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#2109005 - 06/27/13 10:59 AM Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever?
pianoloverus Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 19838
Loc: New York City
Some examples of why I think he is:

I Loves You Porgy
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NwParjhWa00

Be My Love
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iENQgr0l2Qw

Old Man River
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIUIuCrPGVg

My Wild Irish Rose
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PxCea54SGZY&feature=related

Shenandoah
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hx2quk1g8p8

Somewhere Over The Rainbow
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VultD5pIbd8

Any other pianists you prefer for ballads? All the scores except the second available for free online.

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Piano & Music Accessories
#2109047 - 06/27/13 12:17 PM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: pianoloverus]
Dfrankjazz Online   content
Full Member

Registered: 03/03/13
Posts: 189
Loc: NYC
I think he's the greatest pianist in every genre, ever. The greatest pianist who EVER lived.

Dave Frank

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#2109077 - 06/27/13 01:15 PM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: Dfrankjazz]
36251 Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/12/10
Posts: 787
Originally Posted By: Dfrank
I think he's the greatest pianist in every genre, ever. The greatest pianist who EVER lived.

Dave Frank
Everyone entitled to their opinion, even great players like yourself.
_________________________
AG N2, CP4, GK MK & MP

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#2109084 - 06/27/13 01:26 PM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: Dfrankjazz]
jjo Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 672
Loc: Chicago
A lot of (digital)ink is spilled on Jarrett's fully improvised solo concerts, likely because they are so unique. While those performances are wonderful, I think his renditions of these standards are equally extraordinary. They are particularly notable as an example of the perfection of "touch," something that classical pianists work night and day on but is not emphasized as much in jazz.

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#2109140 - 06/27/13 03:10 PM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: pianoloverus]
phacke Offline

Gold Supporter until November 11 2014


Registered: 10/18/12
Posts: 664
Loc: CO, USA
Pretty much whatever Keith Jarrett touches turns to gold. I count him as my #1 inspiration in various ways, musically (outside of my mom who introduced me to music and piano in the first place!). Thanks for posting these clips that I was not aware of.

Best wishes-
_________________________
phacke

Steinway YM (1933)
...Working on:
J. S. Bach, Sonata No. 1 in B minor (BWV 1014) duet with violin
F. Chopin, Prelude 28 (15)

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#2109291 - 06/27/13 08:37 PM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: pianoloverus]
Music Me Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/23/12
Posts: 246
Loc: New York
Again, I agree: Everyone is entitled to their opinion. For me, the greatest Jazz Pianist/Composer who EVER lived was Bill Evans. He is my inspiration.
_________________________
Barbara
...without music, no life...

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#2109471 - 06/28/13 05:17 AM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: pianoloverus]
Seasider53 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 06/11/13
Posts: 5
Loc: Lancashire, UK
Thank you for posting those beautiful examples of Keith's work.

I heard Bill Evans before I heard Keith, so I am kinda imprinted on Bill, much in the same way that a newly-hatched goose will follow the first thing it sees!

They are different and depending on my mood I wll listen to one in preference to the other. IMO Bill is cooler and purer, Keith is warmer and more emotional. I can't choose!

Vive la difference!
_________________________
You can teach an old dog new tricks!
Yamaha PSR-S650 as midi controller
Roland FP 80

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#2109624 - 06/28/13 11:57 AM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: pianoloverus]
Sir Lurksalot Online   content
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/19/04
Posts: 1259
That Old Man River video is a favorite of mine. Love the brief fugue-ish part.

Certainly one of the greatest, and my favorite pianist. But of course there will never be a definitive ranking system.

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#2109709 - 06/28/13 01:51 PM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: pianoloverus]
jazztpt Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/18/10
Posts: 348
Bill or Keith, impossible to say who is better but I doubt there would be many arguments about them being two of the greatest. At the end of the day its all down to personal preference, I prefer X so he is the greatest. I suspect some Oscar Peterson fans might think he is the best.
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Piano Recordings

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#2109772 - 06/28/13 04:10 PM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: jazztpt]
Sir Lurksalot Online   content
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/19/04
Posts: 1259
Originally Posted By: jazztpt
I suspect some Oscar Peterson fans might think he is the best.


Though I don't think he's identified with ballads as closely as Bill or Keith.

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#2110018 - 06/29/13 01:30 AM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: Dfrankjazz]
laguna_greg Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/02/13
Posts: 1505
Loc: guess where in CA and WA
Originally Posted By: Dfrank
I think he's the greatest pianist in every genre, ever. The greatest pianist who EVER lived.

