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#2103308 - 06/16/13 12:34 PM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: Info2011]
InQuiet Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 06/15/13
Posts: 1
Greetings,

I've been researching some of the new Kawai DP models, with the intention to upgrade my cn 290. I really like the features of the ES7, but I'm becoming apprehensive about ordering one online considering the QC issues I've been reading about. Any recent purchasers care to share their opinions or stories regarding an ES7?
Thanks!


Edited by InQuiet (06/16/13 12:36 PM)

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#2104429 - 06/18/13 02:17 PM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: InQuiet]
NYRfan Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 05/24/13
Posts: 10
Loc: Ohio
I just got third unit, but it was damaged by delivery company (CEVA)... I'll post some pictures soon.

EDIT:

pics

https://plus.google.com/photos/107707066...=CN6dg4iIkbqxcQ


Edited by NYRfan (06/18/13 02:25 PM)
_________________________
Kawai es7, Scandalli Polifonico

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#2104450 - 06/18/13 03:11 PM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: NYRfan]
spanishbuddha Online   content
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/08/09
Posts: 2240
Loc: UK
Originally Posted By: NYRfan
I just got third unit, but it was damaged by delivery company (CEVA)... I'll post some pictures soon.

EDIT:

pics

https://plus.google.com/photos/107707066...=CN6dg4iIkbqxcQ

Oh that's bad luck. I suppose the keybed is perfect though? Another exchange....?

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#2104457 - 06/18/13 03:27 PM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: spanishbuddha]
NYRfan Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 05/24/13
Posts: 10
Loc: Ohio
Keybed isn't damaged. I'm waiting for response from my dealer. I really don't want to have a 2000$ piano with a huge bend on the back.
_________________________
Kawai es7, Scandalli Polifonico

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#2104486 - 06/18/13 04:20 PM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: NYRfan]
Marko in Boston Online   content
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/30/12
Posts: 605
Loc: Boston, Massachusetts
Originally Posted By: NYRfan
Keybed isn't damaged. I'm waiting for response from my dealer. I really don't want to have a 2000$ piano with a huge bend on the back.


Not only that, but there are some delicate electronics In DPs. Very well could be more damage than cosmetics. Not so uncommon hearing about shipping damage in this forum.

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#2104529 - 06/18/13 05:16 PM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: NYRfan]
Kawai James Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 8416
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Originally Posted By: NYRfan
I just got third unit, but it was damaged by delivery company (CEVA)... I'll post some pictures soon.

EDIT:

pics

https://plus.google.com/photos/107707066...=CN6dg4iIkbqxcQ


Ouch, that looks nasty. Fingers crossed the replacement is delivered with a little more care.

James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#2104629 - 06/18/13 08:25 PM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: InQuiet]
NYRfan Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 05/24/13
Posts: 10
Loc: Ohio
Originally Posted By: InQuiet
Greetings,

I've been researching some of the new Kawai DP models, with the intention to upgrade my cn 290. I really like the features of the ES7, but I'm becoming apprehensive about ordering one online considering the QC issues I've been reading about. Any recent purchasers care to share their opinions or stories regarding an ES7?
Thanks!


ES7 is an awesome DP. I really love it, even despite some problems with first two units (third one was perfect). If you are hesitant about buying online, send me PM and I can give you name of the store where I bought mine. They'll deal with any problem you have with your DP and ship you a replacement or fix it if needed.
_________________________
Kawai es7, Scandalli Polifonico

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#2104656 - 06/18/13 10:30 PM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: Info2011]
dmd Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/15/09
Posts: 1689
Loc: Pennsylvania
I have had my ES7 for a couple of months now and it is the best DP I have owned. It has a very nice tone and the keybed is great. I recently had one of the keys periodically not sounding a tone when pressed. I called KawaiUS tech support and they are working with a nearby technician to come and service it for me.
_________________________
Don

My current system: Kawai ES7 + Focal CMS40 Powered Monitors, SennHeiser HD555 Phones, Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 audio interface, Mackie ProFX8 Mixer, Ravenscroft275, True Keys American Grand, Ivory II American Concert D, Steinway Basic, Galaxy Vintage D, True Pianos, Pianoteq, Alicia's Keys

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#2104759 - 06/19/13 06:57 AM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: Info2011]
mabraman Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/24/12
Posts: 304
Loc: Valencia, Spain
...so,did the other DPs, you had before, break even sooner than this one? smile

I started playing last September, on a 80's Yamaha (pf-80) that had been treated really bad (it served as a goalpost in football beach games, among other stories including liquids).
Keybed was almost in perfect condition, just the speakers were broken (bad contacts, a very cheap repairing btw).
Perhaps this reliability allows Yamaha to not develope its sound as much as others, and still keep at the forefront.
Kawais have a nicer emulation of a real piano for a given price, but...do they last as much as others?

