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#2118912 - 07/17/13 05:00 AM How important is it to change fingers on repeated notes?
Samuel1993 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/02/08
Posts: 351
Loc: United Kingdom
Hello all,

I'm currently learning Chopin's little posthumous 'Marche Funebre', using the Schirmer edition. Here's a copy of the piece...
http://petrucci.mus.auth.gr/imglnks/usim..._Op.72_No.2.pdf

M edition suggests that in bar 3 (and all other subsequent bars with repeated chords), that the RH alternates between 1-3-5 and 2-3-5. My teacher fully agrees with this and believes it would be beneficial to follow the suggested fingering.

However, to me this seems pointless. I understand changing fingers on repeated notes in Chopin's Grande Valse Brilliante or a Liszt Rhapsody, but I feel that doing so in this case, seemingly over complicates a relatively 'simple' piece.

I was hoping to get more opinions on the matter, as I find I can't get the hang of it, and it doesn't come naturally to me. What does everyone else think?

Best wishes
_________________________
Currently working on...
Chopin - Fantasie Impromptu in C sharp minor Op.66
Mozart - Piano Sonata in E flat K.282
Liszt - Romance in E minor "O pourquoi donc" S.196

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#2118915 - 07/17/13 05:18 AM Re: How important is it to change fingers on repeated notes? [Re: Samuel1993]
Nikolas Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/26/07
Posts: 5429
Loc: Europe
I will admit that I also don't see much point in changing fingering for the same chords. Unless one would like to somewhat stress a chord in a different way, but other than that it seems to only complicate stuff...
_________________________
http://www.musica-ferrum.com

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#2118963 - 07/17/13 08:16 AM Re: How important is it to change fingers on repeated notes? [Re: Samuel1993]
wr Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/23/07
Posts: 8027
Originally Posted By: Samuel1993
Hello all,

I'm currently learning Chopin's little posthumous 'Marche Funebre', using the Schirmer edition. Here's a copy of the piece...
http://petrucci.mus.auth.gr/imglnks/usim..._Op.72_No.2.pdf

M edition suggests that in bar 3 (and all other subsequent bars with repeated chords), that the RH alternates between 1-3-5 and 2-3-5. My teacher fully agrees with this and believes it would be beneficial to follow the suggested fingering.

However, to me this seems pointless. I understand changing fingers on repeated notes in Chopin's Grande Valse Brilliante or a Liszt Rhapsody, but I feel that doing so in this case, seemingly over complicates a relatively 'simple' piece.

I was hoping to get more opinions on the matter, as I find I can't get the hang of it, and it doesn't come naturally to me. What does everyone else think?



Your teacher thinks it beneficial in what way, exactly?

I could accept an argument that changing the fingers keeps the chords from sounding overly static, but there's also an argument to be made that the chords should sound static.

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#2119002 - 07/17/13 10:08 AM Re: How important is it to change fingers on repeated notes? [Re: Samuel1993]
Kreisler Offline



Registered: 11/27/02
Posts: 13818
Loc: Iowa City, IA
Regardless of whether or not it's pointless, the suggested alternation is a relatively simple technical skill that you should possess. Don't take the easy way out - use this as an opportunity to work on your technique and build a new skill.
_________________________
"If we continually try to force a child to do what he is afraid to do, he will become more timid, and will use his brains and energy, not to explore the unknown, but to find ways to avoid the pressures we put on him." (John Holt)

www.pianoped.com
www.youtube.com/user/UIPianoPed

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#2119008 - 07/17/13 10:25 AM Re: How important is it to change fingers on repeated notes? [Re: Kreisler]
Mark_C Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 19871
Loc: New York
Originally Posted By: Kreisler
Regardless of whether or not it's pointless, the suggested alternation is a relatively simple technical skill that you should possess.

Originally I said here that I don't think so and that in fact I think it's a little nuts. But for the heck of it I went and tried it (I'd never done such a thing before) -- and I changed my mind. I think it can be a useful thing, depending on the passage -- the layout of the notes and the expression you're going for. In this case, it does seem to help me do it the way I'd want to do it.


Edited by Mark_C (07/17/13 10:35 AM)

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#2119029 - 07/17/13 11:26 AM Re: How important is it to change fingers on repeated notes? [Re: Samuel1993]
Derulux Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/06/05
Posts: 5377
Loc: Philadelphia
This is one of those things where I can do it, but just because I can, doesn't mean I will. I can't think of a single piece where I've ever needed to switch fingers for a repeated chord, but that doesn't mean that it isn't sometimes practical -- so, like Kreisler said, I would at least learn how to do it before choosing whether or not to do it in this instance.

FYI, looking at this measure, I would use 124, because it sets you up a little better for the 145 in the next measure. 135, and especially 235, don't really do that.
_________________________
Every day we are afforded a new chance. The problem with life is not that you run out of chances. In the end, what you run out of are days.

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#2119032 - 07/17/13 11:33 AM Re: How important is it to change fingers on repeated notes? [Re: Samuel1993]
BruceD Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 18292
Loc: Victoria, BC
How many of us would use 1-3 (score fingering) for the G octave on beat one of measure 15?

Regards,
_________________________
BruceD
- - - - -
Estonia 190

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#2119033 - 07/17/13 11:36 AM Re: How important is it to change fingers on repeated notes? [Re: BruceD]
Mark_C Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 19871
Loc: New York
Originally Posted By: BruceD
How many of us would use 1-3 (score fingering) for the G octave on beat one of measure 15?

ha ha ha ha ha

GOOD GET!

That has to be just a mistake -- a misprint or slip of the pen or whatever. Absolutely absolutely has to be. It arguably wouldn't be quite so clear if it were on a black-note octave. But this? Total mistake.

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#2119080 - 07/17/13 01:15 PM Re: How important is it to change fingers on repeated notes? [Re: Mark_C]
Derulux Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/06/05
Posts: 5377
Loc: Philadelphia
Originally Posted By: Mark_C
Originally Posted By: BruceD
How many of us would use 1-3 (score fingering) for the G octave on beat one of measure 15?

ha ha ha ha ha

GOOD GET!

That has to be a just a mistake -- a misprint or slip of the pen or whatever. Absolutely absolutely has to be. It arguably wouldn't be quite so clear if it were on a black-note octave. But this? Total mistake.

What, you mean you guys don't take it all with the LH?
_________________________
Every day we are afforded a new chance. The problem with life is not that you run out of chances. In the end, what you run out of are days.

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