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#2088881 - 05/25/13 10:27 PM Fantom X MIDI
dooger94 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/13/13
Posts: 23
Hello, I recently bought a Fantom X6 and am trying to hook it up to my computer. I have a midi cable to usb set up on it now, and nothing is working. Mainly, for right now, I'm wanting to transfer a song from the fantom to my computer, but in the future I would also like to use my fantom as a midi controller, to help me make music on my PC as well. Anyway, the only thing I have right now is the midi cable which doesn't seem to do anything, and no one recommends. What's the point of the midi spots being there, and what are they supposed to do?

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#2088905 - 05/25/13 10:58 PM Re: Fantom X MIDI [Re: dooger94]
toddy Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/30/11
Posts: 1743
Loc: Portugal
Maybe the drivers on the computer are not working correctly for some reason. You can try downloading & reinstalling them from here http://www.roland.com/support/article/?q=downloads&p=FANTOM-X6

You can then check exactly how the midi data is flowing by using this utility brilliant and perfectly free & safe: http://www.midiox.com/

Drivers - including midi drivers - can be a shocking pain in the ass.
_________________________
Roland HP 302, Yamaha SY85

Reaper / NI Komplete 9 /Kontakt 5// EWQL Sym Choirs/ Sym Orchestra Silver/ MOR2
Mics: SP B1 & MXL V67g/ Alesis MicTube Preamp/ Xenyx302/ Yamaha HS7s .

"Only a fool is fooled" pv88, All Fools' Day 2014.

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#2088914 - 05/25/13 11:05 PM Re: Fantom X MIDI [Re: dooger94]
dooger94 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/13/13
Posts: 23
I tried downloading that. I forgot to mention the keyboard was used and didn't come with the CD installer, so I've been trying to install these from the website. The driver seems to be in a zip file, I tried unzipping it but it says the setup file doesn't exist. I successfully downloaded and unzipped the Fantom x editor and librarian though. And yes, I'm becoming painfully aware this is going to be harder than expected, especially without the installation CD.

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#2088915 - 05/25/13 11:05 PM Re: Fantom X MIDI [Re: dooger94]
R0B Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/03/08
Posts: 1439
Loc: Australia
Worth double checking that you have the midi 'IN' plug connected to midi 'OUT' of the Fantom, and not the other way round.
_________________________
Rob

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#2088921 - 05/25/13 11:12 PM Re: Fantom X MIDI [Re: dooger94]
toddy Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/30/11
Posts: 1743
Loc: Portugal
oh dear....are you working with the right version (ie 32bit or 64bit)?

Anyway, midi-ox might help you see if there's any activity at all. Also, the computer should be thrashing around looking for the drivers as soon as you plug in the USB. It's usually a matter of some experimenting and a great deal of messing round, including down-powering and re-booting the computer a few times.
_________________________
Roland HP 302, Yamaha SY85

Reaper / NI Komplete 9 /Kontakt 5// EWQL Sym Choirs/ Sym Orchestra Silver/ MOR2
Mics: SP B1 & MXL V67g/ Alesis MicTube Preamp/ Xenyx302/ Yamaha HS7s .

"Only a fool is fooled" pv88, All Fools' Day 2014.

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#2088936 - 05/25/13 11:31 PM Re: Fantom X MIDI [Re: dooger94]
Kawai James Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 9330
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Originally Posted By: dooger94
I have a midi cable to usb set up on it now, and nothing is working.


May I ask which brand/model of USB-->MIDI cable?
You may need to install a driver for this cable, if so it should have been included, and/or can be downloaded from the manufacturer's website.

Unless you're connecting your Fantom to the computer using just USB (i.e. USB from the Fantom to a USB port on the your computer) it probably won't be necessary to install specific Fantom drivers - at least, not for simple MIDI communications. However, if there is an editor programme, I expect some additional driver or software will be required on the computer.