Mine works well, so far (6 months)
_________________________
Learning piano from scratch since September, 2012.
Kawai ES7.

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#2105204 - 06/20/13 04:29 AM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: Marko in Boston]
justpin Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/25/12
Posts: 504
Loc: Holmes Chapel
Quote:
Outstanding service Kawai James. This just another reason why Im so happy i bought Kawai and will for as long as possible. You certainly do not see Roland and Yamaha personally jumping in to make things right when someone needs help on the forum. Service is so important when you purchase such intricate and expensive electronics such as a digital piano. You really need the company to stand behind and support it's products. Well done Kawai.



Heh I may go drop my CV in at Roland.... I'm considering moving back home in 2014 and Hamamatsu on paper at least is not so far away..... esp as I've read a lot of people state that Roland manuals are crap. Wait you do understand what I write yes?

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#2105209 - 06/20/13 04:58 AM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: Info2011]
Kawai James Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 8416
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Where is 'home' for you justpin?
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#2105220 - 06/20/13 06:17 AM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: Info2011]
justpin Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/25/12
Posts: 504
Loc: Holmes Chapel
Now you mention it I'm not entirely sure...

My father is from Mie though but we don't talk much these days..... tbh I think I'm just waffling because of the awful state of the UK job market...



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aFZKlfRrGbw

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#2105223 - 06/20/13 06:29 AM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: Info2011]
Kawai James Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 8416
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Ah, my sister and I used to love that show.

Our dog was called Hobo too, btw.

James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#2107211 - 06/24/13 01:30 PM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: Kawai James]
NYRfan Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 05/24/13
Posts: 10
Loc: Ohio
Hey guys, you probably won't believe it, but the third piano (the one damaged by delivery company) has a noisy key, and this time looks like it's more serious than just a little unwanted noise. Also I don't think it has anything to do with damage caused by delivery company.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_RNhJb-cBFg
_________________________
Kawai es7, Scandalli Polifonico

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#2107212 - 06/24/13 01:33 PM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: Info2011]
justpin Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/25/12
Posts: 504
Loc: Holmes Chapel
Maybe somebody is telling you that the ES7 isn't the piano your looking for.

/Jedi mind trick

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#2107222 - 06/24/13 01:57 PM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: justpin]
NYRfan Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 05/24/13
Posts: 10
Loc: Ohio
It's more like Kawai is trying to tell everybody not to buy their stuff. I love the feel and sound of that piano, but that might not be enough if another unit has any of those problems.
_________________________
Kawai es7, Scandalli Polifonico

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#2107252 - 06/24/13 02:43 PM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: Info2011]
justpin Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/25/12
Posts: 504
Loc: Holmes Chapel
I dunno, as part of this forum for a year and a bit, I've noticed all the manufactures seem to have issues with quality control.

However it is making me think should I bother with the ES7 now.

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#2114826 - 07/08/13 06:12 PM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: Info2011]
shepdave Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/31/10
Posts: 42
Loc: Vienna, VA
(Resurrecting this thread, because...)

I have been playing my ES7 for a little over a week now, and I'm loving the feel and touch. However, there is one key, sure enough, that seems to shout somewhat more loudly than the rest. (My loud key is Bb3, I think--an octave plus a whole step below middle C.)

The problem seems to be present in all the various piano versions. I haven't really checked in the non-piano instruments, since all I'm doing is playing piano. I'll give it about another week just to make sure it doesn't have anything to do with my touch, but I don't think it does. The note jumps out no matter with which hand I play it, or with which finger in a scale-wise pattern or other sequence.

If the problem is still noticeable after I spend another week getting used to playing it, I'll call the dealer where I bought it. (I got it from a local Kawai dealer in the area.)

