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#2093068 - 05/31/13 07:15 PM Do you see any advantage in this strategy for adults?
pianolover85 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/07/13
Posts: 94
So...I have been searching for a method over the last month to finally start and on the suggestion of my teacher went with the Piano Adventures adult books. there are 2 levels and I am very happy as many on the Faber forum have mentioned how interesting the songs and pedagogical approaches are.

One thing though: I would like to ask you friends and experts here: I have seen scattered posts from teachers on different forums who said they prefer using children-versions of methods instead of their adult versions.

Well to be honest I have some thoughts on this myself too:
Aside from the cheesy child-friendly pictures, child methods are more extensive and more approachable. for example in Piano adventures they have 2 all in one adult books but their children (main) line has 5 levels each with separate and more extensive books on Method, Theory, performance, technique that are extensive and helps children build a solid foundation and better and focused development of technique. This is obviously supplemented with real songs to keep interest.

Do you think there is an advantage of using the 5 level children version of piano adventures with adults instead of the adult books?

I myself have all the piano adventure 5 level books...

Thanks for your replies
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#2093110 - 05/31/13 10:02 PM Re: Do you see any advantage in this strategy for adults? [Re: pianolover85]
PianoStudent88 Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/16/11
Posts: 3181
Loc: Maine
I myself would use the regular series, not the adult series. The regular series has more information and exercises to help develop good technique, and I think this is key. Some other advantages of the regular series are that you get more pieces, and more theory practice pages.

The adult series will move faster on the theory that adults pick things up faster. It also introduces lead sheet playing on the theory that this interests adults.

The adult series does not go as far as the regular series. This is by design, with the plan being that after you get a start, you transition to regular PA. Depending on your mastery of adult PA, you can transition into regular PA 3A, 3B, or 4. (On paper, regular 4 is the next level, but most teachers transition into 3A or 3B to be sure those skills and concepts are reinforced. IMHO adult PA moves too quickly and superficially through the equivalent of regular 3A and 3B).

I enjoy the pictures in children's methods.
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#2093192 - 06/01/13 04:23 AM Re: Do you see any advantage in this strategy for adults? [Re: pianolover85]
keystring Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 11688
Loc: Canada
There is a thought behind the adult books which follows one particular observed trend among adult learners. The idea is that adult students want to learn to play music quickly, not go into too much depth, learn to play the music they already love, don't want to spend years doing it, and don't have the time that younger students are supposed to have. Of course not everyone belonging to the same "age group" (can 20 - 100 really be an age group?) will fit these parameters.

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#2093210 - 06/01/13 06:51 AM Re: Do you see any advantage in this strategy for adults? [Re: pianolover85]
Morodiene Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 11935
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Keystring has a good point. Also, adults learn differently than children do. Concepts come easier for adults and so they don't need to practice those concepts as much as a child does. Bear in mind that method books are not intended to be all-inclusive. Supplemental material like theory books and pieces that reiterate already learned concepts are assumed to be added.
_________________________
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Petrof 9'2 Concert, Yamaha G3, Roland FP-7, Yamaha MOX6, Kawai MP11

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#2093239 - 06/01/13 08:59 AM Re: Do you see any advantage in this strategy for adults? [Re: pianolover85]
keystring Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 11688
Loc: Canada
There is another side to the fact that adults grasp concepts. I hope I can explain. We begin to think abstractly and in the world of ideas in our teens and on into adulthood. Young children go by concrete experience. Mathematical concepts such as volume, "bigger", subtraction come from filling a bucket with building blocks or sand, and playing with things. We don't need to physically pour water into a 4-cup container using a cup to know what that means. We can imagine it, and be certain of our knowledge, and then use it.

To learn music, otoh, we need to experience it. That very ability to form concepts gets in our way. If you read about something - say major and minor chords - you may get this intellectually. In a sense you tell yourself what you should hear, and you don't get to hear it in the raw first hand the way the child does. In a way we will interpret it into what we ought to hear, if we hear it at all. A system that counts on the fast way we grasp concepts may cause us to skim through things which maybe we ought to experience deeply.

Some years ago I was shown that concepts can be grasped by the senses and body first, and then be understood by the mind, when it comes to music. The difference was made was mind-blowing. For myself, I want music to be as direct as possible, and that leads me to whatever is done with kids. I also tend to go that way when I teach.

