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#2102365 - 06/14/13 09:17 AM What's in a name?
Almaviva Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/21/13
Posts: 605
Loc: Richmond, Virginia
I've noticed that a number of piano makes include both a given name and a family name on their fallboard logos - "Wilh. Steinberg", for instance. I understand why the name "Wilh." is put on this piano, to distinguish it from the "Gerh. Steinberg" line of pianos once made by Yantai Perzina. Also, that is (was) the name of the company - Wilh. Steinberg Pianofortefabrik.

However, one doesn't see "Julius Bluthner" or "Carl Sauter" stenciled on Bluthner or Sauter piano fallboards, respectively. I suppose that since there are no other Bluthner or Sauter piano companies out there, they don't bother with the given name in the logo.

Then how does one explain "August Forster" and "Charles R. Walter"? I'm not aware of other piano companies that use the Forster or Walter surnames, so why use the given names in the fallboard logos?

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#2102373 - 06/14/13 09:24 AM Re: What's in a name? [Re: Almaviva]
malkin Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/18/09
Posts: 2610
Loc: *sigh* Salt Lake City
Marketing.
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#2102379 - 06/14/13 09:31 AM Re: What's in a name? [Re: Almaviva]
Minnesota Marty Offline

Platinum Supporter until October 5 2014


Registered: 05/15/12
Posts: 7439
Loc: Rochester MN
Ego?
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Marty in Minnesota

It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.

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#2102385 - 06/14/13 09:36 AM Re: What's in a name? [Re: Almaviva]
BrainCramp Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/09/12
Posts: 259
Loc: USA
It might be the legal name of the corporation.

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#2102387 - 06/14/13 09:38 AM Re: What's in a name? [Re: Almaviva]
Steve Cohen Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 10490
Loc: Maryland/DC/No. VA
There is ample history of both approaches going back for well over 100 years.

It is simply a choice.
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My postings, unless stated otherwise, are my personal opinions, not those of my clients.

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#2102442 - 06/14/13 11:46 AM Re: What's in a name? [Re: Almaviva]
Supply Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/11/06
Posts: 3919
Loc: Vancouver Island, BC, Canada
Steve is spot on.
I would also like to point out that there is apparently a lot of misunderstanding about what a logo is. The logo is a graphic of a trademark or symbol designed for easy brand recognition. The name of the brand on the fallboard is almost never its logo, although sometimes the logo will appear along with the name e.g. on Steinways. Companies will change the fonts of the fallboard name over time. Again, nothing to do with the logo. Go to the websites of different companies to see three different things:
1) the actual company name,
2) the name used on the fallboard,
3) the company logo.

PS: Just to clarify: you won't find a Blüthner or Sauter or any other German piano with anything "stenciled" onto the fallboard. This method of applying the name is reserved for the cheapest of instruments. On German pianos the names are made of inlaid brass.
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#2102458 - 06/14/13 12:17 PM Re: What's in a name? [Re: Almaviva]
Minnesota Marty Offline

Platinum Supporter until October 5 2014


Registered: 05/15/12
Posts: 7439
Loc: Rochester MN
Actually Jurgen, I don't know of any company which stencils its name on a fallboard. They are applied by means of a decal.
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Marty in Minnesota

It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.

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#2102508 - 06/14/13 01:56 PM Re: What's in a name? [Re: Almaviva]
Supply Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/11/06
Posts: 3919
Loc: Vancouver Island, BC, Canada
I have possibly seen more pianos than you have. Or maybe more bad, cheap pianos....
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Piano Forte Supply
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#2102514 - 06/14/13 02:06 PM Re: What's in a name? [Re: Almaviva]
Minnesota Marty Offline

Platinum Supporter until October 5 2014


Registered: 05/15/12
Posts: 7439
Loc: Rochester MN
A stencil and paint? That's a new one on me. I've seen people try to write a bogus name on a fallboard using a paint pen, however. Just ask Rickster!
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Marty in Minnesota

It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.

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#2102542 - 06/14/13 02:58 PM Re: What's in a name? [Re: Almaviva]
PianoWorksATL Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/19/09
Posts: 2726
Loc: Atlanta, GA
Currently, only a few named brands have names similar enough to be confused, but historically, there has been a lot of confusion and some of it intentional.

August Förster, while a very old brand, isn't the oldest German maker to carry the name "Förster" as listed in the Piano Atlas. There are at least 4 other brands that predate Charles R. Walter that use the name "Walter." Those other companies did not survive, but that is the history.

So, in a sense, it is marketing, but it is largely practical.
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#2102555 - 06/14/13 03:46 PM Re: What's in a name? [Re: PianoWorksATL]
terminaldegree Online   content
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/03/06
Posts: 2729
Loc: western Wisconsin
Originally Posted By: PianoWorksATL
Currently, only a few named brands have names similar enough to be confused, but historically, there has been a lot of confusion and some of it intentional.