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#2114921 - 07/08/13 10:53 PM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: shepdave]
dmd Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/15/09
Posts: 1689
Loc: Pennsylvania
It won't go away. I have experienced the same thing and had to have it serviced. I now am noticing it with another key. Apparently, there is some sort of systemic issue with that. I am not entirely sure that this type of thing is not inherent in most digital keyboards.
_________________________
Don

My current system: Kawai ES7 + Focal CMS40 Powered Monitors, SennHeiser HD555 Phones, Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 audio interface, Mackie ProFX8 Mixer, Ravenscroft275, True Keys American Grand, Ivory II American Concert D, Steinway Basic, Galaxy Vintage D, True Pianos, Pianoteq, Alicia's Keys

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#2114923 - 07/08/13 11:05 PM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: dmd]
shepdave Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/31/10
Posts: 42
Loc: Vienna, VA
Originally Posted By: dmd
It won't go away. I have experienced the same thing and had to have it serviced. I now am noticing it with another key. Apparently, there is some sort of systemic issue with that. I am not entirely sure that this type of thing is not inherent in most digital keyboards.

I wondered about that. After I wrote that post I went over and tested it. I just did a 5-finger exercise with a G minor chord, with that Bb in the middle, using both hands. I tested all the piano sounds, and that Bb was always louder. But only when I'm striking it fairly firmly. When I'm playing the piano...uh, piano...then I don't really notice it.

I tested all other instrument voices as well. It shows up in all the pianos, but in none of the other instruments.

Maybe it's just one of those things that makes you go, "Hmmmmm..."

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#2115027 - 07/09/13 05:23 AM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: shepdave]
Marko in Boston Online   content
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/30/12
Posts: 605
Loc: Boston, Massachusetts
Originally Posted By: shepdave

I tested all other instrument voices as well. It shows up in all the pianos, but in none of the other instruments.


I just ran all my keys and do not have any particular loud key. But interesting you say it shows up only in pianos. Makes me believe that it is software rather than hardware. Maybe next software update can possibly correct it. (I assume you guys are on current v1.13)

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#2115051 - 07/09/13 07:18 AM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: shepdave]
dmd Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/15/09
Posts: 1689
Loc: Pennsylvania
Originally Posted By: shepdave
I wondered about that. After I wrote that post I went over and tested it. I just did a 5-finger exercise with a G minor chord, with that Bb in the middle, using both hands. I tested all the piano sounds, and that Bb was always louder. But only when I'm striking it fairly firmly. When I'm playing the piano...uh, piano...then I don't really notice it.

I tested all other instrument voices as well. It shows up in all the pianos, but in none of the other instruments.

Maybe it's just one of those things that makes you go, "Hmmmmm..."


You have described it perfectly. It does not happen when you strike the key lightly.
_________________________
Don

My current system: Kawai ES7 + Focal CMS40 Powered Monitors, SennHeiser HD555 Phones, Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 audio interface, Mackie ProFX8 Mixer, Ravenscroft275, True Keys American Grand, Ivory II American Concert D, Steinway Basic, Galaxy Vintage D, True Pianos, Pianoteq, Alicia's Keys

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#2115053 - 07/09/13 07:21 AM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: Marko in Boston]
dmd Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/15/09
Posts: 1689
Loc: Pennsylvania
Originally Posted By: Marko in Boston
Originally Posted By: shepdave

I tested all other instrument voices as well. It shows up in all the pianos, but in none of the other instruments.


I just ran all my keys and do not have any particular loud key. But interesting you say it shows up only in pianos. Makes me believe that it is software rather than hardware. Maybe next software update can possibly correct it. (I assume you guys are on current v1.13)


I have had it corrected with a service call and it is a hardware problem. There are some pads which have sensors on them which are located beneath the keys. They needed to be replaced for the area of the problem.
_________________________
Don

My current system: Kawai ES7 + Focal CMS40 Powered Monitors, SennHeiser HD555 Phones, Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 audio interface, Mackie ProFX8 Mixer, Ravenscroft275, True Keys American Grand, Ivory II American Concert D, Steinway Basic, Galaxy Vintage D, True Pianos, Pianoteq, Alicia's Keys

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#2143479 - 09/03/13 02:33 PM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: Info2011]
Info2011 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/13/11
Posts: 35
Just to close out on the original topic posted by me - I did finally get resolution from Kawai (I think in no small part thanks to KJ).

As of about 3 weeks ago, I received my original unit (with the one key which needed fixing having been repaired). And it indeed does have a better feeling action than the second unit which had replaced it. (Not exactly heavier, but much better feel, with less bottoming out).

So, just wanted to close this out - thanks.

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#2236246 - 02/23/14 07:02 AM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: Info2011]
musicman100 Online   content
Full Member

Registered: 06/28/07
Posts: 68
Loc: North east .UK
Hi,

Some else seems to have a problem with an es7

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KiqEfBsnZQE

And looking at the comment Kawai has repaired it and says there is no problem.