Dave Frank


I guess you never heard any recordings of Joseph Hoffmann! Or Jo Lehvinne (or his wife)? Or Arthur Rubinstein!?!?!

And don't tell me I can't post that classical junk here! This thread has already been posted in the "classical" forum (to very poor effect), whatever that is!!!

If you're going to bring it up, you deserve the comparison...


Edited by laguna_greg (06/29/13 01:34 AM)
_________________________
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1919 Mason & Hamlin AA
1931 Bechstein C - now sold
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dorothy_Taubman (a recent article I wrote about one of my teachers)

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#2110117 - 06/29/13 09:47 AM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: laguna_greg]
Dfrankjazz Online   content
Full Member

Registered: 03/03/13
Posts: 189
Loc: NYC
It's because what Keith is doing when he plays that it is my opinion that he's the greatest pianist ever. The great classical pianists (Richter is my fav) like the ones you mentioned are unbelievable in their keyboard mastery, expression, technique, nuance and emotive power. These geniuses are superhuman lights to the world absolutely.

It just so happens that Keith IS IMPROVISING THE MUSIC from 0 when he plays. What is is doing is inconceivable from a human point of view -he is able to hear and transmit multi-dimensional perfectly controlled and nuanced superhuman music, and when he sits down to play he has no idea what is coming next.

Can you believe that? I cannot. I've spent my whole life in music, as I'm sure most of us have, and there is NOBODY, ever, that is even in the same universe as him.

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#2110211 - 06/29/13 02:52 PM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: laguna_greg]
Seasider53 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 06/11/13
Posts: 5
Loc: Lancashire, UK
Originally Posted By: laguna_greg
Originally Posted By: Dfrank
I think he's the greatest pianist in every genre, ever. The greatest pianist who EVER lived.

Dave Frank


I guess you never heard any recordings of Joseph Hoffmann! Or Jo Lehvinne (or his wife)? Or Arthur Rubinstein!?!?!

And don't tell me I can't post that classical junk here! This thread has already been posted in the "classical" forum (to very poor effect), whatever that is!!!

If you're going to bring it up, you deserve the comparison...


The OP was talking about Ballads, and he gave several links to show the type of music he meant.

Did Rubenstein and Hoffman play Ballads of this type? If so, I would like to hear them.
_________________________
You can teach an old dog new tricks!
Yamaha PSR-S650 as midi controller
Roland FP 80

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#2110237 - 06/29/13 03:39 PM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: pianoloverus]
knotty Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/01/07
Posts: 3001
Loc: Bethesda, MD (Washington D.C)
Dave,
Did you ever have a job that didn't involve piano?

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#2110266 - 06/29/13 04:45 PM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: pianoloverus]
Dfrankjazz Online   content
Full Member

Registered: 03/03/13
Posts: 189
Loc: NYC
For 9 months I sold stereos out of the back of my van when I was 25.

DF

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#2110320 - 06/29/13 07:46 PM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: Dfrankjazz]
daviel Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/14/07
Posts: 933
Loc: Waxahachie, Texas
Originally Posted By: Dfrank

It just so happens that Keith IS IMPROVISING THE MUSIC from 0 when he plays. What is is doing is inconceivable from a human point of view -he is able to hear and transmit multi-dimensional perfectly controlled and nuanced superhuman music, and when he sits down to play he has no idea what is coming next.


Very well put. The elegant music he creates is wonderful


Edited by daviel (06/29/13 07:46 PM)
Edit Reason: spelling
_________________________
"She loves to limbo, that much is clear. She's got the right dynamic for the New Frontier"
http://roadhouseallstars.com/

David Loving, Waxahachie, Texas

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#2110325 - 06/29/13 08:07 PM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: Dfrankjazz]
Mwm Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/20/13
Posts: 752
Originally Posted By: Dfrank
It's because what Keith is doing when he plays that it is my opinion that he's the greatest pianist ever. The great classical pianists (Richter is my fav) like the ones you mentioned are unbelievable in their keyboard mastery, expression, technique, nuance and emotive power. These geniuses are superhuman lights to the world absolutely.

It just so happens that Keith IS IMPROVISING THE MUSIC from 0 when he plays. What is is doing is inconceivable from a human point of view -he is able to hear and transmit multi-dimensional perfectly controlled and nuanced superhuman music, and when he sits down to play he has no idea what is coming next.

Can you believe that? I cannot. I've spent my whole life in music, as I'm sure most of us have, and there is NOBODY, ever, that is even in the same universe as him.

What Keith does was considered an ordinary, not extraordinary requirement of classical musicians in times past.

