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#2086075 - 05/21/13 01:25 AM Scriabin Prelude Op. 13, No. 3 (again!)
Cinnamonbear Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/09/10
Posts: 3845
Loc: Rockford, IL
Hey, friends! I just recorded this today with my little Tascam DP-004 on a Steinway L at a senior center where I play fairly regularly. If you want to know about the work that was done on this piano, you can click here.

The recording is here:

https://www.box.com/s/ssqkuudefa7nwtdbc1h0

Not the most sensitive or accurate rendition. Still, I hope you can enjoy it for what it is.

--Andy


Edited by Cinnamonbear (05/21/13 01:49 AM)
_________________________
I may not be fast,
but at least I'm slow.

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#2086189 - 05/21/13 10:01 AM Re: Scriabin Prelude Op. 13, No. 3 (again!) [Re: Cinnamonbear]
Tim Adrianson Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/07/10
Posts: 1021
Hi, Cinnamonbear -- Well, I, for one, enjoyed it for what it is -- one of the numerous little jewels of early Scriabin. In his early days, he was IMO especially good at capturing lyrical innocence, and this piece is certainly a great example of that. There's a lot of this type of his music to be had before he got all mystical on us.*

Thanks for sharing this!

*I don't mean this disparagingly; I consider his later music phenomenal -- it's just that there's SO much early Scriabin that's rarely heard, and some of it is drop-dead beautiful.

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#2086259 - 05/21/13 01:40 PM Re: Scriabin Prelude Op. 13, No. 3 (again!) [Re: Cinnamonbear]
D. S. F. Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/10/10
Posts: 142
Well, I did read the full post on the technician's forum. This is wonderful. I have spent the past year and a half in a program called Music for Seniors, which gives me recitals in retirement homes, assisted living, and health centers in the area...and I tell you ALL of the instruments I encounter are neglected and in bad shape. I wonder what a difference the type of care you and Bill showed would have on these other instruments!

The recording sounds great, an especially satisfying reward after all your labors on the instrument. Early Scriabin, so succinct, can be a special treat.

Dave
_________________________
Music does not have to be understood;
It has to be listened to.
- Hermann Scherchen.

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#2086293 - 05/21/13 02:25 PM Re: Scriabin Prelude Op. 13, No. 3 (again!) [Re: D. S. F.]
carey Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/13/05
Posts: 6211
Loc: Phoenix, Arizona
Andy - I read the entire technicians forum post as well. Enjoyed the full explanation - AND the photos of work in progress !!! Most of all, I loved the sound of the instrument as you played the Scriabin. I'm sure the Steinway will get much more use now that it is up to snuff !!!! Now perhaps the "home" can put a little sign on the piano saying something about food - crumbs - liquids, etc. and perhaps they can keep the fall board closed to help prevent dust build up. Looking forward to hearing you play something that shows off the piano's full dynamic range (hint hint) grin
_________________________
YouTube channel - http://www.youtube.com/user/pianophilo

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#2086645 - 05/22/13 08:29 AM Re: Scriabin Prelude Op. 13, No. 3 (again!) [Re: carey]
Cinnamonbear Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/09/10
Posts: 3845
Loc: Rockford, IL
Originally Posted By: carey
[...] Looking forward to hearing you play something that shows off the piano's full dynamic range (hint hint) grin



Islamey? crazy Arpeggiated and asynchronized? grin
_________________________
I may not be fast,
but at least I'm slow.

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#2086648 - 05/22/13 08:38 AM Re: Scriabin Prelude Op. 13, No. 3 (again!) [Re: D. S. F.]
Cinnamonbear Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/09/10
Posts: 3845
Loc: Rockford, IL
Originally Posted By: D. S. F.
Well, I did read the full post on the technician's forum. This is wonderful. I have spent the past year and a half in a program called Music for Seniors, which gives me recitals in retirement homes, assisted living, and health centers in the area...and I tell you ALL of the instruments I encounter are neglected and in bad shape. I wonder what a difference the type of care you and Bill showed would have on these other instruments! [...]


Thanks for the comments, D.S.F.! I've been to a number of senior centers in this area, and the range of types of pianos and their care varies so widely! There is one place that has a very dumpy studio upright in horrible shape that gets played EVERY DAY by a retired church organist with a twinkle in his eye who is so happy to just have an instrument to play. I couldn't get past the activity director when I offered to tune it for free! *Sigh* Please pray for me to get in there!!!