What experience have UK or Europe kawai users have of getting problems sorted?

I was just about to but a ES7 but now i am so sure!!!

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#2236469 - 02/23/14 05:30 PM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: Info2011]
Rapmaninov Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 09/20/13
Posts: 8
My ES7 also had a loud key (E4, the E above middle C). It was playing the louder, harsher classical piano sample than its neighboring keys when I played softly and stuck out like a sore thumb. I hooked it up to my computer and measured the midi attack velocity, which was about 15 to 20 points higher than its neighbours for the same pressure, so I knew I wasn't imagining it. My dealer contacted a service company which came and fixed it at no cost under warranty.

The serviceman opened it up and rubbed the three sensors of the E4 key with a cotton bud dipped in methylated spirits, which did the trick. He said the E4 key, being in the middle of the keyboard, is right on the edge of the two circuit boards on which the sensors are mounted, and sometimes dust can get in there. He said all it takes is a speck of dust on a sensor to throw the loudness out.

I saw the sensors. They look just like buttons from a tv remote if you've ever seen inside: a carbon pad in a silicon rubber housing which presses down onto a circuit board of not-quite-touching tracks to close the connection. 3 of them per note, with a short, medium and long button stem so they close in rapid succession when the note is played, and the electronics measure the time between them to calculate velocity. A speck of dust makes the switch close sooner than it should and the note sounds louder.

I was impressed at the simplicity of the sensor system, considering how expressive the instrument is. And by Kawai's warranty service. I had the last white ES7 in the country so was glad not to have to wait for another to ship from Indonesia. When the warranty is expired I think I could clean the sensors myself. The hardest part is getting to them.

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#2236657 - 02/24/14 05:57 AM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: Info2011]
mabraman Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/24/12
Posts: 304
Loc: Valencia, Spain
Man, you've made my day.
Dmd had already got his ES7 serviced on the same issue, but what you are referring to, now, is the exact thing I've been talking about for one year!
So...I'll take mine to boxes. Wish it won't take too much time to get repaired.
Just two thoughts:
1.-it's perhaps not a matter of dust. I recall having found the same issue on a demo model, out of the box.
2.-It only happens in Concert Grand 1.

Damm! It looked so promisory...
_________________________
Learning piano from scratch since September, 2012.
Kawai ES7.

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#2237167 - 02/25/14 12:36 AM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: InQuiet]
FrankDaddy Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/24/10
Posts: 67
Loc: Louisiana, US
I bought one from a music store going out of business in Monroe, LA USA in the last 45 days. I just checked my keys. None make any odd noises like rubbing or bumping. The tone is even across the keyboard. No loud keys. I did upgrade to the latest software. So i am very happy with the DP. By the way Kawai James is one of the reasons I own 3 Kawai DPs. I can always find answers here with any questions about my units. By the way none of my 3 units (knock on wood) have ever been in the Shop. I play at church in both a traditional and Praise and Worship service. I also play in a Christian band and travel around town with my gear. So safe to say I have had a very positive experience with all of my purchases.

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#2237226 - 02/25/14 04:52 AM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: Info2011]
mabraman Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/24/12
Posts: 304
Loc: Valencia, Spain
Given your background, it must be God's protection.:)
_________________________
Learning piano from scratch since September, 2012.
Kawai ES7.

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#2246838 - 03/15/14 05:55 AM Re: Kawai ES7 Action/Feel [Re: mabraman]
Rapmaninov Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 09/20/13
Posts: 8
Originally Posted By: mabraman
Man, you've made my day.
Just two thoughts:
1.-it's perhaps not a matter of dust. I recall having found the same issue on a demo model, out of the box.
2.-It only happens in Concert Grand 1.

Hi mabraham, sorry for the delay. Glad to help. I hope you've had it fixed.

My ES7 had the loud key straight out of the box, brand new. I don't know if it was dust or a little unevenness or a flake of carbon breaking off the pad inside the sensor.

Also, while the note stuck out like a sore thumb to me, it was possibly more subtle to the quality assurance tester in the factory. I guess it was most pronounced in Concert Grand because in the moderately soft range I usually play the sound sample the ES7 chooses for Concert Grand is just short of the louder/harsher sample set, and the faulty key was sending a velocity number just high enough to go over the threshold and sound harsh.

The other instruments perhaps have fewer layers of samples than the flagship Concert Grand, so the loud key merely played the same sample a little bit louder, which is not as noticeable.

I would hope the factory testers would know this and do their testing with Concert Grand.

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