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#2110327 - 06/29/13 08:12 PM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: pianoloverus]
Dfrankjazz Online   content
Full Member

Registered: 03/03/13
Posts: 189
Loc: NYC
who knows what they did? It died out, most likely because most improvisers weren't doing anything as good as they composers were composing..Of course I'd give anything to hear Bach and Lizst turn it loose!

DF

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#2110328 - 06/29/13 08:19 PM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: Dfrankjazz]
Mwm Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/20/13
Posts: 752
Originally Posted By: Dfrank
who knows what they did? It died out, most likely because most improvisers weren't doing anything as good as they composers were composing..Of course I'd give anything to hear Bach and Lizst turn it loose!

DF

Improvisation as an art in classical music still exists. Period keyboardists read from figured bass and fill in the harmonies and lines as they see fit. Organists still compete in improvisation. While dying, it is not a dead art eft to jazz musicians.

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#2110412 - 06/30/13 12:35 AM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: pianoloverus]
etcetra Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/25/08
Posts: 1446
For me discussions like this is just pointless. I can't think of a single pianist who are regarded as a "master" on both genres. There have been classical musicians who have been competent, and even good, but none of them really are regarded in the same ranks as the likes of Keith Jarret, Oscar Peterson... etc., and vice versa.

I can pick any other musical subgenre. Comparing Chucho Valdes to Keith Jarret is just as pointless. They are require different skills set and attention to different aspects of music, and if you judge every music by one rigid criteria, you are going to miss out on wide range of experiences that music can really offer. In other words, I use different ears when I listen to Rubenstein, Keith Jarret, Chucho Valdes, Cecil Taylor, Ethan Iverson or Stevie Wonder. Not being a snob about one type of music really opened my ears to new things, including hip hop(believe it or not, it takes a real talent and craftsmanship to do whats someone like J Dilla does on his records).

Keith Jarret is one of my favorite pianists, but then again I love listening to so many different pianists, and they all have different things to offer. I'd rather not think of music as a contest in general.


Edited by etcetra (06/30/13 12:46 AM)

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#2110651 - 06/30/13 02:40 PM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: etcetra]
Mwm Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/20/13
Posts: 752
Originally Posted By: etcetra
For me discussions like this is just pointless. I can't think of a single pianist who are regarded as a "master" on both genres. There have been classical musicians who have been competent, and even good, but none of them really are regarded in the same ranks as the likes of Keith Jarret, Oscar Peterson... etc., and vice versa.

I can pick any other musical subgenre. Comparing Chucho Valdes to Keith Jarret is just as pointless. They are require different skills set and attention to different aspects of music, and if you judge every music by one rigid criteria, you are going to miss out on wide range of experiences that music can really offer. In other words, I use different ears when I listen to Rubenstein, Keith Jarret, Chucho Valdes, Cecil Taylor, Ethan Iverson or Stevie Wonder. Not being a snob about one type of music really opened my ears to new things, including hip hop(believe it or not, it takes a real talent and craftsmanship to do whats someone like J Dilla does on his records).

Keith Jarret is one of my favorite pianists, but then again I love listening to so many different pianists, and they all have different things to offer. I'd rather not think of music as a contest in general.

Well said. Sadly, we live in a society that places some value on being the best, even when it is not possible to determine objectively what or who is the best. Like you, we should embrace diversity, and shun those whose waste their time judging ( including me, since I am clearly judging here).

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#2111025 - 07/01/13 07:39 AM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: Mwm]
etcetra Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/25/08
Posts: 1446
Originally Posted By: Mwm

Well said. Sadly, we live in a society that places some value on being the best, even when it is not possible to determine objectively what or who is the best. Like you, we should embrace diversity, and shun those whose waste their time judging ( including me, since I am clearly judging here).


Thanks smile I just wanted to add my two cents because I didn't want things to get ugly. I may not understand everything about classical piano playing but I really do have tremendous respect for the craft. On the other hand, it can be very frustrating when a classical musicians talks about merits of jazz piano without really understanding how we judge the craftsmanship that goes into jazz. I used to do that for non-jazz keyboardist too. I didn't want the thread to go to that route.

I've also used to worship the likes of Bill Evans and Keith Jarrett too, and I would have said they were the absolute best, but then again, the more jazz piano I listen to, the more it get's difficult to make that kind claim. Claire Fischer's "Alone together" is my favorite jazz piano album of all time, and I find Enrico Pieranunzi, Fred Hersch, Alan Broadbent's playing of jazz ballad just as exquisite. To say who is better just seems pointless. They all bring something special to the table that only they could, and they do it at incredibly high level.

I also agree that improvisation is very much alive in some classical circles too, and the perception of it being dead probably has more to do with lack of awareness than anything else. It's the same reason people say Jazz is dead.