Edited by Cinnamonbear (05/22/13 08:54 AM)
_________________________
I may not be fast,
but at least I'm slow.

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#2086653 - 05/22/13 08:43 AM Re: Scriabin Prelude Op. 13, No. 3 (again!) [Re: Tim Adrianson]
Cinnamonbear Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/09/10
Posts: 3845
Loc: Rockford, IL
Originally Posted By: Tim Adrianson
[...] *I don't mean this disparagingly; I consider his later music phenomenal -- it's just that there's SO much early Scriabin that's rarely heard, and some of it is drop-dead beautiful.


Right, Tim! I know what you mean. What I like about some of the early stuff is that it is quite accessible (technically speaking), and very lyrical, and on his way up Mystic Mountain Scriabin discovered some very profound sounds along the way. I'm so glad he sent the postcards! grin
_________________________
I may not be fast,
but at least I'm slow.

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#2086800 - 05/22/13 12:59 PM Re: Scriabin Prelude Op. 13, No. 3 (again!) [Re: Cinnamonbear]
Damon Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/22/06
Posts: 6067
Loc: St. Louis area
Originally Posted By: Cinnamonbear
Originally Posted By: carey
[...] Looking forward to hearing you play something that shows off the piano's full dynamic range (hint hint) grin



Islamey? crazy Arpeggiated and asynchronized? grin



Didn't Bachmach already do that? smile
_________________________
It's been scientifically proven that Horowitz sucks.

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#2087105 - 05/23/13 12:30 AM Re: Scriabin Prelude Op. 13, No. 3 (again!) [Re: Damon]
Cinnamonbear Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/09/10
Posts: 3845
Loc: Rockford, IL
Originally Posted By: Damon
Originally Posted By: Cinnamonbear
Originally Posted By: carey
[...] Looking forward to hearing you play something that shows off the piano's full dynamic range (hint hint) grin



Islamey? crazy Arpeggiated and asynchronized? grin



Didn't Bachmach already do that? smile


Probably... But not on a well regulated and freshly tuned nursing home Steinway L! grin
_________________________
I may not be fast,
but at least I'm slow.

Top
#2087258 - 05/23/13 09:51 AM Re: Scriabin Prelude Op. 13, No. 3 (again!) [Re: Cinnamonbear]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 11422
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Beautiful playing, I'm not familiar with this particular prelude, but I really enjoyed it!

A question about the recording: What was the position of the mic(s)? I'm curious about recording setups that people use.
_________________________
private piano/voice teacher - full time
MTNA member
www.valeoconservatory.com
Petrof 9'2 Concert, Yamaha G3, Roland FP-7, Yamaha MOX6, Kawai MP11

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#2087406 - 05/23/13 01:03 PM Re: Scriabin Prelude Op. 13, No. 3 (again!) [Re: Cinnamonbear]
woodog Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/21/12
Posts: 376
Loc: Bowling Green, KY
I envy your time with Bill Bremmer. Wonderful playing too!

best!

Forrest
_________________________
Graham Fitch's Piano Pedagogy Site
(A WORTHY RESOURCE!)

--------------------
current studies:
Debussy: Suite Bergamasque
Beethoven Op. 78
Bach WTC 1, C# Major (#3)

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#2087904 - 05/24/13 10:53 AM Re: Scriabin Prelude Op. 13, No. 3 (again!) [Re: Morodiene]
Cinnamonbear Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/09/10
Posts: 3845
Loc: Rockford, IL
Originally Posted By: Morodiene
[...] A question about the recording: What was the position of the mic(s)? I'm curious about recording setups that people use.


Hi, Morodiene! Thanks for listening! I'm glad you enjoyed it.

To answer your question about the recording, if a picture is worth a thousand words, here is a three thousand word essay.