We also have teachers complaining that adults don't seem to really listen, and I wonder how much this conceptualizing may play a role here too.

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#2093339 - 06/01/13 01:29 PM Re: Do you see any advantage in this strategy for adults? [Re: pianolover85]
PianoStudent88 Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/16/11
Posts: 3181
Loc: Maine
The small sample of Piano Adventures teachers I've talked to who prefer to use something other than regular with their older students (say, 10-13 through adult) prefer PA Accelerated over Adult.

I'm not sure of all the reasons, but one difference is that PA Adult crams in a smattering of 3A and 3B, while Accelerated is very clearly defined to go through 2B only and transition the student into 3A. A forced pace and skimming is not an advantage.
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#2093471 - 06/01/13 04:58 PM Re: Do you see any advantage in this strategy for adults? [Re: pianolover85]
PaperClip Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/21/09
Posts: 522
Loc: Amsterdam, Holland
When I first started, I used a book for children. I got very demotivated and depressed along the way by the children songs. Maybe if you have kids, it might be different for you. I got motivated again by using 'adult' material. Practising children songs every day was for me the same as hearing christmas songs all day long, every day of the year. -.-
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Playing since May 02 2009

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#2093721 - 06/02/13 01:37 AM Re: Do you see any advantage in this strategy for adults? [Re: pianolover85]
mattroilanh_tt Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/27/13
Posts: 66
I think you can try both versions at the same time. Whenever you feel fed up with one version, you can leave it behind and concentrate on the other. After a time, comeback with the first version, it will be too easy that you don't have to practice to play it.

I am self-learning using 3 book: Methode Rose (children method book), Alfred (adult book), Suzuki Piano School (children book). Everything is under control, no messing at all, and no gap.


Edited by mattroilanh_tt (06/02/13 01:39 AM)
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#2093788 - 06/02/13 07:09 AM Re: Do you see any advantage in this strategy for adults? [Re: pianolover85]
landorrano Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/26/06
Posts: 2468
Loc: France
Curious, the word strategy. An army, an enemy, a general ... and Johnny get your gun!

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#2093806 - 06/02/13 08:48 AM Re: Do you see any advantage in this strategy for adults? [Re: landorrano]
keystring Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 11688
Loc: Canada
Originally Posted By: landorrano
Curious, the word strategy. An army, an enemy, a general ... and Johnny get your gun!

Is this the only place that you use strategy? Strategy and approach is used everywhere when trying to reach goals. You yourself, when you repeatedly talk about Solfege and singing - that too is a strategy. In my mind it is not just a thing of war.

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#2094028 - 06/02/13 05:11 PM Re: Do you see any advantage in this strategy for adults? [Re: keystring]
landorrano Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/26/06
Posts: 2468
Loc: France
Originally Posted By: keystring
You yourself, when you repeatedly talk about Solfege and singing - that too is a strategy.


I love it: General Dorémi, at your service !

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#2094054 - 06/02/13 06:20 PM Re: Do you see any advantage in this strategy for adults? [Re: landorrano]
malkin Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/18/09
Posts: 2554
Loc: *sigh* Salt Lake City
Bonjour General Dorémi! *salute*

Alas, the word 'strategy' has lost much of its military connotation, in the US at least. Any vague plan or even a thought of a destination qualifies as a strategy these days.

*biting my tongue regarding any geopolitical implications*
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/strategy

Nevertheless, General Dorémi is a worthy title, as are General Knowledge and Martial Law (and ((perhaps especially)) Private Parts.)
_________________________
A good student is one who makes the teacher feel like a good teacher.

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#2094061 - 06/02/13 06:44 PM Re: Do you see any advantage in this strategy for adults? [Re: pianolover85]
landorrano Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/26/06
Posts: 2468
Loc: France
It seems that General Knowledge got religion and now he's Cardinal Knowledge !

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#2094081 - 06/02/13 07:33 PM Re: Do you see any advantage in this strategy for adults? [Re: landorrano]
malkin Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/18/09
Posts: 2554
Loc: *sigh* Salt Lake City
I suppose he's in the Lord's Army then. I'm sure he's annoyed by any confusion with his distant relation Carnal Knowledge!
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