Edited by etcetra (07/01/13 07:43 AM)

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#2111051 - 07/01/13 08:58 AM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: pianoloverus]
RonL Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/10/12
Posts: 181
In a contest to see who is the greatest pianist the winner is: we the listeners.

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#2111203 - 07/01/13 01:28 PM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: pianoloverus]
Michael Martinez Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/22/12
Posts: 516
Loc: California
I guess I'll be the minority here, but honestly I can't listen to either Keith Jarret or Bill Evans solo piano for any great lengths of time. Their solo jazz stuff is just too dense with non-standard reharmonization and "classical" type stuff for me to be able to hang on for more than 5 or 10 minutes.

Give me any cocktail pianist worth their salt or someone like Lou Levy or Mulgrew Miller on solo piano and I can listen to them all day long.

It's a sensibility thing. My personal taste is more attuned to the rythms and changes of the standards and straigtahead jazz.
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#2111214 - 07/01/13 01:46 PM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: Michael Martinez]
beeboss Online   content
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/18/09
Posts: 1222
Loc: uk south
Originally Posted By: Michael Martinez

It's a sensibility thing. My personal taste is more attuned to the rythms and changes of the standards and straigtahead jazz.


Maybe you would like this solo Jarrett a bit more...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2wA_AiWx_s&list=PLB81805EB39F7BC98

a bit more 'cocktail' maybe
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#2111743 - 07/02/13 05:47 PM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: beeboss]
Michael Martinez Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/22/12
Posts: 516
Loc: California
Originally Posted By: beeboss

Maybe you would like this solo Jarrett a bit more...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2wA_AiWx_s&list=PLB81805EB39F7BC98

a bit more 'cocktail' maybe



eh, honestly I'm lukewarm on that. For listening purposes I prefer something like this:
http://www.cocktailpiano.com/volume_1.html

or this:

http://www.amazon.com/Bar-Piano-Plays-Fa...ds=Simon+Schott

or Van Craven's work

or even the pianist for the Atlantic Five Jazz band, although he tends to be very technical

or Beegie Adair if she were to do solo piano... she probably has, but everytime I've heard her its with a trio

Beegie


Edited by Michael Martinez (07/02/13 05:56 PM)
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#2111757 - 07/02/13 06:24 PM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: pianoloverus]
Michael Martinez Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/22/12
Posts: 516
Loc: California
and I'll link this because the first couple minutes are piano only, and the general mood of the piece is in a cocktail style:

Mulgrew Miller - Skylark


Edited by Michael Martinez (07/02/13 06:24 PM)
_________________________
Music Educator, Computer Engineer, avid reader of literature, enjoyer of the outdoors
http://www.michael--martinez.com/music/

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#2112524 - 07/04/13 12:25 AM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: pianoloverus]
The Wind Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/28/13
Posts: 468
I haven't heard any greater, dead or alive in any genre. Now if they had recording devices in Mozart's, Beethoven or Bach's era perhaps we could make a suitable comparison.

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#2112536 - 07/04/13 12:54 AM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: Michael Martinez]
The Wind Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/28/13
Posts: 468
Originally Posted By: Michael Martinez
I guess I'll be the minority here, but honestly I can't listen to either Keith Jarret or Bill Evans solo piano for any great lengths of time. Their solo jazz stuff is just too dense with non-standard reharmonization and "classical" type stuff for me to be able to hang on for more than 5 or 10 minutes.

It's a sensibility thing. My personal taste is more attuned to the rythms and changes of the standards and straigtahead jazz.


Hmm, a rather strange thing to say. If you are talking straight-ahead jazz standards both Jarrett and Evans are top of the list. Frankly, those links you provided sound like any pianist I could hear at a Holiday Inn lobby. Nothing original or inspiring.

If you think Jarrett does reharmonizations I can only imagine what happens when you listen to Herbie Hancock.

Jarrett plays chords simply, often in triads or 7ths. He'll do some dominate 7th adds like the standard b9/#9, b5/#5 but nothing unusual in jazz. Herbie on the other hand is a master of color and "impressionist" style.

Perhaps your ears just aren't attuned to the nuances of jazz. Kitsch cocktail piano is the furthest thing from real jazz.

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#2112896 - 07/04/13 04:15 PM Re: Is Keith Jarrett the greatest solo ballad player ever? [Re: pianoloverus]
jjo Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 672
Loc: Chicago
No one has mentioned Jarrett's new recording with his Standards Trio, Somewhere. It you like the Standards Trio, I'm sure you'll like this one. It's a live recording from several years ago, just released.

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