Cheers,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#2088949 - 05/25/13 11:46 PM Re: Fantom X MIDI [Re: Kawai James]
dooger94 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/13/13
Posts: 23
http://www.amazon.com/HDE-Cable-Converter-Music-Keyboard/dp/B001LJUVO4

It's this connector here. It only came with the cable. When I connect it should anything come up?

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#2088950 - 05/25/13 11:48 PM Re: Fantom X MIDI [Re: R0B]
dooger94 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/13/13
Posts: 23
Oh my god I'm an idiot. I have a feeling that plugging the in into the out will begin to solve my problems. So sorry for taking everyone's time by something as little as this.


Edited by dooger94 (05/25/13 11:48 PM)

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#2089041 - 05/26/13 07:11 AM Re: Fantom X MIDI [Re: dooger94]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 12043
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
dooger: don't worry! This is all a part of the process and we've all done it.

Can I ask, how do you like your Fantom, and what did you pay for it? I'm looking into getting one.
_________________________
private piano/voice teacher - full time
MTNA member
www.valeoconservatory.com
Petrof 9'2 Concert, Yamaha G3, Roland FP-7, Yamaha MOX6, Kawai MP11

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#2089102 - 05/26/13 10:18 AM Re: Fantom X MIDI [Re: dooger94]
Jeff Clef Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/05/08
Posts: 4425
Loc: San Jose, CA
Manufacturers too often don't make it exactly easy to read the tiny type, inconveniently located, that tells us what port goes to what function--- really, it's not the end-user who should feel guilty over this kind of innocent mistake.

Besides that, it is a VERY common experience that cables develop--- well, I don't know what they develop, but I know they stop working. So it can pay to try a different cable if there's a mysterious problem. Stage performers learn to keep spares in their kit, because it never happens at a good time.

I looked at the Fantom, and maybe I should have gotten it. So if you get it working, I'd like to hear about how you like it.
_________________________
Clef


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#2089120 - 05/26/13 10:49 AM Re: Fantom X MIDI [Re: Morodiene]
dooger94 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/13/13
Posts: 23
My opinion of this workstation will be coming from a noob standpoint, not to mention it's the only keyboard in the range of $100 or higher that I've ever had or tried, so beware. I paid $700 for it used on eBay, though it didn't come with a stand, and after I bought it I found out I needed speakers to even hear the sound. I have the X6 version, and since I've only ever owned a cheap, light up key Casio for about 12 years (I'm 18) this Fantom was like a magical wonder sent from heaven. The piano sound on it, for me, sounds exactly like a real piano. The sequencer I'm sure is pretty easy to use, but it would be smart to read up about it a little bit so you know what you're doing, other than that it just takes using it over and over until you get it right. I'm still struggling with getting it connected to my computer, as I've never used MIDI or anything like it, but I imagine it works great too. I've only had it for a couple of days, and there are things this keyboard can do that I may not find out about for years because there's so much to work with (in a good way). Also, the color screen is fantastic. These are the only features I've been able to get to yet, andI love the Fantom so far and am sure it will lovingly aid my journey into music making. I highly recommend it from what I see.

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#2089121 - 05/26/13 10:51 AM Re: Fantom X MIDI [Re: dooger94]
R0B Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/03/08
Posts: 1439
Loc: Australia
Hi Dooger,

As Morodiene says, we've all done it blush .

It seems logical to plug the midi IN plug into the midi IN socket, but in reality, it is midi OUT from your keyboard, to midi IN to the computer, and vice versa.

Please let us know if you got it working smile
_________________________
Rob

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#2089133 - 05/26/13 11:16 AM Re: Fantom X MIDI [Re: dooger94]
toddy Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/30/11
Posts: 1743
Loc: Portugal
Sir Clive Sinclair tried calling his inputs outputs and his outputs inputs back in the early home computer days - late 70's. He did this so that you plugged your 'input' plug (coming from your tape/cassette recorder) into your 'input' socket on the computer, and the 'output' plug went into the 'output' socket in the computer.