I tuned a Yamaha G1 yesterday, which is about the same size as the Steinway L of the initial post. (Since I saw your question before I headed out, I took my digital recorder and camera along for an "on location" photo shoot. grin ) I figured when I was finished tuning, I'd set up the recorder in the exact same way as I had it on the Steinway (or as exact as I could get it), with the exact same settings, and play the exact same prelude, then we could compare and learn even more! laugh

First, here's the digital recorder and the settings:



I placed the recorder on the right of the music desk with the microphones pointed into the piano, oriented at an angle:





I transferred the file from the digital recorder into CuBase, where I increased its volume before converting it from .wav to .mp3 and uploading it to Boxnet. I have to say, I'm happier with this version as far as the playing goes. The piano is not prepped nearly like the Steinway L that just got a day's worth of regulation. I mean, re-shaping the hammers on the Yamaha would greatly improve the tone, especially when the soft pedal is engaged. Also, do you notice how "clicky clacky" the action sounds on the Yamaha? And how there is no "clicky clacky" in the Steinway? Regulation. I'm still at the bottom end of the learning curve where tuning is concerned, but both Bill's tuning of the Steinway and my tuning of the Yamaha are EBVT III (Equal Beating Victorian Temperament III).

And so, here is the way it sounds (lid fully open, soft pedal engaged):

https://www.box.com/s/qg6ax15u6d771xx6d77k

See what you think.

Originally Posted By: woodog
I envy your time with Bill Bremmer. Wonderful playing too!

best!

Forrest


Forrest! laugh Good to hear from you. Bill is a great teacher, and I consider myself very fortunate, indeed, that he has taken me under his wing.

Originally Posted By: Damon
Originally Posted By: Cinnamonbear
Originally Posted By: carey
[...] Looking forward to hearing you play something that shows off the piano's full dynamic range (hint hint) grin



Islamey? crazy Arpeggiated and asynchronized? grin



Didn't Bachmach already do that? smile


Damon and Carey: I don't think BachMach has done this one, yet. I recorded this before I finished tuning, yesterday, to give the rendition certain colouring. I picked this particular piece with both of you in mind--Carey, to answer your question about dynamic range; Damon, because it's Liszt.

It is a very good take, perhaps the best this has been played. Lesser pianists have tried it and failed, though I do not claim to be in the same league as BachMach2. I do apologize for the recording quality, however, which is, unfortunately, quite good. Perhaps I will upload this to YouTube with a rolling score so interested pianophiles can follow along with a definitive interpretation.

Franz Liszt -- Rhapsodie hongroise No. 15

Cheers!

--Andy
_________________________
I may not be fast,
but at least I'm slow.

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#2088280 - 05/24/13 07:48 PM Re: Scriabin Prelude Op. 13, No. 3 (again!) [Re: Cinnamonbear]
carey Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/13/05
Posts: 6211
Loc: Phoenix, Arizona
Originally Posted By: Cinnamonbear
Damon and Carey: I don't think BachMach has done this one, yet. I recorded this before I finished tuning, yesterday, to give the rendition certain colouring. I picked this particular piece with both of you in mind--Carey, to answer your question about dynamic range; Damon, because it's Liszt.

It is a very good take, perhaps the best this has been played. Lesser pianists have tried it and failed, though I do not claim to be in the same league as BachMach2. I do apologize for the recording quality, however, which is, unfortunately, quite good. Perhaps I will upload this to YouTube with a rolling score so interested pianophiles can follow along with a definitive interpretation.

Franz Liszt -- Rhapsodie hongroise No. 15


HA HA HA HA HA HA !!!!!!! LOVED IT !!!!

Much more creative than anything BachMach2 has posted !!!!!!

Steve Gillmore - move over !! grin grin grin


Edited by carey (05/24/13 07:48 PM)
_________________________
YouTube channel - http://www.youtube.com/user/pianophilo

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#2088287 - 05/24/13 08:00 PM Re: Scriabin Prelude Op. 13, No. 3 (again!) [Re: Cinnamonbear]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 11422
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Andy,

I much rather enjoyed the Steinway over the Yamaha wink . Looks like your unit could handle external mics too, which might be interesting for different placement of mics and variety in sounds.
_________________________
private piano/voice teacher - full time
MTNA member
www.valeoconservatory.com
Petrof 9'2 Concert, Yamaha G3, Roland FP-7, Yamaha MOX6, Kawai MP11

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#2088288 - 05/24/13 08:00 PM Re: Scriabin Prelude Op. 13, No. 3 (again!) [Re: Cinnamonbear]
Vid Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/12/01
Posts: 804
Loc: Vancouver, B.C.
thumb ha

Words fail me!
_________________________
Kawai VPC1, Pianoteq, Galaxy Vintage D

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#2088297 - 05/24/13 08:36 PM Re: Scriabin Prelude Op. 13, No. 3 (again!) [Re: Vid]
Cinnamonbear Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/09/10
Posts: 3845
Loc: Rockford, IL
Originally Posted By: Vid
[...]
Words fail me!