The Bosite and Steinlager names come to mind...
What are some of the other ones? This could be fun!
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#2102557 - 06/14/13 03:49 PM Re: What's in a name? [Re: Almaviva]
Frankni Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/12/13
Posts: 160
Loc: UK
Originally Posted By: Almaviva
I've noticed that a number of piano makes include both a given name and a family name on their fallboard logos - "Wilh. Steinberg", for instance. I understand why the name "Wilh." is put on this piano, to distinguish it from the "Gerh. Steinberg" line of pianos once made by Yantai Perzina. Also, that is (was) the name of the company - Wilh. Steinberg Pianofortefabrik.

However, one doesn't see "Julius Bluthner" or "Carl Sauter" stenciled on Bluthner or Sauter piano fallboards, respectively. I suppose that since there are no other Bluthner or Sauter piano companies out there, they don't bother with the given name in the logo.

Then how does one explain "August Forster" and "Charles R. Walter"? I'm not aware of other piano companies that use the Forster or Walter surnames, so why use the given names in the fallboard logos?


The most interesting fact re. initials I find the distinction between Bechstein and C. Bechstein, which seems to translate into a price difference of at least 10,000 (in whatever currency you like). A very expensive "C" in my mind.


Edited by Frankni (06/14/13 03:53 PM)
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Yamaha C3, Sauter Delta 185

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#2102863 - 06/15/13 11:21 AM Re: What's in a name? [Re: Supply]
Del Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/04/03
Posts: 5316
Loc: Olympia, Washington
Originally Posted By: Supply
PS: Just to clarify: you won't find a Blüthner or Sauter or any other German piano with anything "stenciled" onto the fallboard. This method of applying the name is reserved for the cheapest of instruments. On German pianos the names are made of inlaid brass.

They used to be "inlaid." Nowadays they are most likely made of adhesive-backed thin brass lettering that is applied to the keycover before the last coats of polyester are applied. Then the polyester is sanded back until the brass lettering is exposed. Looks "inlaid" but is a whole lot easier to apply.

ddf
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Stupidity is a rare condition, ignorance is a common choice. --Anon

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#2103068 - 06/15/13 09:32 PM Re: What's in a name? [Re: Almaviva]
Supply Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/11/06
Posts: 3919
Loc: Vancouver Island, BC, Canada
I am aware of that. Those brass letters are essentially inlaid into the think polyester.
_________________________
Jurgen Goering
Piano Forte Supply
www.pianofortesupply.com

Piattino Caster Cups distributor

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#2103075 - 06/15/13 09:49 PM Re: What's in a name? [Re: Supply]
Minnesota Marty Offline

Platinum Supporter until October 5 2014


Registered: 05/15/12
Posts: 7439
Loc: Rochester MN
Originally Posted By: Supply
I am aware of that. Those brass letters are essentially inlaid into the think polyester.

That's one of the best covers I've ever heard. (all puns intended!)
_________________________
Marty in Minnesota

It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.

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#2103141 - 06/16/13 01:36 AM Re: What's in a name? [Re: Almaviva]
Supply Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/11/06
Posts: 3919
Loc: Vancouver Island, BC, Canada
Hey come on Marty! Give a guy a few minutes to correct the typos next time! thumb

thick .... think
close but no cigar?
_________________________
Jurgen Goering
Piano Forte Supply
www.pianofortesupply.com

Piattino Caster Cups distributor

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#2103242 - 06/16/13 10:14 AM Re: What's in a name? [Re: Almaviva]
malkin Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/18/09
Posts: 2610
Loc: *sigh* Salt Lake City
Perhaps it a variation of Professor Harold Hill's 'Think System.'
_________________________
A good student is one who makes the teacher feel like a good teacher.

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#2103254 - 06/16/13 10:36 AM Re: What's in a name? [Re: Almaviva]
Minnesota Marty Offline

Platinum Supporter until October 5 2014


Registered: 05/15/12
Posts: 7439
Loc: Rochester MN
According to his writings, Professor Hill maintained that thick polyphony led to the development of think polyester. It becomes naturally inlaid in the mind and on the fallboard.

(Jurgen - this is just too good!)
_________________________
Marty in Minnesota

It's much easier to bash a Steinway than it is to play one.

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#2103265 - 06/16/13 11:03 AM Re: What's in a name? [Re: Almaviva]
Bob Newbie Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/02/06
Posts: 1549
When I see the name Weber, I think of barbecue grills, not pianos smile

same goes for Yamaha, 30 yrs. ago when someone mentioned Yamaha, first thing that came to mind was motorcycles, not pianos..


Edited by Bob Newbie (06/16/13 11:08 AM)

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