This was done as a convenience, to save people making the error mentioned above, which as was pointed out, we've all made. But poor old Sir Clive was sneered at so much - and called potty - by bedroom computer geek types that the idea never took on.

So when MIDI came out, a little while later in about 1982, they lost their nerve and resorted to the old 'in to out' and 'out to in' system.

...which is logical enough, of course, but still causes problems.
_________________________
Roland HP 302, Yamaha SY85

Reaper / NI Komplete 9 /Kontakt 5// EWQL Sym Choirs/ Sym Orchestra Silver/ MOR2
Mics: SP B1 & MXL V67g/ Alesis MicTube Preamp/ Xenyx302/ Yamaha HS7s .

"Only a fool is fooled" pv88, All Fools' Day 2014.

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#2089328 - 05/26/13 05:19 PM Re: Fantom X MIDI [Re: toddy]
dooger94 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/13/13
Posts: 23
Thank you all for making me feel not so stupid grin
Now, I've went ahead and found a USB to USB cable so I could transfer a song from the Fantom to my PC. Everything worked, but when I went to open the file, it said "The version of this file is not compatible with the version of Windows you are running. Check your computer's information to see whether you need a 32 bit or 64 bit version of the program, and then contact the publisher." Okay, I know I'm running a 64 bit Windows Vista, but my keyboard didn't come with the installation CD, so I downloaded a couple of things from the Roland website. I got the Librarian and Fantom Editor. Do I need something else to make these files playable??

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#2089331 - 05/26/13 05:22 PM Re: Fantom X MIDI [Re: dooger94]
chicolom Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/26/12
Posts: 69
My Fantom X8 had a USB out Jack that I just hook directly to the computer for midi purposes. In the fantoms system settings there is an option to set the USB mode to either midi or storage (storage being for accessing files off the internal memory or card).


Edited by chicolom (05/26/13 05:24 PM)
_________________________
Kawai MP6 | Ravenscroft 275 | True Keys American & Italian | Galaxy Vintage D, II, & Giant | Old Black Grand | Imperfect Fazioli

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#2089341 - 05/26/13 05:29 PM Re: Fantom X MIDI [Re: dooger94]
dooger94 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/13/13
Posts: 23
I have it set up on storage mode. I downloaded the sample file from my Fantom, but it won't open the file, it says it's not compatible with my version of windows. And I've tried downloading all of these different drivers from the Roland website but they won't unzip the set up.

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#2089428 - 05/26/13 07:21 PM Re: Fantom X MIDI [Re: dooger94]
Kawai James Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 9330
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
dooger94, perhaps you can check the owner's manual to ensure that you are following the correct procedure, or contact Roland's product support through the 'Roland Clan' forum?

Kind regards,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#2089472 - 05/26/13 08:58 PM Re: Fantom X MIDI [Re: dooger94]
chicolom Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/26/12
Posts: 69
Originally Posted By: dooger94
I have it set up on storage mode. I downloaded the sample file from my Fantom, but it won't open the file, it says it's not compatible with my version of windows. And I've tried downloading all of these different drivers from the Roland website but they won't unzip the set up.
If you're talking about an audio sample, they're just .wav files.

If your talking about one of the workstation's song sequence files, they are a weird format that windows can't do anything with. There are ways to convert it into a midi file though.

What file type (extension) did you extract from the fantom?
_________________________
Kawai MP6 | Ravenscroft 275 | True Keys American & Italian | Galaxy Vintage D, II, & Giant | Old Black Grand | Imperfect Fazioli

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#2089510 - 05/26/13 09:36 PM Re: Fantom X MIDI [Re: chicolom]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 12043
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Originally Posted By: chicolom
Originally Posted By: dooger94
I have it set up on storage mode. I downloaded the sample file from my Fantom, but it won't open the file, it says it's not compatible with my version of windows. And I've tried downloading all of these different drivers from the Roland website but they won't unzip the set up.
If you're talking about an audio sample, they're just .wav files.

