to progress unless you have injured yourself in the previous day's practice.

Anecdotally, I have had many students who only practice 4 days a week and they do not progress like the students who practice 6 or 7 but a long shot. I do agree there is no "cramming" in piano, you can't make up for lost days, and life does happen so there are days you may need to take off.

As far as this quote about not looking at your hands:

I sort of agree, sort of disagree. Students who constantly look at their hands while learning a piece get very accustomed to being able to see their hands move in order to play it. Their heads bob like a yoyo because they don't know the music yet, and they never will because they constantly lose the sense of flow in between looking at the music and looking at their hands. I have absolutely no problem with students looking at their hands once they've learned the piece and have it memorized, or if they are changing hand positions to accommodate a leap.

Hi Michael,

Thank you very much for taking the time to reply to my post.

I completely agree that learning piano is a very slow process. I also agree that we must continue to review pieces we have learned if we are to play them flawlessly (I would prefer to say "well") day after day.

But am I reading the above correctly that the way you practice you will not allow yourself to hit a single incorrect key? And that you will always play slow enough so that you don't ever make a mistake? It seems that way because you mention making no mistakes and playing flawlessly etc numerous times..?

If I am making mistakes I know I have to slow it down as much as necessary to be able to play a section properly. But if I played in a way as I think you are describing, not allowing any mistakes and not progressing until it is flawless, I would never progress. Or more truthfully I would progress extremely slowly.

To paraphrase you are saying you will practice beginner pieces that are 4 measures long without making mistakes, and review the 4 measure pieces day after day for up to 3 years before moving beyond those 4 measure beginner pieces? I can not see how this is the best way to progress. However, I noticed a post below saying they agree with your advice. I don't think I would apply this part of it to my playing but it is interesting to me.




You are not the first person to say this but it has been addressed a number of times. I didn't say I want to play the piano for 10 hours per day, I wanted to spend 10 hours (a full day) focusing on piano playing, studying, listening, watching, reading and whatever other suggestions people could give me. Not playing (hitting keys) for 10 hours in a day every day!

Although I could happily play 10 hours in a day but not for any extended period of time! I have had a few days spending 6-7 hours playing very happily and would have played longer if I had some guidance on what to practice. I also have bad sleeping routine so a couple hours in the morning, in the afternoon and a few hours into the late night can quickly add up. But I know my sleeping has to change because it is very important to becoming a better pianist.



You are very serious about playing perfectly and without mistakes every time. Playing without mistakes is great, but to this extreme I would think would inhibit development. But I am just a beginner too so I would like to hear other peoples opinion on the matter

Thank you for addressing this Morodiene and for your advice about practicing every day.

I was going to respond to Michael but I agree with what you have said. I think if I never looked at my hands while I am a complete beginner, and practiced in a way Michael described earlier, I would give up before progressing

I do understand where he is coming from and I purposefully practice on my upright digital because it forces my eyes to look high up at the sheet more often than on my keyboard (plus I prefer the upright digital - but it was already a consideration)

But what is the purpose of looking at your hands? If you are playing material for a beginner, then your hands will be staying in one position an d not shifting at all.

Wow Jessica, Thank you thank you thank you.

I have received some great advice from these threads now and I am going to go back through them and write a list of some of the points I want to go over and not forget.

I have been thinking I will do better with a routine for my practice - such as what you have said above. So I am going to go through the threads and come up with something (that will be flexible but a guide). I think it will help me stay focused and not waste practice time and the time not spent at the piano.

After all of these replies and the link that Morodiene sent I think I will aim for 2-4 hours focused practice per day and a maximum of 4 hours focused practice per day. The rest of the days will be filled up with yours and the many other fantastic suggestions from everyone here.

Thank you and thanks everyone

Well I guess I am not playing material for a beginner. Because my hands are doing a lot of shifting

I see your point. And the reason is probably because I haven't had a teacher so I have probably been practicing pieces way too difficult. Like Bohemian Rhapsody lol.

I believe my teacher is onto this because of the sheets she gave me and what she told me about moving away from playing by ear and youtube videos, and reading the sheets instead.

But she still wanted me to learn the next section of Bohemian Rhapsody too.. so who knows what her teaching method is at this stage

I'm sure she wouldn't have assigned Bohemian Rhapsody to begin with, but since you want to do that she is trying to accommodate you while teaching you what you need to learn.

A good piano teacher teaching an adult student will teach not just stuff that's conducive to the student's musical and pianistic development, but also stuff that keeps the student's interest going. Therefore, even if the teacher has no interest in pop/rock music herself (and doesn't think that it helps in the student's musical development), if she sees that her student is interested in it, she will also 'teach' it alongside more technically and musically challenging music.

This may be different from the way she would teach a young child.

I started piano lessons at the very old age of 10, and my first teacher always obliged me in my obsession with the theme from 'Love Story' (by Francis Lai) by playing it for me at the end of every lesson, with the promise that she'd teach it to me once I'd acquired sufficient technique to play all those LH arpeggios. (At that time, I'd never heard any classical music, other than what I was taught at the piano). But by then, a few months down the line, I'd lost interest in sentimental movie tunes and became obsessed with Mozart, Beethoven and Chopin instead.....

That would be correct. Plus I honestly think she wanted to hear me play the next part lol. But I told her it's too hard for me and she said to just give it a shot

You know you have to sing along with that, don't you?
How's your articulation on "Mamma mia" and "Galileo"?

Well, have fun with your new musical direction in life. Remember it's a marathon pursuit so don't knock yourself out in the first few miles.