Thank you, Vid. smile [*nods* and *bows*] I find that very reassuring.
_________________________
I may not be fast,
but at least I'm slow.

Top
#2088304 - 05/24/13 08:44 PM Re: Scriabin Prelude Op. 13, No. 3 (again!) [Re: Cinnamonbear]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 11422
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Originally Posted By: Cinnamonbear
Originally Posted By: Vid
[...]
Words fail me!


Thank you, Vid. smile [*nods* and *bows*] I find that very reassuring.
Do we really need a BachMach3? laugh
_________________________
private piano/voice teacher - full time
MTNA member
www.valeoconservatory.com
Petrof 9'2 Concert, Yamaha G3, Roland FP-7, Yamaha MOX6, Kawai MP11

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#2088315 - 05/24/13 09:06 PM Re: Scriabin Prelude Op. 13, No. 3 (again!) [Re: carey]
Cinnamonbear Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/09/10
Posts: 3845
Loc: Rockford, IL
Originally Posted By: carey
[...]
Steve Gillmore - move over !! grin grin grin


Well, now, lets not get "Carey'd" away, my good friend. grin

As imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, were we to take a good objective look at my work on the Liszt Rhapsody, despite what I said in my introduction, upon reflection, there are several weaknesses with my performance, none of which you would find in a BachMach2 rendition. 1) BachMach2 is a much better reader than I am. 2) BachMach2 would have, very likely, done a much better job carrying through with the melodic line. And 3) pianistic technical nuance--BachMach2 has it in droves. My realization of this piece is extremely crude in comparison, despite learning it for the recital of my junior year in high school, and having, lo, this past 30 years or so to polish it.

Suffice it to say, I am glad it is not a competition. I would, in fact, greatly enjoy hearing BachMach2's realization of this particular Hungarian Rhapsody. I wonder if he takes requests?
_________________________
I may not be fast,
but at least I'm slow.

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#2088323 - 05/24/13 09:26 PM Re: Scriabin Prelude Op. 13, No. 3 (again!) [Re: Morodiene]
Cinnamonbear Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/09/10
Posts: 3845
Loc: Rockford, IL
Originally Posted By: Morodiene
Andy,

I much rather enjoyed the Steinway over the Yamaha wink . [...]


I understand. The Steinway is definitely richer, warmer, and more full. I've never been a big fan of the Steinway "feel" under my hands and fingers, though--I have not yet found a Steinway that "did it" for me.

Even in these two recordings, objectively speaking, I think you can hear a stiffness in my playing on the Steinway, and a much more sensitive attention to voicing and phrasing on the Yamaha, despite the pedal mistake at 0:09. There is something about the action on the Yamaha that I respond to positively, despite the lack of a fine regulation, as on the Steinway. I also think the sound coming from the Yamaha has more distinct harmonic color, but that might be my young, unpracticed ear.


Edited by Cinnamonbear (05/24/13 09:30 PM)
_________________________
I may not be fast,
but at least I'm slow.

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#2089134 - 05/26/13 11:17 AM Re: Scriabin Prelude Op. 13, No. 3 (again!) [Re: Cinnamonbear]
Damon Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/22/06
Posts: 6067
Loc: St. Louis area
Originally Posted By: Cinnamonbear
Originally Posted By: carey
[...]
Steve Gillmore - move over !! grin grin grin


Well, now, lets not get "Carey'd" away, my good friend. grin

As imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, were we to take a good objective look at my work on the Liszt Rhapsody, despite what I said in my introduction, upon reflection, there are several weaknesses with my performance, none of which you would find in a BachMach2 rendition. 1) BachMach2 is a much better reader than I am. 2) BachMach2 would have, very likely, done a much better job carrying through with the melodic line. And 3) pianistic technical nuance--BachMach2 has it in droves.


4) Bachmach2 would have played the whole thing....unfortunately. eek

laugh
_________________________
It's been scientifically proven that Horowitz sucks.

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