If your talking about one of the workstation's song sequence files, they are a weird format that windows can't do anything with. There are ways to convert it into a midi file though.

What file type (extension) did you extract from the fantom?
I think this is probably the problem, although with Vista, you never know wink. What exactly are you trying to accomplish with the USB connection to your computer? Do you just want to hear it played via the computer speakers? Do you want to be able to do some manipulation of the music (in which case you'll need to download some software to take care of that)? Do you want to record an audio file (like .wav) - in this case you'll not want to use USB/MIDI but audio out.
_________________________
private piano/voice teacher - full time
MTNA member
www.valeoconservatory.com
Petrof 9'2 Concert, Yamaha G3, Roland FP-7, Yamaha MOX6, Kawai MP11

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#2090030 - 05/27/13 05:17 PM Re: Fantom X MIDI [Re: Morodiene]
dooger94 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/13/13
Posts: 23
Initially, I just wanted to take a song recorded on the fantom and transfer it to my computer. Finally, I just sampled the song, finally got my fantom connected via usb cable, and downloaded the sample and unzipped it, which thankfully worked. Is this the easiest way to do this? What if I wanted to edit it on my computer? Also, now that you mention it, is there a way to play my fantom through my computer speakers? I would love that. And yes, eventually I want to manipulate it from my computer, maybe try to do remixes of songs, but I know I'll have to get a software to that. Any free ones I can try out that you know of?

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#2090033 - 05/27/13 05:20 PM Re: Fantom X MIDI [Re: Kawai James]
dooger94 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/13/13
Posts: 23
Thanks for that suggestion, I tried, but no one ever replies lol laugh

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#2090188 - 05/27/13 08:47 PM Re: Fantom X MIDI [Re: dooger94]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 12043
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Originally Posted By: dooger94
Initially, I just wanted to take a song recorded on the fantom and transfer it to my computer.
What then? Burn a CD? Post on Youtube?
Quote:
Finally, I just sampled the song, finally got my fantom connected via usb cable, and downloaded the sample and unzipped it, which thankfully worked. Is this the easiest way to do this? What if I wanted to edit it on my computer?
It would most likely be easier if you used MIDI editing software and used your USB cable connection to record on the computer directly from the keyboard. If you want to edit, you will also need software to do that.
Quote:
Also, now that you mention it, is there a way to play my fantom through my computer speakers? I would love that.
This should be simple (if you weren't using Vista wink ) you take the audio line out from your Fantom into the headphone/line into the computer.
Quote:
And yes, eventually I want to manipulate it from my computer, maybe try to do remixes of songs, but I know I'll have to get a software to that. Any free ones I can try out that you know of?
Reaper, but there's quite a learning curve. There are others Garage Band, Cubase, um, I'm forgetting some. But I don't think they are free.
_________________________
private piano/voice teacher - full time
MTNA member
www.valeoconservatory.com
Petrof 9'2 Concert, Yamaha G3, Roland FP-7, Yamaha MOX6, Kawai MP11

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#2090798 - 05/28/13 04:18 PM Re: Fantom X MIDI [Re: dooger94]
chicolom Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/26/12
Posts: 69
Originally Posted By: dooger94
Initially, I just wanted to take a song recorded on the fantom and transfer it to my computer. Finally, I just sampled the song, finally got my fantom connected via usb cable, and downloaded the sample and unzipped it, which thankfully worked. Is this the easiest way to do this? What if I wanted to edit it on my computer? Also, now that you mention it, is there a way to play my fantom through my computer speakers? I would love that. And yes, eventually I want to manipulate it from my computer, maybe try to do remixes of songs, but I know I'll have to get a software to that. Any free ones I can try out that you know of?


Sampling it to an audio file will work, it will just be baked into a audio file. If you have a song that's mainly piano, you should also be able to save/export the song to a midi file, so it will just keep all the performance data and you will have to play it back via a virtual piano on your computer.

As for transferring a complex song with multiple parts/tracks from the Fantom X and being able to open it up on a sequencer on a computer and edit, that may not be possible. I think all the sequencing you do on a the Fantom is supposed to stay on the fantom, since it's tied to the Fantom's sound engine. You can probably do something with exporting the tracks as midi to work with them on the computer. It would be easier to just do your sequencing on the computer from now on so it's more compatible and not tied to the Fantom's sound engine.

To edit on your computer, you will want some DAW software. Reaper is an example.

I can't remember the name of the software I used, but it was very crude and the only thing I used it for was to turn some piano songs from the fantom into midi files on the computer. You should be able to just save/export to midi directly on the fantom which will save you having to do those extra convert-to-midi steps on the computer.

If you want to play the Fantom's sounds through speakers, it will have to be done by hooking up the analog audio output jacks on the back to your speakers.
_________________________
Kawai MP6 | Ravenscroft 275 | True Keys American & Italian | Galaxy Vintage D, II, & Giant | Old Black Grand | Imperfect Fazioli

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#2092321 - 05/30/13 05:24 PM Re: Fantom X MIDI [Re: chicolom]
dooger94 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/13/13
Posts: 23
Originally Posted By: chicolom



As for transferring a complex song with multiple parts/tracks from the Fantom X and being able to open it up on a sequencer on a computer and edit, that may not be possible. I think all the sequencing you do on a the Fantom is supposed to stay on the fantom, since it's tied to the Fantom's sound engine. You can probably do something with exporting the tracks as midi to work with them on the computer. It would be easier to just do your sequencing on the computer from now on so it's more compatible and not tied to the Fantom's sound engine.

To edit on your computer, you will want some DAW software. Reaper is an example.

I can't remember the name of the software I used, but it was very crude and the only thing I used it for was to turn some piano songs from the fantom into midi files on the computer. You should be able to just save/export to midi directly on the fantom which will save you having to do those extra convert-to-midi steps on the computer.

If you want to play the Fantom's sounds through speakers, it will have to be done by hooking up the analog audio output jacks on the back to your speakers.




Okay, are there any websites you know of that can help me start sequencing on my computer? Like, a guide for a beginner? I'm going to have many questions, and it'll take forever to trial and error, and Google every thing as it comes up.

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#2093072 - 05/31/13 07:31 PM Re: Fantom X MIDI [Re: dooger94]
chicolom Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/26/12
Posts: 69
I don't know if any sites like that unfortunately. I don't do all that much sequencing myself.
_________________________
Kawai MP6 | Ravenscroft 275 | True Keys American & Italian | Galaxy Vintage D, II, & Giant | Old Black Grand | Imperfect Fazioli

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#2093076 - 05/31/13 07:42 PM Re: Fantom X MIDI [Re: dooger94]
toddy Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/30/11
Posts: 1743
Loc: Portugal
Really, the best way with these sorts of programs is to fiddle about with them until you get it working. Chicolom above mentioned Reaper. So you can try this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdO2YvzKLm0
...which is a tutorial for beginners. Also, Reaper has a very large and very active forum: http://forum.cockos.com/forumdisplay.php?f=20

...and of course, there's always the manual if all else fails.

That's just some of the support stuff for Reaper - but Protools, Cakewalk, Logic & Cubase etc must have the same type of support.


Edited by toddy (05/31/13 07:45 PM)
_________________________
Roland HP 302, Yamaha SY85

Reaper / NI Komplete 9 /Kontakt 5// EWQL Sym Choirs/ Sym Orchestra Silver/ MOR2
Mics: SP B1 & MXL V67g/ Alesis MicTube Preamp/ Xenyx302/ Yamaha HS7s .

"Only a fool is fooled" pv88, All Fools' Day 2014.

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